Social Culture of the Legal Profession

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think your fears are valid. Whether people want to admit it or not, BigLaw partnership comes down to two things: bringing in money and, secondarily, a good old fashioned popularity contest. If you can't hack it in the "bro" life -- get out while you can. It won't matter that you're smarter, nicer or a better lawyer in the end. Sad but true. The bros running the big deals at firms are interfacing with bros in the c-suite. The rest of us will be used up and thrown out with the recycling.

+1. Bringing in the money also means being a winner or at least placing in the popularity contest. But hey what job isn't like that anyway?

[Anonymous]

Q- just because I am curious- do you think there is a difference in the importance placed on this between those who went to school straight from undergrad and those that went a few years after being at work? I know plenty of people who went to law school in their mid-late 20s that didn't seem as effected by the social culture of school, perhaps because they had been out in the world already and saw law school as basically their "job" for those 3 years. I wonder if the social culture effects people more (good or bad) and is linked to the confidence more if they are coming out of college directly and still in that sort of mentality?

Would be interesting to hear people's perspectives on this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'd like some perspective from more experienced lawyers. I'm a junior associate at a medium-size law firm. I am a sociable introvert, I'm never shy, and I always felt like I could talk to people easily - until law school.

Law school reminded me strongly of fraternity/sorority life in college, which I did not take part in. I hate drinking, I'm not loud or high energy and I don't like late nights. But this was the main way law students seemed to socialize at my law school, and it seems to be a heavy part of my firm culture too. Both law school and law firm life are characterized by loud, extroverted, heavy drinkers, a very "bro" atmosphere. I'm generally a confident and friendly guy so I've managed to maintain a sort of cordial neutrality with my colleagues and former classmates, and I made a couple really close friends in law school, but I'm concerned about the networking opportunities in the future for lawyers like me.

I can't relate to most of these people, not the way I could easily befriend people in college. What does that mean for my future when it comes to getting referrals and all the other advantages that come with networking? My more social, extroverted, fratty classmates have solid connections through law school and their new firms or government jobs because their form of socializing "clicks" with the mainstream environment.

I guess I just want to hear from other lawyers who felt similarly out of place in the party atmosphere and extrovert-centric world of our profession. Did you have a smaller circle of law school friends? Did it ultimately hinder or not affect your professional and social life? How do people like us succeed?

Are you willing to network over lunch, volunteering on a DC Bar committee or charitable organization, play golf? How do you plan to get clients?

[Anonymous]

I haven't read through all of the posts but I will say this:

a) law is a service industry so personal connections matter. That being said, there can be many ways to develop those relationships.
b) In my experience, culture can vary greatly from firm to firm, group to group and even client to client. You may be in the wrong place. (I think the same may be true of law school(.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Q- just because I am curious- do you think there is a difference in the importance placed on this between those who went to school straight from undergrad and those that went a few years after being at work? I know plenty of people who went to law school in their mid-late 20s that didn't seem as effected by the social culture of school, perhaps because they had been out in the world already and saw law school as basically their "job" for those 3 years. I wonder if the social culture effects people more (good or bad) and is linked to the confidence more if they are coming out of college directly and still in that sort of mentality?

Would be interesting to hear people's perspectives on this.

I tend to agree with your hypothesis, at least to an extent. I work in a law school as think the older law students usually have a slightly easier time with the adjustment to law school culture. I do think having worked for a while is a help. On the other hand, most of the law students, straight out of undergrad or not, find law school culture pretty unsatisfying.

[Anonymous]

I don't think the age matters because until recent years, everyone pretty much went to law school right after college. OP, you will mature and learn how to deal with your natural tendency to be introverted. Someone earlier gave good tips to network over lunch, in a bar association committee or anywhere else when you find the size of the group to be manageable. You'll get better over time. Do something out of your comfort zone. Each time it becomes easier. It's like acting in a play. Put yourself out there.

[Anonymous]

I recently left big law for the fed government (and am thinking about going back to a firm in a few years). At my old firm I think a large number of attorneys were introverts. However- they were still sociable and knew how to become involved and make connections. Depending on the type of law you do - getting clients isn't necessarily about joining every club and attending every law event. You can find your own way to network both internally and externally. Just be strategic about it. But, especially if you are more junior, force yourself to attend a happy hour every so often or make a lunch date with others.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Q- just because I am curious- do you think there is a difference in the importance placed on this between those who went to school straight from undergrad and those that went a few years after being at work? I know plenty of people who went to law school in their mid-late 20s that didn't seem as effected by the social culture of school, perhaps because they had been out in the world already and saw law school as basically their "job" for those 3 years. I wonder if the social culture effects people more (good or bad) and is linked to the confidence more if they are coming out of college directly and still in that sort of mentality?

Would be interesting to hear people's perspectives on this.

As an older law student, this definitely was true for me. My lasting friendships from law school are with other older students. My advice to the OP is to follow your passion -- get involved with ABA committees or pro bono work that interests you. The people you meet there will be potential friends as well as good networking contacts.

[Anonymous]

Find practice areas that suit your personality. I did not enjoy client development, so primarily worked in government. Regulatory work tends not to be super social. And, the ALJs in my agency are definitely not social (at least not at work).

[Anonymous]

most big firms have a few aspie types/people who just don't "bro down" and get into that culture. they typically are brilliant researchers/writers (on the litigation side at least) and can make partner. i have a feeling the days of that are numbered, though, because it's becoming 100% about what kind of business you bring in.

i am pretty introverted and work at a big firm (office with about 25 lawyers, though, so my particular office isn't huge). i am fairly introverted and kind of "quirky." i was quiet and antisocial for the first year or so i was here, but i get along great with everyone now. for some people, it just takes some time.

[Anonymous]

I'm a law student and I never heard of the idea of volunteering for bar committees. That sounds really useful. How does it work? How do you get chosen to be on one, is it like an election? Is it a cliquey environment even in a big city like DC or is it more fluid and open?

[Anonymous]

After I take the bar on July 29th-30th (New York), I'm going to start shopping for apartment rentals in New York City. Got a Biglaw offer there. I am a clueless introvert, and I want to start structuring my social life productively. Everyone I socialize with must be a potential connection to a possible client. Apart from bar committees and expensive golf club memberships, what can I do in New York City to get into a social circle of high-net-worth individuals, businessmen, bankers, etc?

I was thinking of starting with any high school/college/law school friends I have in the city, but I was wondering how to socialize beyond that too. I am aware of Meetup.com and plan to utilize it too.

Any tips or advice would be helpful. I am really not good at this "game".

[Anonymous]

Oh man, that is sad. Choose people to hang out with whose company you enjoy, get to know NY, and build a happy life outside of work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Oh man, that is sad. Choose people to hang out with whose company you enjoy, get to know NY, and build a happy life outside of work.

16:17 here. Some of us are behind the curve when it comes to social networking. I always thought my friendly-but-introverted personality was fine as long as I got good grades and worked hard. But I've started to learn that Biglawyering is all about social connections and bringing in clients, and this thread confirms it. People like me, who usually only ever hang out with one or two friends at a time and don't know a ton of people, have to catch up. I don't have the luxury of just hanging out with people I like after work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Not to hijack OP's thread, but I'm an introverted law student (rising 2L) and I would also like to know how introverts like us can network in this profession. I have 1 good friend in law school, and that's it. Everyone else gives me the cold shoulder and makes it hard for me to make friends. It doesn't help that I hate going to big parties, and that's how they all mingle with each other.

It's like high school. I feel like I'm "not cool".

overcome your introvertedness with your eliteness - clerk with a top judge, go into academia, etc.