s/o Do you have a queen bee and know it, and were you one too?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I have a son but just curious out of observation on the playground. It would seem that a parent would know they have a queen bee? If the mother is one too I guess that would be natural. I guess my question is that there is no way around for having queen bees that they will always dictate their whims on others. Why teachers and schools let them get away with this?

What specifically do you expect teachers to do?

Oh, I don't know... reinforce positive behaviors and crack down on negative behaviors? Just a guess.

There are also a lot of ways you can structure classroom activities and routines to reward inclusive, respectful teamwork.

In spite of this, I've found so many young, childless teachers (my former colleagues) to be totally unsympathetic to bullied children-- complaining that they're "needy" and "annoying". Very sad.

[Anonymous]

Your guess lacks detail. What exactly does "cracking down on negative behaviors" look like? Sending a kid to the office if some outward sign is observed? Do you know what happens when you send a kid to the office? Or should a teacher call the parents? What kind of consequences actually work to stop the bad behaviors? What consequences are you comfortable with your child's teacher administering if your child is accused of bullying?

Yes, reinforcing positive behaviors is a fine idea, but I'm not sure that praising Jane for holding the door open is going to translate into Jane being nice to a less popular girl on the playground when the teacher is out of earshot.

Bullying is an awful problem, and part of the reason it is such a problem is its sneakiness. It takes place in the lunch room, at recess, and it's subtle. Further, so many parents here resort to expecting the teacher to magically fix it, or be responsible for fixing it, and yet, teachers are often powerless to deliver consequences for bad behavior.

I'm not sure what the answer is, but, so far, I think expecting that teachers can halt something we parents have no concrete strategies to address is not an answer at all.

[Anonymous]

And sometimes, the QBs are the teacher's favorites. And when your child brings social bullying to the teacher's attention, it falls on deaf ears. We called this a learning experience for our DD!

[Anonymous]

DD suffers a QBs wrath. This QB wins the teachers over by being very sweet and helpful with disadvantaged or special needs kids. It gets her lots of attention and all the teachers and parents think she's a hero or something. But then she spends the rest of the day acting like a complete jerk to DD and a number of other kids.

I finally had a long talk with QBs mom, who happened to be a very good friend of mine. We had a pretty productive (and horribly awkward) conversation, her DD apologized and has been nicer since. But the mom is totally giving me the cold shoulder and won't even look at me. Apple does not fall far from the tree. I have extended an olive branch and she blew me off.

Also, the mom told me that she got in touch with some of the teachers after she found out what her DD was doing to see if they saw any of this behavior. she told me about one in particular who said she didn't see any of this behavior and thinks she's a great kid. Well, later on a friend of mine who works at the school happened to mention to me that this teacher complains about QB all the time and thinks she's a bully. When I told her what the teacher had told the mom, she just said "yeah, no teacher who's on the chopping block will risk anything by getting involved in a situation like that." WTF? so she lied to a parent who reached out to her in an attempt to get the real scoop on what's going on with her DD?

Not QB related, but the previous year (4th gr) DD had an issue where she was basically being bullied by the school counselor, of all people! She pulled her in her office and yelled at her for something that was later proven she didn't do. Anyway, the teacher knew what was going on and just sat there while the counselor railed on DH and I about what an "unpleasant" kid she is. (DD had NEVER had a single issue with behavior or anything else at school). So DH and I talked to the principal and told her the story. I mentioned that the teacher was not helpful and she basically told me that the entire faculty knows the counselor is crazy, and they all jsut try to deep their distance from her

I've gotten off topic, sort of, but some of you have talked about teacher involvement. My point is, in my experience, the teachers won't get involved when things get dicey. Even to help a child they know is being treated unfair. this is a sweeping generalization, of course. but times are tough, and most teachers don't want to stir things up and put themselves on the line. Very sad though.

[Anonymous]

Yes, your whole post is one unsubstantiated, gossipy and total sweeping generalization that only sheds light on your biases.

Next.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In my experience queen bees are very good at fooling adults. They are always the girls that teachers and parents adore. That makes it hard for the adults to believe that the queen bee is brutal to other girls.

Yeah but when the queen bee grows up, she'll be the first one out when someone at work goes postal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Your guess lacks detail. What exactly does "cracking down on negative behaviors" look like? Sending a kid to the office if some outward sign is observed? Do you know what happens when you send a kid to the office? Or should a teacher call the parents? What kind of consequences actually work to stop the bad behaviors? What consequences are you comfortable with your child's teacher administering if your child is accused of bullying?

Yes, reinforcing positive behaviors is a fine idea, but I'm not sure that praising Jane for holding the door open is going to translate into Jane being nice to a less popular girl on the playground when the teacher is out of earshot.

Bullying is an awful problem, and part of the reason it is such a problem is its sneakiness. It takes place in the lunch room, at recess, and it's subtle. Further, so many parents here resort to expecting the teacher to magically fix it, or be responsible for fixing it, and yet, teachers are often powerless to deliver consequences for bad behavior.

I'm not sure what the answer is, but, so far, I think expecting that teachers can halt something we parents have no concrete strategies to address is not an answer at all.

Teachers, when aware, can do so much to change negative social behavior and to sensitize children to the feelings of others. Often adults, teachers, coaches and parents alike, lavish attention publicly on children who are socially fluent, talented academically or athletically. Usually this isn't intentional. The result is that the child is elevated and protected socially in the eyes of their peers, empowering them. If said child isn't guided in how to treat others fairly and with kindness QB behaviors will develop. The child's (developmentally) immature perspective becomes more self centered and he/she learns quickly how to manipulate the adults in charge. The teacher/coach/parents' challenge is to treat all children equally no matter how drawn to or repelled by the kids' behaviors they find themselves. Creating this kind of environment in a classroom means changing up groupings so cliques are not reinforced and monitoring to be sure quieter voices are encouraged and listened to and going out of your way to make it clear that no one child is favored. When a conflict occurs, the children involved need to be taught effective communication skills in conflict resolution. It is simple, it is exhausting but it is essential.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In my experience queen bees are very good at fooling adults. They are always the girls that teachers and parents adore. That makes it hard for the adults to believe that the queen bee is brutal to other girls.

Exactly. Exclusion, dictating who the other kids can/can't play with, etc.-they're all control tactics. A lot of queen bees are super (maybe overly) polite to adults because then the adults stay happy. If a teacher spends a lot of time with a group of kids, he/she should be able to tell who is the "queen bee". But if it makes you feel better, by all means tell the teacher.

My daughter had a bad experience with a queen bee type girl (in high school, I thought they were past that!) The girl was very nice at first, but gradually became downright mean, catty and exclusionary toward other girls and she even hassled some of them over the internet. The problem was adults didn't catch on to the bullying because the girl was very polite to them-she was from Georgia, called everyone sir or ma'm, was always dressed in preppy clothes and knew how to make small talk with adults.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Ah, the 80s, a simpler time when "queen bee" behavior would be "disciplined" by the short and sweet admonishment to "stop acting like a jackass or all your toys are going to Goodwill."

I like you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have a son but just curious out of observation on the playground. It would seem that a parent would know they have a queen bee? If the mother is one too I guess that would be natural. I guess my question is that there is no way around for having queen bees that they will always dictate their whims on others. Why teachers and schools let them get away with this?

Don't kid yourself. There are plenty of queen bee boys. Did not think this was the case until i had all boys. Just as mean and just as sneaky. Think student president of grade school; he has/ had everyone fooled. All smiles, charm, a's to teachers and adults but to many kids (or the less popular ones) he had plenty to " say". It is evrywhere and i would not jump to the parents as the cause. Some kids are just this way and i find the smarter they are the more they get away with because they know how far to go, who is an easy target, and what to say to lay blame elsewhere.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DD suffers a QBs wrath. This QB wins the teachers over by being very sweet and helpful with disadvantaged or special needs kids. It gets her lots of attention and all the teachers and parents think she's a hero or something. But then she spends the rest of the day acting like a complete jerk to DD and a number of other kids.

I finally had a long talk with QBs mom, who happened to be a very good friend of mine. We had a pretty productive (and horribly awkward) conversation, her DD apologized and has been nicer since. But the mom is totally giving me the cold shoulder and won't even look at me. Apple does not fall far from theone in particular who said she didn't see any of this behavior and thinks she's a great kid. Well, later on a friend of mine who works at the school happened to mention to me that this teacher complains about QB all the time and thinks she's a bully. When I told her what the teacher had told the mom, she just said "yeah, no teacher who's on the chopping block will risk anything by getting involved in a situation like that." WTF? so she lied to a parent who reached out to her in an attempt to get the real sco tree. I have extended an olive branch and she blew me off.

Also, the mom told me that she got in touch with some of the teachers after she found out what her DD was doing to see if they saw any of this behavior. she told me about op on what's going on with her DD?

Not QB related, but the previous year (4th gr) DD had an issue where she was basically being bullied by the school counselor, of all people! She pulled her in her office and yelled at her for something that was later proven she didn't do. Anyway, the teacher knew what was going on and just sat there while the counselor railed on DH and I about what an "unpleasant" kid she is. (DD had NEVER had a single issue with behavior or anything else at school). So DH and I talked to the principal and told her the story. I mentioned that the teacher was not helpful and she basically told me that the entire faculty knows the counselor is crazy, and they all jsut try to deep their distance from her

I've gotten off topic, sort of, but some of you have talked about teacher involvement. My point is, in my experience, the teachers won't get involved when things get dicey. Even to help a child they know is being treated unfair. this is a sweeping generalization, of course. but times are tough, and most teachers don't want to stir things up and put themselves on the line. Very sad though.

Yes, I have been through this! Very ugly situation and the QB and mother were just alike. Did you write this post for me? Or has theis QB just found another victim?

Yerye

[Anonymous]

What are the teachers supposed to do. A teacher can't send someone to the office just be they exclude someone from a play group. That happens all the time. One day girls are best friends, the next they they are enemies, the next they are friends again. This is life.

[Anonymous]

With everything that teachers have to deal with on a daily basis, I am sure that Susie complaining that Sally won't play with her is farther down the list of priorities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Volunteering in the classroom this past year, the queen bee girl in my child's class was the kind who could fool the adults - very sweet and compliant. In fact, the teacher thought that another girl was the difficult one. But it was the first girl who excluded kids and got others to do so. I do hope someone finds her out in coming years but I doubt it.

Why didn't you bring it to the teacher's attention? In a nice helpful way, of course.

[Anonymous]

"In my experience queen bees are very good at fooling adults. They are always the girls that teachers and parents adore. That makes it hard for the adults to believe that the queen bee is brutal to other girls."

Yup, and some of the ones I knew had QB mothers who ran the PTA, the HOA, etc. If anyone sad a bad word about the mothers or daughters, "You're jealous!" is the standard response.