really interesting article on math and acceleration

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Of course if you went for a fitness membership and they told you you could not move on to the other equipment until you showed them you could run a mile in 7 minutes without your ankle brace because I am sorry you have a weak ankle but we want you to prove you are fit before we move you forward. You explain you are there for the spinning class and what does that have to do with your ankel and running fast. They say - We know it is crazy but it is part of our policies and procedures and there is liability you know. You would probably quit even though you could do it. You don't think kids feel that way sometimes.

Yea - and there are some kids that will run on that bad ankle through the pain - but think of all the kids you lost on the way.

I think you missed the poster's point. Don't overthink this and fake yourself out. With the new year comes resolutions to get fitter and a brand new gym membership. In January many will come to the gym regularly but as we move into February the eagerness and keenness wears off. We start to slip and gym attendance dwindles. The dedication, discipline and stick-to-it ness simply fails us. I believe this was the simple point the poster was making. Math club activities requires the same level of commitment to get the results desired.

I think you missed the point - addition and multiplication facts does not make a good Math student.

Lots of hard working kids could work hard and be committed if schools could get past the fact they can't do adding and multiplying in a timed situation.

[Anonymous]

Kids need to be able to multiply, divide, add and subtract without thinking about it and without a calculator. It should be a split second response. Then and only then are the prepared to move on to higher math. If you don't have a solid foundation, their understanding of math from here on out will suffer.

[Anonymous]

I think you missed the point - addition and multiplication facts does not make a good Math student.

Lots of hard working kids could work hard and be committed if schools could get past the fact they can't do adding and multiplying in a timed situation.

If your child can't do these simple arithematic tasks the math tool kit is empty do calculator will salvage this.

[Anonymous]

I have a degree in Math. We programmed all our problems after the elementary levels of Math like calculus, diverential eq and linear algebra.

The idea that advanced Math needs to just be able to do calculations in your head is silly.

Sounds like one of those modern degrees in fuzzy math.

The problem high school and college teachers have is that these kids need remediation. They can't even do a multiple choice exam like the SAT math section tons of SAT prep and a calculator.

No wonder higher level math is difficult for them.

If you cannot add, subtract, divide and multiply effortlessly with whole numbers, fractions and decimals (NO CALCULATORS) before middle school...the ball game is pretty much over.

[Anonymous]

Kids need to be able to multiply, divide, add and subtract without thinking about it and without a calculator. It should be a split second response. Then and only then are the prepared to move on to higher math. If you don't have a solid foundation, their understanding of math from here on out will suffer.

American kids could perform these tasks before the days of calculators decades ago. Kids going to school today in poorer countries without calculators can also perform these tasks. Perhaps this may explain who is getting advanced degrees in mathematics, engineering and physics today ... without the fears of dropping out and insecure inferiority.

[Anonymous]

Sounds like one of those modern degrees in fuzzy math.

The problem high school and college teachers have is that these kids need remediation. They can't even do a multiple choice exam like the SAT math section tons of SAT prep and a calculator.

No wonder higher level math is difficult for them.

If you cannot add, subtract, divide and multiply effortlessly with whole numbers, fractions and decimals (NO CALCULATORS) before middle school...the ball game is pretty much over.

That says it all. Pretty much, lights out, ball game over. Data emerging over the last decade in our country seems to confirm this in STEM. Math competence is the driver for its application.

[Anonymous]

I have a degree in Math. We programmed all our problems after the elementary levels of Math like calculus, diverential eq and linear algebra.

The idea that advanced Math needs to just be able to do calculations in your head is silly.

I do not have a degree in fuzzy math but only once you get to advanced Math do you have the license to use a calculator for computation. Many who relie on such a device in elementary school will never get to advanced Math. They make up the largest group of Math drop outs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:From 2009, but new to me (referred to in another context by a former public school math teacher):

http://www.aps.org/publications/apsnews/200910/backpage.cfm

It's about how raising state standards in math has lead to more remediation in college because kids "learn" things in a way and at a time that doesn't allow them to develop the kind of mastery and understanding needed to know how to use what they've learned (or maybe even to retain it). Written by a physics professor with kids in Maryland public schools and based on his experiences both as a parent and a teacher.

Thought provoking read, thanks for posting

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Kids need to be able to multiply, divide, add and subtract without thinking about it and without a calculator. It should be a split second response. Then and only then are the prepared to move on to higher math. If you don't have a solid foundation, their understanding of math from here on out will suffer.

Don't completely agree. It makes it easier to move on, but not impossible. They should give it a good try though. Every child by end of grade 4 should have multiplication tables down (even by end of 3rd grade). But if they do not, it does not automatically mean higher math is out. I have a math degree from a prestigious university and never completely learned my tables (GPA 3.6). Still have trouble with the 8's.

[Anonymous]

For all the STEM major cheerleaders


http://www.cnn.com/video/?hpt=hp_t3#/video/us/2012/01/31/tsr-snow-obama-resume.cnn

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I've had kids in both public and private and here's my two cents. The problem isn't the advanced math itself, because some kids actually do well with the additional challenge. The problem is when parents and kids think they *need* to do advanced math but the kids aren't really ready.

Half of this perceived "need" is really status. ("Johnny is in advanced math, how about little Mikey?")

And half of it is a legitimate (I think) parental fear that if little Johnny doesn't get on the advanced track in 3rd grade, then he won't be a candidate for advanced math in later grades (because you can't easily skip from on-grade math to above-grade math). And ultimately he won't get into the college of his choice.

My kid has been guilty of this as well - he pushed us to meet with the head of school to get him into advanced math. I thought at the time, and I still think, it was partly a status thing among the kids because he'd tell us stories about how so-and-so got in so he wanted to be in too. He's now in the Takoma math magnet and getting As, so there was something there, but I'm not ruling out the status aspect either.

There is little evidence that "advanced math" in the elementary years makes anyone more likely to be a skilled mathematician.
I agree with the status thing. It is blatantly about status. These parents trample on the system abusing teachers and administrators (and their own children) trying to get advanced math classes for Johnny. They don't care if their actions with advanced groupings actually hurt kids in the lower groups (which has been shown) or leads to incomplete understanding by Johnny. They just want Johnny to be in Trig by 8th grade. The worst part of this is that these parents would NEVER WANT JOHNNY TO BE A MATHEMATICIAN because they know that it does not pay. They want Johnny to be a lawyer or doctor or something more lucrative.
There are many many selfish parents out there.

[Anonymous]

Let me see, kids don't need to learn to multiply because they can use a calculator, they don't need to learn to spell because they use spell-check, they don't need to learn to write because they can type on a keyboard, they don't need to speak because they can text. What exactly do they need to learn to do? I think we have a whole generation (of Americans) who are seriously fucked the first time the power goes out or they run out of batteries.

[Anonymous]

Don't completely agree. It makes it easier to move on, but not impossible. They should give it a good try though. Every child by end of grade 4 should have multiplication tables down (even by end of 3rd grade). But if they do not, it does not automatically mean higher math is out. I have a math degree from a prestigious university and never completely learned my tables (GPA 3.6). Still have trouble with the 8's.

Great. Of course, there is nothing wrong with trying. I support this 100%. Doesn't mean all will succeed like you. Given the choice I would prefer mastery of basic math fundamentals early before middle school. That said, it doesn't mean one can't climb mountains even in high school or college.

[Anonymous]

Let me see, kids don't need to learn to multiply because they can use a calculator, they don't need to learn to spell because they use spell-check, they don't need to learn to write because they can type on a keyboard, they don't need to speak because they can text. What exactly do they need to learn to do? I think we have a whole generation (of Americans) who are seriously fucked the first time the power goes out or they run out of batteries.

Well said...the entitlement and dependency generation.

No, they should play and have fun. Everything else is torture and abuse.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Let me see, kids don't need to learn to multiply because they can use a calculator, they don't need to learn to spell because they use spell-check, they don't need to learn to write because they can type on a keyboard, they don't need to speak because they can text. What exactly do they need to learn to do? I think we have a whole generation (of Americans) who are seriously fucked the first time the power goes out or they run out of batteries.

Well said...the entitlement and dependency generation.

No, they should play and have fun. Everything else is torture and abuse.

It's ok as long as mommy and daddy can leave a huge pile of money to take care of their snowflake's problems even after they are gone. The problem is that everyone is getting hit hard by the economy and reality so that huge pile is in jeopardy these days. You need to teach them how to fish not just keep giving them fish.