Goldman Sachs: 40% of $400-500K and $500K+ households “live paycheck to paycheck”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s hard to know what is accurate in this area. High end shops here seem filled with buyers. Are there that many wealthy people, or are people throwing money away that they can’t afford? I assume both.

What kind of high end shops are you talking about?

I’m specifically talking about the 20-30 minutes waits to get help at Chanel, Gucci and Louis Vuitton I experienced on Saturday. Lots of men and women walking out with big bags. Mostly young people in the line.

It's the holidays. People are buying gifts, and those luxury items -- especially at the entry price points -- are very popular for holiday giving. Those shops are going to be "filled with buyers" this time of year, and a lot less so come January.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We make about $450k. We max out most deductions, have a $4,800 mortgage payment, no daycare or debt and we pay cash for cars and vacations, and I can not fathom paying for a nanny, dual private, country club, and cleaning. When college comes we have savings. No quarterly tax payments (we're regular employees).

Ok. So you are better than the people we are discussing. Ok?

[Anonymous]

The definition isn’t really paycheck to paycheck as most of us understand it. It reads more that it’s harder to save money than in the past year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I assume at that income level they mean they aren't very liquid and therefore rely on each paycheck to pay their bills. They just don't want to sell off property or stock/bonds, but they could if they lost their income, so it's not really paycheck to paycheck like it would be for low-income families.

That comp might also not be salary but a considerable about of it in bonus. So they live paycheck to paycheck until they get that annual bonus.

This is basically us. 750k HHI but 150k+ is tied up in generally guaranteed bonus. We also refinanced into a 15 year mortgage so our numbers are really tight on a monthly basis even though they don’t have to be. We consider the extra $5k/month in mortgage we’re paying by doing a 15 year is basically just guaranteed savings into our principal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think they mean after they max out their 401ks, fund 529s and HSAs, and pay private school tuition, and the mortgage they have no cash flow left.

This describes a lot of people at this income level, including us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I assume at that income level they mean they aren't very liquid and therefore rely on each paycheck to pay their bills. They just don't want to sell off property or stock/bonds, but they could if they lost their income, so it's not really paycheck to paycheck like it would be for low-income families.

+1

[Anonymous]

I believe it. There’s a poster on another active thread making $3M with $15M NW saying they can’t afford to retire and keep up their lifestyle.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think they mean after they max out their 401ks, fund 529s and HSAs, and pay private school tuition, and the mortgage they have no cash flow left.

This is us exactly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:^ I should add we clean our own house and rake our own leaves. When DS goes to college next year we might change that to the tune of a few thousand a year, but for now it's important he have some chores and see us doing them too. Just our take.

Completely agree with this. We cook at home, rake leaves, do our own laundry & grocery shopping. That's real life and I want to make sure my privileged kids know what it entails.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We make about $450k. We max out most deductions, have a $4,800 mortgage payment, no daycare or debt and we pay cash for cars and vacations, and I can not fathom paying for a nanny, dual private, country club, and cleaning. When college comes we have savings. No quarterly tax payments (we're regular employees).

Ditto for us. And yet it still does sometimes feel like we're living paycheck to paycheck bc of the deductions and occasional expensive months. So I get it, but like most pps agree that it's not the same paycheck to paycheck definition as someone who is not budgeting AFTER socking away for retirement, 529, health insurance, etc.

[Anonymous]

We have a 7 figure HHI and still rely on our jobs to pay the bills—is that what it means to live paycheck to paycheck?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s hard to know what is accurate in this area. High end shops here seem filled with buyers. Are there that many wealthy people, or are people throwing money away that they can’t afford? I assume both.

What kind of high end shops are you talking about?

I’m specifically talking about the 20-30 minutes waits to get help at Chanel, Gucci and Louis Vuitton I experienced on Saturday. Lots of men and women walking out with big bags. Mostly young people in the line.

The people I see at these shops don’t look like they make $400K. They’re buying $4000 bags but wearing spandex and pushing junky strollers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We have a 7 figure HHI and still rely on our jobs to pay the bills—is that what it means to live paycheck to paycheck?

Here’s how it is phrased in the survey.

How would you describe your financial situation?

Primarily live paycheck to paycheck: I find it tough to make progress on any long-term financial goals

Moderately improve each year: I am able to make some saving progress each year

Considerably better: I am able to make progress on both short-term and long-term financial goals.

Even if you are socking away a ton of deductions that lower take home pay, you should be at “Moderately improve each year” at $500K+

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We make about $450k. We max out most deductions, have a $4,800 mortgage payment, no daycare or debt and we pay cash for cars and vacations, and I can not fathom paying for a nanny, dual private, country club, and cleaning. When college comes we have savings. No quarterly tax payments (we're regular employees).

Yup exactly this middle class lifestyle

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We have a 7 figure HHI and still rely on our jobs to pay the bills—is that what it means to live paycheck to paycheck?

Here’s how it is phrased in the survey.

How would you describe your financial situation?

Primarily live paycheck to paycheck: I find it tough to make progress on any long-term financial goals

Moderately improve each year: I am able to make some saving progress each year

Considerably better: I am able to make progress on both short-term and long-term financial goals.

Even if you are socking away a ton of deductions that lower take home pay, you should be at “Moderately improve each year” at $500K+

We are high income. I would have said living paycheck to paycheck but that is because we are contributing to long term financial goals. We don’t have a lot of spare cash at the end of the month because it is going into those. The above would put me in “considerably better”