Big Builds in Bethesda Not Selling

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Those are not in the most desirable parts of Bethesda, not even close. The new builds in 20814 and 20816 still seem to be all be pushing $3 or $4 million. I’m not even sure why we’re talking about NIH. Of course Bethesda is not affordable anymore for NIH workers but that’s been true for many years. The best properties in Bethesda are still selling to the law firm partners, doctors, and business execs, just as has always been the case. Who do you think is affording the exorbitant tuition at Landon, Holton, and the like?

And the county tax doesn’t help. We crossed the river to Arlington once we hit mid 6 figures - the county tax is no joke as your income rises. Our friends with trusts all stayed in Bethesda / CC but anyone who’s self made crossed the river.

Some people are obsessed about taxes, and some aren't. I don't really think about MoCo taxes, and I'm not wealthy nor do I have a trust fund. I've lived in my neighborhood for 15 years, and I've never heard my neighbors mention it either. I'm not saying it's wrong to be concerned about taxes; I'm just saying that many people don't let it guide their lives or they view it as part of supporting the less fortunate. Plus, if you're self-made and care so deeply about taxes, it feels like Florida or Texas would be better choices than Virginia.

The difference is also less than some might think, about 1%: https://wallethub.com/edu/states-with-highest-lowest-tax-burden/20494. Virginia people forget about all the taxes they pay that Maryland doesn't have, like the car tax, grocery tax, and 10% restaurant tax.

Plus property taxes are generally rolled into your mortgage so you don't see them.
The impact is only a big deal if there's a huge reassessment in your area. And even then, governments tend to do that on a step basis rather than a shock basis.

[Anonymous]

The second one is awful

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Those are not in the most desirable parts of Bethesda, not even close. The new builds in 20814 and 20816 still seem to be all be pushing $3 or $4 million. I’m not even sure why we’re talking about NIH. Of course Bethesda is not affordable anymore for NIH workers but that’s been true for many years. The best properties in Bethesda are still selling to the law firm partners, doctors, and business execs, just as has always been the case. Who do you think is affording the exorbitant tuition at Landon, Holton, and the like?

And the county tax doesn’t help. We crossed the river to Arlington once we hit mid 6 figures - the county tax is no joke as your income rises. Our friends with trusts all stayed in Bethesda / CC but anyone who’s self made crossed the river.

For some strange reason people in NoVa think everyone else aspires to live there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m begging suburbanites from Bethesda McLean Potomac and great falls to stop building houses with more than 4000 sq ft. 6000 sq ft is an abomination and you truly don’t need that much house. It screams “might as well build another entertainment room while we’re at it”. Build a garden! Use the outside! You’ve hit diminishing returns on sq ft development. Develop some taste.

+1 we have a large family in 3000! I don’t understand what people are doing in these homes.

[Anonymous]

Because until this administration came along, Bethesda was in a building boom and it was a seller's market.

Now they're suffering from the economic downturn, like everyone else.

I live closer to downtown Bethesda, and I've seen the market softening in my neighborhood as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Those are not in the most desirable parts of Bethesda, not even close. The new builds in 20814 and 20816 still seem to be all be pushing $3 or $4 million. I’m not even sure why we’re talking about NIH. Of course Bethesda is not affordable anymore for NIH workers but that’s been true for many years. The best properties in Bethesda are still selling to the law firm partners, doctors, and business execs, just as has always been the case. Who do you think is affording the exorbitant tuition at Landon, Holton, and the like?

And the county tax doesn’t help. We crossed the river to Arlington once we hit mid 6 figures - the county tax is no joke as your income rises. Our friends with trusts all stayed in Bethesda / CC but anyone who’s self made crossed the river.

It’s only an issue if you earn like 150k. Once you reach like 300k as a household, MoCo becomes fun again and you don’t care too much about the county or property tax. The increased SALT deduction should help too these next years

We make $800K and pay something like $25K / year to moco alone as DINKs.

You’re delusional if you think that’s comparable to a $1K car tax and the SALT deduction is capped at $600K so that doesn’t help either.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m begging suburbanites from Bethesda McLean Potomac and great falls to stop building houses with more than 4000 sq ft. 6000 sq ft is an abomination and you truly don’t need that much house. It screams “might as well build another entertainment room while we’re at it”. Build a garden! Use the outside! You’ve hit diminishing returns on sq ft development. Develop some taste.

+1 we have a large family in 3000! I don’t understand what people are doing in these homes.

which is a massive mcmansion by standards of just 25 years ago. My Mom had a family of six in a 1,400 sf house and I had a family of 5 in a 1,300 sf house. Both neighborhoods 2,000 sf were rich people houses.

Ironically now that I am an empty nestor I do have a large house. But OMG. Thanksgiving I had all three of my single kids homes for week 18-15 and one had a dog, the other a cat, we have a dog, then a few of friends came over at one point. I need the big house way way more than I did when kids were little.

Part of problem is today's kids WILL NOT MOVE FORWARD. My neighbor has 5 kids aged 22-25 and none are married. They live in a 7,000 sf house and thanksgiving and week all five was staying over and most have girlfriends and boyfriends and pets. It was a circus over there 8-10 cars in driveway and 15-20 people staying over.

I am convinced parents downsize to soley to hide from kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Those are not in the most desirable parts of Bethesda, not even close. The new builds in 20814 and 20816 still seem to be all be pushing $3 or $4 million. I’m not even sure why we’re talking about NIH. Of course Bethesda is not affordable anymore for NIH workers but that’s been true for many years. The best properties in Bethesda are still selling to the law firm partners, doctors, and business execs, just as has always been the case. Who do you think is affording the exorbitant tuition at Landon, Holton, and the like?

And the county tax doesn’t help. We crossed the river to Arlington once we hit mid 6 figures - the county tax is no joke as your income rises. Our friends with trusts all stayed in Bethesda / CC but anyone who’s self made crossed the river.

For some strange reason people in NoVa think everyone else aspires to live there.

[b]

Well, that’s a non sequitur. No one said that. They said VA has lower taxes, which it does. Most people think that’s relevant in a forum about purchasing expensive real estate and taxes. Everyone on the Hill in DC moved off once their kids hit a certain age because of poor schools, taxes and mismanagement — most to VA for lower taxes and its public college system. Same on Maryland. People love to VA for lower taxes, FCPS public schools and the in-state public’s.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Those are not in the most desirable parts of Bethesda, not even close. The new builds in 20814 and 20816 still seem to be all be pushing $3 or $4 million. I’m not even sure why we’re talking about NIH. Of course Bethesda is not affordable anymore for NIH workers but that’s been true for many years. The best properties in Bethesda are still selling to the law firm partners, doctors, and business execs, just as has always been the case. Who do you think is affording the exorbitant tuition at Landon, Holton, and the like?

And the county tax doesn’t help. We crossed the river to Arlington once we hit mid 6 figures - the county tax is no joke as your income rises. Our friends with trusts all stayed in Bethesda / CC but anyone who’s self made crossed the river.

It’s only an issue if you earn like 150k. Once you reach like 300k as a household, MoCo becomes fun again and you don’t care too much about the county or property tax. The increased SALT deduction should help too these next years

We make $800K and pay something like $25K / year to moco alone as DINKs.

You’re delusional if you think that’s comparable to a $1K car tax and the SALT deduction is capped at $600K so that doesn’t help either.

That is peanuts at 800K. 25K out of $800K is a rounding error. So ok I will bite on this. Selling my MoCo house will cost me $100K in real estate commision. Around another $100K in closing costs on old house and new house, getting house ready to sell with repairs and updates then on new house of course my wife will want repairs and updates as she always does and moving costs so around $200K.

The average peak high earner my section is around 55 lets assume they work to 65. That will save them $250K taxes by moving to Virginia. And a lot of peak earners including me are older. My neighbor is a 63 year big executive.

Yes it makes sense moving at a younger age with high income to VA. But I live on a block of high earners in MoCo and most even on day they buy home are pretty old. The last three "young" buyers on Block moved to area for W schools or private schools. My rich neighbor moved as her older kid was in Private High School school in Bethesda already and most of friends there already. Next kid was starting HS and she actually wanted Public so they moved to Bethesda and she went to Whitman. And like most rich people they met after grad school and had kids later and his wife retired by time moved to MoCo. So just his salary for a few years.

He left VA for Moco. OMG, but he had a job he goes to DC twice a week and kid goes to HS in Bethesda and did not want to retire around Tysons area

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m begging suburbanites from Bethesda McLean Potomac and great falls to stop building houses with more than 4000 sq ft. 6000 sq ft is an abomination and you truly don’t need that much house. It screams “might as well build another entertainment room while we’re at it”. Build a garden! Use the outside! You’ve hit diminishing returns on sq ft development. Develop some taste.

+1 we have a large family in 3000! I don’t understand what people are doing in these homes.

We also live in 3000 and it’s almost too big. DH wanted to buy a bigger house, and I put my foot down. I make sure my kids know to aim for a smaller house with a moderate yard. I think 2000 to 2500 is ideal for a family of four. I have family and friends who feel differently, but they have more kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Those are not in the most desirable parts of Bethesda, not even close. The new builds in 20814 and 20816 still seem to be all be pushing $3 or $4 million. I’m not even sure why we’re talking about NIH. Of course Bethesda is not affordable anymore for NIH workers but that’s been true for many years. The best properties in Bethesda are still selling to the law firm partners, doctors, and business execs, just as has always been the case. Who do you think is affording the exorbitant tuition at Landon, Holton, and the like?

And the county tax doesn’t help. We crossed the river to Arlington once we hit mid 6 figures - the county tax is no joke as your income rises. Our friends with trusts all stayed in Bethesda / CC but anyone who’s self made crossed the river.

It’s only an issue if you earn like 150k. Once you reach like 300k as a household, MoCo becomes fun again and you don’t care too much about the county or property tax. The increased SALT deduction should help too these next years

PP you quoted - when I said hit mid 6 figures I meant $500K+, not $150K lol

We actually didn’t notice the county tax when we made $300K because it’s not as bad at that level $ wise (I think we paid under $10K back then?) It’s as you pass $500K and get closer to / over $1M it gets absurd. Which you kinda need to make to afford $2.5+ M homes without a trust or family help.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m begging suburbanites from Bethesda McLean Potomac and great falls to stop building houses with more than 4000 sq ft. 6000 sq ft is an abomination and you truly don’t need that much house. It screams “might as well build another entertainment room while we’re at it”. Build a garden! Use the outside! You’ve hit diminishing returns on sq ft development. Develop some taste.

+1 we have a large family in 3000! I don’t understand what people are doing in these homes.

We also live in 3000 and it’s almost too big. DH wanted to buy a bigger house, and I put my foot down. I make sure my kids know to aim for a smaller house with a moderate yard. I think 2000 to 2500 is ideal for a family of four. I have family and friends who feel differently, but they have more kids.

3,000SF can be a HUGE HUGE MASSIVE house or a moderate size at same time. My brother has a one story house in Florida on a slab with 3,000 SF and a two car garage (400sk) so he had 3,400 sf of indoor sapace.

I looked at a 3,000 SF house once that had a finished basement (1,500 sf), a two car garage (400 SF) and a walk up attic with stair case for storage (1,500 sf) that could be finished for more living space. The house had 6,400 sf of indoor space. But listed as 3,000 SF.

[Anonymous]

Family of 4 in 3,000 sq feet with a small but decent yard, and it is the right size. Everyone has their own bedroom, one dedicated office and one office/guest room, and half the basement is finished and half is storage.

I would not go smaller. During covid, we could all work from home and the kids could do their schoolwork without being in each other's way.

FWIW, 20817, and 2 million dollar homes are going quickly, but $2.1, not $2.5

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The second one is awful

Came here to say this. The second one is really terrible. Everything is odd--especially the huge second story porch on the front of the house. Who would want that? Ugh.

OP--I completely agree. If these were 4-5 bedrooms with slightly less square footage in the $1.6-$1.8 range, they'd sell quickly (even given how dumb the second one's design choices are). It doesn't make sense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why do builders create these monstrosities with no yards that dwarf all the neighbors? They then sit. Why not build something more in line with the neighborhood that would sell faster? If it takes a year to sell was that extra bedroom or two worth it??

https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/8916-Oneida-Ln-Bethesda-MD-20817/37174409_zpid/

https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/8908-Mohawk-Ln-Bethesda-MD-20817/37174313_zpid/

Hmm, this is pretty much the look for almost every new build in Bethesda for almost the past 5+ years. It works so why stop.

Right, and people clearly pay more for more indoor square footage, so that's what the market gives them. It's not complicated.