AP PreCalc

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is going to depend on your district. Around the country, it's very common to apply to college without having taken Calculus or to have taken it senior year. However, that's because it's the norm in their districts.

In the DMV, or at least in MCPS and FCPS, the "norm" is that smart kids take Calculus junior year. I think it's ridiculous but it's the rat race.

\
This is 100% not "the norm" for "smart kids". Algebra in 8th, Geometry in 9th, Alg 2 in 10th, Precalc in 11th, Calculus in 12th is "the norm" here.

For FCPS, the prior poster was correct. Most advanced kids in FCPS take algebra in 7th, definitely not 8th.

Agree. Algebra in 8th has pretty much become on level. Pre-algebra in 8th grade would be considered remedial in FCPS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think CWRU may not be impressed by AP preface esp if going for a stem major

Not sure about BC

But if that's the norm in their school, not taking it would have looked bad. It's not necessarily a boost, but it keeps them at baseline.

Right? Like is Conn College/YCBK really saying that you should stop taking math after Algebra 2 because AP precalc is “low rigor” so you should take a bunch of “higher rigor” AP electives instead? They heavily implied as much in this discussion, but I don’t think that would be their actual advice.

[Anonymous]

It’s the norm now for “good but not great” math students. It’s fine for most colleges, especially if they’re ending at Calc AB. It’s actually a tough class for kids who are good, not great. Many struggle to get A’s for the first time.

[Anonymous]

AP Precalc has replaced honors precalc at many high schools. It doesn't look good or bad, it just is. It's not as though the choice were AP Precalc vs calc; the choice is AP precalc vs whatever the less-rigorous course is called at that high school (and there is a lot of variety; college algebra, precalc and trig, etc.). I haven't listened to the podcast, but I don't understand what they might be trying to imply. Yeah, we know it's not college level math, and we know it won't be among the rigorous APs that colleges care about, but so what? You still have to take it on the road to calc. Take the course and be glad for the GPA weight.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It’s the norm now for “good but not great” math students. It’s fine for most colleges, especially if they’re ending at Calc AB. It’s actually a tough class for kids who are good, not great. Many struggle to get A’s for the first time.

It's also now the norm for great math students, who still take a precalc course in between algebra 2 and calc.

[Anonymous]

Our (mediocre fcps) school only has AP Precalculus and non-honors Precalculus.

[Anonymous]

I listened. I *think* what they were inferring is that an AP precalc test is a money grab. APs are supposed to be college equivalent courses - and precalc isn't a college equivalent course.

So it wasn't a slag on PreCalc the class, but PreCalc the test.

But they could have been clearer.

I'm not a math person and dont have math kids, but I've never really understood how kids are supposed to get to Calc AB or BC before 12th. That's just not how our HS works. You'd have to do a lot of work outside HS and then appeal and I dont' see that being done where I live and we def have kids at CWRU and BC etc, every ear.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is going to depend on your district. Around the country, it's very common to apply to college without having taken Calculus or to have taken it senior year. However, that's because it's the norm in their districts.

In the DMV, or at least in MCPS and FCPS, the "norm" is that smart kids take Calculus junior year. I think it's ridiculous but it's the rat race.

\
This is 100% not "the norm" for "smart kids". Algebra in 8th, Geometry in 9th, Alg 2 in 10th, Precalc in 11th, Calculus in 12th is "the norm" here.

For not-particularly-mathy kids, sure. Particularly mathy kids at every elementary school in FCPS have long since had a clear path to algebra in 7th, with many schools now offering algebra in 6th.

[Anonymous]

I'm confused about the classes mentioned. So, the order is AP Pre Calc, AP Calc AB and the AP Calc BC.

There is BC Pre Calc AP and you can skip AP Calc AB?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm confused about the classes mentioned. So, the order is AP Pre Calc, AP Calc AB and the AP Calc BC.

There is BC Pre Calc AP and you can skip AP Calc AB?

The math track depends on the high school. Different high schools organize their courses differently. You really need to read your high school's course catalog closely. Most will set out some information on math track, often in chart form.

At two of my kids' high schools, the track is: AP Precalc, Calc AB, Calc BC, with each course being a prerequisite for the next. However, both also began allowing students to skip AB, which was not the case in past years.

I don't know what BC Precalc AP would refer to, but it sounds like a precalc course designed specifically to skip calc AB.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm confused about the classes mentioned. So, the order is AP Pre Calc, AP Calc AB and the AP Calc BC.

There is BC Pre Calc AP and you can skip AP Calc AB?

The math track depends on the high school. Different high schools organize their courses differently. You really need to read your high school's course catalog closely. Most will set out some information on math track, often in chart form.

At two of my kids' high schools, the track is: AP Precalc, Calc AB, Calc BC, with each course being a prerequisite for the next. However, both also began allowing students to skip AB, which was not the case in past years.

I don't know what BC Precalc AP would refer to, but it sounds like a precalc course designed specifically to skip calc AB.

Yes, that’s how it’s done at DS’s high school. It was confusing and no one explains it. Basically, Precalc BC goes beyond the AP Precalc exam and enables them to go from that class to AP Calc BC. The AP Precalc test should be easy for them. In our school, if you take AP Precalc AB, they won’t let you sign up for AP Calc BC. They also wouldn’t let nonhonors algebra 2 kids sign up for AP Precalc BC. Those kids had to take AP Precalc AB.

[Anonymous]

Agree with what everyone is saying. It was the right move, similar to a junior year honors math class. It would have been wrong not to take it.

I feel for these kids. AP Seminar is considered the most rigorous option for English in 10th grade at our school, and some people will say "that's not an English class. you don't have 4 year of English!" Even after taking AP Lit and Lang in 11th and 12th.

It's gotten so crazy. You try to go for rigor but then you get mindf-ed like, no actually you should have accelerated in Math over the summer. No actually taking that AP over an Honors class is LESS rigorous.

There aren't clear guidelines. You can't win. It's gross.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I listened. I *think* what they were inferring is that an AP precalc test is a money grab. APs are supposed to be college equivalent courses - and precalc isn't a college equivalent course.

So it wasn't a slag on PreCalc the class, but PreCalc the test.

But they could have been clearer.

I'm not a math person and dont have math kids, but I've never really understood how kids are supposed to get to Calc AB or BC before 12th. That's just not how our HS works. You'd have to do a lot of work outside HS and then appeal and I dont' see that being done where I live and we def have kids at CWRU and BC etc, every ear.

Obviously results from a school where no one can take APs before a certain year or it offers few APs or no fast tracked math option, expectations are different than at schools with those options. So the fact that kids get into those schools from your school isn’t relevant to kids where those opportunities are offered.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I listened to YCBK this morning on my commute and they were basically saying AP precalc is a joke. Ugh. This is the junior year class and AP test my kid did - and we were so psyched w a great score. Doing calc now.

Do other kids applying to CWRU and BC-level colleges have AP Calc done in junior year?

Not all AP Precalc courses are alike. The college board curriculum provides 4 units, but only 3 are on the exam. So the true value of this course will *very much* depend on who it is taught/who is teaching it, even though this difference probably won't be visible on your child's transcript.

For that reason, some FCPS schools offer two versions of AP Precalc: AP Precalc "AB" and "BC", with the latter the version being the one that's more intense and covers all 4 units. Other districts provide DE/AP Precalculus which extends the CB curriculum with some additional items to match a DE curriculum, though it's not much.

So you need to carefully ask how it's taught. The barebones, 3 units version to just meet the College AP test is more of a joke than a fuller version would be that includes all the material traditionally taught in an honor precalc course, particularly one that prepares student to take Calc BC directly without spending another semester or year on Calc AB.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I listened to YCBK this morning on my commute and they were basically saying AP precalc is a joke. Ugh. This is the junior year class and AP test my kid did - and we were so psyched w a great score. Doing calc now.

Do other kids applying to CWRU and BC-level colleges have AP Calc done in junior year?

Not all AP Precalc courses are alike. The college board curriculum provides 4 units, but only 3 are on the exam. So the true value of this course will *very much* depend on who it is taught/who is teaching it, even though this difference probably won't be visible on your child's transcript.

For that reason, some FCPS schools offer two versions of AP Precalc: AP Precalc "AB" and "BC", with the latter the version being the one that's more intense and covers all 4 units. Other districts provide DE/AP Precalculus which extends the CB curriculum with some additional items to match a DE curriculum, though it's not much.

So you need to carefully ask how it's taught. The barebones, 3 units version to just meet the College AP test is more of a joke than a fuller version would be that includes all the material traditionally taught in an honor precalc course, particularly one that prepares student to take Calc BC directly without spending another semester or year on Calc AB.

But CWRU isn’t going to know any of this granular detail. People just do the best they can at their high school, and it works itself out.