How Princeton is Getting Around the Endowment Tax

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I've never attended one of these private schools with the massive need-based aid programs. Is it a weird dichotomy with basically only poor kids and rich kids and no real middle class?

I attended a state school so there were basically all types of kids, but lots of middle class.

That's exactly what I've noticed at DC's ivy. And it's a very different experience depending on which group you're in.

[Anonymous]

This just had me run the NPC for Princeton and DS could go there for $13k, wow. He is still several years off, but that does make me feel a little better since the price of college is insane and I hope for more schools to do similar (since actually getting into Princeton is of course very unlikely).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've never attended one of these private schools with the massive need-based aid programs. Is it a weird dichotomy with basically only poor kids and rich kids and no real middle class?

I attended a state school so there were basically all types of kids, but lots of middle class.

There is a lot of aid that goes to middle class families at a place like Princeton. At Princeton middle class is poor.

Not true. Our income is middle class but our assets are not. We had the audacity to save and live a lifestyle well within our limits. We ran Princeton’s NPC (as well as for other private schools) and it resulted in zero aid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've never attended one of these private schools with the massive need-based aid programs. Is it a weird dichotomy with basically only poor kids and rich kids and no real middle class?

I attended a state school so there were basically all types of kids, but lots of middle class.

There is a lot of aid that goes to middle class families at a place like Princeton. At Princeton middle class is poor.

Not true. Our income is middle class but our assets are not. We had the audacity to save and live a lifestyle well within our limits. We ran Princeton’s NPC (as well as for other private schools) and it resulted in zero aid.

I’m pp..,And let me add, my kid was very high stats including 1550 (no prep); NMF; valedictorian; 4.0/4.8 (5.2 upon graduating); high rigor); solid long term EC including niche sport and instrument both at state level.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Seems like a win for everyone!

Seems like it makes the endowment tax arbitrary stupid nonsense. Don't tax Princeton but tax MIT. Don't text Amherst or NYU but tax Notre Dame. This whole thing just seems pointless.

It is a Pigovian tax. It wasn’t intended to raise revenue. This is an optimal outcome, perhaps even an intended one.

It’s kind of crappy to be a family who makes just a tad over the line (or who have more than typical assets) who will pay full price while others just a tiny bit under the line pay none. I get the rationale but it’s not optimal from that perspective.

[Anonymous]

I think TCU is doing this too.

https://www.star-telegram.com/news/local/fort-worth/article311582144.html

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've never attended one of these private schools with the massive need-based aid programs. Is it a weird dichotomy with basically only poor kids and rich kids and no real middle class?

I attended a state school so there were basically all types of kids, but lots of middle class.

There is a lot of aid that goes to middle class families at a place like Princeton. At Princeton middle class is poor.

Not true. Our income is middle class but our assets are not. We had the audacity to save and live a lifestyle well within our limits. We ran Princeton’s NPC (as well as for other private schools) and it resulted in zero aid.

I’m pp..,And let me add, my kid was very high stats including 1550 (no prep); NMF; valedictorian; 4.0/4.8 (5.2 upon graduating); high rigor); solid long term EC including niche sport and instrument both at state level.

Princeton does not award merit aid to anyone. So what do stats have to do with it? Princeton will only award need based aid.

But with those stats a student can get merit aid at many institutions....but not princeton or any need blind ivy. You were not singled out. That is the case for every student.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think TCU is doing this too.

https://www.star-telegram.com/news/local/fort-worth/article311582144.html

That doesn't have anything to do with the endowment tax.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Seems like a win for everyone!

Seems like it makes the endowment tax arbitrary stupid nonsense. Don't tax Princeton but tax MIT. Don't text Amherst or NYU but tax Notre Dame. This whole thing just seems pointless.

It is a Pigovian tax. It wasn’t intended to raise revenue. This is an optimal outcome, perhaps even an intended one.

It’s kind of crappy to be a family who makes just a tad over the line (or who have more than typical assets) who will pay full price while others just a tiny bit under the line pay none. I get the rationale but it’s not optimal from that perspective.

Totally agree - this system is very binary - all or nothing. There will be a lot of gamesmanship among families to get below the line - ironically people will have an incentive to take a pay cut for a few years. It makes very little sense yet given the constraints Princeton is dealing with, I don't blame them. But as one who is not far over the line and also had the audacity to live somewhat conservatively and save money for college, it is frustrating. But life isn't fair - I'm fortunate to have more than most other Americans and college is not a God-given right.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I've never attended one of these private schools with the massive need-based aid programs. Is it a weird dichotomy with basically only poor kids and rich kids and no real middle class?

I attended a state school so there were basically all types of kids, but lots of middle class.

Aid goes to families making $250,000 so it's not like these families are poor.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I've never attended one of these private schools with the massive need-based aid programs. Is it a weird dichotomy with basically only poor kids and rich kids and no real middle class?

I attended a state school so there were basically all types of kids, but lots of middle class.

I think it's only partially related to the cost/financial aid, but between that and an emphasis on FGLI/minorities and athletes, there is much less room for the non-hooked, upper-middle-class white kid than there used to be.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Seems like a win for everyone!

Seems like it makes the endowment tax arbitrary stupid nonsense. Don't tax Princeton but tax MIT. Don't text Amherst or NYU but tax Notre Dame. This whole thing just seems pointless.

It is a Pigovian tax. It wasn’t intended to raise revenue. This is an optimal outcome, perhaps even an intended one.

It’s kind of crappy to be a family who makes just a tad over the line (or who have more than typical assets) who will pay full price while others just a tiny bit under the line pay none. I get the rationale but it’s not optimal from that perspective.

Totally agree - this system is very binary - all or nothing. There will be a lot of gamesmanship among families to get below the line - ironically people will have an incentive to take a pay cut for a few years. It makes very little sense yet given the constraints Princeton is dealing with, I don't blame them. But as one who is not far over the line and also had the audacity to live somewhat conservatively and save money for college, it is frustrating. But life isn't fair - I'm fortunate to have more than most other Americans and college is not a God-given right.

This is wrong. It is not binary but a sliding scale but Princeton is in a position to be generous.

But are you seriously saying " life is not fair" because you are unhappy with your financial aid award at Princeton? Are you the same poster that was so "squeezed" a college even though they had a car on campus and could only "occasionally" go out to a show? Some of you all are seriously in a bubble.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Seems like a win for everyone!

Seems like it makes the endowment tax arbitrary stupid nonsense. Don't tax Princeton but tax MIT. Don't text Amherst or NYU but tax Notre Dame. This whole thing just seems pointless.

It is a Pigovian tax. It wasn’t intended to raise revenue. This is an optimal outcome, perhaps even an intended one.

It’s kind of crappy to be a family who makes just a tad over the line (or who have more than typical assets) who will pay full price while others just a tiny bit under the line pay none. I get the rationale but it’s not optimal from that perspective.

Totally agree - this system is very binary - all or nothing. There will be a lot of gamesmanship among families to get below the line - ironically people will have an incentive to take a pay cut for a few years. It makes very little sense yet given the constraints Princeton is dealing with, I don't blame them. But as one who is not far over the line and also had the audacity to live somewhat conservatively and save money for college, it is frustrating. But life isn't fair - I'm fortunate to have more than most other Americans and college is not a God-given right.

Plus don't pretend that your approach to money and saving isn't helping you out in other ways. You might not be getting a college break, but there are so many other benefits you get by living this way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Seems like a win for everyone!

Seems like it makes the endowment tax arbitrary stupid nonsense. Don't tax Princeton but tax MIT. Don't text Amherst or NYU but tax Notre Dame. This whole thing just seems pointless.

It is a Pigovian tax. It wasn’t intended to raise revenue. This is an optimal outcome, perhaps even an intended one.

It’s kind of crappy to be a family who makes just a tad over the line (or who have more than typical assets) who will pay full price while others just a tiny bit under the line pay none. I get the rationale but it’s not optimal from that perspective.

Totally agree - this system is very binary - all or nothing. There will be a lot of gamesmanship among families to get below the line - ironically people will have an incentive to take a pay cut for a few years. It makes very little sense yet given the constraints Princeton is dealing with, I don't blame them. But as one who is not far over the line and also had the audacity to live somewhat conservatively and save money for college, it is frustrating. But life isn't fair - I'm fortunate to have more than most other Americans and college is not a God-given right.

This is wrong. It is not binary but a sliding scale but Princeton is in a position to be generous.

But are you seriously saying " life is not fair" because you are unhappy with your financial aid award at Princeton? Are you the same poster that was so "squeezed" a college even though they had a car on campus and could only "occasionally" go out to a show? Some of you all are seriously in a bubble.

I knew a recruited athlete at Princeton. His mom said she could "get their income" under the level. There is definitely "gamesmanship".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Seems like a win for everyone!

Seems like it makes the endowment tax arbitrary stupid nonsense. Don't tax Princeton but tax MIT. Don't text Amherst or NYU but tax Notre Dame. This whole thing just seems pointless.

It is a Pigovian tax. It wasn’t intended to raise revenue. This is an optimal outcome, perhaps even an intended one.

It’s kind of crappy to be a family who makes just a tad over the line (or who have more than typical assets) who will pay full price while others just a tiny bit under the line pay none. I get the rationale but it’s not optimal from that perspective.

Totally agree - this system is very binary - all or nothing. There will be a lot of gamesmanship among families to get below the line - ironically people will have an incentive to take a pay cut for a few years. It makes very little sense yet given the constraints Princeton is dealing with, I don't blame them. But as one who is not far over the line and also had the audacity to live somewhat conservatively and save money for college, it is frustrating. But life isn't fair - I'm fortunate to have more than most other Americans and college is not a God-given right.

This is wrong. It is not binary but a sliding scale but Princeton is in a position to be generous.

But are you seriously saying " life is not fair" because you are unhappy with your financial aid award at Princeton? Are you the same poster that was so "squeezed" a college even though they had a car on campus and could only "occasionally" go out to a show? Some of you all are seriously in a bubble.

I knew a recruited athlete at Princeton. His mom said she could "get their income" under the level. There is definitely "gamesmanship".

Under a certain amount is tuition free. It seemed like once you go over that threshold all of a sudden you have to pay full freight. That is not how it works.