Top universities are “top” essentially because of professional schools?

[Anonymous]

Literally top 4.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So I’ve noticed this thing with college rankings and it appears that the universities we consider to be “top” are top because of specifically business and law school rankings ( medical school is a different). With the exception of a handful of privates like Johns Hopkins or Rice, along with the ivies of Princeton and Brown, most universities derive their reputations primarily from just these two subjects. Take UVA for example. Historically, it is not well known in either stem or humanities quite frankly. Just compare their department rankings in economics or history to the more historically prestigious Michigan and Wisconsin. But, UVA is seen as comparable and even better than those two, based purely on business and law schools. Furthermore, undergraduate selectivity seems to be primarily generated through competitive pre law/pre-mba finance bros.

You're mistaken. Quite a few "elite" American universities don't have top tier business or law schools - Princeton, CalTech, Duke, Johns Hopkins, Brown, West Point, Annapolis, Williams, Amherst, Carnegie Mellon to name a few.

I'll grant you UVA though. Excellent law and business school.

And some are really well known in one graduate field and not the other. Or don't do it. Like Dartmouth and business. But no law school.

Duke currently has the #4 Law School and #12 business school according to U.S. News.

No one in law actually considers Duke a top 4 law school. harvard, yale, stanford, penn, chicago, northwestern, michigan, NYU, boalt, all out class it. This shows in the entering class stats as well.

People "in law" don't have intelligent opinions that are formed independent of US News. For as long as US News has been around, HLS has always had the absolute #1 Peer ratings (sometimes tied with Yale). But when US News changed the formula to heavily factor expenditure per student, they ensured that all smaller law schools would go up in rankings and HLS would go down. In the 1960s Yale made the curriculum kinder and gentler and thus started taking away many students who previously would have chosen Harvard. All of Yale's faculty stars are now at retirement age, and HLS is on the upswing again in terms of superb faculty quality, not to mention HLS' exceptional depth and breadth, and a general increase in quality of life (no grades). but it makes no difference until the USNEWS gods decide to change their bizarre quantitative weighting of various factors, which they will never do.

Duke is always regarded as a top law school by everyone. But a smart group of people might figure out that USNEWS is complete pile of crap. and should probably be ignored. This is DCUM, so unfortunately, this crowd will never figure it out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's T14 but not T4.

There is no top 4 only Top 6 for law schools and top 14. Top 6 has 7 schools--Yale Stanford Harvard Chicago Columbia NYU and now Penn is inching it's way up and some put it in there.

But you knew that?

[Anonymous]

This is why people should focus on schools with primary focus on undergrad programs like Princeton, Rice, Amherst types.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's T14 but not T4.

There is no top 4 only Top 6 for law schools and top 14. Top 6 has 7 schools--Yale Stanford Harvard Chicago Columbia NYU and now Penn is inching it's way up and some put it in there.

But you knew that?

Law school rankings. But you didn't know that?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's T14 but not T4.

There is no top 4 only Top 6 for law schools and top 14. Top 6 has 7 schools--Yale Stanford Harvard Chicago Columbia NYU and now Penn is inching it's way up and some put it in there.

But you knew that?

Law school rankings. But you didn't know that?

Speak English

[Anonymous]

All I knew was I went to GW for undergrad and law school students used to complain that the undergrad is holding back a higher ranking of the law school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:All I knew was I went to GW for undergrad and law school students used to complain that the undergrad is holding back a higher ranking of the law school.

To be fair, all law schools have a tendency to produce more than their fair share of successful alumni for the institution. Harvard law produces more movers and shakers in world affairs (heads of state, senators, NGO), high finance, business, filmmakers, judiciary, etc... than Harvard undergrad ever does, to be honest. BUT that's just a function of trying to pick people when their 17 vs 23+ and at a different stage of life. With some notable exceptions, the "tech talent" is often doing PHD work. It doesn't mean that it rubs off on the undergrad rankings...it's just different.

I can't really imagine that UG and Professional school rankings feed off each other this way. Princeton is doing great, for example.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's T14 but not T4.

There is no top 4 only Top 6 for law schools and top 14. Top 6 has 7 schools--Yale Stanford Harvard Chicago Columbia NYU and now Penn is inching it's way up and some put it in there.

But you knew that?

Law school rankings. But you didn't know that?

There are people who believe Duke is top 4 based on us news when other schools didn't submit data. It has never been considered a top 4 school - regardless of the T14 moniker which many are familiar with in the legal progression. Akin to M7 for MBA. It's just on the tail end of T14.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's T14 but not T4.

There is no top 4 only Top 6 for law schools and top 14. Top 6 has 7 schools--Yale Stanford Harvard Chicago Columbia NYU and now Penn is inching it's way up and some put it in there.

But you knew that?

Law school rankings. But you didn't know that?

There are people who believe Duke is top 4 based on us news when other schools didn't submit data. It has never been considered a top 4 school - regardless of the T14 moniker which many are familiar with in the legal progression. Akin to M7 for MBA. It's just on the tail end of T14.

And to clarify, the people who believe Duke is top 4 are duke alums who like to overrate their school and act condescendingly to people who went to better schools ironically.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What’s your basis for this claim? USNWR rankings are for undergraduate programs. Law schools have their own separate rankings. I don’t think a law school ranking directly correlates to the same school’s undergrad ranking or reputation. If someone didn’t go to law school, I don’t assume something about their undergrad degree based on that college’s law school program (that would make no sense).

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So I’ve noticed this thing with college rankings and it appears that the universities we consider to be “top” are top because of specifically business and law school rankings ( medical school is a different). With the exception of a handful of privates like Johns Hopkins or Rice, along with the ivies of Princeton and Brown, most universities derive their reputations primarily from just these two subjects. Take UVA for example. Historically, it is not well known in either stem or humanities quite frankly. Just compare their department rankings in economics or history to the more historically prestigious Michigan and Wisconsin. But, UVA is seen as comparable and even better than those two, based purely on business and law schools. Furthermore, undergraduate selectivity seems to be primarily generated through competitive pre law/pre-mba finance bros.

You're mistaken. Quite a few "elite" American universities don't have top tier business or law schools - Princeton, CalTech, Duke, Johns Hopkins, Brown, West Point, Annapolis, Williams, Amherst, Carnegie Mellon to name a few.

I'll grant you UVA though. Excellent law and business school.

And some are really well known in one graduate field and not the other. Or don't do it. Like Dartmouth and business. But no law school.

The service academies aren't really top of anything in terms of academics.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So I’ve noticed this thing with college rankings and it appears that the universities we consider to be “top” are top because of specifically business and law school rankings ( medical school is a different). With the exception of a handful of privates like Johns Hopkins or Rice, along with the ivies of Princeton and Brown, most universities derive their reputations primarily from just these two subjects. Take UVA for example. Historically, it is not well known in either stem or humanities quite frankly. Just compare their department rankings in economics or history to the more historically prestigious Michigan and Wisconsin. But, UVA is seen as comparable and even better than those two, based purely on business and law schools. Furthermore, undergraduate selectivity seems to be primarily generated through competitive pre law/pre-mba finance bros.

You're mistaken. Quite a few "elite" American universities don't have top tier business or law schools - Princeton, CalTech, Duke, Johns Hopkins, Brown, West Point, Annapolis, Williams, Amherst, Carnegie Mellon to name a few.

I'll grant you UVA though. Excellent law and business school.

And some are really well known in one graduate field and not the other. Or don't do it. Like Dartmouth and business. But no law school.

The service academies aren't really top of anything in terms of academics.

Way better than almost any SLAC though.

[Anonymous]

why did you skip over medical schools? JHU wouldn't have the reputation it has without its medical school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So I’ve noticed this thing with college rankings and it appears that the universities we consider to be “top” are top because of specifically business and law school rankings ( medical school is a different). With the exception of a handful of privates like Johns Hopkins or Rice, along with the ivies of Princeton and Brown, most universities derive their reputations primarily from just these two subjects. Take UVA for example. Historically, it is not well known in either stem or humanities quite frankly. Just compare their department rankings in economics or history to the more historically prestigious Michigan and Wisconsin. But, UVA is seen as comparable and even better than those two, based purely on business and law schools. Furthermore, undergraduate selectivity seems to be primarily generated through competitive pre law/pre-mba finance bros.

people in this area have a heightened opinion of UVA. the ROW don't put it in same breath as Michigan