Return of the CogAT

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, supposedly it was back last year for 2nd graders and then they didn't actually administer the test, so take it with a grain of salt. And it sounds like it is being used for SIPPI identification, which means nothing, rather than for CES admissions, where its use would be more meaningful.

If it’s being administered to 3rd graders, it could be for CES.

Lottery is more aligned with the DEI goals. Things like CogAT favor wealthy families. I remember my kids CES teacher asking how many kids prepped for it and 80% of the class raised their hands.

But right now the lottery uses MAP, which is based on exposure and most certainly favors white/wealthy families. CogAT would be better from that perspective in that its now based on exposure.

MCPS corrects for this by making it more difficult for kids from the white/wealthy schools to qualify for the CES lottery (i.e., "locally norming" their scores).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, supposedly it was back last year for 2nd graders and then they didn't actually administer the test, so take it with a grain of salt. And it sounds like it is being used for SIPPI identification, which means nothing, rather than for CES admissions, where its use would be more meaningful.

If it’s being administered to 3rd graders, it could be for CES.

Lottery is more aligned with the DEI goals. Things like CogAT favor wealthy families. I remember my kids CES teacher asking how many kids prepped for it and 80% of the class raised their hands.

How did they prepare? Classes? Tutors?

[Anonymous]

Is there any way to prepare for MAP R? What do they test on? We have a 3rd grader.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Is there any way to prepare for MAP R? What do they test on? We have a 3rd grader.

Read books

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Is there any way to prepare for MAP R? What do they test on? We have a 3rd grader.

You can do enrichment and tutoring to improve competency in reading which will improve the MAP-R score, but there isn't explicit test-prep that I'm aware of.

It's a diagnostic test, so it just tells you where your kid is based on MCPS and national averages.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My 3rd grader will have MAP M & MAP R (reading) test these 2 weeks. Do these early 2 test score count towards CES placement? Are these 2 tests different from the ones they take at 2nd grade? We have not had the back to school night yet, so we have no ideas what scores count and how will we notified.

Here are two websites with information from MCPS:

1- AEI -about SIPPI/GT Identification: https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/curriculum/enriched/
(mentions CogAT)

2- about the central review/ CES Lottery: https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/curriculum/specialprograms/elementary/center-enriched-studies (only mentions CogAT in the FAQ to say it was not considered last year)

The MAP used for CES has been only the winter one for several years. It is locally normed, so the percentile is not the national norm that is on your score report. They figure it out by grouping similar schools and norming just in that smaller group. It can be a lot lower in the wealthier schools.

[Anonymous]

mouseJerry wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, supposedly it was back last year for 2nd graders and then they didn't actually administer the test, so take it with a grain of salt. And it sounds like it is being used for SIPPI identification, which means nothing, rather than for CES admissions, where its use would be more meaningful.

If it’s being administered to 3rd graders, it could be for CES.

Could anyone please recommend a good CogAT book just for practice? Thanks

I just got one off of Amazon. My kid took the practice exam once. That was the extent of prepping. They did get into HGC (old name) and HS magnet; didn't apply to MS magnet (too far).

DC was a very advanced reader and talker starting from very early on (like 3). The practice exam was just to get DC familiarized with the test.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My 3rd grader will have MAP M & MAP R (reading) test these 2 weeks. Do these early 2 test score count towards CES placement? Are these 2 tests different from the ones they take at 2nd grade? We have not had the back to school night yet, so we have no ideas what scores count and how will we notified.

1) Only the MAP-R will count toward placement in the CES lottey, not the MAP-M. In the past, they have used the winter test, not the fall test.

2) Yes, they are different. The MAP-M has more challenging content than the MAP-P. And MCPS no longer administers a MAP reading test for K-2, so the MAP-R is completely new.

Last year a teacher with no notice pulled my 2nd grader along with a bunch of other students to do MAP-R (on top of having done dibels) and we have the MAP-R score result. Just fyi MCPS may give MAP-R to some 2nd graders.

[Anonymous]

mouseJerry wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, supposedly it was back last year for 2nd graders and then they didn't actually administer the test, so take it with a grain of salt. And it sounds like it is being used for SIPPI identification, which means nothing, rather than for CES admissions, where its use would be more meaningful.

If it’s being administered to 3rd graders, it could be for CES.

Could anyone please recommend a good CogAT book just for practice? Thanks

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Is there any way to prepare for MAP R? What do they test on? We have a 3rd grader.

Reading comp + vocabulary, best prep is just reading books.

[Anonymous]

If MCPS doesn't really care about SIPPi/GT identification and does it just to comply with state mandates, I wonder why would they bother with the hassle of adminstering an extra test for it?

Does that mean it's more likely they actually intend to use the COGAT for CES lottery/local enrichment placement instead?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, supposedly it was back last year for 2nd graders and then they didn't actually administer the test, so take it with a grain of salt. And it sounds like it is being used for SIPPI identification, which means nothing, rather than for CES admissions, where its use would be more meaningful.

If it’s being administered to 3rd graders, it could be for CES.

Lottery is more aligned with the DEI goals. Things like CogAT favor wealthy families. I remember my kids CES teacher asking how many kids prepped for it and 80% of the class raised their hands.

Here we go again. The poster thinks a national standardized race neutral exam is bad. Same goes for the idea you can prep course, but if that was true, the MCPS would probably offer a Saturday program for it. But they won’t because they know it doesn’t help. Who are these crazy people?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My 3rd grader will have MAP M & MAP R (reading) test these 2 weeks. Do these early 2 test score count towards CES placement? Are these 2 tests different from the ones they take at 2nd grade? We have not had the back to school night yet, so we have no ideas what scores count and how will we notified.

1) Only the MAP-R will count toward placement in the CES lottey, not the MAP-M. In the past, they have used the winter test, not the fall test.

2) Yes, they are different. The MAP-M has more challenging content than the MAP-P. And MCPS no longer administers a MAP reading test for K-2, so the MAP-R is completely new.

Last year a teacher with no notice pulled my 2nd grader along with a bunch of other students to do MAP-R (on top of having done dibels) and we have the MAP-R score result. Just fyi MCPS may give MAP-R to some 2nd graders.

MAP you can prep for. It’s basically a set of exams to see if you’re on, below, or exceed grade level. If you tutor on the side, your kid will score higher. Favors parents with resources.

Cogat is mostly pattern, spatial, reasoning exams. Think of it as a puzzle exam to see if your kid is clever. Difficult to ‘prep’ for.

Cogat will get your kid Mensa accepted but MAP won’t.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If MCPS doesn't really care about SIPPi/GT identification and does it just to comply with state mandates, I wonder why would they bother with the hassle of adminstering an extra test for it?

Does that mean it's more likely they actually intend to use the COGAT for CES lottery/local enrichment placement instead?

No, it's becuase the accelerated and enriched instruction office, which manages the SIPPI process, believes the Cogat is the appropriate test. DCCAPS, which conducts the lottery, does not. So you have it used for SIPPI and not for CES admission.