AO Application Review and Rating

[Anonymous]

Looking for more information like this for other schools:

Vanderbilt
Michigan
USC
Middlebury

How do you find it?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Looking for more information like this for other schools:

Vanderbilt
Michigan
USC
Middlebury

How do you find it?

There is a former AO that has a FB group for Michigan that answers questions about the process. https://www.empowered4college.com/

[Anonymous]

yale?

[Anonymous]

Notre Dame?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:yale?

For Yale, check out the “Inside the Yale Admissions Office” podcast.

[Anonymous]

Is someone going to do this for the other schools?

[Anonymous]

After looking at all of my kids applications, I’m starting to see how easy it is to see what an AO values.

It’s clear that Vanderbilt, for example, has one simple essay that does not touch on intellectual curiosity. They’re looking for leadership and impact - pure & simple.

Whereas a school like Duke or Northwestern is looking for a combination of intellectual curiosity, significant demonstrated positive impact, and social engagement.

Fascinating.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:After looking at all of my kids applications, I’m starting to see how easy it is to see what an AO values.

It’s clear that Vanderbilt, for example, has one simple essay that does not touch on intellectual curiosity. They’re looking for leadership and impact - pure & simple.

Whereas a school like Duke or Northwestern is looking for a combination of intellectual curiosity, significant demonstrated positive impact, and social engagement.

Fascinating.

You think you have gleaned this from the supplemental options alone? Is it just that Northwestern and Duke require/allow more supplementals?
And you conclude Vanderbilt only cares about leadership and impact even when they don't ask for that?

Fascinating.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After looking at all of my kids applications, I’m starting to see how easy it is to see what an AO values.

It’s clear that Vanderbilt, for example, has one simple essay that does not touch on intellectual curiosity. They’re looking for leadership and impact - pure & simple.

Whereas a school like Duke or Northwestern is looking for a combination of intellectual curiosity, significant demonstrated positive impact, and social engagement.

Fascinating.

You think you have gleaned this from the supplemental options alone? Is it just that Northwestern and Duke require/allow more supplementals?
And you conclude Vanderbilt only cares about leadership and impact even when they don't ask for that?

Fascinating.

Look at their admissions data (website or blog). What they highlight how they talk about what’s important.

The number of supplements a school has is an indicator of what they are looking for.

[Anonymous]

For the poster looking for how ECs are evaluated or scored and why.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Northwestern:

They like real genuine kids - little to no exaggeration. AO are focused on:

Intellectual impact: Northwestern isn’t just concerned about learning for learning’s sake (although that’s important, too). They also want to see how you can take your work in the classroom and use it to impact the world around you.

Research: Northwestern wants students who will take advantage of all the research initiatives on campus. They want you to think about (and demonstrate) entrepreneurship, innovation, and a keen eye for research.

Student support and community: Northwestern is big on supporting students and maintaining a strong sense of community. Browsing through information about student life will help you find your “fit.”

While academic preparation is the most important factor overall in the admissions process, this is a weeding out factor, meant to ensure that all of the students at Northwestern are academically prepared for the rigors of college courses. Excelling academically alone is not enough to guarantee acceptance. Northwestern uses a holistic admissions process, and while academics are considered in this, they are not the entirety of what the school is looking for.

Northwestern is interested in “fit,” the idea that a student and a college should be well-suited for each other. That is the students strengths, and what they want to pursue, should line up with what the school is looking for, and what they can offer to the student in turn. Students who are passionate, intellectually curious, and academically driven fit into the idea of Northwestern.

For extracurricular involvement, Northwestern is looking for passionate, focused students, as most other elite universities are. Students who demonstrate considerable talent and aptitude in their own niche as specialists are more likely to stand out and gain acceptance. Students who are good at many things but not great at any one thing have a harder time standing out.

Other big parts of NU's application review process:

Team-Based Reading
During the Early Decision cycle, applications are initially reviewed through a method known as "Team-Based Reading." In this phase, teams of two admissions officers collaboratively review each application file. This approach ensures a comprehensive assessment from multiple perspectives, which helps the admissions team gain a deeper understanding of each applicant's unique context and potential.

Class Shaping
Following the initial review, the process moves into the "Class Shaping" stage. Here, decisions are refined to ensure a diverse class, balancing factors such as academic interests, geographic origin, and other institutional priorities. This stage is crucial for building a well-rounded student body that aligns with Northwestern's values and goals.

Evaluation in School Groups
It is important to note that applications are evaluated in "school groups." This means that your profile will be viewed not only holistically but also in comparison to peers from your own high school. This approach places a strong emphasis on selecting the most challenging courses available and standing out within your specific educational context. Excelling academically and being an active participant in your local community is critical to improving your chances of admission.


How Academic Rigor is Graded at Northwestern
Northwestern evaluates academic rigor on a scale from 1 to 5, with a '1' or '2' typically required for admission:

Academic Rigor
Rating Description How to Achieve[i]
1 Highest Rigor Top 3% of class, 1500+ SAT/33+ ACT, maximizing AP/IB/Honors courses, demonstrated intellectual curiosity through research, high AP exam scores

2 Strong Rigor Competitive class rank, strong SAT/ACT scores, challenging coursework within context of your school
3 Moderate Rigor Solid academic performance, consistent effort in core subjects
4 Below Average Rigor Minimal engagement in challenging coursework
5 Limited Rigor Very limited academic effort

Extracurriculars:
At Northwestern University, extracurricular activities are not just a complement to your academic performance; they are a core part of your application, making up 30% of the overall evaluation. [This is higher than DUKE]

Northwestern assesses extracurricular involvement on a scale from 1 to 5, focusing on leadership and impact. It's essential that your involvement is not merely extensive but meaningful—leadership roles, national awards, or initiatives that have significantly impacted your community are highly valued.

Extracurricular Impact[u]
Rating Description Examples
1 National/International Recognition Olympic athlete, major film/TV roles, national youth orchestra
2 State-Level Achievement State-level music ensemble, Boys/Girls State, all-state athletic team, university-published research
3 Localized Leadership Captain of sports team, Gold Award/Eagle Scout, president of a significant club
4 Consistent Involvement Active member in multiple clubs or organizations for 2+ years
5 No Involvement NA

Fascinating.
So if you are applying from a private without the Tier 1 EC/Awards, but your classmate(s) have that, NU is a wasted application.

I would not say so. My kid is at NU with very basic ECs. Nice essays, great academics. Applied ED.

[Anonymous]

Looking for this info for Georgetown. Since the admissions guy is very old school, I wonder whether their process is as algorithmic as the others seem to be.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Duke:

So unlike the Ivies, Duke, has a strict numerical point system in which applicants are rated on six distinct criteria, as opposed to the two ratings given by the Ivies, so that when you apply to an Ivy League school, they give you an academic rating and a personal grade, those are the two ratings. When you apply to Duke, they have six different distinct ratings that they give you:

"For applicants to Trinity, applicants are rated on six different criteria, and each criteria is weighted 10 points for a total of 60 points maximum.

- Strength of curriculum (AP courses, etc.) = 10 points
- Grades and class rank = 10 points
- SAT/ACT scores = 10 points
- Extra-curricular achievement with focus on national awards = 10 points
- Essays = 10 points
- Letters of recommendation = 10 points"

And so generally, you wanted your overall composite score for these six different criteria to be over 45 to really have a serious shot of getting in.***

NOTE: Duke no longer giving numerical rating to standardized testing, essays in undergraduate admissions as of this year - so the scoring has changed to a max of 40 points instead of 60.

According to Guttentag, the only categories given numerical ratings now are the four categories that remain: “the strength of a student’s curriculum, their grades in academic courses, their extracurricular activities and the letters of recommendation.” Many people think this makes ECs MUCH MORE IMPORTANT at Duke than other T10s.

https://www.dukechronicle.com/article/2024/02/duke-university-undergraduate-admissions-changes-numerical-rating-standardized-testing-essays-covid-test-optional-ai-generated-college-consultants

Very helpful.

Has anyone’s kids seen their file at Duke? Curious what stood out from the admission officer review perspective. Wondering where I can find that type of information or level of detail.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Northwestern:

They like real genuine kids - little to no exaggeration. AO are focused on:

Intellectual impact: Northwestern isn’t just concerned about learning for learning’s sake (although that’s important, too). They also want to see how you can take your work in the classroom and use it to impact the world around you.

Research: Northwestern wants students who will take advantage of all the research initiatives on campus. They want you to think about (and demonstrate) entrepreneurship, innovation, and a keen eye for research.

Student support and community: Northwestern is big on supporting students and maintaining a strong sense of community. Browsing through information about student life will help you find your “fit.”

While academic preparation is the most important factor overall in the admissions process, this is a weeding out factor, meant to ensure that all of the students at Northwestern are academically prepared for the rigors of college courses. Excelling academically alone is not enough to guarantee acceptance. Northwestern uses a holistic admissions process, and while academics are considered in this, they are not the entirety of what the school is looking for.

Northwestern is interested in “fit,” the idea that a student and a college should be well-suited for each other. That is the students strengths, and what they want to pursue, should line up with what the school is looking for, and what they can offer to the student in turn. Students who are passionate, intellectually curious, and academically driven fit into the idea of Northwestern.

For extracurricular involvement, Northwestern is looking for passionate, focused students, as most other elite universities are. Students who demonstrate considerable talent and aptitude in their own niche as specialists are more likely to stand out and gain acceptance. Students who are good at many things but not great at any one thing have a harder time standing out.

Other big parts of NU's application review process:

Team-Based Reading
During the Early Decision cycle, applications are initially reviewed through a method known as "Team-Based Reading." In this phase, teams of two admissions officers collaboratively review each application file. This approach ensures a comprehensive assessment from multiple perspectives, which helps the admissions team gain a deeper understanding of each applicant's unique context and potential.

Class Shaping
Following the initial review, the process moves into the "Class Shaping" stage. Here, decisions are refined to ensure a diverse class, balancing factors such as academic interests, geographic origin, and other institutional priorities. This stage is crucial for building a well-rounded student body that aligns with Northwestern's values and goals.

Evaluation in School Groups
It is important to note that applications are evaluated in "school groups." This means that your profile will be viewed not only holistically but also in comparison to peers from your own high school. This approach places a strong emphasis on selecting the most challenging courses available and standing out within your specific educational context. Excelling academically and being an active participant in your local community is critical to improving your chances of admission.


How Academic Rigor is Graded at Northwestern
Northwestern evaluates academic rigor on a scale from 1 to 5, with a '1' or '2' typically required for admission:

Academic Rigor
Rating Description How to Achieve[i]
1 Highest Rigor Top 3% of class, 1500+ SAT/33+ ACT, maximizing AP/IB/Honors courses, demonstrated intellectual curiosity through research, high AP exam scores

2 Strong Rigor Competitive class rank, strong SAT/ACT scores, challenging coursework within context of your school
3 Moderate Rigor Solid academic performance, consistent effort in core subjects
4 Below Average Rigor Minimal engagement in challenging coursework
5 Limited Rigor Very limited academic effort

Extracurriculars:
At Northwestern University, extracurricular activities are not just a complement to your academic performance; they are a core part of your application, making up 30% of the overall evaluation. [This is higher than DUKE]

Northwestern assesses extracurricular involvement on a scale from 1 to 5, focusing on leadership and impact. It's essential that your involvement is not merely extensive but meaningful—leadership roles, national awards, or initiatives that have significantly impacted your community are highly valued.

Extracurricular Impact[u]
Rating Description Examples
1 National/International Recognition Olympic athlete, major film/TV roles, national youth orchestra
2 State-Level Achievement State-level music ensemble, Boys/Girls State, all-state athletic team, university-published research
3 Localized Leadership Captain of sports team, Gold Award/Eagle Scout, president of a significant club
4 Consistent Involvement Active member in multiple clubs or organizations for 2+ years
5 No Involvement NA

Fascinating.
So if you are applying from a private without the Tier 1 EC/Awards, but your classmate(s) have that, NU is a wasted application.

I would not say so. My kid is at NU with very basic ECs. Nice essays, great academics. Applied ED.

What was the major or academic area?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Looking for more information like this for other schools:

Vanderbilt
Michigan
USC
Middlebury

How do you find it?

There is a former AO that has a FB group for Michigan that answers questions about the process. https://www.empowered4college.com/

This