Question About UVA Admissions and Foreign Language

[Anonymous]

NP. I thought the normal course sequence is Language 1-4, then either AP or DE for the language in year 5. How do you take 6 years of a language?

[Anonymous]

My son doesn't love languages, but he can manage to pull an A in regular level each year.

He didn't want to leave anything to chance so took language all 4 years in HS (yes he also had a year in junior high).

A lot of Ivies specifically recite they want to see 4 years of foreign language---some schools also specify taking FL in high school (not counting MS).

It's going to vary. If anyone is unsure where the kid might apply---just take it is probably the advice I'd give.

I'm sure a bunch of people will write in and say their got into X university and didn't have 4 years in HS or only had 2 years total--but why leave anything to chance?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We will let you know. My son only went through Spanish 4 (in 8th through 11th grades), and he applied EA to the College of Engineering this fall.

He took a foreign language his junior year. OP’s kid doesn’t want to take one after sophomore year. That’s different.

This is the OP. My child also went through Spanish IV - only difference was that they completed Spanish 4 in 10th Grade (7th-10th grades).

I understand that. But whether they admit it or not colleges, including UVA, give less weight to language courses taken in middle school than high school.

Look, you are going to get all kinds of responses. You are going to get folks jumping in and saying they have kids who got in without taking a foreign language for four years in high school. That’s great. That doesn’t change the fact that majority do take a foreign language all four years and that UVA make it clear that that is the option that they prefer. Those are the facts. Allow anecdotes that differ to sway your opinion at your own risk.

When my kids were in high school and considering UVA, none of them had any interest whatsoever in stem. That did not stop them from taking four years of math and science up to and through the AP level. They did that because they knew that UVA wanted to see that kind of a transcript. It makes no difference that the student is interested in stem and wants to forego non-stem high school classes.

I hear you, and I think I am reaching the unfortunate conclusion that they will need to take two more years of Spanish in order to be competitive, but I find the whole thing ridiculous because they took two years of language in middle school while others did not. It is not quite the same thing as math, social studies, science, and language arts - all middle schoolers had to take these core subjects but they did not have to take a foreign language in 7th and 8th grade. My child chose to take a foreign language in addition to their other core classes in middle school and should be given credit for doing so.

I know very few students on a college track who didn’t start taking a foreign language in middle school.

Christ, I took French in middle school back in the 1980s. Most kids take at least level 1 in Foreign language in MS. It's not unique or special. AND- some kids may choose to start a completely different language in 9th. The language offereings tend to be more limited in most middle schools.

[Anonymous]

The Engineering school does not care about foreign languages. Your kid would be better off taking another math or science class than a 5th year of a foreign language.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:NP. I thought the normal course sequence is Language 1-4, then either AP or DE for the language in year 5. How do you take 6 years of a language?

Two of mine who had 6 years took two years of the FL as IB classes. Another went from a very strong public MS in Arlington to private HS and had to take a test at the HS to see his level of proficiency, along with two other friends going from the same public MS to the same private HS. Despite having 3 years of FL in MS they all tested as if having only 1 year. Generally MS foreign language is not as strong as HS and UVA likely knows that.

[Anonymous]

My DS took 3 years in MS but skipped Language this year as a freshman (2 APs at a W in MoCo and we wanted to make sure he had some reasonable electives; also a travel athlete). MS Counselor advised against it but it was the right decision for his first year.
We were thinking of having him continue to take language courses next year but for college credit at the community college in the summers, instead of during the school year.

Has anyone every tried something like this?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We will let you know. My son only went through Spanish 4 (in 8th through 11th grades), and he applied EA to the College of Engineering this fall.

He took a foreign language his junior year. OP’s kid doesn’t want to take one after sophomore year. That’s different.

This is the OP. My child also went through Spanish IV - only difference was that they completed Spanish 4 in 10th Grade (7th-10th grades).

Does FCPS offer Spanish 1 & 2 in middle school somewhere or are they coming from somewhere else? RCMS I know offers Spanish 1A in 7th and then Spanish 1B in 8th. My kid has done well but I'm concerned once he hits 9th grade the pace of Spanish 2 will be intense... but we didn't seem to have another option than this split of Spanish 1 across 7th and 8th.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We will let you know. My son only went through Spanish 4 (in 8th through 11th grades), and he applied EA to the College of Engineering this fall.

He took a foreign language his junior year. OP’s kid doesn’t want to take one after sophomore year. That’s different.

This is the OP. My child also went through Spanish IV - only difference was that they completed Spanish 4 in 10th Grade (7th-10th grades).

UVA is not going to care that your DS took Spanish in 7th and 8th grades. They want to see one language consistently taken in grades 9-12, including AP, assuming you DS's HS offers it. Taking Spanish in 9th and 10th and another language in 11th and 12th is not advisable and not what UVA is looking for. Even for engineering.

UVA prefers students who start later and achieve less. That’s why it’s better to take levels 1-4 in grades 9-12 than it is to take levels 1-6 in grades 6-11. I’m not going to tell you it makes sense. But that’s the rule: if you care about UVA, you should start later and achieve less.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We will let you know. My son only went through Spanish 4 (in 8th through 11th grades), and he applied EA to the College of Engineering this fall.

He took a foreign language his junior year. OP’s kid doesn’t want to take one after sophomore year. That’s different.

This is the OP. My child also went through Spanish IV - only difference was that they completed Spanish 4 in 10th Grade (7th-10th grades).

UVA is not going to care that your DS took Spanish in 7th and 8th grades. They want to see one language consistently taken in grades 9-12, including AP, assuming you DS's HS offers it. Taking Spanish in 9th and 10th and another language in 11th and 12th is not advisable and not what UVA is looking for. Even for engineering.

UVA prefers students who start later and achieve less. That’s why it’s better to take levels 1-4 in grades 9-12 than it is to take levels 1-6 in grades 6-11. I’m not going to tell you it makes sense. But that’s the rule: if you care about UVA, you should start later and achieve less.

Well some kids switch foreign languages in HS. They aren’t doing less. They might choose to take a FL that wasn’t offered in MS. My son didn’t want to take just Spanish or French—so when he got to 9th- he started a new language. His course load is not less in anyway.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:NP. I thought the normal course sequence is Language 1-4, then either AP or DE for the language in year 5. How do you take 6 years of a language?

For starters there’s AP language and AP lit

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The Engineering school does not care about foreign languages. Your kid would be better off taking another math or science class than a 5th year of a foreign language.

Yes, I agree, we should listen to this poster instead of what the dean of admissions actually posts on her blog.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The Engineering school does not care about foreign languages. Your kid would be better off taking another math or science class than a 5th year of a foreign language.

I posted a link directly from UVA’s website you did not read it so I am going to cut and paste here:

1. All of your core classes are important.
A lot of people focus on the core areas that correspond to their current academic interest. I've even had people wave off certain subjects because they aren't interested in them or they don't come "naturally" to them. High school is the time to get a broad education and college is the time to specialize (after foundation work). We are most concerned with a student's work in five core areas (in alpha order, not order of importance): English, Math, Science, Social Science, and World Language*.

At UVA, students don't even declare a major until the end of the second year in the College of Arts and Sciences or the end of the first year in Engineering and Architecture. The Nursing and Kinesiology students are the only ones admitted directly into a program. There's some data that says you are apt to change your mind about your major between senior year of high school and when you declare. This is why we don't want you to get too narrow in your focus in high school. A broad foundation will help in the long run.

3. Doubling up in one subject at the expense of the core doesn't "look good."
There are some students who are so excited about a certain subject that they want to double or even triple up on courses in that area. I don't think it's smart to drop core subjects to load up classes in one area. Cover the core and use your electives to explore your interests.

Nothing here says anything about this, not applying to the engineering school, and this is the Dean of admissions website.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We will let you know. My son only went through Spanish 4 (in 8th through 11th grades), and he applied EA to the College of Engineering this fall.

He took a foreign language his junior year. OP’s kid doesn’t want to take one after sophomore year. That’s different.

This is the OP. My child also went through Spanish IV - only difference was that they completed Spanish 4 in 10th Grade (7th-10th grades).

I understand that. But whether they admit it or not colleges, including UVA, give less weight to language courses taken in middle school than high school.

Look, you are going to get all kinds of responses. You are going to get folks jumping in and saying they have kids who got in without taking a foreign language for four years in high school. That’s great. That doesn’t change the fact that majority do take a foreign language all four years and that UVA make it clear that that is the option that they prefer. Those are the facts. Allow anecdotes that differ to sway your opinion at your own risk.

When my kids were in high school and considering UVA, none of them had any interest whatsoever in stem. That did not stop them from taking four years of math and science up to and through the AP level. They did that because they knew that UVA wanted to see that kind of a transcript. It makes no difference that the student is interested in stem and wants to forego non-stem high school classes.

I hear you, and I think I am reaching the unfortunate conclusion that they will need to take two more years of Spanish in order to be competitive, but I find the whole thing ridiculous because they took two years of language in middle school while others did not. It is not quite the same thing as math, social studies, science, and language arts - all middle schoolers had to take these core subjects but they did not have to take a foreign language in 7th and 8th grade. My child chose to take a foreign language in addition to their other core classes in middle school and should be given credit for doing so.

Goodness. No college cares what your kid did or didn't do in middle school.

[Anonymous]

Does Latin count as a foreign language?

[Anonymous]

OP again. I appreciate the poster who posted the information from UVA's website. That is extremely helpful and I will share it with my child. I think we have the answer and the risk seems too high not to take the foreign language class.