Why is there nothing between Rec and Low level travel?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I see the sport is softball. At 12, all the girls should be seeing significant playing time on a low level travel team. I’d keep an eye out for a new team as they are not all like this.

Do you have any idea why she doesn’t play, skill wise? Has the coach said anything? Some batting or pitching lessons, or learning a new position to fill a defensive hole can be helpful. In terms of getting playing time.

Also, some of the teams at this age are straight up daddyball, or are simply an established group that has been playing together for years already (nearly impossible to break into the starting lineup).

OP here. It must be hitting because her fielding is definitely average for the team’s abilities. The team is newly formed (wasn’t playing together last year.) I honestly sometimes wish they had just cut her at tryouts but there is no way to know that then.

That could definitely be it. Is she in the batting lineup every game (are they batting the roster, or only batting 9-10 girls?) How much playing time does she currently get, and at what positions typically? Can she pitch at all? Has the coach given any feedback at practice that might be a clue? I ask those questions because it really may just be a small thing or certain skill she needs to work on, to get herself into the mix. At age 12, improvement can be extremely rapid- sometimes things just need to “click” with a certain skill.. I certainly wouldn’t give up on travel softball due to this (and sounds like she plans to stick it out for the season regardless).

You could also straight up ask the coach but that is not always well received…

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. For us it’s softball, I’d rather not say where specifically but in Nova.

Keep looking. There are plenty of 12C teams that are really just rec players.

Heck, there's some C teams that could get beat by rec teams at 12C

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I see the sport is softball. At 12, all the girls should be seeing significant playing time on a low level travel team. I’d keep an eye out for a new team as they are not all like this.

Do you have any idea why she doesn’t play, skill wise? Has the coach said anything? Some batting or pitching lessons, or learning a new position to fill a defensive hole can be helpful. In terms of getting playing time.

Also, some of the teams at this age are straight up daddyball, or are simply an established group that has been playing together for years already (nearly impossible to break into the starting lineup).

I think the challenge is that even at the C level, its normal for coaches to just play 9 (or 10)on elimination day, and 2-3 girls sit.

So, OP's daughter may play on Saturday, but depending on where she bats in the line-up, may only get 1-2 plate appearances when the games when the games are capped at 80 minutes or the mercy rule ends the game early.

So from OP's perspective, they played 2 games on Saturday (and probably spent 8 hours at the field) for 3 at-bats, and then daughter may not have played at all on Sunday. But the coach's perspective is that she played in 2 out of the 3 (or 4) games of the weekend.

I get that frustration, even though its a part of the game

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I see the sport is softball. At 12, all the girls should be seeing significant playing time on a low level travel team. I’d keep an eye out for a new team as they are not all like this.

Do you have any idea why she doesn’t play, skill wise? Has the coach said anything? Some batting or pitching lessons, or learning a new position to fill a defensive hole can be helpful. In terms of getting playing time.

Also, some of the teams at this age are straight up daddyball, or are simply an established group that has been playing together for years already (nearly impossible to break into the starting lineup).

I think the challenge is that even at the C level, its normal for coaches to just play 9 (or 10)on elimination day, and 2-3 girls sit.

So, OP's daughter may play on Saturday, but depending on where she bats in the line-up, may only get 1-2 plate appearances when the games when the games are capped at 80 minutes or the mercy rule ends the game early.

So from OP's perspective, they played 2 games on Saturday (and probably spent 8 hours at the field) for 3 at-bats, and then daughter may not have played at all on Sunday. But the coach's perspective is that she played in 2 out of the 3 (or 4) games of the weekend.

I get that frustration, even though its a part of the game

This is an excellent point. It is a big change from rec and parents and kids often find it jarring. Sitting whole games or for large chunks is more jarring than the rec model where they bat the roster and don’t usually sit more than 1-2 innings in a row. Even if the at bats and playing time are equal or more, when looked at through a whole weekend or several games.

My son had a new kid join his 12U club team last year, and the mom was so shocked by this that she pulled her kid off the team after the first tournament. I think he played one full pool game and then sat the whole 2nd pool game. Then played maybe 1/2 the first Sunday game (was subbed out), sat the 2nd one. Something like that. It was pretty standard (especially for a new kid on the team coming out of rec, in his first tournament) but the mom completely flipped.

[Anonymous]

Different coaches have different philosophies, and I wish we'd thought to ask before we joined our DDs team. She's playing at the B level and the coaches still bat and play everyone equally, even the pitchers (who are clearly not equal...and key to winning games). It's a lovely sentiment that as kids they're still developing and all should play. But it's pretty frustrating to be a travel team run like a rec league, where everyone takes a turn at the outfield and sitting, for example. Winning isn't everything, but if we're paying a bunch of money and driving to tournaments it'd be nice for the kids to have a chance to win.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. For us it’s softball, I’d rather not say where specifically but in Nova.

Some leagues have rec plus. Also, different rec leagues. Some are stronger than others. Ours was quite competitive through 10u. If you were the best in our rec league, you definitely would not be one of the worst on a C team. How old is your daughter? Can you give a general geographical area? I wish I knew your team because I bet I could make other recommendations.

[Anonymous]

Batting lessons! The pitching is much faster in travel so it takes time to catch up to it as a hitter. My daughter barely hit at all in her first season of travel. By her second season she had a BA over .500. Just keep putting in the work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I see the sport is softball. At 12, all the girls should be seeing significant playing time on a low level travel team. I’d keep an eye out for a new team as they are not all like this.

Do you have any idea why she doesn’t play, skill wise? Has the coach said anything? Some batting or pitching lessons, or learning a new position to fill a defensive hole can be helpful. In terms of getting playing time.

Also, some of the teams at this age are straight up daddyball, or are simply an established group that has been playing together for years already (nearly impossible to break into the starting lineup).

I think the challenge is that even at the C level, its normal for coaches to just play 9 (or 10)on elimination day, and 2-3 girls sit.

So, OP's daughter may play on Saturday, but depending on where she bats in the line-up, may only get 1-2 plate appearances when the games when the games are capped at 80 minutes or the mercy rule ends the game early.

So from OP's perspective, they played 2 games on Saturday (and probably spent 8 hours at the field) for 3 at-bats, and then daughter may not have played at all on Sunday. But the coach's perspective is that she played in 2 out of the 3 (or 4) games of the weekend.

I get that frustration, even though its a part of the game

OP here. Yes, this is pretty much it. Since we are new to travel, it was a complete shock to us. Overall we like the team, girls, coaches, parents, etc. So we will probably let the year play out and then decide.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DC is 12 and we finally caved on doing travel this year as Rec was becoming unbearable for DC with all the new kids and kids who don’t take practice and games seriously. We tried the find the lowest key, lowest level travel team we could and DC is still the “worst” kid on the team and barely plays. I guess we will stick the year out but I don’t think this is for us.

I don’t understand why there isn’t a third choice - a league of kids like DC who were the top 1-3 kids on their Rec team but have no interest in sitting the bench in travel, private coaching or playing in college.

There is. It's usually called "all-stars" or something and is a post-regular season "travel light" experience. At least in diamond sports.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Different coaches have different philosophies, and I wish we'd thought to ask before we joined our DDs team. She's playing at the B level and the coaches still bat and play everyone equally, even the pitchers (who are clearly not equal...and key to winning games). It's a lovely sentiment that as kids they're still developing and all should play. But it's pretty frustrating to be a travel team run like a rec league, where everyone takes a turn at the outfield and sitting, for example. Winning isn't everything, but if we're paying a bunch of money and driving to tournaments it'd be nice for the kids to have a chance to win.

Yeah, unfortunately, you usually have to learn this lesson the hard way.

For 10U or 12u, its always a good idea to ask things like:

- what is your lineup strategy for tournaments? Does it differ between pool play and elimination day?
- what is your philosophy on defensive placement? Will girls focus on one or two position areas (essentially, are there going to be pods of girls (OF, Mid IFs, Corner IF, and Catcher) or do girls get more opportunities to try new positions? There are different approaches and they all have their merits, but its good to know.
- Depth chart on the team. For example, if DD is a catcher, I want to know how many other catchers are on the team, and where she falls on the depth chart. We've actually been on a baseball team for DS that produces a depth chart (and updates it throughout the year)

But if your DD really does love the sport, try to find the right fit of a team. Going back to rec is probably not the best answer. Finding a team more focused on development of all 12/13 girls is probably the answer. But also accepting the fact that if she doesn't produce much at the plate, these tournament games may only allow her 2-3 ABs each day. That time camp is tough when you're batting the whole lineup

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. For us it’s softball, I’d rather not say where specifically but in Nova.

PP here. Ok, so softball definitely has "all-stars" after the Spring season. It's the bridge between House/rec and full-on travel. It's a short summer season. The teams are selected but have committed players, just not as skilled as travel players. They play tournaments, etc. All the House organizations have them -- Arlington Spirit, for example. WLGSL Nationals. Just poke around.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I see the sport is softball. At 12, all the girls should be seeing significant playing time on a low level travel team. I’d keep an eye out for a new team as they are not all like this.

Do you have any idea why she doesn’t play, skill wise? Has the coach said anything? Some batting or pitching lessons, or learning a new position to fill a defensive hole can be helpful. In terms of getting playing time.

Also, some of the teams at this age are straight up daddyball, or are simply an established group that has been playing together for years already (nearly impossible to break into the starting lineup).

I think the challenge is that even at the C level, its normal for coaches to just play 9 (or 10)on elimination day, and 2-3 girls sit.

So, OP's daughter may play on Saturday, but depending on where she bats in the line-up, may only get 1-2 plate appearances when the games when the games are capped at 80 minutes or the mercy rule ends the game early.

So from OP's perspective, they played 2 games on Saturday (and probably spent 8 hours at the field) for 3 at-bats, and then daughter may not have played at all on Sunday. But the coach's perspective is that she played in 2 out of the 3 (or 4) games of the weekend.

I get that frustration, even though its a part of the game

OP here. Yes, this is pretty much it. Since we are new to travel, it was a complete shock to us. Overall we like the team, girls, coaches, parents, etc. So we will probably let the year play out and then decide.

Fall ball is also kind of weird, as coaches are trying things out but there are usually fewer games to be played.

Depending on the team, she may play 40-50 games in the spring, and she'll still get a TON more at bats than she would have had she stayed in rec.

Also, early in the spring, hopefully your coach schedules some scrimmages. And in my opinion, a good coach maximizes scrimmages by playing with the line-up and getting those girls more ABs by putting them at the top of the line up.

[Anonymous]

OP, how is your DD's team doing against other teams? I would start really watching the other teams and how much they move girls around, how the coaches treat the girls, etc. Don't give up. My DD went from rec to B travel ball and that was an adjustment for sure. But I see such a wide range of C teams (and B teams) in this area, I feel like there is a team for your daughter. Or a much stronger rec league.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. For us it’s softball, I’d rather not say where specifically but in Nova.

We do rec league softball in Nova and we have a mix of players who are hugely committed and some less so. We did travel one season and DD fit in fine with the level of play. We went back to due to the time and travel commitment. The thing we noticed about travel is that 90% of the conversations are about players jumping teams. They all want to go to a more competitive team and they all want more playing time. Our rec league teams are the same families we've known for years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Different coaches have different philosophies, and I wish we'd thought to ask before we joined our DDs team. She's playing at the B level and the coaches still bat and play everyone equally, even the pitchers (who are clearly not equal...and key to winning games). It's a lovely sentiment that as kids they're still developing and all should play. But it's pretty frustrating to be a travel team run like a rec league, where everyone takes a turn at the outfield and sitting, for example. Winning isn't everything, but if we're paying a bunch of money and driving to tournaments it'd be nice for the kids to have a chance to win.

If your only experience so far is fall ball, what you describe is normal and appropriate as fall is supposed to be more developmental. Things will tighten up in Spring.

Although when things really tighten up and parents learn their child really ISNT the second coming of Jennie Finch, that’s when the drama starts and the knives come out.