“I’d rather have a happy kid at UMD than a miserable one at Harvard”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You left out the very important precursor: "You don't want to hear this, and probably cannot process it at this stage, but it is far better for her to develop a strong social sense of self, have fun and friendships, and feel in control of her own life than is is to go to any particular college." Those are they very things she's developing now by not focusing all her energy on getting into Harvard to please somebody else.

I don't think the poster was saying UMD would make the child less depressed than Harvard per se. It's the path to Harvard and the expectation to get into Harvard at the expense of self.So saying the depressed Harvard student would be depressed (or as depressed) at UMD isn't fair because the future college student is developing her sense of self and attending to her current and future mental health by not putting all effort and hope for her future on Harvard.

Agency is a big deal for teens. Have you looked into the work of Madeline Levine? https://madelinelevine.com/books/the-price-of-privilege/

+1 This essay on stress in high achievers was in the Journal of College Admission Counseling and goes into this same issue:

https://lesshighschoolstress.com/part-1/

The same website also has links to a bunch of studies on how the pressure to overachieve in hopes of gaining admission to an elite college impacts many kids negatively:

https://lesshighschoolstress.com/research-study-links/

[Anonymous]

My own college experience inclines me to disagree with the OP.

Think of it in a different context. Would you agree with “I’d rather have a happy kid playing a D3 sport than a miserable one at the Olympics.” It makes perfect sense that higher pressure, more “excellent” institutions can be more stressful.

[Anonymous]

Not all kids who go to prestigious colleges are miserable. But all kids whose parents are overly invested in the kids going to prestigious colleges are either miserable, insufferable, or both.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My own college experience inclines me to disagree with the OP.

Think of it in a different context. Would you agree with “I’d rather have a happy kid playing a D3 sport than a miserable one at the Olympics.” It makes perfect sense that higher pressure, more “excellent” institutions can be more stressful.

Yes, of course, my kids’ happiness is more important than some external achievement. If they really want that achievement, then it’s different.

[Anonymous]

It appears that the prevalence of suicide at colleges is correlated with prestige. T50 ones appear to have far more suicides.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Not all kids who go to prestigious colleges are miserable. But all kids whose parents are overly invested in the kids going to prestigious colleges are either miserable, insufferable, or both.

Related: even if all kids who wind up at prestigious colleges were pushed relentlessly, it does not follow that all kids who are pushed relentlessly will wind up at prestigious colleges.

[Anonymous]

The premise of this story is false. NC State just reported the 7th student death this year alone. More people are miserable at lower level states than at ivies.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The premise of this story is false. NC State just reported the 7th student death this year alone. More people are miserable at lower level states than at ivies.

“Low level states” would be someplace like Salisbury.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I think you may have missed the point of that thread you cited. It seems very unlikely that anyone was trying to say that everyone who works hard enough to get into Harvard is going to be miserable.

But what's undeniable is that the assumption by many parents, students, high schools, etc. that one needs to be admitted to an elite college like Harvard in order to have a successful and happy life is steering a lot of kids toward misery. Many, many kids sacrifice sleep, healthy eating, friends, fun, etc. in pursuit of being one of the 5% who will be admitted, and they end up in poor physical and mental health when they enter whichever college they end up attending. They'll be miserable if they get into Harvard or if they end up at Maryland.

Yes, the intensity is a positive for academic and professional success, but kids need to learn the important skill of recognizing when they've reached their limits. Research is showing that 50% of kids are highly stressed out on a daily basis, and 25% have medically diagnosable depression. And that almost always follows them to college and the workforce. Is that who we want in leadership positions in the coming decades?

This NYU study might help in understanding what's going on:

https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpsyg.2015.01028/full

I agree with this point.

The people I knew, from my generation, who got into Harvard or MIT were naturally brilliant. They didn't focus their entire life around getting into an elite university. They had a life. Their youth wasn't taken up chasing something they're really not suited for..

Also, would any of us want one of these strivers to be our brain surgeon should we ever need one, or do we want the naturally brilliant individual to be our brain surgeon?

[Anonymous]

So the fact that someone else had an opinion that was different from yours kept you up at night and burned inside of you until you came on here to start a whole thread? And that thread is about someone else having an opinion that differs from yours?

[Anonymous]

If a kid who got into Harvard goes to a state school, s/he will almost surely be in some sort of selective honors program or major which is often a unique experience.

[Anonymous]

It is a false dichotomy.

[Anonymous]

Silly to get twisted into the elite/middling argument and not deal with the basic point, which is that you'll do better at a school where you are happier than one you chose for prestige without regard to cultural fit. That's just kinda basic truth.

[Anonymous]

IDK.. I have a friend who went to Harvard and hated every minute of it. They hated the people, and I think the weather made them unhappy, too. They were also originally from CA.

They transferred to Cal and was much happier.

Obviously, Cal is pretty prestigious, too, but I do think certain personalities wouldn't like certain types of schools.

[Anonymous]

I know two people (now 40) who got into and dropped outnof MIT. They were burnt out, other kids were much much smarter or at least coursework was easier for them. It took them years to recover. Gap years, Community college, state school. They are now regular professionals, nothing "special" career wise (one is a fed and one is a teacher) but happy in their circles who all went to a state school. Anecdotes aren't data and who know what would have happened if they went to a state school first and didnt have a crisis during their college years.