Dual citizens (US/Europe) - college options in Europe?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don’t think France requires residency - tuition is very low. The downside, OP, is that your children will need to master the language if attending a non-UK university, and that low-tuition universities are more exacting in their grading systems than US colleges. Given that students don’t pay high tuition, the schools will fail them if they’re not up to the standards, since there is no real financial downside for the student.

France mostly requires residency. A lot of misinformation in this thread.

[Anonymous]

I meant you don’t need to establish residency several months ahead of time.

https://www.letudiant.fr/amp/etudes/parcoursup/s-inscrire-sur-parcoursup-quand-on-est-lyceen-etranger-ou-que-l-on-ne-reside-pas-en-france-mode-d-emploi.html

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not true- the residency requirement is a UK thing. You won’t find that- at least not much/ on the continent.

So, what you are saying is that it IS true because the PPs were talking about UK. You also offer no info here. So maybe omit the judgment and add some info next time.

I think that poster is correct.

Typical universities on the Continent charts a very low tuition rate for everyone. The big exception is that Netherlands, but non-EU tuition is only about $14,000 per year. The problem there is housing.

I take issue with how they approached it. The UK experiences are not "wrong," PPs we were clear and id'd them accurately, so the "not true" was just unnecessary and inaccurate, frankly. Then that person added no info. Others have added more to the picture.

Here's another addition. Know a couple of kids studying at Maastricht.
Reasonable (click on tuition guide in this link). https://www.maastrichtuniversity.nl/support/your-studies-begin/tuition-fees/tuition-fee-guide-bachelor%E2%80%99s-programmes-202324

[Anonymous]

try beyondthestates

[Anonymous]

My kids are dual French-American citizens. The oldest is going to a private university in the US, the younger is considering Canadian unis, because she wants a cold climate. As French citizens, we can pay Canadian tuition in Quebec, which makes McGill the same price as our in-state flagship.

The French university system is very difficult to access for French expats who have something other than a Baccalaureat, so this was never a consideration. They don't want to go to another continental European country, but did/will consider UK universities, for which we would pay international tuition - but undergrad is generally 3 years there, instead of 4.

[Anonymous]

Spanish public universities are essentially free, like under 500 euros a year (and even that amount is usually automatically covered by govt scholarship).

Getting in to university in Spain is a little tricky for Spaniards educated outside of Spain, because of the of PAU (university entrance exam) and the Bachillerato requirement. Spanish students usually spend the last two years of high school preparing these exams which are given once a year in the spring. Those two years of study lead to the Bachillerato degree. A combination of Bachillerato grades + PAU score = the score that determines what your kid can major in. The score required to major in a field fluctuates from year to year and school to school.

Your kids may also have to take the DELE to show at least a B1 level of proficiency (although I think that requirement may be waived for Spanish citizens.) Also, if you want to go to a school in an autonomous region with another official language (Barcelona for example) you will need to show proficiency in Catalan, Basque, etc, as well.

There is a loophole, which is if your kid successfully completes the International Baccalaureate program in the US including passing the exams, that will be accepted by Spain as equivalent to the Bachillerato + PAU. You will have to get this certified by the UNED in Spain. If you don't have access to IB, there are adult education centers in Spain that are aimed at working adults that offer the 2 year bachillerato classes at night or through distance education.

I must warn you though that Spanish public university is nothing like American universities. It's all big lectures, grade is based on one exam, and it's very normal for professors to fail half the class so people have to retake classes and a 4 year degree often turns into a 7 year degree. I don't think many degrees are taught in English other than English philology.

[Anonymous]

Thing is though, with exceptions of some schools and countries, the public uni options in Europe are inferior to the US colleges in terms of student life/personal attention/career assistance.

In mainland Europe, especially Germany, France, and the like, the big public unis tend to be very big, more like a job, large classes, few resources, probably no dorms or centralised student life. The elites in these countries often, but not always, will send their kids to the US, UK, or elite European private unis. Or they'll have some sort of elite club or residential college, private from the university, for the kid to join—like in Germany, or like with the "colegio mayores" in Spain.

Do your research with each school and obviously there are exceptions:

- The UK as a whole, St Andrews, Oxbridge, the London unis, etc
- Ireland, though Trinity is probably the only university worth going to here as an international.
- More elite private unis—like Bocconi in Milan or IE in Spain. International unis and still cheaper than US schools. But vet other private unis carefully, there are many that aren't great.
- You could look for schools with more experience catering to international students, like Sciences Po, University of Maastricht in the Netherlands.
- You could look at Central European University in Vienna, though the undergrad programs are rather new.

[Anonymous]

Doesn’t Spain have like a 50% unemployment rate among the youth? Not the climate I would want my kid in.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not true- the residency requirement is a UK thing. You won’t find that- at least not much/ on the continent.

So, what you are saying is that it IS true because the PPs were talking about UK. You also offer no info here. So maybe omit the judgment and add some info next time.

I think that poster is correct.

Typical universities on the Continent charts a very low tuition rate for everyone. The big exception is that Netherlands, but non-EU tuition is only about $14,000 per year. The problem there is housing.

I take issue with how they approached it. The UK experiences are not "wrong," PPs we were clear and id'd them accurately, so the "not true" was just unnecessary and inaccurate, frankly. Then that person added no info. Others have added more to the picture.

Here's another addition. Know a couple of kids studying at Maastricht.
Reasonable (click on tuition guide in this link). https://www.maastrichtuniversity.nl/support/your-studies-begin/tuition-fees/tuition-fee-guide-bachelor%E2%80%99s-programmes-202324

Yes, interesting you've noticed that too. Maastricht is really trying to position itself as a good place for internationals—though more recruiting from across the EU than from the states at this point. Quite successfully so far, very interesting strategy. Were the kids you know there from the states or europe?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Doesn’t Spain have like a 50% unemployment rate among the youth? Not the climate I would want my kid in.

I'd say it's just silly probably for an American to attend a large public university in Spain.

But lots of internationals go to IE—private uni in Madrid with good outcomes, business, architecture, other subjects too.
University of Navarra attracts a fair number of internationals, but it is an Opus Dei uni.

Please, there's still lots of opportunities in Spain, Barcelona and Madrid are both big business centers. It's an EU member. And probably better quality of life than anywhere in the US. people love Spain.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My kids are dual French-American citizens. The oldest is going to a private university in the US, the younger is considering Canadian unis, because she wants a cold climate. As French citizens, we can pay Canadian tuition in Quebec, which makes McGill the same price as our in-state flagship.

The French university system is very difficult to access for French expats who have something other than a Baccalaureat, so this was never a consideration. They don't want to go to another continental European country, but did/will consider UK universities, for which we would pay international tuition - but undergrad is generally 3 years there, instead of 4.

Thanks for this message. Does this mean that you can't go to a French university if you don't have the IB degree?

[Anonymous]

Dutch universities are great for this purpose. They have many bachelor’s programs in English and have annual tuition for non-EU residents of $15,000 per year.

The problem is that they have too many international students, are trying to cut the number of international students, and have a bad housing shortage.

I’d be interested in hearing from people who know about English-language bachelor’s programs in Belgium, Germany and France.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My kids are dual citizens with an EU country. As far as universities, they’d have to be residents to get the low tuition. Mine don’t want to live there for the 18 months or whatever is needed to establish residency. That said, the non-resident tuition is still only about $15k/yr (plus off campus housing), so it would still be a relative bargain.

Living there for 18 months would totally be worth it if you graduated debt free. Since we qualify, will certainly look into getting our EU dual citizenship. Any drawbacks to getting the EU-US dual citizenship?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Depends on the country - for Germany you need a certain level of language proficiency. but yes, the price is right.

There was a poster on an older thread that said their EU-citizen nephew attended school in Denmark because it was in English and ended up meeting their spouse and settling there.

No you really don't. Many courses are taught entirely in English.

If you are talking master's degree programs, yes. Bachelor's not so much. If Bachelor, then mostly in engineering programs.

https://www.lmu.de/en/study/all-degrees-and-programs/index.html

Also, for Germany you might want to check with university in question directly, as it can be harder than anticipated to fulfill their entrance requirements. I am speaking from a friend's experience (German Prof working here and wanting to send their kid to Germany due to costs here).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kids are dual citizens with an EU country. As far as universities, they’d have to be residents to get the low tuition. Mine don’t want to live there for the 18 months or whatever is needed to establish residency. That said, the non-resident tuition is still only about $15k/yr (plus off campus housing), so it would still be a relative bargain.

Living there for 18 months would totally be worth it if you graduated debt free. Since we qualify, will certainly look into getting our EU dual citizenship. Any drawbacks to getting the EU-US dual citizenship?

My kid has it. None that we are aware of so far. Sometimes mixed up which passport to use at the airport, which will get a slightly disapproving stern look. Otherwise no issues so far.