How to have the "gay" talk?

[Anonymous]

So in a later post the OP said he saw a couple holding hands and was confused if one was a boy or a girl. Throughout elementary school years of my kids there were some girls that visually people did not know if they were boys or girls.

Odd to post this in red. On gay just say some girls prefer girls and some boys prefer boys. That 's just the way it is. On not being able to immediately discern male from female just say I thought she was a girl and everyone looks different. Leave it at that. Most 10 year olds know what gay is and I assume have seen gay couples or parents.

[Anonymous]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/06/02/AR2010060204478.html

[Anonymous]

Wow, DD knew at age 4 that some families have two mommies and some have two daddies. Its pretty normal for her and we don't have many gay families in our community.

[Anonymous]

As a gay person I am unsure that "most" 10 year olds "know" what it means to say that someone is "gay." I mean, a lot of kids use the term "gay" in a derogatory way, for one. So, OP, while I don't quite understand your anger in your subsequent posts, here's what I'd say. First, I think 10 is a little late to be having a talk about differences in people, but better late than never.

I think telling a kid something like "the girl we saw in the the store was grocery shopping with her partner. Sometimes girls love other girls and boys love other boys, and that's what it means if someone says someone is gay- it means that they love someone who is the same as they are. Some people say mean things about gay people or use the word gay to mean stupid, but we don't do that in our family, because it is hurtful."

Seems to me though, that above and beyond the person's real or perceived gayness, you were most curious/concerned about how to address the issue of someone whose gender presentation is confusing to you. I would have answered my son by saying (if you were sure)- "that was a girl. Some girls are more comfortable wearing clothes that usually boys wear- I think this girl was one of them."

People whose gender presentation doesn't match our expectations unsettle us, they unsettle kids who are learning to put things into categories. I think having questions is totally normal, but how you answer a kid can be really powerful. I'd just reiterate that no matter how a person looks we respect them, that it's rude to ask a person what gender they are, and that isn't it wonderful that we live in a world where people can be different from each other.

I could go on and on on this topic, but I'll just leave it at that I think that a lot of homophobia is rooted in discomfort with "butch" women and "femme" men. The more we can be comfortable with folks whose gender doesn't conform to societal norms the further along we'll be in fighting homophobia and sexism.

/soapbox

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As a gay person I am unsure that "most" 10 year olds "know" what it means to say that someone is "gay." I mean, a lot of kids use the term "gay" in a derogatory way, for one. So, OP, while I don't quite understand your anger in your subsequent posts, here's what I'd say. First, I think 10 is a little late to be having a talk about differences in people, but better late than never.

My 9.5 year old has heard the word "gay" on the bus and on the playground but I don't think he knows it's real meaning, he thinks it means "weird" because that is the way it is used at that age, as in, "That's so gay, dude!"

He doesn't know about homosexuals because we live in a suburban town and do not have any friends (that he would know) who are gay. It has not come up, and I guess we may be remiss in not bringing it up, but we are pretty conservative and we just haven't. When it does come up, I'm not going to put it in a negative light, but I'm not going out of my way to introduce until there is a context for it or he asks.

[Anonymous]

My children, who are 5 and 3, know about different types of families. Some families have a woman, man and children. Our neighbors are two women who live together, have no children, but are a family to each other. We have an elderly neighbor who lives alone but her children visit her and they are her family. My DD1's friend at school has only a mom, the friend says her mom "decided not to marry anyone, so she doesn't have a dad." Very matter of fact. The girl and her mother are each other's family.
It is, after all, just a matter of fact. I tell my kids that people grow up and choose who they want to live with or how they want to live. Anyone can be family. These people love each other the way that I love my husband and my children. My lesbian neighbors are "both girls" (according to my DD1) who live together because, as I explained, that's how they are happy. Anything else is really none of my business!
As far as how people dress, empower your children to be who they want to be (maybe later) by saying, those are just the clothes that person wants to wear. It's really not our business! what other people want to wear.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:NP here. She wants to be a boy? How do you know? That is taking a huge leap. A lesbian is not someone who wants to be a boy.

If it had been me, I would have said, "That's a girl." And if he asked why she was wearing boys' clothes, I would have said, "People like to wear all different kinds of things. She might just like those clothes more than dresses." And if he asked why she was holding hands with another girl, I might have said, "That might have been her girlfriend. Some girls want to date other girls just like some girls want to date boys." And if he asks why, I'd say, "Because you can't help who you like and who you fall in love with, and sometimes girls fall in love with other girls and sometimes boys fall in love with other boys."

I don't know.... what seems MORE logical than the above is that girls with short hair want to be boys.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As a gay person I am unsure that "most" 10 year olds "know" what it means to say that someone is "gay." I mean, a lot of kids use the term "gay" in a derogatory way, for one. So, OP, while I don't quite understand your anger in your subsequent posts, here's what I'd say. First, I think 10 is a little late to be having a talk about differences in people, but better late than never.

I think telling a kid something like "the girl we saw in the the store was grocery shopping with her partner. Sometimes girls love other girls and boys love other boys, and that's what it means if someone says someone is gay- it means that they love someone who is the same as they are. Some people say mean things about gay people or use the word gay to mean stupid, but we don't do that in our family, because it is hurtful."

Seems to me though, that above and beyond the person's real or perceived gayness, you were most curious/concerned about how to address the issue of someone whose gender presentation is confusing to you. I would have answered my son by saying (if you were sure)- "that was a girl. Some girls are more comfortable wearing clothes that usually boys wear- I think this girl was one of them."

People whose gender presentation doesn't match our expectations unsettle us, they unsettle kids who are learning to put things into categories. I think having questions is totally normal, but how you answer a kid can be really powerful. I'd just reiterate that no matter how a person looks we respect them, that it's rude to ask a person what gender they are, and that isn't it wonderful that we live in a world where people can be different from each other.

I could go on and on on this topic, but I'll just leave it at that I think that a lot of homophobia is rooted in discomfort with "butch" women and "femme" men. The more we can be comfortable with folks whose gender doesn't conform to societal norms the further along we'll be in fighting homophobia and sexism.

/soapbox

So well said. Thanks.

[Anonymous]

Agreed. Well said, PP and I hope a help to OP. Thank you.

And I don't think kids really do know what it is to be gay. Seeing things is not the same as understanding them. And kids at age 10 are trying to understand at a new level vs. the sort of conversation one has with a 5 year old. As PP said, the way we answer questions can be very powerful.

[Anonymous]

When my 4yo learned that his preschool friend had two mommies, his only question was, "but who cuts the lawn?"

Kids accept whatever reality is presented to them.

[Anonymous]

I'm a girl with short hair, but I don't want to be a boy. I just want to have short hair!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:When my 4yo learned that his preschool friend had two mommies, his only question was, "but who cuts the lawn?"

Kids accept whatever reality is presented to them.

Exactly.

[Anonymous]

"When my 4yo learned that his preschool friend had two mommies, his only question was, "but who cuts the lawn?"

Kids accept whatever reality is presented to them."

I agree that kids accept whatever reality is presented to them - and it's so wonderful to watch just how unassuming and accepting kids are. What my kids' preschool and elementary school friends say to my kids when they realize they have two moms is "you are soooo lucky".

[Anonymous]

Your kid will only think this is a big deal if you think it is. It is weird to me that that you have to worry about whether it is "time" to have "the talk" with him as if this is some sort of terrible thing that he might be too young to process.

[Anonymous]

I'm a girl with short hair, but I don't want to be a boy. I just want to have short hair!

Well, do you also wear jeans and t-shirts? Those are boy clothes, and if OP saw you, she could tell just by looking at you that really, you want to be a boy!

I find it unbelievable that a person in this day and age actually believes that a gay woman is just a woman who really wants to be a man. It's beyond bizarre that THAT was the explanation OP gave to her child - "that's a girl who wants to be a boy." WTF?!