Transgender pronouns when reminiscing of time before transition

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just had a chat with a trans acquaintance about this. I use the pronouns the person used at the time. Shrouding the past in such shame and darkness that entire chunks have to be deleted is unhealthy. There’s a lot that’s unhealthy about trans activism and this is one of the unhealthiest aspects.

This is so blatantly not for you to decide.

I don’t subscribe to the idea that because a person has decided to change pronouns, I have to pretend that the decades in which I knew them as what they were born as don’t exist. You don’t have the right to make society play along with your preferences. If your mental health cannot accommodate the fact that people remember who you were, then you need new meds.

I can understand why you feel this way, and how from your perspective, it feels like erasure. But I think you've actually almost hit upon the truth in your post with the bolded.

They WERE the person they are now, with the gender they are now. By insisting on calling them the pronouns that they used to use, you are, essentially, saying that she (for example) used to be a man. But she WASN'T a man. She's been a woman all along, and everyone was INCORRECT to be calling her by "he." And that was likely very, very difficult for her to deal with.

And I'm sure that most people's mental health can handle it, and as other people commented upthread, most trans people are understanding of errors in this department because they know it's hard for people. But there's a difference between an error, and knowingly using the wrong pronouns repeatedly because you shouldn't have to do hard things ever to be kind to people and let them own who they are.

When I was little, I took ballet. I used to mispronounce the word "ballet" all the time. I was like five. Now, when I say I took ballet lessons, I pronounce ballet correctly. Because I know it's pronounced "ballet" and that has been the correct pronunciation all along. The fact that I was saying it wrong at the time isn't relevant.

DP. Yes, she was a man before and is a woman now. They have not always been the new gender. They changed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just had a chat with a trans acquaintance about this. I use the pronouns the person used at the time. Shrouding the past in such shame and darkness that entire chunks have to be deleted is unhealthy. There’s a lot that’s unhealthy about trans activism and this is one of the unhealthiest aspects.

This is so blatantly not for you to decide.

I don’t subscribe to the idea that because a person has decided to change pronouns, I have to pretend that the decades in which I knew them as what they were born as don’t exist. You don’t have the right to make society play along with your preferences. If your mental health cannot accommodate the fact that people remember who you were, then you need new meds.

I can understand why you feel this way, and how from your perspective, it feels like erasure. But I think you've actually almost hit upon the truth in your post with the bolded.

They WERE the person they are now, with the gender they are now. By insisting on calling them the pronouns that they used to use, you are, essentially, saying that she (for example) used to be a man. But she WASN'T a man. She's been a woman all along, and everyone was INCORRECT to be calling her by "he." And that was likely very, very difficult for her to deal with.

And I'm sure that most people's mental health can handle it, and as other people commented upthread, most trans people are understanding of errors in this department because they know it's hard for people. But there's a difference between an error, and knowingly using the wrong pronouns repeatedly because you shouldn't have to do hard things ever to be kind to people and let them own who they are.

When I was little, I took ballet. I used to mispronounce the word "ballet" all the time. I was like five. Now, when I say I took ballet lessons, I pronounce ballet correctly. Because I know it's pronounced "ballet" and that has been the correct pronunciation all along. The fact that I was saying it wrong at the time isn't relevant.

DP. Yes, she was a man before and is a woman now. They have not always been the new gender. They changed.

I myself am not trans, but in my understanding, that is not generally the case. Perhaps there are people who really "change" genders, but for most trans people, my understanding is that transitioning socially is closer to "coming out" than "transforming" - she was always a woman.

[Anonymous]

I'm trans and there are certain words that are the equivalent to the N word for trans people. Calling someone their old gender is rude but not the same as one of the words that are slurs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kids tell me, the answer is yes. You have to use the new name and new pronouns for old memories.

I sometimes play it safe and default to "they"

“They” is not an appropriate way to refer to someone who identifies as a specific gender. It is offensive.

I was going to ask this. Isn’t “they/them” a specific nonbinary title who don’t gender themselves as either male or female? If it’s not appropriate to misgender someone who identifies as “she” as “he”, then it’s also not appropriate to refer to someone who identifies as “she” as “they”.

Yup, “they” is for nonbinary people, or general use when you don’t know someone’s gender. It’s not offensive if you’re not sure, but there is unfortunately definitely a thing where people deliberately refuse to gender trans women and trans men— mostly trans women— by using “they” instead of “she.” Kind of a passive aggressive “I acknowledge that you want to identify differently but will never use the terms you want me to because I don’t respect you,” misgendering. It doesn’t sound like PP is doing this at all but may want to be aware that what she’s trying to use to play it safe can also be used to be purposely hurtful.

Some of us are honestly trying to avoid being hurtful and going with what seems neutral when in doubt.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kids tell me, the answer is yes. You have to use the new name and new pronouns for old memories.

I sometimes play it safe and default to "they"

“They” is not an appropriate way to refer to someone who identifies as a specific gender. It is offensive.

I was going to ask this. Isn’t “they/them” a specific nonbinary title who don’t gender themselves as either male or female? If it’s not appropriate to misgender someone who identifies as “she” as “he”, then it’s also not appropriate to refer to someone who identifies as “she” as “they”.

Yup, “they” is for nonbinary people, or general use when you don’t know someone’s gender. It’s not offensive if you’re not sure, but there is unfortunately definitely a thing where people deliberately refuse to gender trans women and trans men— mostly trans women— by using “they” instead of “she.” Kind of a passive aggressive “I acknowledge that you want to identify differently but will never use the terms you want me to because I don’t respect you,” misgendering. It doesn’t sound like PP is doing this at all but may want to be aware that what she’s trying to use to play it safe can also be used to be purposely hurtful.

Some of us are honestly trying to avoid being hurtful and going with what seems neutral when in doubt.

Which is fine, and different from using they as a blanket term for everyone who doesn’t use traditional pronouns to match their gender as you identify them, or if you just don’t want to try and learn people’s preferences for which pronouns to use.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm trans and there are certain words that are the equivalent to the N word for trans people. Calling someone their old gender is rude but not the same as one of the words that are slurs.

No, words you don’t like to hear are NOT the equivalent of the N-word. Were people enslaved in America for being trans? Were schools segregated by trans and non-trans? Was the Ku Klux Klan formed to chase trans people? Was Jim Crow about keeping trans people subject to everyone else? Were two different amendments to the constitution, numerous Supreme Court decisions, and countless laws required to prevent everyone else from subjugating trans people?

Get the entire h3ll out of here with your hysterical, racist foolishness. The way the trans movement has tried to ride black people’s backs to the top has to end.

[Anonymous]

Thanks, OP, for this question. I certainly have a lot to learn. I really appreciate the perspectives of parents who can speak directly on this subject.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kids tell me, the answer is yes. You have to use the new name and new pronouns for old memories.

I sometimes play it safe and default to "they"

“They” is not an appropriate way to refer to someone who identifies as a specific gender. It is offensive.

I was going to ask this. Isn’t “they/them” a specific nonbinary title who don’t gender themselves as either male or female? If it’s not appropriate to misgender someone who identifies as “she” as “he”, then it’s also not appropriate to refer to someone who identifies as “she” as “they”.

Yup, “they” is for nonbinary people, or general use when you don’t know someone’s gender. It’s not offensive if you’re not sure, but there is unfortunately definitely a thing where people deliberately refuse to gender trans women and trans men— mostly trans women— by using “they” instead of “she.” Kind of a passive aggressive “I acknowledge that you want to identify differently but will never use the terms you want me to because I don’t respect you,” misgendering. It doesn’t sound like PP is doing this at all but may want to be aware that what she’s trying to use to play it safe can also be used to be purposely hurtful.

Some of us are honestly trying to avoid being hurtful and going with what seems neutral when in doubt.

This. It can be perplexing and some people are giving rules that sound more like a starbucks order.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm trans and there are certain words that are the equivalent to the N word for trans people. Calling someone their old gender is rude but not the same as one of the words that are slurs.

No, words you don’t like to hear are NOT the equivalent of the N-word. Were people enslaved in America for being trans? Were schools segregated by trans and non-trans? Was the Ku Klux Klan formed to chase trans people? Was Jim Crow about keeping trans people subject to everyone else? Were two different amendments to the constitution, numerous Supreme Court decisions, and countless laws required to prevent everyone else from subjugating trans people?

Get the entire h3ll out of here with your hysterical, racist foolishness. The way the trans movement has tried to ride black people’s backs to the top has to end.

Okay it’s not equivalent you are right. They are slurs. I am sorry for the statement.