12 year old daughter just said she might not be a girl

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m sorry your daughter is feeling depressed. Sounds like she has a lot on her plate. I have seen from my child’s friend group (that has been together since early elementary, so friendships were based on what they liked to do at recess - and it wasn’t sports). That out of 8 of them, only one identifies as straight. The others all identify as gay/trans/bi/asexual (you name it). I find this statistically impossible that this could be the case (again stressing that they didn’t find each other in an affinity group). I don’t think you will know what your daughter truly identifies as sexually and gender wise until she’s a bit older and has had a chance to mature.

This has been the exact same experience with my daughter’s friend group. I too am trying to be supportive and non-judgmental but it all comes at you pretty fast once they hit 12 or so, and I’m quite honestly a little confused. Just offering support, OP. There are a lot of parents feeling like you do.

While well-meaning, this attitude is exactly the problem. You can be “supportive” of children while also exercising judgment. Jesus Christ, people. Judgment is what distinguishes humans from other animals; and parents, elders—ADULTS—should have and demonstrate sound judgment. Your children are crying out for it, quite literally.

Look, with hormones going crazy, a mass culture that is very obviously exerting enormous pressure on kids to conform to some sort of genderless dystopia that doesn’t at all reflect the common sense reality kids can see and feel, it’s no wonder they are confused. I don’t blame them. But this half-baked parenting and the notion that you can’t impart values and exercise judgment when dealing with confused kids is going to be absolutely catastrophic.

9 in 10 kids are not homosexual or trans. It’s completely made up. Think about the harm being done to these young people by perpetuating this idiocy, and allowing them to be coerced by a warped mass culture.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m sorry your daughter is feeling depressed. Sounds like she has a lot on her plate. I have seen from my child’s friend group (that has been together since early elementary, so friendships were based on what they liked to do at recess - and it wasn’t sports). That out of 8 of them, only one identifies as straight. The others all identify as gay/trans/bi/asexual (you name it). I find this statistically impossible that this could be the case (again stressing that they didn’t find each other in an affinity group). I don’t think you will know what your daughter truly identifies as sexually and gender wise until she’s a bit older and has had a chance to mature.

This has been the exact same experience with my daughter’s friend group. I too am trying to be supportive and non-judgmental but it all comes at you pretty fast once they hit 12 or so, and I’m quite honestly a little confused. Just offering support, OP. There are a lot of parents feeling like you do.

While well-meaning, this attitude is exactly the problem. You can be “supportive” of children while also exercising judgment. Jesus Christ, people. Judgment is what distinguishes humans from other animals; and parents, elders—ADULTS—should have and demonstrate sound judgment. Your children are crying out for it, quite literally.

Look, with hormones going crazy, a mass culture that is very obviously exerting enormous pressure on kids to conform to some sort of genderless dystopia that doesn’t at all reflect the common sense reality kids can see and feel, it’s no wonder they are confused. I don’t blame them. But this half-baked parenting and the notion that you can’t impart values and exercise judgment when dealing with confused kids is going to be absolutely catastrophic.

9 in 10 kids are not homosexual or trans. It’s completely made up. Think about the harm being done to these young people by perpetuating this idiocy, and allowing them to be coerced by a warped mass culture.

How do you propose I go about imparting values to my questioning son? When I remind him that he is in a confusing and ever changing phase of development, he informs me that that's not the reason. Tweens and teens know it all. I'm afraid his therapist is gender affirming and entertaining these ideas. He doesn't want to switch therapists. I'm afraid if I end it, he will suffer. The best thing I've done, which I hope you'll approve of, is to tell him that no matter what he's struggling with, he still has responsibilities to himself, our family and his classmates and teachers and he better get his act together because life goes on and he has to honor his commitments and responsibilities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m sorry your daughter is feeling depressed. Sounds like she has a lot on her plate. I have seen from my child’s friend group (that has been together since early elementary, so friendships were based on what they liked to do at recess - and it wasn’t sports). That out of 8 of them, only one identifies as straight. The others all identify as gay/trans/bi/asexual (you name it). I find this statistically impossible that this could be the case (again stressing that they didn’t find each other in an affinity group). I don’t think you will know what your daughter truly identifies as sexually and gender wise until she’s a bit older and has had a chance to mature.

This has been the exact same experience with my daughter’s friend group. I too am trying to be supportive and non-judgmental but it all comes at you pretty fast once they hit 12 or so, and I’m quite honestly a little confused. Just offering support, OP. There are a lot of parents feeling like you do.

While well-meaning, this attitude is exactly the problem. You can be “supportive” of children while also exercising judgment. Jesus Christ, people. Judgment is what distinguishes humans from other animals; and parents, elders—ADULTS—should have and demonstrate sound judgment. Your children are crying out for it, quite literally.

Look, with hormones going crazy, a mass culture that is very obviously exerting enormous pressure on kids to conform to some sort of genderless dystopia that doesn’t at all reflect the common sense reality kids can see and feel, it’s no wonder they are confused. I don’t blame them. But this half-baked parenting and the notion that you can’t impart values and exercise judgment when dealing with confused kids is going to be absolutely catastrophic.

9 in 10 kids are not homosexual or trans. It’s completely made up. Think about the harm being done to these young people by perpetuating this idiocy, and allowing them to be coerced by a warped mass culture.

Ok, go on and tell your 13 year old that their feelings are wrong and their friends are wrong and that what they’ve learned in school is wrong and what’s happening in the greater culture in which they are steeped is wrong and let me know how that works out for your relationship. Yes, parents absolutely have a role to play here, but it is a very, very delicate line to walk at an age when it’s completely developmentally appropriate for kids to push away. The most important thing to them at this age is what their peers and friends are doing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Ok, go on and tell your 13 year old that their feelings are wrong and their friends are wrong and that what they’ve learned in school is wrong and what’s happening in the greater culture in which they are steeped is wrong and let me know how that works out for your relationship. Yes, parents absolutely have a role to play here, but it is a very, very delicate line to walk at an age when it’s completely developmentally appropriate for kids to push away. The most important thing to them at this age is what their peers and friends are doing.

Defiantly yes. And I say this as someone who has been in OP’s shoes. Know that at a certain point, the child will no longer be a child and can make their own choices. Whiteman Walker and Chase Breton (local LGBTQ healthcare) do allow informed consent over 18, meaning the no longer child can say yes to hormones. I decided when we got to that point that I wanted to be involved rather than pushed to the side. I figured it was better to be included and able to ask my questions (so all could hear the answers) of the doctors than to be never spoken to again by my kid.

I did get therapists, but when kids think they know themselves, it’ll only be the best who can get them to talk. And therapists are very affirming, they may not push back.

It is cheap to buy the clothes your child prefers and use the name and pronoun they would like. It’s expensive to lose all contact with your kid when they’re free to leave. I wasn’t going to have that happen. And can you imagine growing up thinking your parents won’t listen and don’t support (or even hate you?). Yes, this will be hard. I still struggle sometimes. But then I see my kid a freshman in college happy and confident, which is really important at this stage.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There's a lot to unpack. Is your child on social media? Have you talked about gender norms and expectations and stereotypes? Is this misogyny? Support and validate your daughter's feelings, but know that if she had body dysmorphia and felt she should have been born male, this would absolutely not be the first you hear of it.

This is what I'm unable to get past! OP here. I'm like, seriously, when you're almost 13 and have thrown yourself into this culture (LGBQ) and come out T? It's not computing for me.... It seems sort of chicken and egg-ish to me.

I left it that we love her no matter what, we're here for her, I acknowledged this might be exactly how she's feeling right now, that I'm not disbelieving her, but we need to be open that it may not be where she lands ultimately, that it may be something she moves through rather than it being her end of the road. OR NOT. I basically said it's a little tough to know at this point and it will be on all of us to see where this goes. I had to force myself to say these things, I have admit. I just don't see it. I'm probably going to hell here, and lightning is about to hit, but it does feel exactly how PPs have stated - this is all just too much. I did say (truthfully this time!) that I'm so happy that society and our culture allows for this type of introspection, but (as someone mentioned upthread) the numbers don't always add up, and most of us are in fact in the correct body. But that the important thing is to go through this process and be happy wherever you come out on the other end.

Damn. Parenting is a full contact sport....

[Anonymous]

She will change her mind about so many things so many times. It’s important not to be threatening or punitive but also not to go all in supporting any new idea or the day.

[Anonymous]

Hi, OP. I'm sorry you are going through this. Your post struck a chord with me because we just went through this in our house, although my child is a (now 13 year old) boy. I posted a thread back in August that is linked below. Like you, the transgender idea never rang true for us. As other people have written, it seemed to be widespread at his school, to an extent that seemed improbable. As we sit here today, he no longer identifies as transgender. He says he is gay, although I don't think that is set in stone either because as recently as two months ago he had a girlfriend.

I will offer three pieces of advice. First, be neutral and non-judgmental, but also warm and inquiring in such a way that she thinks critically about her situation. Before his announcement, our son was watching lots of videos on YouTube and had gotten a lot of misinformation and thought, for example, that he could become a girl and have a baby. It's important that she be able to count on you for both your love and clear thinking. Second, if your daughter has a phone or has access to the internet, I would consider dialing it way back unless you are 100% sure you know what sites she visits and are comfortable with them. In the short term, this may make you extremely unpopular. But my son's mental health improved quite a bit after we cut off his internet and especially YouTube. We now are slowly giving him back some access but with tight restrictions.

Third, a bad therapist is worse than no therapist. I noticed you said that your daughter made the announcement when she was in distress and depressed. I would be very wary of a therapist who is too affirming and does not take stock of the entire mental health status of your child. Like your daughter, our son had depression and other issues. I would suggest that you find a therapist who will help your daughter figure out how her depression, and any other issues are affecting her gender identity. We were lucky and found a good therapist.

One last thing, when my son first told us that he was transgender, he told us he had felt this way for a long time. But he later admitted that he had gotten this online from videos that give kids a script of things to tell their parents. In his case it was not true. So, it may not be true that your daughter has felt this way for a year.

https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/992382.page

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I mean, the schools and her peers are putting these ideas in her head. She probably isn’t trans, though— she is trying on identities and that is ok. She will go through a lot of these phases and pronouncements in the years ahead so just roll with it.

This. My kids friends who turned from girls into boys or vice versa did it for attention seeking and are now back to their biological genders. I think we will look back upon this time and think our schools went too far with this, which in turn confused a lot of kids and resulted in a lot of misplaced attention-seeking behavior. Of course there are real situations but the numbers don't line up.

So true!

+1. OP, frankly, there is no way I’d allow a 12 year old to go down this path. Get to the bottom of what is causing or influencing this self destructive behavior and put a stop to it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Hi, OP. I'm sorry you are going through this. Your post struck a chord with me because we just went through this in our house, although my child is a (now 13 year old) boy. I posted a thread back in August that is linked below. Like you, the transgender idea never rang true for us. As other people have written, it seemed to be widespread at his school, to an extent that seemed improbable. As we sit here today, he no longer identifies as transgender. He says he is gay, although I don't think that is set in stone either because as recently as two months ago he had a girlfriend.

I will offer three pieces of advice. First, be neutral and non-judgmental, but also warm and inquiring in such a way that she thinks critically about her situation. Before his announcement, our son was watching lots of videos on YouTube and had gotten a lot of misinformation and thought, for example, that he could become a girl and have a baby. It's important that she be able to count on you for both your love and clear thinking. Second, if your daughter has a phone or has access to the internet, I would consider dialing it way back unless you are 100% sure you know what sites she visits and are comfortable with them. In the short term, this may make you extremely unpopular. But my son's mental health improved quite a bit after we cut off his internet and especially YouTube. We now are slowly giving him back some access but with tight restrictions.

Third, a bad therapist is worse than no therapist. I noticed you said that your daughter made the announcement when she was in distress and depressed. I would be very wary of a therapist who is too affirming and does not take stock of the entire mental health status of your child. Like your daughter, our son had depression and other issues. I would suggest that you find a therapist who will help your daughter figure out how her depression, and any other issues are affecting her gender identity. We were lucky and found a good therapist.

One last thing, when my son first told us that he was transgender, he told us he had felt this way for a long time. But he later admitted that he had gotten this online from videos that give kids a script of things to tell their parents. In his case it was not true. So, it may not be true that your daughter has felt this way for a year.

https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/992382.page

Thank you so much for this post. I really appreciate it. -OP

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Hi, OP. I'm sorry you are going through this. Your post struck a chord with me because we just went through this in our house, although my child is a (now 13 year old) boy. I posted a thread back in August that is linked below. Like you, the transgender idea never rang true for us. As other people have written, it seemed to be widespread at his school, to an extent that seemed improbable. As we sit here today, he no longer identifies as transgender. He says he is gay, although I don't think that is set in stone either because as recently as two months ago he had a girlfriend.

I will offer three pieces of advice. First, be neutral and non-judgmental, but also warm and inquiring in such a way that she thinks critically about her situation. Before his announcement, our son was watching lots of videos on YouTube and had gotten a lot of misinformation and thought, for example, that he could become a girl and have a baby. It's important that she be able to count on you for both your love and clear thinking. Second, if your daughter has a phone or has access to the internet, I would consider dialing it way back unless you are 100% sure you know what sites she visits and are comfortable with them. In the short term, this may make you extremely unpopular. But my son's mental health improved quite a bit after we cut off his internet and especially YouTube. We now are slowly giving him back some access but with tight restrictions.

Third, a bad therapist is worse than no therapist. I noticed you said that your daughter made the announcement when she was in distress and depressed. I would be very wary of a therapist who is too affirming and does not take stock of the entire mental health status of your child. Like your daughter, our son had depression and other issues. I would suggest that you find a therapist who will help your daughter figure out how her depression, and any other issues are affecting her gender identity. We were lucky and found a good therapist.

One last thing, when my son first told us that he was transgender, he told us he had felt this way for a long time. But he later admitted that he had gotten this online from videos that give kids a script of things to tell their parents. In his case it was not true. So, it may not be true that your daughter has felt this way for a year.

https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/992382.page

This might be hard. Many therapists are afraid of being accused of gate-keeping (and all that may result including harm to their professional reputation), so they are either going affirmation only or refuse to take on clients who are questioning their gender.

[Anonymous]

I feel the need to clarify -- I didn't post to debate whether trans folks are real. I do believe fully in supporting people who are trans to live their lives the way they want/need to, and yes, I know some trans folks and quite a lot of LBGTQ folks (but understandably part of my chosen profession).

I'm not planning on putting my daughter on hormones or making any grand decisions. The counseling is to address the depression. I'm trying not to blow up our relationship while I wait this out and decide IF it's "real." I'm of the opinion, in HER case, that it's not but that's because I know my daughter. I also admit I don't want it to be real FOR HER, but I'm not making that statement on behalf of all folks who are trans.

This is supposed to be a supportive forum, a place for people to inquire about these difficult issues, not a place to dump your criticisms about the veracity of gayness, etc. I'm a complete atheist - I would never dream of going into the religion forum and telling everyone how made up and destructive religions are. What even possesses some of you to come here?

OP - who is left handed, and so is my daughter.

[jsteele]

Locking per OP's request.