Race in college admissions is back in front of the Supreme Court Oral Argument on Oct. 31 (Monday)

[Anonymous]

Have a great weekend!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:LMFAO WTF PEOPLE

Claiming that Math and English Tests are biased.

Also claiming that scoring likability, courage, without even looking at the person is legit, and Harvard is right.

DISGUSTING. NO SHAME.

It’s comical but when people do poorly on an objective test they grasp for an explanation other than their own shortcomings. We live in a victimhood culture where nobody wants to take personal accountability for anything. It’s the fall of Rome.

What’s your working definition of “objective “?
When people know so little about the process of test construction, norming, and validating, yet insist — with nothing to support their assertions— that only “a culture of victimhood” could possibly account for questioning an assessment tool, it’s anything but comical. I might agree with you about the “fall of Rome” though — albeit for very different reasons.

Yes. These posters who think standardized tests are objective haven't read the research. Also, they are one data point that many colleges do consider, so why up in arms about TO or holistic? Most likely from parents who have prepared their kids to perform well on certain metrics and want those alone to count as "merit."

Yep. Follow the money. Scores are highly correlated to zip codes.

Hmm... standardized testing created by eugenicists and segregationists. What could possibly go wrong?

OMG.. here we go again.

Please explain how SAT math questions are racist.

Also, why bother with GPA, since grading is subjective, right?

Why bother looking at academics at all since, apparently, college "education" is more than just about "education".

You are misquoting here. Posters have said that a college education in the US is about more than just academics. US colleges are interested in educating the whole student. They want their graduates to be able to go forward and be leaders in their communities, not just workers in a business.

Academics are important, but they aren’t the *only* characteristic colleges are looking at when they put a class together.

Here's what I was responding to: " standardized testing created by eugenicists and segregationists. "...

Sure, SAT is one data point. So is GPA. So, why bother looking at GPA, then? Why not make that optional, too? Grades can be over inflated, as we all know, so GPAs should definitely be optional.

Standardized tests were created by segregationists, per the PP. Well, so was holistic admissions, yet they still use it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
You are misquoting here. Posters have said that a college education in the US is about more than just academics. US colleges are interested in educating the whole student. They want their graduates to be able to go forward and be leaders in their communities, not just workers in a business.

Academics are important, but they aren’t the *only* characteristic colleges are looking at when they put a class together.

They should not look at race when they do it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
You are misquoting here. Posters have said that a college education in the US is about more than just academics. US colleges are interested in educating the whole student. They want their graduates to be able to go forward and be leaders in their communities, not just workers in a business.

Academics are important, but they aren’t the *only* characteristic colleges are looking at when they put a class together.

They should not look at race when they do it.

I agree but after all is said and done and only 1% of the class is <fill in the protected class> and that is way lower than that population they have created a biased selection methodology.

[Anonymous]

In 2018:

707 black kids got a 5 on AP CalcBC
19,710 Asian kids got a 5 on AP CalcBC

Herein lies the problem

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In 2018:

707 black kids got a 5 on AP CalcBC
19,710 Asian kids got a 5 on AP CalcBC

Herein lies the problem

In U.S. education based on the unique history of this country, I'm not surprised this gross disparity exists.

However in strictly looking at the zero sum dynamic of elite college admissions, it is supply and demand.

Those 707 black students - and black students of that caliber - are in extremely high demand.

When you see the news articles about a black kid getting accepted to ALL of the Ivies, this is the cohort.

So when detractors say that these same black kids at elite schools are " unqualified," no they are not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In 2018:

707 black kids got a 5 on AP CalcBC
19,710 Asian kids got a 5 on AP CalcBC

Herein lies the problem

In U.S. education based on the unique history of this country, I'm not surprised this gross disparity exists.

However in strictly looking at the zero sum dynamic of elite college admissions, it is supply and demand.

Those 707 black students - and black students of that caliber - are in extremely high demand.

When you see the news articles about a black kid getting accepted to ALL of the Ivies, this is the cohort.

So when detractors say that these same black kids at elite schools are " unqualified," no they are not.

?? Why would anyone say these kids who got 5 on AP Calc BC are not qualified? most of them are probably well qualified. However when we go color blind, they might not get in all of the Ivies. Race should not be treated as rare commodity. These kids are probably the biggest victims of Affirmative Action. They don’t get the credit they deserve.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In 2018:

707 black kids got a 5 on AP CalcBC
19,710 Asian kids got a 5 on AP CalcBC

Herein lies the problem

In U.S. education based on the unique history of this country, I'm not surprised this gross disparity exists.

However in strictly looking at the zero sum dynamic of elite college admissions, it is supply and demand.

Those 707 black students - and black students of that caliber - are in extremely high demand.

When you see the news articles about a black kid getting accepted to ALL of the Ivies, this is the cohort.

So when detractors say that these same black kids at elite schools are " unqualified," no they are not.

?? Why would anyone say these kids who got 5 on AP Calc BC are not qualified? most of them are probably well qualified. However when we go color blind, they might not get in all of the Ivies. Race should not be treated as rare commodity. These kids are probably the biggest victims of Affirmative Action. They don’t get the credit they deserve.

Good lord getting a 5 in bc calc does not make you “qualified” for an Ivy. I mean I guess they’re qualified in a literal sense that they can do the work but there probably at least 100,000 college aspirants every year who can do the work at Harvard. That ratio on this very basic credential is just one of the many mins boggling large disparities in achievement at the top end.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In 2018:

707 black kids got a 5 on AP CalcBC
19,710 Asian kids got a 5 on AP CalcBC

Herein lies the problem

That shows opportunity not ability to learn

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In 2018:

707 black kids got a 5 on AP CalcBC
19,710 Asian kids got a 5 on AP CalcBC

Herein lies the problem

If you’re going to throw around numbers, please provide a citation/link to back up your data.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In 2018:

707 black kids got a 5 on AP CalcBC
19,710 Asian kids got a 5 on AP CalcBC

Herein lies the problem

That shows opportunity not ability to learn

Opportunity is different but not nearly different enough to justify this.

Also, where there is a will there is a way. Plenty of poor Asian families are in that 19000. Plenty of families who busted their butt to live in neighborhoods with good schools because education was their #1 priority. Opportunity is a combination of your circumstances and the choices you make.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can see SAT is not the issue when they go Color Blind next year orderd by the Suprment Court.

TO would be advantageious to plenty of Asiasn as well with color blind policy as shown in Berkely, UCLA, CalTech.
Its' really funny that some people think it would only help URMs.

You really need to go to the real sources of the problem if you want real solutions and imporvements.
Blaming on SAT or asking for free points is not even a quick fix.

What are the "real sources" of the problem? What would you propose to improve the problem?

I don't mind spending more tax and support in the lower income area for education.
Tutor service, better teachers, resrouces for test prep, etc. equip them to compete.

This is the American way of solving a problem. Just throw more money at the problem and the problem goes away. It's not that simple because some people lack a work ethic or have different priorities. The problem is complicated and involves blaming people for the choices they are making. So instead of dealing with the real issue, they simply choose to low standards for blacks/hispanics, which is deemed acceptable by Democrats.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In 2018:

707 black kids got a 5 on AP CalcBC
19,710 Asian kids got a 5 on AP CalcBC

Herein lies the problem

That shows opportunity not ability to learn

Nope. Everyone has the opportunity to take the AP exams. You just have to want it. Value the importance. Basically, education needs to be a priority for you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In 2018:

707 black kids got a 5 on AP CalcBC
19,710 Asian kids got a 5 on AP CalcBC

Herein lies the problem

That shows opportunity not ability to learn

Nope. Everyone has the opportunity to take the AP exams. You just have to want it. Value the importance. Basically, education needs to be a priority for you.

I think those who prioritize education are the ones matriculating at T25 colleges.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In 2018:

707 black kids got a 5 on AP CalcBC
19,710 Asian kids got a 5 on AP CalcBC

Herein lies the problem

If you’re going to throw around numbers, please provide a citation/link to back up your data.

Not quite the same as PP, but https://digitalcommons.csp.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1192&context=cup_commons_grad_edd shows ~30% of Asian kids scored 5 while far fewer black (4%) or Hispanic (12%) scored a 5 in Calc AB.