Are you expected to help your family? How about friends?

[Anonymous]

OP from another thread here. DH and I do better financially than both our families (and most people, on the whole) combined. Clearly, some will use that sentence to flame me, which I will ignore. What I am looking for here is advice from those who do better than the rest of their family, and how they handle it. In other words, I am often given the rather strong impression that DH and I are expected to help out the rest of his and/or my family. Not only with essentials, but with also with ridiculous requests. I would rather not provide examples, though I know there are some that like to pry. Of course, it is easier to say no the ridiculous requests, but what about requests that are used as leverage. One example I am willing to give: if it DC's birthday, and we fly family members in for the birthday, we are expected to pay for all of them if we want them to attend and take part in DC's life once per year. Does anyone else experience this kind of manipulative behavior?

I believe it is in part due to a jealous sibling or two (on both sides) who relays that DH and I have money trees (or something?) to the rest of the family. The part that really bothers me is that if it were DH or I, DH and I know for certain that we would be on our own with no one to help, as so many times before. We ask nothing of our families, lest we be told of how difficult their lives are, blah, blah, blah....In fact, their lives are the least difficult of anyone we know, they just expect from us for some reason. Perhaps they resent us?

For the second part of the question, I believe I know the answer. Many will retort "find new friends!", but I find this behavior prevalent and the answer not so easy. If DH and I (for example) go out to eat with another couple, we are often expected to pay. Or, if there is a birthday, anniversary, holiday, we are expected to give outrageous gifts. One friend even wants us to throw her a lavish party with "benefits" we didn't even have at our our gorgeous wedding (that we paid for ourselves - friend did not and actually has no clue about money!) I am really discouraged and put out at this behavior. We help both DH and my families as mentioned above, while our friends parents are still supporting our friends! We don't have that luxury. We are not showy and most people would have no idea about our finances. For example, our cars are ten years old! You would have to be extremely nosy and delve really deep to find out. But we do not discuss money with our friends or family, period. BTW, I can not stand nosy people!

As I mentioned, we have turned down many of their ridiculous requests. How do you handle this type of manipulation? Sorry for the long post. I am just tired.

[Anonymous]

OP you and your DH are suckers ... and people are taking advantage of you.

I have family members with better incomes than me and I have some with lower incomes than me. I don't expect anyone to help me out - either with necessities or extras - nor should your family. I do buy generous gifts for my family especially for the kids. I will buy some of the higher end gifts but the parents don't ask nor do the kids and it is not expected!

Now if it was a bad situation and a family member needed money and I could give it to them, then sure I would do so.

As for friends, unless it is a specific invitation from a friend as in "Let us take you guys out to lunch (dinner, drinks, etc...)" I would never, ever expect my friends to pick up the tab and I have friends who make considerably more money.

[Anonymous]

Could it all stem from "habit?"

My DH used to make significantly more than his friends, because he was a lawyer and friends with a lot of people in lawschool that were barely making any money. So he tended to always pick up the tab. But then it became a habit - where no one would even offer to pick it up - and he started getting invited out - just so he would pick up the tab. This persisted even after the incomes all leveled off. The only way to really stop it was for him to just say no. The more outrageous the request, the more reason to say no.

Of course now, after several years and life changing events - we are by far the poorest of our friends. The one set of friends (who we used to pick up the tab) has been quite kind to us. We never expect them to pay for anything, but they do offer up free babysitting - which is wonderful. The ones that are long gone - well - they were never our friends to begin with.

Family - now that never was an issue.

[Anonymous]

Somewhat of a similar situation in our family, in that we tend to pay the way for anyone in the family who cannot...airline tickets, vacation rental houses, dinners out, etc. We did this without giving it much though for many years, when we had a very high HHI. Now we live on much less, but still significantly more than our parents and most of our siblings. The free ride is still expected, which irks me a little sometimes. But I also realize it's up to us to just stop picking up the tab all the time. Honestly, it's a hard habit to break when you still have it better than most. But we're trying.

[Anonymous]

For your family, I can only hope they love you for what you are, but have grown to expect financial help from you and find it hard to resist. If you explain you are not in that position anymore, I think they would understand. They might not be able to come to all your events, though, or contribute much to joint vacations etc but it does not mean they resent you.

Anyway, I advise you to pay for events you truly care about which might not happen if you did not pay - such as the birthday party travels, if you really wish out-of-towners to attend.

And develop tone-deafness to any attempts to make you foot the bill at dinner, or other sponging!

We are quite poor compared to other family members, and they have generously offered help multiple times - which we accepted on some occasions (job loss, etc) and refused in others.

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the replies so far! We really are being suckers sometimes. DH and I have really worked our butts off, so we should be telling more people to suck it It seems more difficult when it is family, even though we have nothing to feel guilty about. There happens to be no small children in our family, except our own. I should add that sadly no one goes out of their way for them as they did when the other grandchildren (now grown and gone) were their age. I am not usually one to feel sorry for myself, but my post is driving me that way. Keep the advice coming, clearly I need it. Thanks.

[Anonymous]

I'm the poor relative. I usually can't afford to travel to the family week at the beach, so I decline. My aunts and parents have always said "you must come, I'm buying your plane tickets". At which point I accept, go, and have a wonderful time. Is this "taking advantage"? FWIW, before I had a child and the cost of childcare ate up my whole discretionary budget, I paid my own way, including chipping in on the house rental. When that became too much for my budget, family stepped in. And I'm eternally grateful, as I really enjoy the time we spend together.

[Anonymous]

In your shoes, I would decide where your boundaries are, and apply them. If you are willing to pay for parents to fly in, then do that, and no more. In DH's working-class family, we are the high earners (though with a HHI <$200 we are not rolling in money), and I find that DH's siblings have a tendency to *tell* us to kick in $X for family events (e.g. the ILs' big wedding anniversary). Usually it's more than we can or want to spend. Our standard operating procedure is, "sounds like a nice idea; we can contribute $Y." When they protest and tell us they need $X, we tell them that sorry, $Y is what we can give them, and that if it's not enough maybe the plan should change.

RE friends and treating to dinner, etc., that is just bizarre. Turn a deaf ear.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm the poor relative. I usually can't afford to travel to the family week at the beach, so I decline. My aunts and parents have always said "you must come, I'm buying your plane tickets". At which point I accept, go, and have a wonderful time. Is this "taking advantage"? FWIW, before I had a child and the cost of childcare ate up my whole discretionary budget, I paid my own way, including chipping in on the house rental. When that became too much for my budget, family stepped in. And I'm eternally grateful, as I really enjoy the time we spend together.

I think the OP's point wasn't that they accepted the offer, but that they were started to expect the offer and actually request other things. So it would be kind of like you saying "a week at the beach, great - but could you upgrade me to First-Class this time, because I don't like being uncomfortable."

[Anonymous]

It's interesting that you make a big deal of saying you're not showy but then talk about your "gorgeous" wedding. You talk about one or two jealous siblings but apparently it's in BOTH of your families, and then you talk about how your friends are on the take too. These are pretty big red flags that makes me think you are either creating these situations yourself or perceiving them in a way that isn't quite accurate.

You're under no obligation to fly your relatives out for your family events, but they are under no obligation to attend either. I would invite them with the assumption that they pay their own way. If they decide not to come because of the cost, then it's up to you to decide if you want them there badly enough to foot the bill. If you do, then offer, and don't be offended when they say yes. If it's not that important to you, let it go.

As far as giving lavish gifts or paying for other couples' dinners, I'm curious how you know such things are "expected." When the check comes, do they hand it directly to you? What if you guys just didn't pay it? When you give a gift that's not sufficient, do people ask for more? Here again, I think you might be a little more preoccupied with your own financial success than other people are. I would just pay my half of the check, give whatever gift I'm comfortable with, and if someone wants to discuss it they can feel free.

[Anonymous]

one other thing about picking up the check for your friends. if you are inviting them to expensive restaurants that they normally wouldn't afford on their own, backing out of this is somewhat harder. If they invite you somewhere, I would say just throw your credit card in, hand it to them, and say 'shall we split it?' - but that wouldn't be fair if you picked a place beyond their means.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:One example I am willing to give: if it DC's birthday, and we fly family members in for the birthday, we are expected to pay for all of them if we want them to attend and take part in DC's life once per year.

Except for very specific cases, I think that it would be best to limit paid trips to one's parents or children.

Do you go to visit those other family members? Are they spread out or in one place?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm the poor relative. I usually can't afford to travel to the family week at the beach, so I decline. My aunts and parents have always said "you must come, I'm buying your plane tickets". At which point I accept, go, and have a wonderful time. Is this "taking advantage"? FWIW, before I had a child and the cost of childcare ate up my whole discretionary budget, I paid my own way, including chipping in on the house rental. When that became too much for my budget, family stepped in. And I'm eternally grateful, as I really enjoy the time we spend together.

I don't think you are taking advantage. When I offer to pay someone's way, I do it out of kindness and the desire to really enjoy their company. If someone is asking me all the time to pay their way, that's something entirely different.

[Anonymous]

A *v e r y* wealthy friend once confided in me (after I mentioned wanting to reciprocate after a few really terrific meals that she'd insisted on paying for), "I wouldn't want to eat at any of the places you could afford."

We'd grown up together and were like sisters. I shrugged it off, but felt terrible when her actual sister gave a pointed tsk tsk after another dinner. I took it as heavy disapproval that I wasn't doing my share.

She didn't just set an expectation, she made it a rule.

That's one side of it (happened back in my 20s). The other side (after I finished grad school), I took over my parents' mortgage payment to free them up. They NEVER asked and it seemed like a simple thing to do.

Pay it forward, sure, but in your case I'd have to draw a line.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
A *v e r y* wealthy friend once confided in me (after I mentioned wanting to reciprocate after a few really terrific meals that she'd insisted on paying for), "I wouldn't want to eat at any of the places you could afford."
We'd grown up together and were like sisters. I shrugged it off, but felt terrible when her actual sister gave a pointed tsk tsk after another dinner. I took it as heavy disapproval that I wasn't doing my share.

She didn't just set an expectation, she made it a rule.

That's one side of it (happened back in my 20s). The other side (after I finished grad school), I took over my parents' mortgage payment to free them up. They NEVER asked and it seemed like a simple thing to do.

Pay it forward, sure, but in your case I'd have to draw a line.

So she got the wealth but not the class. How sad.