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Political Discussion
Gaza War, Part 3
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Anonymous
That’s not true. Jews were never told To go home by Europeans. Jews were highly assimilated and wealthier than most Christians in Europe because they were into banking and jewelry /diamond trading in Africa . Europeans quite Liked Jews because they were lenders of Money and helped the poor. They decided to “go home” on their own accord and it was decided in the late 1800s that settling in Palestine would Be a goal. This was long before the rise of Nazi Germany. Zionism started as a fringe highly unpopular movement by Jewish religious extremists who wanted to leave Europe. Nuremberg Laws were supported by the Zionist movement to push immigration to Palestine . Most Jews didn’t want to leave Europe and Europe didn’t want the Jews to leave. Some Zionists said the Jews who died in Nazi concentration camps are martyrs for Israel. This sounds eerily similar to what Hamas says now that Gazans dying are Martyrs for a Palestinian state. Both sides have historically chosen power and global sympathy over self preservation. This is why the US should realize the negotiations are hopeless. Both sides exploited their tragedies. Hamas lives for free in Qatari five star hotels just by using the Palestinian sympathy card. Neither side has any real motive to stop the situation. With a two state solution and no Hamas , Israel won’t be able to justify getting so much military aid from us. Both sides will like and choose the money any time over the peace . |
Anonymous
They came from (i.e. were expelled from) the land of Israel. |
Anonymous
Are you effing kidding me?! Have you not heard of Pogroms? Why do you think Jews were clamoring to get into the United States throughout the nineteenth century? Banking and jewelry?! A tiny minority of Jews in Europe were assimilated rich business people. (Jews have genetic issues because of the historic LACK of assimilation). Almost all of them lived apart from Europeans in poverty in shtetls and worked in trades--where do you think all the names like Silverstein, Silverman and Sugarman came from? This is the most ignorant thing I've seen on here all day, and that's quite a feat! |
Anonymous
This is a jaw-droppingly selfish, illogical, truly stupid, racist, and supremacist argument! People lived in the area for tens of thousands of years before Judaism was invented, possibly as early as almost 200,000 years ago (https://www.nhm.ac.uk/discover/news/2018/january/humans-left-africa-40-000-years-earlier-than-we-thought.html). Judaism did not really develop as a monotheistic religion until the Babylonian captivity (around the 6th century BCE). Jews lived in the area for a brief snapshot of human history. All of us except those who are purely African have ancestors who lived in the area on their way out of Africa, and most of them did so long before Judaism was invented. By your logic, why can't these people legitimize the "right to return"? And what about the many people who lived in the area contemporaneously with Jews, some of whom were Jewish, and stayed on, and whose descendants became the Palestinians? These people may now be Jewish, Christian, Muslim, Druze, or something else entirely. Why are they not considered indigenous, and what gave European invaders the right to ethnically cleanse them? And then how "ancestral" is Israel to people who are predominantly European? My blond-haired, blue-eyed Ashkenazi friend took a DNA test and came out almost 90% Polish and about 10% Egyptian. As she herself says, what gives her the right to displace people in the Levant whose ancestors have lived there for 100,000 years? The entire premise of Israel is racist and wrong. |
Anonymous
FFS, there hasn't been a PM in Israel since its inception who would dare come within 100 feet of a 23andMe or Ancestry.com test kit. This idea of indigenous rights and fairytale Mizrachi claims - it's just disturbing how these distortions are used to displace ACTUAL indigenous people, and so ruthlessly. |
Anonymous
Jews. aren't. European. It doesn't matter if your friend has blonde hair, blue eyes and had ancestors in Poland. My DNA test results said 100% "Jewish". No region. Just Jewish. Jews were a nomadic people. No one referred to Armenians living in Europe as European; they are Armenian. It's the same thing. And people really need to separate Jews, the ethnic group, from people who practice Judaism, the religion. It would be so much clearer if we referred to ethnic Jews as Hebrews, the way people used to (and what is stamped on my ancestors' papers when they came here from Eastern Europe --- not Polish, not Russian, but "Hebrew"), or Judeans. Your whole comment is focused on the "invention" of Judaism. The fact is that the people who practiced that religion were around long before the religion itself. Most Jews are atheists, ffs. Jews are indigenous to the Levant. As are Palestinians. They share far more DNA with each other than with Poles and Germans. |
Anonymous
It is no less likely that your DNA test results say Wookie than "Jewish". |
Anonymous
Have you ever asked yourself why a group of Europeans, who were lucky enough to survive a war, no less, would have any interest in moving to a primitive patch of desert outside of Europe? Is this something that you think would be appealing to Russians? Why? |
Anonymous
I'd post them but I doubt that's allowed. |
Anonymous
Are you serious? Land that comes at no cost that you can displace others from on the basis of a fairytale biblical claim? That sounds pitch perfect for a group that acts like the settlers in the West Bank, wouldn't you say? |
Anonymous
No, I actually really don't understand why Poles, Germans, Austrians, etcetera, would opt to leave their first world homeland of Europe to live in the desert. Because they wouldn't. Jews wanted to. Do you know any Europeans? Ask THEM if they think Jews living in Europe are European. Even now. |
Anonymous
If one is offered land and possibly a house (perhaps by then the bodies of the real owners, who were raped and executed by the Irgun or an early iteration of the IDF would be almost cold), it would appeal to many people. Warm climate. Ethnically fairly homogenous, rather like those white supremacist camps up in Idaho. You can see why that would appeal to some people. And while the Holocaust was horrific and traumatic, there was never any reason why innocent and indigenous Palestinians should EVER have been ethnically cleansed for the convenience of the colonizers. The whole idea is sickening. |
Anonymous
+1000 |
Anonymous
The planet is littered with ancestral homelands of peoples that are now homelands to other peoples. "My long long long time ancestors have lived here once" isn't a good justification for "now I get to evict you because ancestral homeland." |
Anonymous
LOL honey at the time of the 90s aliya any country other than Russia was appealing to Russians. Please don't delude yourself that the Russian Jews came to Israel out of love for the "ancestral homeland". Anyone who could leave was leaving at the time. Jews had an out that no one else did. In fact, there was a brisk trade in marrying Jewish boys and girls for the ticket out. |