Do we stay in DC or move to Baltimore?
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Anonymous
Gimme the 10% on $700K in an area with far lower crime and taxes please. Thanks! |
Anonymous
Hey, I'm the previous poster who just moved to Hampden after a long time in another part of Baltimore -- happy to answer any specific questions as I'm obsessed by the RE market here. If you are looking at public schools, I'd encourage you to consider the pluses and minuses of those zoned for Medfield vs Hampden. If you're looking at private schools, there's lots of us over in the private/independent forum who can tell you about specific schools. I feel like there are three "zones" of Hampden: Remington/Hopkins, Right There in the Middle, and Woodberry. I'd choose Remington/Hopkins if you have a reason to want to be near Hopkins. There's some good food around there and commerce, but it's really a JHU life-support system. Not that it makes it unpleasant! But it's definitely student-oriented. Middle Hampden offers mostly small and dense housing. Wonderful walkability, The Avenue is fun, and parking is pure nightmare so spend what you need to for off-street parking. Woodberry has great dining, hip vibe, and is literally on top of a nice Light Rail station. Larger housing options here, much quieter. Somewhat farther from non-dining conveniences -- and by that I mean that you're a mile from the grocery story and library instead of being .5 mile. It's all still very close. Zoned for Medfield Elementary. Parking can be dicey on some streets but isn't quite as brutal as Hampden proper. Mostly older stock like middle Hampden, but with some cool old stone places like this: https://www.redfin.com/MD/Baltimore/1504-Mill-Race-Rd-21211/home/10860655 . There's also quite a bit of new or newer construction around there if that's more your speed. Speaking of which, new construction in Woodberry is one of the very few places in the Baltimore city limits to offer fios. Most of Baltimore is essentially redlined, which sucks. We chose Woodberry because the Light Rail access was key for my spouse's job, and we're on the older side (we dine but don't really drink any more!). We've been super happy here so far. You are going to have great options because we passed over 90% of listings because we wanted 2000 sq ft. That's rare and really cut down our choices. But if you're looking around 1500 sq ft you'll have fun. I assume your budget is around 500k or less? If it's more than that things are a bit different. But $400k in Hampden can get you an awful lot. Have fun, and let us know how things go! |
Anonymous
If you're excited about spending $800k on a tiny TH then you're obviously going to be happy in DC. You're welcome to it. Enjoy! |
Anonymous
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I really like this house in Baltimore for the price:
https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/5414-Purlington-Way-Baltimore-MD-21212/36621758_zpid/? But then you go lookup how much property taxes are on the city's website; the current owner is paying $12,000+ per year in property taxes on an assessment of ~$550,000: https://cityservices.baltimorecity.gov/realproperty/default.aspx Thus, if I were to buy this property, I would get reassessed at the sale price for taxes with no tax breaks. Baltimore's property taxes are about 2.2%, meaning I'd have to fork over about $1250 per month in taxes alone  .
What do I get in return? Terrible schools and a dysfunctional city government with high crime? Why would I pay that much? I can move over to Howard county where the property taxes are HALF. That means I'd save $600+ per month in taxes alone. Do the math: $7200 per year in tax savings x 30 years = $216,000 saved in taxes alone just by choosing Howard county instead. What if I also took that $600 per month that I saved by simply moving to Howard County instead of Baltimore is threw it into the stock market earning 8% per year in compounded returns? https://www.investor.gov/financial-tools-calculators/calculators/compound-interest-calculator The calculator states that that money can turn into $700k-1M+ depending on the return
Just by choosing an address in Baltimore I could potentially lose $800k due to taxes and opportunity costs alone. That's why Baltimore is a horrible ROI. Even if the house appreciates by 100% over 30 years, it will be very difficult to beat the fact I could have made out way better by choosing another area with reduced taxes and insurance. Factor in upkeep, and it is very difficult to justify paying $15k+ per year in property taxes when the bill can be cut in half by literally driving 5-10 minutes away. |
Anonymous
It is amusing to me that the dc boosters who feel the need to post here don’t realize that their gentrifying dc neighborhoods cost twice as much neighborhoods with less crime in Baltimore. To each his own. These are the same folks who can’t figure out that even with a higher property tax rate, it costs much less to buy a comparable sized property in Baltimore. Math is hard. I can think of m several good reasons to prefer dc, but these are it. |
Anonymous
Different strokes for different folks. You don't think it's worth it to live in the city? Don't do it. Go on, don't let the door hit you. It's weird that you don't get that not everybody wants to live in the burbs. |
Anonymous
You are wrong starting at your first premise. Baltimore does not reassess at time of sale. They reassess every three years as all as Maryland does. Once you file for a homestead exception, available to all primary homeowners in MD, they are severely limited in how much they can raise the appraised price each year. Even without that. Appraised value is never as high as market value Second, property values are higher in the county for something comparable. A house that sells for 1.25 million in Roland Park would sell for $1.4 or 1.5 in Ruxton or Lutherville, No one who wants to live in Baltimore city is living in Howard County, sorry. |
Anonymous
Yeah, I live in Howard County and it doesn't make a ton of sense to compare moving to HoCo vs. Baltimore City, the decision to live in either is much more complex than ROI given the differences in culture and such. Maaaybe you could compare choosing Baltimore City vs. County a bit more logically, but even then you're getting a lot of folks picking one or the other for a variety of different reasons. This is coming from someone who really likes Baltimore. Just sort of a fact that even though HoCo is considered a suburb more of Baltimore than DC, it is quite distinct. |
Anonymous
Exactly. We just bought in the city. Why? Because every time we looked at moving out to the county, my wife got a case of the sads. She’s a lifelong city girl and can’t imagine not being surrounded by pavement and people. I am happy with it too, although I think I could enjoy the county as well. But happy wife, happy life. We all have our preferences and I don’t begrudge her this one. So no, spending the same amount of money in Columbia would not have been a big win for us. And honestly all comparable places in Baltimore County were a lot more expensive, even given the reduced taxes. |
Anonymous
Absolutely. This is also why I think comparing DC and Baltimore based primarily on ROI is a little bit of a fool’s errand. The two, despite both being cities, are very very different. You’re not buying a piece of the stock market, you’re buying a home and a lifestyle. We moved from DC to HoCo for a lot of reasons, some financial, but made our decision holistically on what kind of life we wanted for our kids and ourselves for the next 15/20 years. |
Anonymous
This is very accurate. Crime has been pretty bad since last few years and it is not going to get better from here. |
Anonymous
OP again. Thank you, this is so helpful! We have mostly been looking at Middle Hampden and are drawn to the Avenue, but Woodberry sounds appealing. We will definitely be doing public to start, though we may wind up in private for MS and/or HS depending on what happens -- my understanding is that public MS/HS in Baltimore requires the same level of careful navigation as it does in DC, so it's hard to predict given that our DC is still very young. Can you tell me give me an overview of Medfield v. Hampden schools? We know we may also have some options outside of zoned schools because of Baltimore's choice system, but I've heard Roland Park schools are already overcrowded so we are unlikely to get a spot there if we don't live nearby? Is that true? |
Anonymous
I practiced law at a large firm in Baltimore. I am also from Ellicott City. Most of my colleagues and the folks living in my EC neighborhood commute to Baltimore. It depends on which part of HoCO. With that being said, I live in DC now, but I love Baltimore. The suburbs are fine, but the city is great. |
Anonymous
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I’m amused that it seems Howard County has been discussed more than Baltimore County on this thread.
OP, I vote Baltimore—sell your place in DC and enjoy the profit it seems very likely you’ll make, put some of that into a great place in Baltimore and some into other investments. And take a vacation when COVID is over. Given how you’ve described your current neighborhood, some of the grittiness of Baltimore should be no issue for you. The only big questions IMO are if you truly want a more relaxed and hometown city, if you’ll miss the “DC vibe” too much, and of course if it’ll work for your jobs. |
Anonymous
I know someone who lives in Roland Park and you are way off in your assessment of it being low key. A lot of very wealthy people live there, and just like wealthy people everywhere, they are committed to keeping their money and influence. It's not a particularly diverse neighborhood. |