What do you think of nit picky teachers? 6th grade

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm surprised at how many people are dismissing the importance of following directions and actually doing what was assigned, even at work.

If I give an employee a task with specific instructions, it's because I need it that way. Maybe I need a specific font, or maybe even a specific border, because your task is one small part of a bigger presentation and I don't have time to be fixing everyone's borders and fonts.

And if I ask you to prepare a presentation on XYZ, I'm not going to be happy if you give me a presentation about ABC,
no matter how amazing it is and how much brilliance it showed. I asked you to demonstrate XYZ.

Especially in the case of the Spanish test, the child did *not* demonstrate knowledge that was asked. If OP's kid wrote that Buenos Dias means good day, it does *not* demonstrate that he knows when or how to use the phrase, which it sounds like was what was being evaluated.

This is the thing though. Doesn't knowing that Buenos Dias means "good morning" in English indicate that you know it is a greeting and not a farewell? I mean, it's strongly implied. It's worthy of partial credit.

I hate stingy teachers who are just looking for ways to knock kids down instead of build them up. A lot of teachers hate kids.

PP said “good day,” not “good morning.” Which kind of just proves the point.

No one says "good day" in English. They say something that more specifically points to the time of day: morning, afternoon, evening. That's the more accurate translation. You would use Buenos tardes for afternoon or noche for evening.

Buenas but yes. I mostly agree with this interpretation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm surprised at how many people are dismissing the importance of following directions and actually doing what was assigned, even at work.

If I give an employee a task with specific instructions, it's because I need it that way. Maybe I need a specific font, or maybe even a specific border, because your task is one small part of a bigger presentation and I don't have time to be fixing everyone's borders and fonts.

And if I ask you to prepare a presentation on XYZ, I'm not going to be happy if you give me a presentation about ABC,
no matter how amazing it is and how much brilliance it showed. I asked you to demonstrate XYZ.

Especially in the case of the Spanish test, the child did *not* demonstrate knowledge that was asked. If OP's kid wrote that Buenos Dias means good day, it does *not* demonstrate that he knows when or how to use the phrase, which it sounds like was what was being evaluated.

This is the thing though. Doesn't knowing that Buenos Dias means "good morning" in English indicate that you know it is a greeting and not a farewell? I mean, it's strongly implied. It's worthy of partial credit.

I hate stingy teachers who are just looking for ways to knock kids down instead of build them up. A lot of teachers hate kids.

Dias doesn’t mean morning, it means day. And in English good day is typically a farewell.
So if kid literally translated he would have written what is an English farewell.
And if he wrote good morning, he didn’t literally translate it correctly.
And the confusion could have been avoided if he followed the directions

when you're translating, you also have to consider the context of the conversation and colloquialisms. "Good day" might be the literal translation but, as you know, no one says that in English. So someone saying "buenos dias" in Spanish as a greeting would most likely mean "good morning" in English.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm surprised at how many people are dismissing the importance of following directions and actually doing what was assigned, even at work.

If I give an employee a task with specific instructions, it's because I need it that way. Maybe I need a specific font, or maybe even a specific border, because your task is one small part of a bigger presentation and I don't have time to be fixing everyone's borders and fonts.

And if I ask you to prepare a presentation on XYZ, I'm not going to be happy if you give me a presentation about ABC,
no matter how amazing it is and how much brilliance it showed. I asked you to demonstrate XYZ.

Especially in the case of the Spanish test, the child did *not* demonstrate knowledge that was asked. If OP's kid wrote that Buenos Dias means good day, it does *not* demonstrate that he knows when or how to use the phrase, which it sounds like was what was being evaluated.

This is the thing though. Doesn't knowing that Buenos Dias means "good morning" in English indicate that you know it is a greeting and not a farewell? I mean, it's strongly implied. It's worthy of partial credit.

I hate stingy teachers who are just looking for ways to knock kids down instead of build them up. A lot of teachers hate kids.

Dias doesn’t mean morning, it means day. And in English good day is typically a farewell.
So if kid literally translated he would have written what is an English farewell.
And if he wrote good morning, he didn’t literally translate it correctly.
And the confusion could have been avoided if he followed the directions

It’s like a Spanish idiom. You don’t really directly translate it - you translate it to the colloquial meaning. “Lo siento” on a Spanish test should be translated into “I’m sorry” in English, because that’s how it’s used by Spanish speakers. Literally translated, it is “I feel it”, but that’s not how it has come to be used.
Buenas Dias is a Spanish greeting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The OP mentioned that one of the accommodations is that her son is suppose to sit in the front row and he is not sitting there. That would reduce distractions from other kids and could influence his ability to concentrate on his work and his tests. The OP mentioned that one of the accommodations is for the teacher to review the instructions with the child individually and that is not happening. Again, that is influencing his performance. These type of accommodations are there to help the child learn to do these steps on his own but it takes time and reinforcement. If the teacher is not following the accommodations, then the teacher is failing.

Maybe it's true that the teacher isn't following the 504 but preferential seating (that's the phrase most often used) does not always equal front row.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The OP mentioned that one of the accommodations is that her son is suppose to sit in the front row and he is not sitting there. That would reduce distractions from other kids and could influence his ability to concentrate on his work and his tests. The OP mentioned that one of the accommodations is for the teacher to review the instructions with the child individually and that is not happening. Again, that is influencing his performance. These type of accommodations are there to help the child learn to do these steps on his own but it takes time and reinforcement. If the teacher is not following the accommodations, then the teacher is failing.

Maybe it's true that the teacher isn't following the 504 but preferential seating (that's the phrase most often used) does not always equal front row.

OP said that is in his plan though. Those are legal requirements that the school has to meet.

[Anonymous]

Oh lord, I can’t believe DCUM debates things down to finest details.....basically OP: your nice kid didn’t follow the directions carefully ENOUGH, and there were consequences.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am the Prior PP whose 6th grader has an IEP for these types of issues. This is the perfect year for your son to learn to follow directions. The key here is that you and the school need to support him with that.

On tests, he should be circling or highlighting key words - even if that means he takes the test on paper rather than computer. For an assignment, the teacher, aide, (or you depending on the assignment) should go through the rubric with him and make sure he understands what to do. Before he turns in his work, he needs to go through the rubric again and check off all the items he completed. If he missed any, then he needs to complete them. These are all things that can be built into a 504 plan.

If he loses points on a test or assignment because he didn’t follow/understand the directions, then walk through with him where he went wrong and how to do it better next time.

This is part of what he needs to be learning in school. Some things are harder for certain kids to learn and that’s okay. Keep working on it. But, as you can see in this thread, it is important that he learn this skill.

-signed mom of a kid who got every math “estimation” question wrong for three years because he didn’t read carefully enough and didn’t estimate.

OP here.

Yeah we're calling today to talk to his counselor about having his teachers reread his 504 plan, make sure that his testing accommodations are being implemented (according to him, they're not), and to add a goal of making him be better at following directions.

So his teacher writes on the rubric “include cover page with colorful border”. Now you want teacher to reread the 504 plan, and add a goal of “making him better at following directions” ?
How about mommy and daddy say “sonny, where’s the rubric for this poetry project? Let’s be sure you’ve ticked all the boxes.”

THIS. What PP says just above. +1

Parents now fear "helicoptering" so much, and at the same time demand so much from teachers and administrators, that they can end up thinking they shouldn't take any role in a child's homework organization. Note that I'm saying organization--I am not saying to do the child's homework for him. But since OP's son has known issues that already mean he has a 504 plan and needs accommodations at school, then at home he also should be getting help in learning to organize himself for success. And that means what the PP above says: "Let's sit down together and go over the rubric before you begin this project." Then: "Let's go over the rubric now that you're done, and check that you ticked all the boxes before you turn this in."

Kids (whether they need accommodations or don't) are not born knowing how to set priorities, use their time wisely, have a process for checking directions, etc. They have to learn it and parents shouldn't assume teachers have time to teach that in school. It's best taught at home in the context of planning and completing homework--and parents are the ones to guide that learning. OP, I'm not saying YOU never do this! But many parents including some on DCUM seem to think it's cheating or hovering ever to teach their own kids organizational skills or to look at their kids' assignments.

Or, just say, "did you do everything on the rubric?" I don't consider that much of a help or helicopering but apparently OP doesn't even want to hold herself and her kid to asking that about a project assignment. Instead, call principal, have meeting, add burden to teacher, while parents hold themselves accountable for zero.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The OP mentioned that one of the accommodations is that her son is suppose to sit in the front row and he is not sitting there. That would reduce distractions from other kids and could influence his ability to concentrate on his work and his tests. The OP mentioned that one of the accommodations is for the teacher to review the instructions with the child individually and that is not happening. Again, that is influencing his performance. These type of accommodations are there to help the child learn to do these steps on his own but it takes time and reinforcement. If the teacher is not following the accommodations, then the teacher is failing.

Maybe it's true that the teacher isn't following the 504 but preferential seating (that's the phrase most often used) does not always equal front row.

If OP's issue is that the 504 wasn't being followed, why isn't that what her post was about?

"Teacher didn't follow 504" rather than "What do you think of nit picky teachers?"

[Anonymous]

It would drive me nuts also, honestly. People who FOLLOW DIRECTIONS are going to turn into adults who are stuck in middle management and follow processes and procedures without thinking and doing better to make things more efficient.

But yes, help him highlight directions and think through the steps for now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It would drive me nuts also, honestly. People who FOLLOW DIRECTIONS are going to turn into adults who are stuck in middle management and follow processes and procedures without thinking and doing better to make things more efficient.

But yes, help him highlight directions and think through the steps for now.

Or people who keep jobs because they complete tasks assigned to them in the way they are directed to.

Or they learn when it is ok to deviate from the directions, normally when talking to other people about their ideas. But at least there is some acknowledgement that they know that they were suppose to do X.

And as an adult you understand the consequences for deviating from the rules can be losing your job. As a kid, the consequence is a bad grade. It is up to OP to determine if she is going to teach her kid to complete all the steps, so he has a better chance at success, or complain about a part of the assignment that the kid thinks is silly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It would drive me nuts also, honestly. People who FOLLOW DIRECTIONS are going to turn into adults who are stuck in middle management and follow processes and procedures without thinking and doing better to make things more efficient.

But yes, help him highlight directions and think through the steps for now.

Or people who keep jobs because they complete tasks assigned to them in the way they are directed to.

Or they learn when it is ok to deviate from the directions, normally when talking to other people about their ideas. But at least there is some acknowledgement that they know that they were suppose to do X.

And as an adult you understand the consequences for deviating from the rules can be losing your job. As a kid, the consequence is a bad grade. It is up to OP to determine if she is going to teach her kid to complete all the steps, so he has a better chance at success, or complain about a part of the assignment that the kid thinks is silly.

OP here. Obviously we are working on helping my kid follow the directions.

However, I am allowed to privately think these rules are silly and don't actually measure the content he has been learning.

I'm never going to agree about the coloring border thing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here.

I mentioned this in the OP but he does have an ADHD-I diagnosis and part of his 504 plan requires teachers to make sure he understands the directions to tests.

I know she didn't do that. He had been doing well enough in school that we hadn't been making an issue of his 504.

But now I think we should bring it up??

Absolutely bring it up! Ask the school counselor for guidance as well. Perhaps he needs an IEP, which will place more burden on the teachers to be accountable.

Ahh yes, lets make this the teachers' fault! Not OP's kid's responsibility,or OP for that matter, who seems hell bent on coming up with any excuse possible (I did it in college guys!!! my 12 year old son should be able to get away with it!). Ya'll are the reasons teachers hate their jobs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So today my kid got a D on a Spanish test because he translated sentences instead of indicating whether they were greetings/farewells in English.

Clearly he did not follow the directions and so should not receive full marks. But to mark each one completely wrong and give no points at all when he obviously indicated that he understands the words? He did correctly translate the phrases.

A lot of his teachers do this. He got a bunch of points off for not putting a colorful border on his English assignment when the supposed purpose was to write a poem which rhymed? I admit that one annoyed me because as far as I can tell, there is no use to coloring in sixth grade and should not be part of the assignment. He only gets half credit when failing to indicate the unit in math.

He has ADHD-Inattentive so part of it is related to that.

I'm bummed for him because as hard as he studies at home, it's not enough because he is not detailed oriented and these kinds of things fly over his head.

Is it worth talking to his teachers about this or will they just be like "it's on him for not following directions."

NP I think it is a good lesson to learn. Think of all the occupations that if a professional followed your logic than there would be a lot of injured or dead people. I'm thinking doctors, engineers etc. You have to learn how to read directions!

[Anonymous]

I'd be upset as you are OP and I am very deferential and respectful of teachers and the hard work they do. I think a D in this situation was very harsh.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe it's true that the teacher isn't following the 504 but preferential seating (that's the phrase most often used) does not always equal front row.

OP said that is in his plan though. Those are legal requirements that the school has to meet.

As a teacher I can tell you, the best seat in the room for someone with ADHD is not always in the front row. Sounds like a badly written 504. And teachers who don't follow it. And a student who still has a long way to go with executive functioning skills. That is not a recipe for success.