Bowser proposes to add over 1,500 new affordable housing units to "Rock Creek West"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I know everyone is going to get fixated on the prospect of poor people moving into wealthy neighborhoods, but someone should ask how exactly this plan is going to result in affordable housing. It seems vague how that's going to work. Simply building more units is not going to change prices. (Yes, yes, yes, increasing supply puts downward pressure on prices. But lower prices attract more demand, which pushes prices back up).

If they follow Bethesda’s model, the city will grant concessions on height restrictions and site set backs in return for the developers making 15% to 20% of the units for low income households.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

What I find surprising is that Bowser says NOTHING about the schools in these areas. They are already overcrowded. We need more schools WOTP - elementary, middle, and HS.

Sign not this again.

We don't need more schools WOTP.

We need the DC Council to take up re-drawing the boundaries and to move people en masse to the grossly under enrolled schools EOTP.

It is nuts that upper middle class families in Crestwood and Mt Pleasant are sending their kids to Deal and Wilson. It is nuts that gentrifiers in Columbia and 16th Street Heights and Shaw are doing the same or are going to charters.

Force all those families into their neighborhood schools and you solve the school capacity problems WOTP and the under enrollment problems EOTP and for no cost since most of the schools EOTP have already been renovated at great cost. And you probably reduce congestion and air pollution in the process.

And all those woke folks forcing out long term residents would have to put their kids where their proclaimed values are by actually sending their kids to their neighborhood schools rather than picking and choosing how invested they actually are in where they live.

Sure...we see how well that worked with Eastern.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Other cities have tried putting housing for low-income people in rich neighborhoods and have ended up with issues like those poor people can't afford to shop anywhere in their neighborhood. All the stores in their area cater to high-income people.

Exactly! Everything is more expensive in Bethesda - I live there but never shop here if I can avoid it.

[Anonymous]

With the new plans, D.C. has become the first city in the country to have area-specific goals for affordable housing, as well as “to dedicate an entire initiative to examining the barriers and opportunities within each area,” according to a statement issued by the Mayor’s Office.

D.C. Office of Planning (DCOP) and the D.C. Department of Housing and Community Development (DHCD) teamed up to put together the Housing Equity Report, which consists of an analysis of the current situation in the District relating to affordable housing distribution.

The report suggested particular targets involving various areas of the District, in order to help reach Bowser’s goal of creating 36,000 new homes by 2025, 12,000 which are planned to be occupied by low-income residents.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/thedcpost.com/washington-dc-housing-affordable-housing-new-report/amp/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Oh well. Guess the joke is on you cause your position is irrelevant. The city wants to significantly increase dedicated affordable housing options in Rock Creek West and it’s gonna happen despite your alternative suggestions.
Looks like if you don’t want dedicated affordable housing in your neighborhood you’re gonna have to pack your shit and move.

No honey. It's not actually going to happen, simply because an administration produces a "report" describing an aspirational "goal" and then hold a press conference to announce an aspirational "proposal."

Okay sweetie. You can think whatever you want but the future of affordable housing in D.C. won’t be confined to the usual neighborhoods. When Mayor Muriel Bowser released the District’s Housing Equity Report, which will create 36,000 new homes by 2025, 12,000 of which will be affordable to low-income residents but guess what... they won’t be bunched together in the typical areas where you see low-income housing; they will placed to change the way things have been for a long time. The new low-income housing will be integrated throughout the District’s eight wards, giving those in lower income brackets access to the same transportation opportunities and amenities as those of higher income levels.

Now the public review period of the plan runs through Dec. 20 so if you got objections I suggest you get off DCUM and go find yourself a drawing board to get a plan together to poke some legitimate holes in the plan prior to that date - otherwise IT'S GOING TO HAPPEN.

What is Mayor Bow-wow’s plan to preserve the substantial stock of rent controlled housing in Ward 3? That is a huge source of existing affordable housing but the report doesn’t say anything about rent controlled housing. Ironically, upzoning could drastically reduce such housing stock.

Methinks that her plan isn’t really about affordable housing. But it is most certainly about creating new big, dense and tall lucrative development opportunities in NW DC for Bowser’s developer friends.

Why do the NIMBY's from Ward 3 keep positing this absurd argument?

Ward 3 doesn't have any more rent controlled units than any other ward.

But most importantly none of the cities rent controlled units are income screened so someone wealthy is just as likely to benefit as someone low income.

But why do the anti's making this argument think allowing new construction will be a threat to existing buildings? It is likely the opposite that will be the case - fighting new construction is more likely not less likely to increase the pressure to renovate or re-develop rent controlled buildings. So long as there is demand for high end units developers will seek those dollars - if they can't grab them in new construction they will seek them out in existing buildings. When demand outstrips supply prices will rise and low income people will be squeezed out.

But keep on making this asinine argument - those of us who actually care about affordable housing and living in a diverse city appreciate when our opponents are idiots.

[Anonymous]

I wish someone could give me a coherent explanation of how these affordable housing ideas are supposed to work.

There seems to be blind faith that adding housing units will lower prices, but that just seems wrong.

There's five million people in the DC suburbs. If you add 30,000 units in DC, that will immediately be soaked up by people in, say, Arlington looking for better commutes. That in turn will open up places for people to move to Arlington from, say, Manassas who are looking for the same thing. That will open up places in Manassas for people who live in, say, Front Royal.

The end result is lower housing prices in Front Royal. Ok, that's great for people who live there but why should DC residents have to sacrifice so that people in Front Royal enjoy slightly lower housing prices?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I wish someone could give me a coherent explanation of how these affordable housing ideas are supposed to work.

There seems to be blind faith that adding housing units will lower prices, but that just seems wrong.

There's five million people in the DC suburbs. If you add 30,000 units in DC, that will immediately be soaked up by people in, say, Arlington looking for better commutes. That in turn will open up places for people to move to Arlington from, say, Manassas who are looking for the same thing. That will open up places in Manassas for people who live in, say, Front Royal.

The end result is lower housing prices in Front Royal. Ok, that's great for people who live there but why should DC residents have to sacrifice so that people in Front Royal enjoy slightly lower housing prices?

Doubt you're a DC resident so don't worry about it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I wish someone could give me a coherent explanation of how these affordable housing ideas are supposed to work.

There seems to be blind faith that adding housing units will lower prices, but that just seems wrong.

There's five million people in the DC suburbs. If you add 30,000 units in DC, that will immediately be soaked up by people in, say, Arlington looking for better commutes. That in turn will open up places for people to move to Arlington from, say, Manassas who are looking for the same thing. That will open up places in Manassas for people who live in, say, Front Royal.

The end result is lower housing prices in Front Royal. Ok, that's great for people who live there but why should DC residents have to sacrifice so that people in Front Royal enjoy slightly lower housing prices?

1. Yes, this is a regional problem. That is why MWCOG has set REGIONAL goals for more housing, esp more AH. Many people in DC itself are progressive, and want to help moderate and low income people around the region.

2. Having more people live closer in will be better for the environment, and mean less cars driving into DC (since closer places have better transit), better for QOL in DC.

3. Not everyone who lives out in the suburbs wants to move closer in. Some people prefer Arlington to DC, Manassas to Arlington, Front Royal to Manassas, etc. You appear to posit that a one dollar decrease in housing prices in DC fills up any increase in new units (what we economists call a perfectly elastic demand curve) That is almost certainly unrealistic. Its possible that MOST people would move closer in if they could, but that will still mean a slight drop in DC prices from new housing If many people won't (if the demand curve is inelastic - IOW if people really have preference for suburban living) then there could be large drops in DC prices.
3.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wish someone could give me a coherent explanation of how these affordable housing ideas are supposed to work.

There seems to be blind faith that adding housing units will lower prices, but that just seems wrong.

There's five million people in the DC suburbs. If you add 30,000 units in DC, that will immediately be soaked up by people in, say, Arlington looking for better commutes. That in turn will open up places for people to move to Arlington from, say, Manassas who are looking for the same thing. That will open up places in Manassas for people who live in, say, Front Royal.

The end result is lower housing prices in Front Royal. Ok, that's great for people who live there but why should DC residents have to sacrifice so that people in Front Royal enjoy slightly lower housing prices?

1. Yes, this is a regional problem. That is why MWCOG has set REGIONAL goals for more housing, esp more AH. Many people in DC itself are progressive, and want to help moderate and low income people around the region.

2. Having more people live closer in will be better for the environment, and mean less cars driving into DC (since closer places have better transit), better for QOL in DC.

3. Not everyone who lives out in the suburbs wants to move closer in. Some people prefer Arlington to DC, Manassas to Arlington, Front Royal to Manassas, etc. You appear to posit that a one dollar decrease in housing prices in DC fills up any increase in new units (what we economists call a perfectly elastic demand curve) That is almost certainly unrealistic. Its possible that MOST people would move closer in if they could, but that will still mean a slight drop in DC prices from new housing If many people won't (if the demand curve is inelastic - IOW if people really have preference for suburban living) then there could be large drops in DC prices.
3.

Yes, everyone has their own particular reasons for living where they do. My only point is that this notion that adding housing units in DC will result in more affordable housing is a lie.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wish someone could give me a coherent explanation of how these affordable housing ideas are supposed to work.

There seems to be blind faith that adding housing units will lower prices, but that just seems wrong.

There's five million people in the DC suburbs. If you add 30,000 units in DC, that will immediately be soaked up by people in, say, Arlington looking for better commutes. That in turn will open up places for people to move to Arlington from, say, Manassas who are looking for the same thing. That will open up places in Manassas for people who live in, say, Front Royal.

The end result is lower housing prices in Front Royal. Ok, that's great for people who live there but why should DC residents have to sacrifice so that people in Front Royal enjoy slightly lower housing prices?

1. Yes, this is a regional problem. That is why MWCOG has set REGIONAL goals for more housing, esp more AH. Many people in DC itself are progressive, and want to help moderate and low income people around the region.

2. Having more people live closer in will be better for the environment, and mean less cars driving into DC (since closer places have better transit), better for QOL in DC.

3. Not everyone who lives out in the suburbs wants to move closer in. Some people prefer Arlington to DC, Manassas to Arlington, Front Royal to Manassas, etc. You appear to posit that a one dollar decrease in housing prices in DC fills up any increase in new units (what we economists call a perfectly elastic demand curve) That is almost certainly unrealistic. Its possible that MOST people would move closer in if they could, but that will still mean a slight drop in DC prices from new housing If many people won't (if the demand curve is inelastic - IOW if people really have preference for suburban living) then there could be large drops in DC prices.
3.

Yes, everyone has their own particular reasons for living where they do. My only point is that this notion that adding housing units in DC will result in more affordable housing is a lie.

Yes, that is your point. However it is not correct.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wish someone could give me a coherent explanation of how these affordable housing ideas are supposed to work.

There seems to be blind faith that adding housing units will lower prices, but that just seems wrong.

There's five million people in the DC suburbs. If you add 30,000 units in DC, that will immediately be soaked up by people in, say, Arlington looking for better commutes. That in turn will open up places for people to move to Arlington from, say, Manassas who are looking for the same thing. That will open up places in Manassas for people who live in, say, Front Royal.

The end result is lower housing prices in Front Royal. Ok, that's great for people who live there but why should DC residents have to sacrifice so that people in Front Royal enjoy slightly lower housing prices?

1. Yes, this is a regional problem. That is why MWCOG has set REGIONAL goals for more housing, esp more AH. Many people in DC itself are progressive, and want to help moderate and low income people around the region.

2. Having more people live closer in will be better for the environment, and mean less cars driving into DC (since closer places have better transit), better for QOL in DC.

3. Not everyone who lives out in the suburbs wants to move closer in. Some people prefer Arlington to DC, Manassas to Arlington, Front Royal to Manassas, etc. You appear to posit that a one dollar decrease in housing prices in DC fills up any increase in new units (what we economists call a perfectly elastic demand curve) That is almost certainly unrealistic. Its possible that MOST people would move closer in if they could, but that will still mean a slight drop in DC prices from new housing If many people won't (if the demand curve is inelastic - IOW if people really have preference for suburban living) then there could be large drops in DC prices.
3.

Yes, everyone has their own particular reasons for living where they do. My only point is that this notion that adding housing units in DC will result in more affordable housing is a lie.

Yes, that is your point. However it is not correct.

Why not? You still haven't given me a clear explanation.

The only way prices can go down is if supply exceeds demand. But that will never happen. There are five million people in the suburbs. If even one percent of them decided to move into the city, that would more than soak up every last additional unit Bowswer is proposing. And certainly far more than one percent would want to move. Have you seen the traffic leaving the city at rush hour? And that's putting aside everyone who doesn't already live in the metro area but who might want to move here. Supply will never come close to catching up with demand.

You can see this effect in New York City. People live in shoeboxes and yet it is still expensive because there are still far more people who want to live there than can be accommodated.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wish someone could give me a coherent explanation of how these affordable housing ideas are supposed to work.

There seems to be blind faith that adding housing units will lower prices, but that just seems wrong.

There's five million people in the DC suburbs. If you add 30,000 units in DC, that will immediately be soaked up by people in, say, Arlington looking for better commutes. That in turn will open up places for people to move to Arlington from, say, Manassas who are looking for the same thing. That will open up places in Manassas for people who live in, say, Front Royal.

The end result is lower housing prices in Front Royal. Ok, that's great for people who live there but why should DC residents have to sacrifice so that people in Front Royal enjoy slightly lower housing prices?

1. Yes, this is a regional problem. That is why MWCOG has set REGIONAL goals for more housing, esp more AH. Many people in DC itself are progressive, and want to help moderate and low income people around the region.

2. Having more people live closer in will be better for the environment, and mean less cars driving into DC (since closer places have better transit), better for QOL in DC.

3. Not everyone who lives out in the suburbs wants to move closer in. Some people prefer Arlington to DC, Manassas to Arlington, Front Royal to Manassas, etc. You appear to posit that a one dollar decrease in housing prices in DC fills up any increase in new units (what we economists call a perfectly elastic demand curve) That is almost certainly unrealistic. Its possible that MOST people would move closer in if they could, but that will still mean a slight drop in DC prices from new housing If many people won't (if the demand curve is inelastic - IOW if people really have preference for suburban living) then there could be large drops in DC prices.
3.

Yes, everyone has their own particular reasons for living where they do. My only point is that this notion that adding housing units in DC will result in more affordable housing is a lie.

Yes, that is your point. However it is not correct.

Why not? You still haven't given me a clear explanation.

The only way prices can go down is if supply exceeds demand. But that will never happen. There are five million people in the suburbs. If even one percent of them decided to move into the city, that would more than soak up every last additional unit Bowswer is proposing. And certainly far more than one percent would want to move. Have you seen the traffic leaving the city at rush hour? And that's putting aside everyone who doesn't already live in the metro area but who might want to move here. Supply will never come close to catching up with demand.

You can see this effect in New York City. People live in shoeboxes and yet it is still expensive because there are still far more people who want to live there than can be accommodated.

Yeah you definitely need a coherent explanation cause your understanding of what is being done is WAAAAAY out in another galaxy somewhere.

Let's recap and break it down...

Bowser wants to significantly increase dedicated affordable housing options in Rock Creek West, which encompasses some of the city’s highest-income neighborhoods. Her administration has set a goal to bring 1,990 affordable housing units to that part of the District by 2025 — more than four times its current amount of 470 affordable homes.

You with me so far? Okay now take a look at that bolded portion above...you see that? Do you know what that is? Let's break it down...

Dedicated affordable housing is defined as income- and rent-restricted housing supported or subsidized by local and federal programs for households ranging from extremely low-income earning less than 30 percent of the Median Family Income (MFI) up to households earning less than 80 percent of the MFI.

Do you get the gist of what is being said? Look at the bolded portion above...you see that? Do you know what that means. Let's break it down one last time...

Doesn't matter what the exorbitant prices of homes/condos/apartments in certain areas.
There will be XX-number of DEDICATED HOUSING OPTIONS set aside for broke folks in those high-priced areas.

You getting it now?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wish someone could give me a coherent explanation of how these affordable housing ideas are supposed to work.

There seems to be blind faith that adding housing units will lower prices, but that just seems wrong.

There's five million people in the DC suburbs. If you add 30,000 units in DC, that will immediately be soaked up by people in, say, Arlington looking for better commutes. That in turn will open up places for people to move to Arlington from, say, Manassas who are looking for the same thing. That will open up places in Manassas for people who live in, say, Front Royal.

The end result is lower housing prices in Front Royal. Ok, that's great for people who live there but why should DC residents have to sacrifice so that people in Front Royal enjoy slightly lower housing prices?

1. Yes, this is a regional problem. That is why MWCOG has set REGIONAL goals for more housing, esp more AH. Many people in DC itself are progressive, and want to help moderate and low income people around the region.

2. Having more people live closer in will be better for the environment, and mean less cars driving into DC (since closer places have better transit), better for QOL in DC.

3. Not everyone who lives out in the suburbs wants to move closer in. Some people prefer Arlington to DC, Manassas to Arlington, Front Royal to Manassas, etc. You appear to posit that a one dollar decrease in housing prices in DC fills up any increase in new units (what we economists call a perfectly elastic demand curve) That is almost certainly unrealistic. Its possible that MOST people would move closer in if they could, but that will still mean a slight drop in DC prices from new housing If many people won't (if the demand curve is inelastic - IOW if people really have preference for suburban living) then there could be large drops in DC prices.
3.

Yes, everyone has their own particular reasons for living where they do. My only point is that this notion that adding housing units in DC will result in more affordable housing is a lie.

Yes, that is your point. However it is not correct.

Why not? You still haven't given me a clear explanation.

The only way prices can go down is if supply exceeds demand. But that will never happen. There are five million people in the suburbs. If even one percent of them decided to move into the city, that would more than soak up every last additional unit Bowswer is proposing. And certainly far more than one percent would want to move. Have you seen the traffic leaving the city at rush hour? And that's putting aside everyone who doesn't already live in the metro area but who might want to move here. Supply will never come close to catching up with demand.

You can see this effect in New York City. People live in shoeboxes and yet it is still expensive because there are still far more people who want to live there than can be accommodated.

Yeah you definitely need a coherent explanation cause your understanding of what is being done is WAAAAAY out in another galaxy somewhere.

Let's recap and break it down...

Bowser wants to significantly increase dedicated affordable housing options in Rock Creek West, which encompasses some of the city’s highest-income neighborhoods. Her administration has set a goal to bring 1,990 affordable housing units to that part of the District by 2025 — more than four times its current amount of 470 affordable homes.

You with me so far? Okay now take a look at that bolded portion above...you see that? Do you know what that is? Let's break it down...

Dedicated affordable housing is defined as income- and rent-restricted housing supported or subsidized by local and federal programs for households ranging from extremely low-income earning less than 30 percent of the Median Family Income (MFI) up to households earning less than 80 percent of the MFI.

Do you get the gist of what is being said? Look at the bolded portion above...you see that? Do you know what that means. Let's break it down one last time...

Doesn't matter what the exorbitant prices of homes/condos/apartments in certain areas.
There will be XX-number of DEDICATED HOUSING OPTIONS set aside for broke folks in those high-priced areas.

You getting it now?

You're ducking the question (and only citing one part of the mayor's plan -- she wants to add 36,000 units in total by 2025).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wish someone could give me a coherent explanation of how these affordable housing ideas are supposed to work.

There seems to be blind faith that adding housing units will lower prices, but that just seems wrong.

There's five million people in the DC suburbs. If you add 30,000 units in DC, that will immediately be soaked up by people in, say, Arlington looking for better commutes. That in turn will open up places for people to move to Arlington from, say, Manassas who are looking for the same thing. That will open up places in Manassas for people who live in, say, Front Royal.

The end result is lower housing prices in Front Royal. Ok, that's great for people who live there but why should DC residents have to sacrifice so that people in Front Royal enjoy slightly lower housing prices?

1. Yes, this is a regional problem. That is why MWCOG has set REGIONAL goals for more housing, esp more AH. Many people in DC itself are progressive, and want to help moderate and low income people around the region.

2. Having more people live closer in will be better for the environment, and mean less cars driving into DC (since closer places have better transit), better for QOL in DC.

3. Not everyone who lives out in the suburbs wants to move closer in. Some people prefer Arlington to DC, Manassas to Arlington, Front Royal to Manassas, etc. You appear to posit that a one dollar decrease in housing prices in DC fills up any increase in new units (what we economists call a perfectly elastic demand curve) That is almost certainly unrealistic. Its possible that MOST people would move closer in if they could, but that will still mean a slight drop in DC prices from new housing If many people won't (if the demand curve is inelastic - IOW if people really have preference for suburban living) then there could be large drops in DC prices.
3.

Yes, everyone has their own particular reasons for living where they do. My only point is that this notion that adding housing units in DC will result in more affordable housing is a lie.

Yes, that is your point. However it is not correct.

Why not? You still haven't given me a clear explanation.

The only way prices can go down is if supply exceeds demand. But that will never happen. There are five million people in the suburbs. If even one percent of them decided to move into the city, that would more than soak up every last additional unit Bowswer is proposing. And certainly far more than one percent would want to move. Have you seen the traffic leaving the city at rush hour? And that's putting aside everyone who doesn't already live in the metro area but who might want to move here. Supply will never come close to catching up with demand.

You can see this effect in New York City. People live in shoeboxes and yet it is still expensive because there are still far more people who want to live there than can be accommodated.

Yeah you definitely need a coherent explanation cause your understanding of what is being done is WAAAAAY out in another galaxy somewhere.

Let's recap and break it down...

Bowser wants to significantly increase dedicated affordable housing options in Rock Creek West, which encompasses some of the city’s highest-income neighborhoods. Her administration has set a goal to bring 1,990 affordable housing units to that part of the District by 2025 — more than four times its current amount of 470 affordable homes.

You with me so far? Okay now take a look at that bolded portion above...you see that? Do you know what that is? Let's break it down...

Dedicated affordable housing is defined as income- and rent-restricted housing supported or subsidized by local and federal programs for households ranging from extremely low-income earning less than 30 percent of the Median Family Income (MFI) up to households earning less than 80 percent of the MFI.

Do you get the gist of what is being said? Look at the bolded portion above...you see that? Do you know what that means. Let's break it down one last time...

Doesn't matter what the exorbitant prices of homes/condos/apartments in certain areas.
There will be XX-number of DEDICATED HOUSING OPTIONS set aside for broke folks in those high-priced areas.

You getting it now?

You're ducking the question (and only citing one part of the mayor's plan -- she wants to add 36,000 units in total by 2025).

Yes doofus with 12,000 of them DEDICATED AFFORDABLE HOUSING.
What aren’t you getting?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I wish someone could give me a coherent explanation of how these affordable housing ideas are supposed to work.

There seems to be blind faith that adding housing units will lower prices, but that just seems wrong.

There's five million people in the DC suburbs. If you add 30,000 units in DC, that will immediately be soaked up by people in, say, Arlington looking for better commutes. That in turn will open up places for people to move to Arlington from, say, Manassas who are looking for the same thing. That will open up places in Manassas for people who live in, say, Front Royal.

The end result is lower housing prices in Front Royal. Ok, that's great for people who live there but why should DC residents have to sacrifice so that people in Front Royal enjoy slightly lower housing prices?

+1

I'm sure the mayor will be happy to learn that the main beneficiaries of her plan are people who live in distant suburbs and can't vote for her.