Tired of teacher friends complaining

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Look, either you work 10 months and then divide your salary over those 10 months, in which case it's higher but you aren't working those two months... OR you work 12 months and divide you salary over those 12 months and make less per month.

The reason we should pay teachers more is to get smarter people competing for the jobs.

Yup, there's a lot to complain about. There are a lot in most jobs especially mission-based jobs that don't have high requirements for entry.

NP (a teacher). So tired of hearing this! I too, had a challenging career before becoming a teacher. I went to a top-flight college, as did many of my teacher colleagues. We ARE smart and can match wits with anyone in the private sector, thank you very much.

But this is the problem with the whole argument. I don't think anybody here has said teachers are adequately paid: you're not. But if you're doing a really difficult job for little money, either it's worth it to you for some reason or you have no better options. If you have options - which I believe is the case for most teachers - then please own the fact you're choosing this despite its drawbacks and quit complaining. That's all people are saying.

When I got my teaching degree in 1996, school was incredibly different, and parents were incredibly different. There was no national or state curriculum and no standards-based grading. Most kids did not have some disorder or another and there weren't endless accommodations for “conditions.” Teachers weren’t threatened with repercussions for saying “ok, boys and girls...” We weren’t expected to buy kids’ supplies and snacks.

Don’t dare blame me for taking issue with how my profession - for which I've spent so much time and momey on education, licensure, training — has changed.

BS. When I got my law degree, you could still make partner by being an affable person who did good legal work. You didn't have to work a million hours or generate business as an associate. But the profession changed for the worse, so I went and did something else. If I had stayed but complained about it, you wouldn't have wanted to hear that either.

[Anonymous]

RE: what keeps me coming back? This far into my career, I'd have to take a 20K pay cut to do anything else,I'd lose out on a fabulous pension and I'd go from 15 weeks vacation time per year to 2-3 weeks. Plus, whenever I've done other jobs (managed a program, retail, office work, nannied) I have felt bored out of my damn mind. Plus I really do like the kids.
I'm nearly 50, I'm not taking any more pay cuts (I've taken 2 sets of pay cuts moving from district to district as teachers lose money each time they move after a certain number of years). I am going to retire when I'm 60 and collect my very nice pension.

[Anonymous]

PP, what do you mean as very nice???
After paying for insurance premiums and taxes you will barely have $2000 per month which had been cut from
Your paychecks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Look, either you work 10 months and then divide your salary over those 10 months, in which case it's higher but you aren't working those two months... OR you work 12 months and divide you salary over those 12 months and make less per month.

The reason we should pay teachers more is to get smarter people competing for the jobs.

Yup, there's a lot to complain about. There are a lot in most jobs especially mission-based jobs that don't have high requirements for entry.

NP (a teacher). So tired of hearing this! I too, had a challenging career before becoming a teacher. I went to a top-flight college, as did many of my teacher colleagues. We ARE smart and can match wits with anyone in the private sector, thank you very much.

But this is the problem with the whole argument. I don't think anybody here has said teachers are adequately paid: you're not. But if you're doing a really difficult job for little money, either it's worth it to you for some reason or you have no better options. If you have options - which I believe is the case for most teachers - then please own the fact you're choosing this despite its drawbacks and quit complaining. That's all people are saying.

When I got my teaching degree in 1996, school was incredibly different, and parents were incredibly different. There was no national or state curriculum and no standards-based grading. Most kids did not have some disorder or another and there weren't endless accommodations for “conditions.” Teachers weren’t threatened with repercussions for saying “ok, boys and girls...” We weren’t expected to buy kids’ supplies and snacks.

Don’t dare blame me for taking issue with how my profession - for which I've spent so much time and momey on education, licensure, training — has changed.

BS. When I got my law degree, you could still make partner by being an affable person who did good legal work. You didn't have to work a million hours or generate business as an associate. But the profession changed for the worse, so I went and did something else. If I had stayed but complained about it, you wouldn't have wanted to hear that either.

I’m a teacher and suspect we’re about the same age, and I too think the teaching profession has changed. However, I totally disagree with the things you take issue with. “Conditions” didn’t just suddenly materialize and if you were doing your job, you would have been providing needed accommodations to kids who needed them long before IDEA mandated services. My guess is that you are coasting and haven’t stayed current on best practices.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP, what do you mean as very nice???
After paying for insurance premiums and taxes you will barely have $2000 per month which had been cut from
Your paychecks.

I'm in another state. My final salary will be about 120K. (high school teacher with two masters degree and I've stayed in one high paying district my whole life) Because I will be 60 years old with 34 years in the system at the point, in my state, I'll get 75% of that final salary and access to reduced cost health insurance the rest of my life. My friends who only have 20 years in will only be getting about 2K a month. It pays to put in the full amount of years.

I've also maxed out my IRA's since I was 22 and have a teacher spouse, comparably paid, who has done the same.

[Anonymous]

“‘Conditions” didn’t just suddenly materialize and if you were doing your job, you would have been providing needed accommodations to kids who needed them long before IDEA mandated services. My guess is that you are coasting and haven’t stayed current on best practices.”

Or, I acknowledge that most of them are a crock. Not all. But most.

I know, there will be a flood of I’m so thankful you aren’t my kid’s teacher! Know that there are tons of us. We’re sick of it. You’re welcome.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Look, either you work 10 months and then divide your salary over those 10 months, in which case it's higher but you aren't working those two months... OR you work 12 months and divide you salary over those 12 months and make less per month.

The reason we should pay teachers more is to get smarter people competing for the jobs.

Yup, there's a lot to complain about. There are a lot in most jobs especially mission-based jobs that don't have high requirements for entry.

NP (a teacher). So tired of hearing this! I too, had a challenging career before becoming a teacher. I went to a top-flight college, as did many of my teacher colleagues. We ARE smart and can match wits with anyone in the private sector, thank you very much.

But this is the problem with the whole argument. I don't think anybody here has said teachers are adequately paid: you're not. But if you're doing a really difficult job for little money, either it's worth it to you for some reason or you have no better options. If you have options - which I believe is the case for most teachers - then please own the fact you're choosing this despite its drawbacks and quit complaining. That's all people are saying.

When I got my teaching degree in 1996, school was incredibly different, and parents were incredibly different. There was no national or state curriculum and no standards-based grading. Most kids did not have some disorder or another and there weren't endless accommodations for “conditions.” Teachers weren’t threatened with repercussions for saying “ok, boys and girls...” We weren’t expected to buy kids’ supplies and snacks.

Don’t dare blame me for taking issue with how my profession - for which I've spent so much time and momey on education, licensure, training — has changed.

Everyone is just complaining about the changes. My frustration is that there is no leadership or accountability here. Get your unions to set better boundaries between parents and teachers. Tell your unions, PTAs, and local school board that kids are going hungry in your classroom. No luck there? Run for office, organize. We all know that if the majority of teachers were men, there would be a lot more momentum in all of these issues. step up.

And if you can't show respect to all kids of different abilities, then get out of the classroom. Go find some kittens to kick or something.

[Anonymous]

Public schools have been ruined by liberals. It's mandatory to put your kids in private school where all the nonsense is removed .

[Anonymous]

I left public for private. Problem solved. Happy now.

[Anonymous]

19:51 - Virginia is a right to work state. VEA can do nothing. Get educated before you make flippant comments.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:19:51 - Virginia is a right to work state. VEA can do nothing. Get educated before you make flippant comments.

This thread isn't focused on Virginia teachers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Imagine you had to run a meeting 6-7 hours a day. You had to lead the meeting--agenda, content, presentations, discussions, work output, materials, everything. During that meeting, you can't check email or make a phone call. And in between the 6-7 hour meeting, you have smaller 20-1 hour meetings.

Imagine 25 of the 30 participants do not want to be there and don't have the ability to pay attention or follow directions. And you have to keep them on track.

Imagine you had to give immediate feedback/evaluations from today's meeting to every participant.

Imagine after running that meeting, you have to plan and prepare for tomorrow's 6-7 hour meeting.

Imagine if your participants fail to perform or have substandard work product, you are blamed.

Imagine never having an off day. Never spending a day just dealing with the little things.

Imagine it keeps going, day after day. It's exhausting to have to plan and manage every minute of every day for 30-150 participants.

I used to be a teacher. I miss it every day. But I'd never go back. The daily grind with no support staff to handle things was just too much. If I got a secretary, Id totally go back.

Until you've done it, you just don't understand.

"Until you've done it, you just don't understand..." - this is true of any job pretty much; for example the poster whonsaid teaching is one of the only jobs you get to leave at the office in the evenings - they clearly don't get it in regards to MANY (maybe most!) jobs.

I'm in a client facing job and many days have to be "on" all day - meetings, presentations, etc. The none meeting days are lots of calls and office stuff + client dinners after hours - it's fine, I like my job most days and I think it's got positives and negatives. I don't complain, I picked this career, if I feel like it's a sacrifice and think I'm underpaid I would change what I'm doing.

I think that what is frustrating about constant teacher complaining is the need to "one up" every other negative factor anyone else may experience at work-related ok, I'm sure you have bad days and don't like xyz- welcome to life, most people have parts of work they don't like...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Imagine you had to run a meeting 6-7 hours a day. You had to lead the meeting--agenda, content, presentations, discussions, work output, materials, everything. During that meeting, you can't check email or make a phone call. And in between the 6-7 hour meeting, you have smaller 20-1 hour meetings.

Imagine 25 of the 30 participants do not want to be there and don't have the ability to pay attention or follow directions. And you have to keep them on track.

Imagine you had to give immediate feedback/evaluations from today's meeting to every participant.

Imagine after running that meeting, you have to plan and prepare for tomorrow's 6-7 hour meeting.

Imagine if your participants fail to perform or have substandard work product, you are blamed.

Imagine never having an off day. Never spending a day just dealing with the little things.

Imagine it keeps going, day after day. It's exhausting to have to plan and manage every minute of every day for 30-150 participants.

I used to be a teacher. I miss it every day. But I'd never go back. The daily grind with no support staff to handle things was just too much. If I got a secretary, Id totally go back.

Until you've done it, you just don't understand.

"Until you've done it, you just don't understand..." - this is true of any job pretty much; for example the poster whonsaid teaching is one of the only jobs you get to leave at the office in the evenings - they clearly don't get it in regards to MANY (maybe most!) jobs.

I'm in a client facing job and many days have to be "on" all day - meetings, presentations, etc. The none meeting days are lots of calls and office stuff + client dinners after hours - it's fine, I like my job most days and I think it's got positives and negatives. I don't complain, I picked this career, if I feel like it's a sacrifice and think I'm underpaid I would change what I'm doing.

I think that what is frustrating about constant teacher complaining is the need to "one up" every other negative factor anyone else may experience at work-related ok, I'm sure you have bad days and don't like xyz- welcome to life, most people have parts of work they don't like...

Yes, but there is something different from a person who works with other adults mostly compared to working with children. Teachers are in a weird way shamed if they are not always giving and a martyr for the children in their class. Parents, admin all blame the teacher because at the end of the day it all falls on you even though it shouldn't.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Imagine you had to run a meeting 6-7 hours a day. You had to lead the meeting--agenda, content, presentations, discussions, work output, materials, everything. During that meeting, you can't check email or make a phone call. And in between the 6-7 hour meeting, you have smaller 20-1 hour meetings.

Imagine 25 of the 30 participants do not want to be there and don't have the ability to pay attention or follow directions. And you have to keep them on track.

Imagine you had to give immediate feedback/evaluations from today's meeting to every participant.

Imagine after running that meeting, you have to plan and prepare for tomorrow's 6-7 hour meeting.

Imagine if your participants fail to perform or have substandard work product, you are blamed.

Imagine never having an off day. Never spending a day just dealing with the little things.

Imagine it keeps going, day after day. It's exhausting to have to plan and manage every minute of every day for 30-150 participants.

I used to be a teacher. I miss it every day. But I'd never go back. The daily grind with no support staff to handle things was just too much. If I got a secretary, Id totally go back.

Until you've done it, you just don't understand.

"Until you've done it, you just don't understand..." - this is true of any job pretty much; for example the poster whonsaid teaching is one of the only jobs you get to leave at the office in the evenings - they clearly don't get it in regards to MANY (maybe most!) jobs.

I'm in a client facing job and many days have to be "on" all day - meetings, presentations, etc. The none meeting days are lots of calls and office stuff + client dinners after hours - it's fine, I like my job most days and I think it's got positives and negatives. I don't complain, I picked this career, if I feel like it's a sacrifice and think I'm underpaid I would change what I'm doing.

I think that what is frustrating about constant teacher complaining is the need to "one up" every other negative factor anyone else may experience at work-related ok, I'm sure you have bad days and don't like xyz- welcome to life, most people have parts of work they don't like...

Yes, but there is something different from a person who works with other adults mostly compared to working with children. Teachers are in a weird way shamed if they are not always giving and a martyr for the children in their class. Parents, admin all blame the teacher because at the end of the day it all falls on you even though it shouldn't.

You just proved the PP's point. She observed that teachers are always trying to one up anyone else's complaints...and you had to chime in and complain about how your job is just so much worse.

As a parent, I don't expect any teachers or other parents to be martyrs for their children. Teachers dramatically over-generalize their problems.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Imagine you had to run a meeting 6-7 hours a day. You had to lead the meeting--agenda, content, presentations, discussions, work output, materials, everything. During that meeting, you can't check email or make a phone call. And in between the 6-7 hour meeting, you have smaller 20-1 hour meetings.

Imagine 25 of the 30 participants do not want to be there and don't have the ability to pay attention or follow directions. And you have to keep them on track.

Imagine you had to give immediate feedback/evaluations from today's meeting to every participant.

Imagine after running that meeting, you have to plan and prepare for tomorrow's 6-7 hour meeting.

Imagine if your participants fail to perform or have substandard work product, you are blamed.

Imagine never having an off day. Never spending a day just dealing with the little things.

Imagine it keeps going, day after day. It's exhausting to have to plan and manage every minute of every day for 30-150 participants.

I used to be a teacher. I miss it every day. But I'd never go back. The daily grind with no support staff to handle things was just too much. If I got a secretary, Id totally go back.

Until you've done it, you just don't understand.

"Until you've done it, you just don't understand..." - this is true of any job pretty much; for example the poster whonsaid teaching is one of the only jobs you get to leave at the office in the evenings - they clearly don't get it in regards to MANY (maybe most!) jobs.

I'm in a client facing job and many days have to be "on" all day - meetings, presentations, etc. The none meeting days are lots of calls and office stuff + client dinners after hours - it's fine, I like my job most days and I think it's got positives and negatives. I don't complain, I picked this career, if I feel like it's a sacrifice and think I'm underpaid I would change what I'm doing.

I think that what is frustrating about constant teacher complaining is the need to "one up" every other negative factor anyone else may experience at work-related ok, I'm sure you have bad days and don't like xyz- welcome to life, most people have parts of work they don't like...

Yes, but there is something different from a person who works with other adults mostly compared to working with children. Teachers are in a weird way shamed if they are not always giving and a martyr for the children in their class. Parents, admin all blame the teacher because at the end of the day it all falls on you even though it shouldn't.

You just proved the PP's point. She observed that teachers are always trying to one up anyone else's complaints...and you had to chime in and complain about how your job is just so much worse.

As a parent, I don't expect any teachers or other parents to be martyrs for their children. Teachers dramatically over-generalize their problems.

Why can’t you just accept it as fact? If teachers are so overly dramatic about their jobs and they can’t possibly be telling the truth, why don’t you get in on that cushy action? I’m not a teacher and could never be a teacher. I’ve spent enough time in schools as an adult to know that. It’s much worse today than even 10 years ago. Teachers have to be vocal about what they experience because the general public thinks of them as overpaid babysitters. Why is so difficult to understand that the job may actually be that difficult and that all of the teachers on here aren’t just being dramatic?