We don’t know if there are gods, or a God

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Everyone thinks they know but they don't. If there is a god/s, maybe its not about control over our lives, but just the existence of spiritual energy/force.

You are correct, no one can say with 100% absolute certainty that god does or does not exist.

However, I can use reason and logic to evaluate the information we do have available to make a decision.

Upon review, in my opinion, god does not exist.

I would also say that if you have reduced god down to the bare minimum possible for belief of "spiritual energ/force", why bother believing at all?

We have reasonable, natural ideas for many of life's big questions. They are not 100% complete, and odds are likely we may never have full knowledge.

Seeking out new information to help understand our place in the universe does not require god in any shape or form, however you may want to define it or call it.

Just like no one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys sneak your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Incorrect. This is a bad anology.

I could put cameras with multiple sensors around my house to check if they were only invisible in the visual spectrum or in all frequencies of the electromagnetic spectrum. The cameras would directly record the scissors in the house. One could also tie them down and/or put an alarm around them.

This is testable which means we can gather data to help make a determination one way or another.

No, they could alter camera footage. Space monkeys are very sneaky.

No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Failed logic once again. You are making a falsifiable claim. It can be disputed as you can establish valid experiments to collect data.

So yes, I can say with 100% certainty that invisible space monkeys are NOT undertaking the actions you are claiming.

Also, we have reduced god(s) to such an inconsequential role, why would believing change anything?

We have natural explanations that are backed up by logic, experiment, and evidence. There is no need for god(s).

No, there is no evidence. No experiment that will 100% rule it out.

Wrong again.

Really, try working on your critical thinking skills. Your invisible space monkeys is a disprovable claim. Yes, it can be ruled out. A single experiment may not be enough data, but running enough trials will result in data that is statistically significant. Which, it will rule them out.

Also, moving the goalposts does not change the facts. This is exactly what theists try to do in the face of science, reason, and evidence.

The claim was “100% absolute certainty”, not “statistically significant”.

No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Wrong again. You are conflating two posts.

I can say with 100% certainty that your invisible space monkeys do not sneak into my house at night to hide all my scissors.

You seem to not comprehend how evidence and logical conclusions work.

You are making a falsefiable claim. A method of proving that has been presented and you are the one that cannot accept it.

You can’t claim falsity from lack of proof.

You have modified the scenario with very specific conditions/assumptions designed to fail your test.

That doesn’t prove they don’t exist outside of those specific conditions. You would have to observe all scissors all of the time and the monkeys couldn’t be invisible.

It’s unfalsifiable.

No one modified sh!t. You are trying to move the goalposts.

PP said, quote "No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒"

This quoted claim was disputed. A poster asserted yes, they can say 100% with absolute certainty that their scissors in their house are not being hidden by invisible space monkeys.

You are continuing to ignore valid debunking of your ridiculous claim.

And, as also indicated previously, you dont seem to understand how a claim, evidence, logic, and reason work together.

No, the PP can’t claim falsity from lack of proof. The test doesn’t cover all possible scenarios. Any “evidence” would be incomplete.

It’s unfalsifiable.

A test does not have to cover all scenarios.

The burden of proof lies with the assertion.

Until you present evidence FOR the existence of said monkeys and their antics, it is 100% certain they dont exist.

So without evidence of gods, you are 100% certain they don’t exist?

What are you trying to accomplish by continuing to move the goalposts?

First, it was invisible space monkeys in "my" home hiding scissors. Then it was in neighbors or others after I asserted with 100% complete certainty they weren't hiding my scissors.

Now, you are trying to make it some broader philosophy on god?

God does not exist. I am 100% certain.

Are you the cowardly non-believer who claims they only describe themself as agnostic to avoid taking an actual position?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Everyone thinks they know but they don't. If there is a god/s, maybe its not about control over our lives, but just the existence of spiritual energy/force.

You are correct, no one can say with 100% absolute certainty that god does or does not exist.

However, I can use reason and logic to evaluate the information we do have available to make a decision.

Upon review, in my opinion, god does not exist.

I would also say that if you have reduced god down to the bare minimum possible for belief of "spiritual energ/force", why bother believing at all?

We have reasonable, natural ideas for many of life's big questions. They are not 100% complete, and odds are likely we may never have full knowledge.

Seeking out new information to help understand our place in the universe does not require god in any shape or form, however you may want to define it or call it.

Just like no one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys sneak your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Incorrect. This is a bad anology.

I could put cameras with multiple sensors around my house to check if they were only invisible in the visual spectrum or in all frequencies of the electromagnetic spectrum. The cameras would directly record the scissors in the house. One could also tie them down and/or put an alarm around them.

This is testable which means we can gather data to help make a determination one way or another.

No, they could alter camera footage. Space monkeys are very sneaky.

No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Failed logic once again. You are making a falsifiable claim. It can be disputed as you can establish valid experiments to collect data.

So yes, I can say with 100% certainty that invisible space monkeys are NOT undertaking the actions you are claiming.

Also, we have reduced god(s) to such an inconsequential role, why would believing change anything?

We have natural explanations that are backed up by logic, experiment, and evidence. There is no need for god(s).

No, there is no evidence. No experiment that will 100% rule it out.

Wrong again.

Really, try working on your critical thinking skills. Your invisible space monkeys is a disprovable claim. Yes, it can be ruled out. A single experiment may not be enough data, but running enough trials will result in data that is statistically significant. Which, it will rule them out.

Also, moving the goalposts does not change the facts. This is exactly what theists try to do in the face of science, reason, and evidence.

The claim was “100% absolute certainty”, not “statistically significant”.

No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Wrong again. You are conflating two posts.

I can say with 100% certainty that your invisible space monkeys do not sneak into my house at night to hide all my scissors.

You seem to not comprehend how evidence and logical conclusions work.

You are making a falsefiable claim. A method of proving that has been presented and you are the one that cannot accept it.

You can’t claim falsity from lack of proof.

You have modified the scenario with very specific conditions/assumptions designed to fail your test.

That doesn’t prove they don’t exist outside of those specific conditions. You would have to observe all scissors all of the time and the monkeys couldn’t be invisible.

It’s unfalsifiable.

No one modified sh!t. You are trying to move the goalposts.

PP said, quote "No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒"

This quoted claim was disputed. A poster asserted yes, they can say 100% with absolute certainty that their scissors in their house are not being hidden by invisible space monkeys.

You are continuing to ignore valid debunking of your ridiculous claim.

And, as also indicated previously, you dont seem to understand how a claim, evidence, logic, and reason work together.

No, the PP can’t claim falsity from lack of proof. The test doesn’t cover all possible scenarios. Any “evidence” would be incomplete.

It’s unfalsifiable.

A test does not have to cover all scenarios.

The burden of proof lies with the assertion.

Until you present evidence FOR the existence of said monkeys and their antics, it is 100% certain they dont exist.

So without evidence of gods, you are 100% certain they don’t exist?

What are you trying to accomplish by continuing to move the goalposts?

First, it was invisible space monkeys in "my" home hiding scissors. Then it was in neighbors or others after I asserted with 100% complete certainty they weren't hiding my scissors.

Now, you are trying to make it some broader philosophy on god?

God does not exist. I am 100% certain.

Are you the cowardly non-believer who claims they only describe themself as agnostic to avoid taking an actual position?

You may be 100% certain about the monkeys but that’s not based on “evidence”. The test doesn’t cover all possible scenarios - any “evidence” would be incomplete.

You can’t claim falsity from lack of proof.

And you are definitely confusing posters.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Everyone thinks they know but they don't. If there is a god/s, maybe its not about control over our lives, but just the existence of spiritual energy/force.

You are correct, no one can say with 100% absolute certainty that god does or does not exist.

However, I can use reason and logic to evaluate the information we do have available to make a decision.

Upon review, in my opinion, god does not exist.

I would also say that if you have reduced god down to the bare minimum possible for belief of "spiritual energ/force", why bother believing at all?

We have reasonable, natural ideas for many of life's big questions. They are not 100% complete, and odds are likely we may never have full knowledge.

Seeking out new information to help understand our place in the universe does not require god in any shape or form, however you may want to define it or call it.

Just like no one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys sneak your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Incorrect. This is a bad anology.

I could put cameras with multiple sensors around my house to check if they were only invisible in the visual spectrum or in all frequencies of the electromagnetic spectrum. The cameras would directly record the scissors in the house. One could also tie them down and/or put an alarm around them.

This is testable which means we can gather data to help make a determination one way or another.

No, they could alter camera footage. Space monkeys are very sneaky.

No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Failed logic once again. You are making a falsifiable claim. It can be disputed as you can establish valid experiments to collect data.

So yes, I can say with 100% certainty that invisible space monkeys are NOT undertaking the actions you are claiming.

Also, we have reduced god(s) to such an inconsequential role, why would believing change anything?

We have natural explanations that are backed up by logic, experiment, and evidence. There is no need for god(s).

No, there is no evidence. No experiment that will 100% rule it out.

Wrong again.

Really, try working on your critical thinking skills. Your invisible space monkeys is a disprovable claim. Yes, it can be ruled out. A single experiment may not be enough data, but running enough trials will result in data that is statistically significant. Which, it will rule them out.

Also, moving the goalposts does not change the facts. This is exactly what theists try to do in the face of science, reason, and evidence.

The claim was “100% absolute certainty”, not “statistically significant”.

No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Wrong again. You are conflating two posts.

I can say with 100% certainty that your invisible space monkeys do not sneak into my house at night to hide all my scissors.

You seem to not comprehend how evidence and logical conclusions work.

You are making a falsefiable claim. A method of proving that has been presented and you are the one that cannot accept it.

You can’t claim falsity from lack of proof.

You have modified the scenario with very specific conditions/assumptions designed to fail your test.

That doesn’t prove they don’t exist outside of those specific conditions. You would have to observe all scissors all of the time and the monkeys couldn’t be invisible.

It’s unfalsifiable.

No one modified sh!t. You are trying to move the goalposts.

PP said, quote "No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒"

This quoted claim was disputed. A poster asserted yes, they can say 100% with absolute certainty that their scissors in their house are not being hidden by invisible space monkeys.

You are continuing to ignore valid debunking of your ridiculous claim.

And, as also indicated previously, you dont seem to understand how a claim, evidence, logic, and reason work together.

No, the PP can’t claim falsity from lack of proof. The test doesn’t cover all possible scenarios. Any “evidence” would be incomplete.

It’s unfalsifiable.

A test does not have to cover all scenarios.

The burden of proof lies with the assertion.

Until you present evidence FOR the existence of said monkeys and their antics, it is 100% certain they dont exist.

So without evidence of gods, you are 100% certain they don’t exist?

What are you trying to accomplish by continuing to move the goalposts?

First, it was invisible space monkeys in "my" home hiding scissors. Then it was in neighbors or others after I asserted with 100% complete certainty they weren't hiding my scissors.

Now, you are trying to make it some broader philosophy on god?

God does not exist. I am 100% certain.

Are you the cowardly non-believer who claims they only describe themself as agnostic to avoid taking an actual position?

You may be 100% certain about the monkeys but that’s not based on “evidence”. The test doesn’t cover all possible scenarios - any “evidence” would be incomplete.

You can’t claim falsity from lack of proof.

And you are definitely confusing posters.

Yes, I do have evidence. I have my daily experiences where this has never happened. I could start to document it so that I would have hard data, but that is completely unnecessary to countering your bogus idea.

And it is false unless you can present proof to the contrary.

Go ahead and do so.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Everyone thinks they know but they don't. If there is a god/s, maybe its not about control over our lives, but just the existence of spiritual energy/force.

You are correct, no one can say with 100% absolute certainty that god does or does not exist.

However, I can use reason and logic to evaluate the information we do have available to make a decision.

Upon review, in my opinion, god does not exist.

I would also say that if you have reduced god down to the bare minimum possible for belief of "spiritual energ/force", why bother believing at all?

We have reasonable, natural ideas for many of life's big questions. They are not 100% complete, and odds are likely we may never have full knowledge.

Seeking out new information to help understand our place in the universe does not require god in any shape or form, however you may want to define it or call it.

Just like no one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys sneak your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Incorrect. This is a bad anology.

I could put cameras with multiple sensors around my house to check if they were only invisible in the visual spectrum or in all frequencies of the electromagnetic spectrum. The cameras would directly record the scissors in the house. One could also tie them down and/or put an alarm around them.

This is testable which means we can gather data to help make a determination one way or another.

No, they could alter camera footage. Space monkeys are very sneaky.

No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Failed logic once again. You are making a falsifiable claim. It can be disputed as you can establish valid experiments to collect data.

So yes, I can say with 100% certainty that invisible space monkeys are NOT undertaking the actions you are claiming.

Also, we have reduced god(s) to such an inconsequential role, why would believing change anything?

We have natural explanations that are backed up by logic, experiment, and evidence. There is no need for god(s).

No, there is no evidence. No experiment that will 100% rule it out.

Wrong again.

Really, try working on your critical thinking skills. Your invisible space monkeys is a disprovable claim. Yes, it can be ruled out. A single experiment may not be enough data, but running enough trials will result in data that is statistically significant. Which, it will rule them out.

Also, moving the goalposts does not change the facts. This is exactly what theists try to do in the face of science, reason, and evidence.

The claim was “100% absolute certainty”, not “statistically significant”.

No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Wrong again. You are conflating two posts.

I can say with 100% certainty that your invisible space monkeys do not sneak into my house at night to hide all my scissors.

You seem to not comprehend how evidence and logical conclusions work.

You are making a falsefiable claim. A method of proving that has been presented and you are the one that cannot accept it.

You can’t claim falsity from lack of proof.

You have modified the scenario with very specific conditions/assumptions designed to fail your test.

That doesn’t prove they don’t exist outside of those specific conditions. You would have to observe all scissors all of the time and the monkeys couldn’t be invisible.

It’s unfalsifiable.

No one modified sh!t. You are trying to move the goalposts.

PP said, quote "No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒"

This quoted claim was disputed. A poster asserted yes, they can say 100% with absolute certainty that their scissors in their house are not being hidden by invisible space monkeys.

You are continuing to ignore valid debunking of your ridiculous claim.

And, as also indicated previously, you dont seem to understand how a claim, evidence, logic, and reason work together.

No, the PP can’t claim falsity from lack of proof. The test doesn’t cover all possible scenarios. Any “evidence” would be incomplete.

It’s unfalsifiable.

A test does not have to cover all scenarios.

The burden of proof lies with the assertion.

Until you present evidence FOR the existence of said monkeys and their antics, it is 100% certain they dont exist.

So without evidence of gods, you are 100% certain they don’t exist?

What are you trying to accomplish by continuing to move the goalposts?

First, it was invisible space monkeys in "my" home hiding scissors. Then it was in neighbors or others after I asserted with 100% complete certainty they weren't hiding my scissors.

Now, you are trying to make it some broader philosophy on god?

God does not exist. I am 100% certain.

Are you the cowardly non-believer who claims they only describe themself as agnostic to avoid taking an actual position?

Yes, pp is the cowardly non-believer who claims they only describe themself as agnostic to avoid taking an actual position.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Everyone thinks they know but they don't. If there is a god/s, maybe its not about control over our lives, but just the existence of spiritual energy/force.

You are correct, no one can say with 100% absolute certainty that god does or does not exist.

However, I can use reason and logic to evaluate the information we do have available to make a decision.

Upon review, in my opinion, god does not exist.

I would also say that if you have reduced god down to the bare minimum possible for belief of "spiritual energ/force", why bother believing at all?

We have reasonable, natural ideas for many of life's big questions. They are not 100% complete, and odds are likely we may never have full knowledge.

Seeking out new information to help understand our place in the universe does not require god in any shape or form, however you may want to define it or call it.

Just like no one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys sneak your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Incorrect. This is a bad anology.

I could put cameras with multiple sensors around my house to check if they were only invisible in the visual spectrum or in all frequencies of the electromagnetic spectrum. The cameras would directly record the scissors in the house. One could also tie them down and/or put an alarm around them.

This is testable which means we can gather data to help make a determination one way or another.

No, they could alter camera footage. Space monkeys are very sneaky.

No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Failed logic once again. You are making a falsifiable claim. It can be disputed as you can establish valid experiments to collect data.

So yes, I can say with 100% certainty that invisible space monkeys are NOT undertaking the actions you are claiming.

Also, we have reduced god(s) to such an inconsequential role, why would believing change anything?

We have natural explanations that are backed up by logic, experiment, and evidence. There is no need for god(s).

No, there is no evidence. No experiment that will 100% rule it out.

Wrong again.

Really, try working on your critical thinking skills. Your invisible space monkeys is a disprovable claim. Yes, it can be ruled out. A single experiment may not be enough data, but running enough trials will result in data that is statistically significant. Which, it will rule them out.

Also, moving the goalposts does not change the facts. This is exactly what theists try to do in the face of science, reason, and evidence.

The claim was “100% absolute certainty”, not “statistically significant”.

No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Wrong again. You are conflating two posts.

I can say with 100% certainty that your invisible space monkeys do not sneak into my house at night to hide all my scissors.

You seem to not comprehend how evidence and logical conclusions work.

You are making a falsefiable claim. A method of proving that has been presented and you are the one that cannot accept it.

You can’t claim falsity from lack of proof.

You have modified the scenario with very specific conditions/assumptions designed to fail your test.

That doesn’t prove they don’t exist outside of those specific conditions. You would have to observe all scissors all of the time and the monkeys couldn’t be invisible.

It’s unfalsifiable.

No one modified sh!t. You are trying to move the goalposts.

PP said, quote "No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒"

This quoted claim was disputed. A poster asserted yes, they can say 100% with absolute certainty that their scissors in their house are not being hidden by invisible space monkeys.

You are continuing to ignore valid debunking of your ridiculous claim.

And, as also indicated previously, you dont seem to understand how a claim, evidence, logic, and reason work together.

No, the PP can’t claim falsity from lack of proof. The test doesn’t cover all possible scenarios. Any “evidence” would be incomplete.

It’s unfalsifiable.

A test does not have to cover all scenarios.

The burden of proof lies with the assertion.

Until you present evidence FOR the existence of said monkeys and their antics, it is 100% certain they dont exist.

So without evidence of gods, you are 100% certain they don’t exist?

What are you trying to accomplish by continuing to move the goalposts?

First, it was invisible space monkeys in "my" home hiding scissors. Then it was in neighbors or others after I asserted with 100% complete certainty they weren't hiding my scissors.

Now, you are trying to make it some broader philosophy on god?

God does not exist. I am 100% certain.

Are you the cowardly non-believer who claims they only describe themself as agnostic to avoid taking an actual position?

You may be 100% certain about the monkeys but that’s not based on “evidence”. The test doesn’t cover all possible scenarios - any “evidence” would be incomplete.

You can’t claim falsity from lack of proof.

And you are definitely confusing posters.

Yes, I do have evidence. I have my daily experiences where this has never happened. I could start to document it so that I would have hard data, but that is completely unnecessary to countering your bogus idea.

And it is false unless you can present proof to the contrary.

Go ahead and do so.

Poster trying to argue with you doesn't understand how making a claim works and how to use evidence. It is clearly a falsifiable theory.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Only on dcum would multiple people pretend they know with certainty there is or isn’t a God or gods.

I know with certainly that a pink elephant - or an elephant of any color - did NOT set the world in motion. How about you?

How do you know that for certain?

Because that falls outside the realm of the natural world.

People fabricated “supernatural forces” in their mind as a way to explain unknown things before science.

Yes it certainly appears that way - but if you can’t show evidence of a claim, how can you “know with certainty”?

How does one “show evidence” of something that doesn’t exist?

Show evidence that we aren’t living in a computer simulation.

You don’t, you can’t, and that is the point: you should not claim certainty without evidence. If you do, you give the theists the right to do so as well. That is what they want most, a level playing field for their illogical position.

In your second sentence you are asking the question of hard solipsism. Totally different one and not relevant to the god question in any way except as a distraction. Short answer: all debates have to start with some presuppositions. The laws of logic are generally considered the most basic ones. If we can’t agree on the premise that this is reality we experience, no discussion about the nature of that experience can be had so let’s not even bother. If someone’s presupposition is that a god exists (which a large percentage of theist arguments do) then also there is no way to have a discussion about it.

Claiming that something exists is a lot different than claiming something doesn’t. You can’t prove a negative.

Prove that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak your house at night to hide the scissors.

Prove that the god isn’t an invisible space monkey running a computer simulation.

Did you even read what you are responding to?

I did. It's bunk. Did you read my comment?

You could try replying to it with some substance instead of nonsense. When did I make any of the claims you ask me to prove? I don’t believe those things, nor do I believe in a god. I am just not going to claim certainty without evidence, nor will I accept it when theists do that, or when others do.

Claims require evidence. It’s basic logic.

So you are not certain if invisible space monkeys sneak your house at night to hide the scissors - or not?

No, I am not certain. But I also do not believe it. It’s a preposterous concept, and not worth considering. Just like a god.

I will tell you this: I don’t make any claim I can’t back up with evidence, because I am not an idiot.

So flying spaghetti monsters might exist?

If you are asking this question, even facetiously, you have missed so many points.

The question is not whether or not they might exist. The question is that it is a silly question to consider without evidence, so don’t make a claim either way… unless you are an idiot.

You don’t realize the irony of the point you think you are making.

So you would never say with 100% absolute certainty that flying spaghetti monsters don’t exist?

I would never make any claim about the existence of such. Stupid and meaningless to do sol. That is the point of the FSM. You know this. You are a fricking troll.

Do flying spaghetti monsters exist? Are you certain of your answer?

Not hard questions.

I do not believe they exist, no. But I cannot demonstrate that fact so I don’t claim it to be absolutely true. A burden of proof is on someone making a claim.

What is so hard about this to understand that you keep repeating the same question over and over?

You were evading a clear answer.

I just wanted you to confirm that you aren’t 100% certain that flying spaghetti monsters don’t exist.

Do you have a reading comprehension problem?

I make NO CLAIM WHATSOEVER that FSMs do or do not exist.

“ I do not believe they exist, no. But I cannot demonstrate that fact so I don’t claim it to be absolutely true. ”

So you can’t say you’re 100% certain.

I don’t claim to be 100% certain, or any degree certain. I make no claim regarding their existence whatsoever. Which is what I keep repeating OVER AND OVER AND YOU CAN’T SEEM TO COMPREHEND.

I do not believe they exist because I have seen no evidence of it. This is a simple concept for most people to understand.

“Mommy, do flying spaghetti monsters exist?”

“I don’t think so, but I can’t say definitively.”

🤡

What I can say definitively is that you are an idiot and a troll.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Everyone thinks they know but they don't. If there is a god/s, maybe its not about control over our lives, but just the existence of spiritual energy/force.

You are correct, no one can say with 100% absolute certainty that god does or does not exist.

However, I can use reason and logic to evaluate the information we do have available to make a decision.

Upon review, in my opinion, god does not exist.

I would also say that if you have reduced god down to the bare minimum possible for belief of "spiritual energ/force", why bother believing at all?

We have reasonable, natural ideas for many of life's big questions. They are not 100% complete, and odds are likely we may never have full knowledge.

Seeking out new information to help understand our place in the universe does not require god in any shape or form, however you may want to define it or call it.

Just like no one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys sneak your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Incorrect. This is a bad anology.

I could put cameras with multiple sensors around my house to check if they were only invisible in the visual spectrum or in all frequencies of the electromagnetic spectrum. The cameras would directly record the scissors in the house. One could also tie them down and/or put an alarm around them.

This is testable which means we can gather data to help make a determination one way or another.

No, they could alter camera footage. Space monkeys are very sneaky.

No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Failed logic once again. You are making a falsifiable claim. It can be disputed as you can establish valid experiments to collect data.

So yes, I can say with 100% certainty that invisible space monkeys are NOT undertaking the actions you are claiming.

Also, we have reduced god(s) to such an inconsequential role, why would believing change anything?

We have natural explanations that are backed up by logic, experiment, and evidence. There is no need for god(s).

No, there is no evidence. No experiment that will 100% rule it out.

Wrong again.

Really, try working on your critical thinking skills. Your invisible space monkeys is a disprovable claim. Yes, it can be ruled out. A single experiment may not be enough data, but running enough trials will result in data that is statistically significant. Which, it will rule them out.

Also, moving the goalposts does not change the facts. This is exactly what theists try to do in the face of science, reason, and evidence.

The claim was “100% absolute certainty”, not “statistically significant”.

No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Wrong again. You are conflating two posts.

I can say with 100% certainty that your invisible space monkeys do not sneak into my house at night to hide all my scissors.

You seem to not comprehend how evidence and logical conclusions work.

You are making a falsefiable claim. A method of proving that has been presented and you are the one that cannot accept it.

You can’t claim falsity from lack of proof.

You have modified the scenario with very specific conditions/assumptions designed to fail your test.

That doesn’t prove they don’t exist outside of those specific conditions. You would have to observe all scissors all of the time and the monkeys couldn’t be invisible.

It’s unfalsifiable.

No one modified sh!t. You are trying to move the goalposts.

PP said, quote "No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒"

This quoted claim was disputed. A poster asserted yes, they can say 100% with absolute certainty that their scissors in their house are not being hidden by invisible space monkeys.

You are continuing to ignore valid debunking of your ridiculous claim.

And, as also indicated previously, you dont seem to understand how a claim, evidence, logic, and reason work together.

No, the PP can’t claim falsity from lack of proof. The test doesn’t cover all possible scenarios. Any “evidence” would be incomplete.

It’s unfalsifiable.

A test does not have to cover all scenarios.

The burden of proof lies with the assertion.

Until you present evidence FOR the existence of said monkeys and their antics, it is 100% certain they dont exist.

So without evidence of gods, you are 100% certain they don’t exist?

What are you trying to accomplish by continuing to move the goalposts?

First, it was invisible space monkeys in "my" home hiding scissors. Then it was in neighbors or others after I asserted with 100% complete certainty they weren't hiding my scissors.

Now, you are trying to make it some broader philosophy on god?

God does not exist. I am 100% certain.

Are you the cowardly non-believer who claims they only describe themself as agnostic to avoid taking an actual position?

You may be 100% certain about the monkeys but that’s not based on “evidence”. The test doesn’t cover all possible scenarios - any “evidence” would be incomplete.

You can’t claim falsity from lack of proof.

And you are definitely confusing posters.

Yes, I do have evidence. I have my daily experiences where this has never happened. I could start to document it so that I would have hard data, but that is completely unnecessary to countering your bogus idea.

And it is false unless you can present proof to the contrary.

Go ahead and do so.

You are adding assumptions. Moving the goalposts, so to speak. You can’t claim falsity from lack of proof.

I didn't claim that they exist. And, according the agnostic clown, you can't claim with 100% absolute certainty that they don't.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Everyone thinks they know but they don't. If there is a god/s, maybe its not about control over our lives, but just the existence of spiritual energy/force.

You are correct, no one can say with 100% absolute certainty that god does or does not exist.

However, I can use reason and logic to evaluate the information we do have available to make a decision.

Upon review, in my opinion, god does not exist.

I would also say that if you have reduced god down to the bare minimum possible for belief of "spiritual energ/force", why bother believing at all?

We have reasonable, natural ideas for many of life's big questions. They are not 100% complete, and odds are likely we may never have full knowledge.

Seeking out new information to help understand our place in the universe does not require god in any shape or form, however you may want to define it or call it.

Just like no one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys sneak your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Incorrect. This is a bad anology.

I could put cameras with multiple sensors around my house to check if they were only invisible in the visual spectrum or in all frequencies of the electromagnetic spectrum. The cameras would directly record the scissors in the house. One could also tie them down and/or put an alarm around them.

This is testable which means we can gather data to help make a determination one way or another.

No, they could alter camera footage. Space monkeys are very sneaky.

No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Failed logic once again. You are making a falsifiable claim. It can be disputed as you can establish valid experiments to collect data.

So yes, I can say with 100% certainty that invisible space monkeys are NOT undertaking the actions you are claiming.

Also, we have reduced god(s) to such an inconsequential role, why would believing change anything?

We have natural explanations that are backed up by logic, experiment, and evidence. There is no need for god(s).

No, there is no evidence. No experiment that will 100% rule it out.

Wrong again.

Really, try working on your critical thinking skills. Your invisible space monkeys is a disprovable claim. Yes, it can be ruled out. A single experiment may not be enough data, but running enough trials will result in data that is statistically significant. Which, it will rule them out.

Also, moving the goalposts does not change the facts. This is exactly what theists try to do in the face of science, reason, and evidence.

The claim was “100% absolute certainty”, not “statistically significant”.

No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Wrong again. You are conflating two posts.

I can say with 100% certainty that your invisible space monkeys do not sneak into my house at night to hide all my scissors.

You seem to not comprehend how evidence and logical conclusions work.

You are making a falsefiable claim. A method of proving that has been presented and you are the one that cannot accept it.

You can’t claim falsity from lack of proof.

You have modified the scenario with very specific conditions/assumptions designed to fail your test.

That doesn’t prove they don’t exist outside of those specific conditions. You would have to observe all scissors all of the time and the monkeys couldn’t be invisible.

It’s unfalsifiable.

No one modified sh!t. You are trying to move the goalposts.

PP said, quote "No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒"

This quoted claim was disputed. A poster asserted yes, they can say 100% with absolute certainty that their scissors in their house are not being hidden by invisible space monkeys.

You are continuing to ignore valid debunking of your ridiculous claim.

And, as also indicated previously, you dont seem to understand how a claim, evidence, logic, and reason work together.

No, the PP can’t claim falsity from lack of proof. The test doesn’t cover all possible scenarios. Any “evidence” would be incomplete.

It’s unfalsifiable.

A test does not have to cover all scenarios.

The burden of proof lies with the assertion.

Until you present evidence FOR the existence of said monkeys and their antics, it is 100% certain they dont exist.

So without evidence of gods, you are 100% certain they don’t exist?

What are you trying to accomplish by continuing to move the goalposts?

First, it was invisible space monkeys in "my" home hiding scissors. Then it was in neighbors or others after I asserted with 100% complete certainty they weren't hiding my scissors.

Now, you are trying to make it some broader philosophy on god?

God does not exist. I am 100% certain.

Are you the cowardly non-believer who claims they only describe themself as agnostic to avoid taking an actual position?

You may be 100% certain about the monkeys but that’s not based on “evidence”. The test doesn’t cover all possible scenarios - any “evidence” would be incomplete.

You can’t claim falsity from lack of proof.

And you are definitely confusing posters.

Yes, I do have evidence. I have my daily experiences where this has never happened. I could start to document it so that I would have hard data, but that is completely unnecessary to countering your bogus idea.

And it is false unless you can present proof to the contrary.

Go ahead and do so.

You are adding assumptions. Moving the goalposts, so to speak. You can’t claim falsity from lack of proof.

I didn't claim that they exist. And, according the agnostic clown, you can't claim with 100% absolute certainty that they don't.

Huh? I'm trying to follow and respond to you, but you are not making sense.

In this specific scenario, invisible space monkeys are not hiding scissors in my home or any others. Its an absurd premise and easily debunked.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:So many posts stating that people should face reality, there are no gods or God.

This is not a settled question.

Whomever posts this is stating their opinion, which if correctly stated, they personally don’t believe in gods or a God.

They claim something that no one really knows.

So if you don’t believe in gods or a God, great, that’s your opinion.

But other people do believe in a higher power, gods, a God, or God. Their belief is just as valid and acceptable as not believing.

No, your opinion that Gods exist is not "as valid and acceptable as not believing" unless you apply that same standard to belief in fairies and Santa Claus. They, like God, are invisible beings, that all kids grow out of before adulthood. Also, I bet you only believe in one of the Gods that are out there -- say the Christian God and not the Muslim God. How can that be?

The Christian God and the Muslim God are the same God (Abrahamic God). If you’re going to try and make a point, at least get your facts right.

Did the Christian god dictate the Quran to Mohammed? If so, Christians are in big trouble for not following the rules.

Actually they are all the same rules every time. It’s just that people keep misinterpreting them.

But did the Christian god dictate the Quran to Mohammed? Or do the Christians have a different story/different god?

Same original God. What’s so difficult for you to understand? You clearly aren’t religious, so why are you contributing?

Let me rephrase since you are struggling:

Do Christians believe that their god dictated the Quran to Mohammed?

NP here. You seem to be confused, because you have asked two different questions. Whether Christians believe their God dictated the Quran is a different question than if the Christian God and Muslim God are the same. The God of Christianity and Islam is the God of Abraham, as PP pointed out. Same God. In contrast, the God of Abraham is not the same as Vishnu (as an example). Different gods. No one is saying Christians believe God dictated the Quran (they don’t), but it’s not the gotcha question you seem to think it is. It’s an entirely different question. Christians and Muslims believe different things about their deity, but the deity in both religions is from the same, singular origin. See the difference?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So many posts stating that people should face reality, there are no gods or God.

This is not a settled question.

Whomever posts this is stating their opinion, which if correctly stated, they personally don’t believe in gods or a God.

They claim something that no one really knows.

So if you don’t believe in gods or a God, great, that’s your opinion.

But other people do believe in a higher power, gods, a God, or God. Their belief is just as valid and acceptable as not believing.

No, your opinion that Gods exist is not "as valid and acceptable as not believing" unless you apply that same standard to belief in fairies and Santa Claus. They, like God, are invisible beings, that all kids grow out of before adulthood. Also, I bet you only believe in one of the Gods that are out there -- say the Christian God and not the Muslim God. How can that be?

The Christian God and the Muslim God are the same God (Abrahamic God). If you’re going to try and make a point, at least get your facts right.

Did the Christian god dictate the Quran to Mohammed? If so, Christians are in big trouble for not following the rules.

Actually they are all the same rules every time. It’s just that people keep misinterpreting them.

But did the Christian god dictate the Quran to Mohammed? Or do the Christians have a different story/different god?

Same original God. What’s so difficult for you to understand? You clearly aren’t religious, so why are you contributing?

Let me rephrase since you are struggling:

Do Christians believe that their god dictated the Quran to Mohammed?

NP here. You seem to be confused, because you have asked two different questions. Whether Christians believe their God dictated the Quran is a different question than if the Christian God and Muslim God are the same. The God of Christianity and Islam is the God of Abraham, as PP pointed out. Same God. In contrast, the God of Abraham is not the same as Vishnu (as an example). Different gods. No one is saying Christians believe God dictated the Quran (they don’t), but it’s not the gotcha question you seem to think it is. It’s an entirely different question. Christians and Muslims believe different things about their deity, but the deity in both religions is from the same, singular origin. See the difference?

So the Christian version of "god" is significantly different than the Muslim god. Just like it's different from the god that Jewish people worship. Do Jewish people think that god had a son? No.

They may have originated from the same OG story, but their versions are very different. Not the same stories. Not the same beliefs. Not the same gods.

1.0 <> 2.0 <> 3.0

The supernatural entity that christians believe to be "god" is very different than the supernatural entities that muslim or jewish people believe exist. It's like the multiverse.

Spoiler: A "god" IS the belief, not an actual entity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Everyone thinks they know but they don't. If there is a god/s, maybe its not about control over our lives, but just the existence of spiritual energy/force.

You are correct, no one can say with 100% absolute certainty that god does or does not exist.

However, I can use reason and logic to evaluate the information we do have available to make a decision.

Upon review, in my opinion, god does not exist.

I would also say that if you have reduced god down to the bare minimum possible for belief of "spiritual energ/force", why bother believing at all?

We have reasonable, natural ideas for many of life's big questions. They are not 100% complete, and odds are likely we may never have full knowledge.

Seeking out new information to help understand our place in the universe does not require god in any shape or form, however you may want to define it or call it.

Just like no one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys sneak your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Incorrect. This is a bad anology.

I could put cameras with multiple sensors around my house to check if they were only invisible in the visual spectrum or in all frequencies of the electromagnetic spectrum. The cameras would directly record the scissors in the house. One could also tie them down and/or put an alarm around them.

This is testable which means we can gather data to help make a determination one way or another.

No, they could alter camera footage. Space monkeys are very sneaky.

No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Failed logic once again. You are making a falsifiable claim. It can be disputed as you can establish valid experiments to collect data.

So yes, I can say with 100% certainty that invisible space monkeys are NOT undertaking the actions you are claiming.

Also, we have reduced god(s) to such an inconsequential role, why would believing change anything?

We have natural explanations that are backed up by logic, experiment, and evidence. There is no need for god(s).

No, there is no evidence. No experiment that will 100% rule it out.

Wrong again.

Really, try working on your critical thinking skills. Your invisible space monkeys is a disprovable claim. Yes, it can be ruled out. A single experiment may not be enough data, but running enough trials will result in data that is statistically significant. Which, it will rule them out.

Also, moving the goalposts does not change the facts. This is exactly what theists try to do in the face of science, reason, and evidence.

The claim was “100% absolute certainty”, not “statistically significant”.

No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Wrong again. You are conflating two posts.

I can say with 100% certainty that your invisible space monkeys do not sneak into my house at night to hide all my scissors.

You seem to not comprehend how evidence and logical conclusions work.

You are making a falsefiable claim. A method of proving that has been presented and you are the one that cannot accept it.

You can’t claim falsity from lack of proof.

You have modified the scenario with very specific conditions/assumptions designed to fail your test.

That doesn’t prove they don’t exist outside of those specific conditions. You would have to observe all scissors all of the time and the monkeys couldn’t be invisible.

It’s unfalsifiable.

No one modified sh!t. You are trying to move the goalposts.

PP said, quote "No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒"

This quoted claim was disputed. A poster asserted yes, they can say 100% with absolute certainty that their scissors in their house are not being hidden by invisible space monkeys.

You are continuing to ignore valid debunking of your ridiculous claim.

And, as also indicated previously, you dont seem to understand how a claim, evidence, logic, and reason work together.

No, the PP can’t claim falsity from lack of proof. The test doesn’t cover all possible scenarios. Any “evidence” would be incomplete.

It’s unfalsifiable.

A test does not have to cover all scenarios.

The burden of proof lies with the assertion.

Until you present evidence FOR the existence of said monkeys and their antics, it is 100% certain they dont exist.

So without evidence of gods, you are 100% certain they don’t exist?

What are you trying to accomplish by continuing to move the goalposts?

First, it was invisible space monkeys in "my" home hiding scissors. Then it was in neighbors or others after I asserted with 100% complete certainty they weren't hiding my scissors.

Now, you are trying to make it some broader philosophy on god?

God does not exist. I am 100% certain.

Are you the cowardly non-believer who claims they only describe themself as agnostic to avoid taking an actual position?

You may be 100% certain about the monkeys but that’s not based on “evidence”. The test doesn’t cover all possible scenarios - any “evidence” would be incomplete.

You can’t claim falsity from lack of proof.

And you are definitely confusing posters.

Yes, I do have evidence. I have my daily experiences where this has never happened. I could start to document it so that I would have hard data, but that is completely unnecessary to countering your bogus idea.

And it is false unless you can present proof to the contrary.

Go ahead and do so.

You are adding assumptions. Moving the goalposts, so to speak. You can’t claim falsity from lack of proof.

I didn't claim that they exist. And, according the agnostic clown, you can't claim with 100% absolute certainty that they don't.

Huh? I'm trying to follow and respond to you, but you are not making sense.

In this specific scenario, invisible space monkeys are not hiding scissors in my home or any others. Its an absurd premise and easily debunked.

It is absurd, but not easily debunked. Just like many other absurd concepts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Everyone thinks they know but they don't. If there is a god/s, maybe its not about control over our lives, but just the existence of spiritual energy/force.

You are correct, no one can say with 100% absolute certainty that god does or does not exist.

However, I can use reason and logic to evaluate the information we do have available to make a decision.

Upon review, in my opinion, god does not exist.

I would also say that if you have reduced god down to the bare minimum possible for belief of "spiritual energ/force", why bother believing at all?

We have reasonable, natural ideas for many of life's big questions. They are not 100% complete, and odds are likely we may never have full knowledge.

Seeking out new information to help understand our place in the universe does not require god in any shape or form, however you may want to define it or call it.

Just like no one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys sneak your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Incorrect. This is a bad anology.

I could put cameras with multiple sensors around my house to check if they were only invisible in the visual spectrum or in all frequencies of the electromagnetic spectrum. The cameras would directly record the scissors in the house. One could also tie them down and/or put an alarm around them.

This is testable which means we can gather data to help make a determination one way or another.

No, they could alter camera footage. Space monkeys are very sneaky.

No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Failed logic once again. You are making a falsifiable claim. It can be disputed as you can establish valid experiments to collect data.

So yes, I can say with 100% certainty that invisible space monkeys are NOT undertaking the actions you are claiming.

Also, we have reduced god(s) to such an inconsequential role, why would believing change anything?

We have natural explanations that are backed up by logic, experiment, and evidence. There is no need for god(s).

No, there is no evidence. No experiment that will 100% rule it out.

Wrong again.

Really, try working on your critical thinking skills. Your invisible space monkeys is a disprovable claim. Yes, it can be ruled out. A single experiment may not be enough data, but running enough trials will result in data that is statistically significant. Which, it will rule them out.

Also, moving the goalposts does not change the facts. This is exactly what theists try to do in the face of science, reason, and evidence.

The claim was “100% absolute certainty”, not “statistically significant”.

No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Wrong again. You are conflating two posts.

I can say with 100% certainty that your invisible space monkeys do not sneak into my house at night to hide all my scissors.

You seem to not comprehend how evidence and logical conclusions work.

You are making a falsefiable claim. A method of proving that has been presented and you are the one that cannot accept it.

You can’t claim falsity from lack of proof.

You have modified the scenario with very specific conditions/assumptions designed to fail your test.

That doesn’t prove they don’t exist outside of those specific conditions. You would have to observe all scissors all of the time and the monkeys couldn’t be invisible.

It’s unfalsifiable.

No one modified sh!t. You are trying to move the goalposts.

PP said, quote "No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒"

This quoted claim was disputed. A poster asserted yes, they can say 100% with absolute certainty that their scissors in their house are not being hidden by invisible space monkeys.

You are continuing to ignore valid debunking of your ridiculous claim.

And, as also indicated previously, you dont seem to understand how a claim, evidence, logic, and reason work together.

No, the PP can’t claim falsity from lack of proof. The test doesn’t cover all possible scenarios. Any “evidence” would be incomplete.

It’s unfalsifiable.

A test does not have to cover all scenarios.

The burden of proof lies with the assertion.

Until you present evidence FOR the existence of said monkeys and their antics, it is 100% certain they dont exist.

So without evidence of gods, you are 100% certain they don’t exist?

What are you trying to accomplish by continuing to move the goalposts?

First, it was invisible space monkeys in "my" home hiding scissors. Then it was in neighbors or others after I asserted with 100% complete certainty they weren't hiding my scissors.

Now, you are trying to make it some broader philosophy on god?

God does not exist. I am 100% certain.

Are you the cowardly non-believer who claims they only describe themself as agnostic to avoid taking an actual position?

You may be 100% certain about the monkeys but that’s not based on “evidence”. The test doesn’t cover all possible scenarios - any “evidence” would be incomplete.

You can’t claim falsity from lack of proof.

And you are definitely confusing posters.

Yes, I do have evidence. I have my daily experiences where this has never happened. I could start to document it so that I would have hard data, but that is completely unnecessary to countering your bogus idea.

And it is false unless you can present proof to the contrary.

Go ahead and do so.

You are adding assumptions. Moving the goalposts, so to speak. You can’t claim falsity from lack of proof.

I didn't claim that they exist. And, according the agnostic clown, you can't claim with 100% absolute certainty that they don't.

Huh? I'm trying to follow and respond to you, but you are not making sense.

In this specific scenario, invisible space monkeys are not hiding scissors in my home or any others. Its an absurd premise and easily debunked.

It is absurd, but not easily debunked. Just like many other absurd concepts.

Elaborate on why you think its not easily debunked?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Everyone thinks they know but they don't. If there is a god/s, maybe its not about control over our lives, but just the existence of spiritual energy/force.

You are correct, no one can say with 100% absolute certainty that god does or does not exist.

However, I can use reason and logic to evaluate the information we do have available to make a decision.

Upon review, in my opinion, god does not exist.

I would also say that if you have reduced god down to the bare minimum possible for belief of "spiritual energ/force", why bother believing at all?

We have reasonable, natural ideas for many of life's big questions. They are not 100% complete, and odds are likely we may never have full knowledge.

Seeking out new information to help understand our place in the universe does not require god in any shape or form, however you may want to define it or call it.

Just like no one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys sneak your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Incorrect. This is a bad anology.

I could put cameras with multiple sensors around my house to check if they were only invisible in the visual spectrum or in all frequencies of the electromagnetic spectrum. The cameras would directly record the scissors in the house. One could also tie them down and/or put an alarm around them.

This is testable which means we can gather data to help make a determination one way or another.

No, they could alter camera footage. Space monkeys are very sneaky.

No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Failed logic once again. You are making a falsifiable claim. It can be disputed as you can establish valid experiments to collect data.

So yes, I can say with 100% certainty that invisible space monkeys are NOT undertaking the actions you are claiming.

Also, we have reduced god(s) to such an inconsequential role, why would believing change anything?

We have natural explanations that are backed up by logic, experiment, and evidence. There is no need for god(s).

No, there is no evidence. No experiment that will 100% rule it out.

Wrong again.

Really, try working on your critical thinking skills. Your invisible space monkeys is a disprovable claim. Yes, it can be ruled out. A single experiment may not be enough data, but running enough trials will result in data that is statistically significant. Which, it will rule them out.

Also, moving the goalposts does not change the facts. This is exactly what theists try to do in the face of science, reason, and evidence.

The claim was “100% absolute certainty”, not “statistically significant”.

No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒

Wrong again. You are conflating two posts.

I can say with 100% certainty that your invisible space monkeys do not sneak into my house at night to hide all my scissors.

You seem to not comprehend how evidence and logical conclusions work.

You are making a falsefiable claim. A method of proving that has been presented and you are the one that cannot accept it.

You can’t claim falsity from lack of proof.

You have modified the scenario with very specific conditions/assumptions designed to fail your test.

That doesn’t prove they don’t exist outside of those specific conditions. You would have to observe all scissors all of the time and the monkeys couldn’t be invisible.

It’s unfalsifiable.

No one modified sh!t. You are trying to move the goalposts.

PP said, quote "No one can say with 100% absolute certainty that invisible space monkeys don’t sneak into your house at night to hide all of the scissors. ✂️ 🐒"

This quoted claim was disputed. A poster asserted yes, they can say 100% with absolute certainty that their scissors in their house are not being hidden by invisible space monkeys.

You are continuing to ignore valid debunking of your ridiculous claim.

And, as also indicated previously, you dont seem to understand how a claim, evidence, logic, and reason work together.

No, the PP can’t claim falsity from lack of proof. The test doesn’t cover all possible scenarios. Any “evidence” would be incomplete.

It’s unfalsifiable.

A test does not have to cover all scenarios.

The burden of proof lies with the assertion.

Until you present evidence FOR the existence of said monkeys and their antics, it is 100% certain they dont exist.

So without evidence of gods, you are 100% certain they don’t exist?

What are you trying to accomplish by continuing to move the goalposts?

First, it was invisible space monkeys in "my" home hiding scissors. Then it was in neighbors or others after I asserted with 100% complete certainty they weren't hiding my scissors.

Now, you are trying to make it some broader philosophy on god?

God does not exist. I am 100% certain.

Are you the cowardly non-believer who claims they only describe themself as agnostic to avoid taking an actual position?

You may be 100% certain about the monkeys but that’s not based on “evidence”. The test doesn’t cover all possible scenarios - any “evidence” would be incomplete.

You can’t claim falsity from lack of proof.

And you are definitely confusing posters.

Yes, I do have evidence. I have my daily experiences where this has never happened. I could start to document it so that I would have hard data, but that is completely unnecessary to countering your bogus idea.

And it is false unless you can present proof to the contrary.

Go ahead and do so.

You are adding assumptions. Moving the goalposts, so to speak. You can’t claim falsity from lack of proof.

I didn't claim that they exist. And, according the agnostic clown, you can't claim with 100% absolute certainty that they don't.

Huh? I'm trying to follow and respond to you, but you are not making sense.

In this specific scenario, invisible space monkeys are not hiding scissors in my home or any others. Its an absurd premise and easily debunked.

It is absurd, but not easily debunked. Just like many other absurd concepts.

Elaborate on why you think its not easily debunked?

It’s tough to have “evidence” of NOT seeing something invisible.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So many posts stating that people should face reality, there are no gods or God.

This is not a settled question.

Whomever posts this is stating their opinion, which if correctly stated, they personally don’t believe in gods or a God.

They claim something that no one really knows.

So if you don’t believe in gods or a God, great, that’s your opinion.

But other people do believe in a higher power, gods, a God, or God. Their belief is just as valid and acceptable as not believing.

No, your opinion that Gods exist is not "as valid and acceptable as not believing" unless you apply that same standard to belief in fairies and Santa Claus. They, like God, are invisible beings, that all kids grow out of before adulthood. Also, I bet you only believe in one of the Gods that are out there -- say the Christian God and not the Muslim God. How can that be?

The Christian God and the Muslim God are the same God (Abrahamic God). If you’re going to try and make a point, at least get your facts right.

Did the Christian god dictate the Quran to Mohammed? If so, Christians are in big trouble for not following the rules.

Actually they are all the same rules every time. It’s just that people keep misinterpreting them.

But did the Christian god dictate the Quran to Mohammed? Or do the Christians have a different story/different god?

Same original God. What’s so difficult for you to understand? You clearly aren’t religious, so why are you contributing?

Let me rephrase since you are struggling:

Do Christians believe that their god dictated the Quran to Mohammed?

NP here. You seem to be confused, because you have asked two different questions. Whether Christians believe their God dictated the Quran is a different question than if the Christian God and Muslim God are the same. The God of Christianity and Islam is the God of Abraham, as PP pointed out. Same God. In contrast, the God of Abraham is not the same as Vishnu (as an example). Different gods. No one is saying Christians believe God dictated the Quran (they don’t), but it’s not the gotcha question you seem to think it is. It’s an entirely different question. Christians and Muslims believe different things about their deity, but the deity in both religions is from the same, singular origin. See the difference?

So the Christian version of "god" is significantly different than the Muslim god. Just like it's different from the god that Jewish people worship. Do Jewish people think that god had a son? No.

They may have originated from the same OG story, but their versions are very different. Not the same stories. Not the same beliefs. Not the same gods.

1.0 <> 2.0 <> 3.0

The supernatural entity that christians believe to be "god" is very different than the supernatural entities that muslim or jewish people believe exist. It's like the multiverse.

Spoiler: A "god" IS the belief, not an actual entity.

You’re hinging your point on the wrong thing. Same original God. Different beliefs about that God. You are saying the same things as the above PPs but then reaching a different conclusion. Your logic isn’t sound.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So many posts stating that people should face reality, there are no gods or God.

This is not a settled question.

Whomever posts this is stating their opinion, which if correctly stated, they personally don’t believe in gods or a God.

They claim something that no one really knows.

So if you don’t believe in gods or a God, great, that’s your opinion.

But other people do believe in a higher power, gods, a God, or God. Their belief is just as valid and acceptable as not believing.

No, your opinion that Gods exist is not "as valid and acceptable as not believing" unless you apply that same standard to belief in fairies and Santa Claus. They, like God, are invisible beings, that all kids grow out of before adulthood. Also, I bet you only believe in one of the Gods that are out there -- say the Christian God and not the Muslim God. How can that be?

The Christian God and the Muslim God are the same God (Abrahamic God). If you’re going to try and make a point, at least get your facts right.

Did the Christian god dictate the Quran to Mohammed? If so, Christians are in big trouble for not following the rules.

Actually they are all the same rules every time. It’s just that people keep misinterpreting them.

But did the Christian god dictate the Quran to Mohammed? Or do the Christians have a different story/different god?

Same original God. What’s so difficult for you to understand? You clearly aren’t religious, so why are you contributing?

Let me rephrase since you are struggling:

Do Christians believe that their god dictated the Quran to Mohammed?

NP here. You seem to be confused, because you have asked two different questions. Whether Christians believe their God dictated the Quran is a different question than if the Christian God and Muslim God are the same. The God of Christianity and Islam is the God of Abraham, as PP pointed out. Same God. In contrast, the God of Abraham is not the same as Vishnu (as an example). Different gods. No one is saying Christians believe God dictated the Quran (they don’t), but it’s not the gotcha question you seem to think it is. It’s an entirely different question. Christians and Muslims believe different things about their deity, but the deity in both religions is from the same, singular origin. See the difference?

So the Christian version of "god" is significantly different than the Muslim god. Just like it's different from the god that Jewish people worship. Do Jewish people think that god had a son? No.

They may have originated from the same OG story, but their versions are very different. Not the same stories. Not the same beliefs. Not the same gods.

1.0 <> 2.0 <> 3.0

The supernatural entity that christians believe to be "god" is very different than the supernatural entities that muslim or jewish people believe exist. It's like the multiverse.

Spoiler: A "god" IS the belief, not an actual entity.

You’re hinging your point on the wrong thing. Same original God. Different beliefs about that God. You are saying the same things as the above PPs but then reaching a different conclusion. Your logic isn’t sound.

Gods exist as beliefs in people’s minds. If a critical mass of people significantly change those beliefs then their “god” has morphed into something new that the OG believers no longer recognize as their own. It becomes a new, different version.

Do Jewish people believe that their god knocked up a virgin? No, their picture of what god says and does is different.

The beliefs are the god. Different beliefs, different god.