Question on High Tuition…

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have a quick question.

Normally if there are monopolistic practices that are detrimental to consumers you could file a claim at the federal trade commission or the office of consumer protection in dc. Is there anything similar for schools, or in essence they are free to charge anything they want. This is genuine question. Thank you.

One way or another (unless you have diplomatic status), you already are paying for your kid’s education in the public school system, so if you are sending your kid to private school, you are voluntarily paying extra for that. You don’t have to. You also “buy” private school education by the year. No one is required to buy 13, 7 or 4 (or even 2) years of it. Your kid’s private school isn’t committing to sell it to you next year, either. Hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of kids switch schools every year. Your kid can do that, too, if you don’t like next year’s price. Anyone surprised by increases in tuition every single year hasn’t been paying attention.

You don’t need to rely on some seemingly unmotivated government agency if you think private schools are engaged anticompetitive practices. Find a good plaintiffs law firm willing to file a private antitrust class action. You might be able to get treble damages or at least enough from a settlement as the named plaintiff to pay for your kid’s college tuition and your retirement.

First of all. The vast majority of kids stay in the same school most of their education if they can because it is costly to find a school that is a god match for the kid. So yes, it desirable to have a tuition that is predictable over time and not increasing consistently above let’s say wage inflation (which is higher than cpi inflation) .

Second, the lawsuit is not a bad idea but a bit expensive. If had the money I rather bribe the rest of the board members of the schools to pass budgets based on needs not wants.

The question I would ask is the following: If we need to invest one extra dollar that would request a higher tuition, is that dollar going to objectively improve the quality of education of the kids such that the investment is worthwhile or it’s just something that would improve the reputation of the board?

There is something about schools corporate governance that is off.

Your kid can leave or you can get involved in how the school is run.

Sure. But it’s harder when corruption is involved. That’s why I posed the original question if there is a regulatory agency that could help.

The only corruption involved is in your head.

Add another regulatory agency? You mean like the US Dept of Education? Or the State Board of Education? Or maybe the County Board of Education? What about educational accreditation agencies? How have all those agencies improve public schools’ governance? And you want that for privates?

NP. Very good point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There are some private schools that I would put them at the same level as Trump university in terms of quality and transparency.

???

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have a quick question.

Normally if there are monopolistic practices that are detrimental to consumers you could file a claim at the federal trade commission or the office of consumer protection in dc. Is there anything similar for schools, or in essence they are free to charge anything they want. This is genuine question. Thank you.

One way or another (unless you have diplomatic status), you already are paying for your kid’s education in the public school system, so if you are sending your kid to private school, you are voluntarily paying extra for that. You don’t have to. You also “buy” private school education by the year. No one is required to buy 13, 7 or 4 (or even 2) years of it. Your kid’s private school isn’t committing to sell it to you next year, either. Hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of kids switch schools every year. Your kid can do that, too, if you don’t like next year’s price. Anyone surprised by increases in tuition every single year hasn’t been paying attention.

You don’t need to rely on some seemingly unmotivated government agency if you think private schools are engaged anticompetitive practices. Find a good plaintiffs law firm willing to file a private antitrust class action. You might be able to get treble damages or at least enough from a settlement as the named plaintiff to pay for your kid’s college tuition and your retirement.

First of all. The vast majority of kids stay in the same school most of their education if they can because it is costly to find a school that is a god match for the kid. So yes, it desirable to have a tuition that is predictable over time and not increasing consistently above let’s say wage inflation (which is higher than cpi inflation) .

Second, the lawsuit is not a bad idea but a bit expensive. If had the money I rather bribe the rest of the board members of the schools to pass budgets based on needs not wants.

The question I would ask is the following: If we need to invest one extra dollar that would request a higher tuition, is that dollar going to objectively improve the quality of education of the kids such that the investment is worthwhile or it’s just something that would improve the reputation of the board?

There is something about schools corporate governance that is off.

Your kid can leave or you can get involved in how the school is run.

Sure. But it’s harder when corruption is involved. That’s why I posed the original question if there is a regulatory agency that could help.

The only corruption involved is in your head.

Add another regulatory agency? You mean like the US Dept of Education? Or the State Board of Education? Or maybe the County Board of Education? What about educational accreditation agencies? How have all those agencies improve public schools’ governance? And you want that for privates?

NP. Very good point.

Of course, because it never happens that a HOS hirers a friend without recruitment process. Unheard of….

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s a private school. They can charge whatever they want. Only the people who can’t afford it are complaining about the cost.

Not complaining at all. The US legal system allows consumers to contest abusive practices by corporations. Nothing outrageous about that. Just curious if there was something similar in DC. In Arizona has being proposed. Nothing crazy.

Looking to Arizona for DC private school policy is apples to oranges. The reason why a bill has been proposed in AZ to limit tuition increases in private schools is because AZ has a fairly rare voucher system (they call it ESA) that gives thousands of dollars to families who request it to pay for private school.

The problem is that once lawmakers in AZ dropped limits for the vouchers and allowed anyone to get the funds, including people who were already paying for private school without the ESA voucher funds, some private schools raised tuition by more than usual.

This isn’t a case of AZ state legislators having a soft spot for private school parents and looking to cap tuition costs because it’s just too expensive. It’s because, in AZ, some schools said “oh, families are now getting $8,000 on average from the state to pay for tuition. Well, they could afford the price before they got these funds so let’s raise tuition by $8,000”.

That was good policy. Wonder why tuition is growing higher than the wages of most parents. Hopefully such a regulation could help.

Supply and demand, maybe?

Corruption maybe ?

You can’t just toss out corruption because it sounds cool. How exactly does corruption lead to an increase to tuition? Don’t parents willingly pay tuition amounts, which are determined and publicized before families sign contracts for each school year?

In fact it is possible to toss the word corruption when there is not fulll disclosure on how the money is spent. Why do you think the pentagon budget is bloated. Do you think the lack of transparency makes spending more efficient. That’s an interesting theory.

[Anonymous]

In reality probably makes sense to raise tuition faster than income to make the school more exclusive.

If you want to cater to the richest families makes sense to keep raising tuition.

Now the question for other families is if they want this. Maybe they want it and everybody is happy. Expensive school for exclusive communities. Not bad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP the DOJ is actively investigating at least one NAIS affiliated organization for something similar to this. If you have proof of anticompetitive scheme I would contact the DOJ antitrust division.

+1. The people acting like private schools are untouchable because of “the free market” or “being a nonprofit” seem painfully unaware that those aren’t defenses against uncompetitive practices, corruption, etc. But the bar for establishing that is high. You can’t just point to a DCUM thread or high tuition.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In reality probably makes sense to raise tuition faster than income to make the school more exclusive.

If you want to cater to the richest families makes sense to keep raising tuition.

Now the question for other families is if they want this. Maybe they want it and everybody is happy. Expensive school for exclusive communities. Not bad.

This is a big factor. Schools will charge as much as they can because they know wealthy people will pay to be part of a community seen as exclusive. Schools that keep tuition lower to serve a wider community are looked down upon despite achieving the more diverse community the expensive schools say they want.

It’s simply rich people wanting a place where they are only with other rich people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s a private school. They can charge whatever they want. Only the people who can’t afford it are complaining about the cost.

Not complaining at all. The US legal system allows consumers to contest abusive practices by corporations. Nothing outrageous about that. Just curious if there was something similar in DC. In Arizona has being proposed. Nothing crazy.

Looking to Arizona for DC private school policy is apples to oranges. The reason why a bill has been proposed in AZ to limit tuition increases in private schools is because AZ has a fairly rare voucher system (they call it ESA) that gives thousands of dollars to families who request it to pay for private school.

The problem is that once lawmakers in AZ dropped limits for the vouchers and allowed anyone to get the funds, including people who were already paying for private school without the ESA voucher funds, some private schools raised tuition by more than usual.

This isn’t a case of AZ state legislators having a soft spot for private school parents and looking to cap tuition costs because it’s just too expensive. It’s because, in AZ, some schools said “oh, families are now getting $8,000 on average from the state to pay for tuition. Well, they could afford the price before they got these funds so let’s raise tuition by $8,000”.

Kind of like what colleges and universities all over this country did with federal student loans.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP the DOJ is actively investigating at least one NAIS affiliated organization for something similar to this. If you have proof of anticompetitive scheme I would contact the DOJ antitrust division.

+1. The people acting like private schools are untouchable because of “the free market” or “being a nonprofit” seem painfully unaware that those aren’t defenses against uncompetitive practices, corruption, etc. But the bar for establishing that is high. You can’t just point to a DCUM thread or high tuition.

+1. I am a bit puzzled why some people are not even willing to talk about this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In reality probably makes sense to raise tuition faster than income to make the school more exclusive.

If you want to cater to the richest families makes sense to keep raising tuition.

Now the question for other families is if they want this. Maybe they want it and everybody is happy. Expensive school for exclusive communities. Not bad.

This is a big factor. Schools will charge as much as they can because they know wealthy people will pay to be part of a community seen as exclusive. Schools that keep tuition lower to serve a wider community are looked down upon despite achieving the more diverse community the expensive schools say they want.

It’s simply rich people wanting a place where they are only with other rich people.

Agree. It’s a bit puzzling why they push for the inclusiveness pitch when in fact they are conventional elite schools. In my view it’s very bizarre.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s a private school. They can charge whatever they want. Only the people who can’t afford it are complaining about the cost.

Not complaining at all. The US legal system allows consumers to contest abusive practices by corporations. Nothing outrageous about that. Just curious if there was something similar in DC. In Arizona has being proposed. Nothing crazy.

Looking to Arizona for DC private school policy is apples to oranges. The reason why a bill has been proposed in AZ to limit tuition increases in private schools is because AZ has a fairly rare voucher system (they call it ESA) that gives thousands of dollars to families who request it to pay for private school.

The problem is that once lawmakers in AZ dropped limits for the vouchers and allowed anyone to get the funds, including people who were already paying for private school without the ESA voucher funds, some private schools raised tuition by more than usual.

This isn’t a case of AZ state legislators having a soft spot for private school parents and looking to cap tuition costs because it’s just too expensive. It’s because, in AZ, some schools said “oh, families are now getting $8,000 on average from the state to pay for tuition. Well, they could afford the price before they got these funds so let’s raise tuition by $8,000”.

Kind of like what colleges and universities all over this country did with federal student loans.

Again. The issue might be lack of competition in the sense that there is not a robust and well funded public system in place that would force private schools and colleges to offer good value for money.

[Anonymous]

Still the price is strange comparing it with the tuition in private colleges in dc such as Georgetown and George washington (just tuition).

Private schools
Charge about 60k and colleges 65k. I presume
That the cost of providing college education to be significantly more expensive so I believe there might be some mismanagement in schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Still the price is strange comparing it with the tuition in private colleges in dc such as Georgetown and George washington (just tuition).

Private schools
Charge about 60k and colleges 65k. I presume
That the cost of providing college education to be significantly more expensive so I believe there might be some mismanagement in schools.

Colleges usually have way more sources of revenue than independent schools. Not an apples to apples comparison.

From athletic derived income from TV contracts and licensing, etc. to federal grants for sciences in particular (when that was being properly funded), colleges have wildly different financial pictures than private schools.

The independent schools are usually only working off tuition, summer programs, donations, and draw from endowment.

[Anonymous]

What has changed in the last 15 years in independent schools mirrors other sectors:

More administrators and more salary devoted to those administrators; HoS and upper admin compensation has generally increased much more than teachers by raw and percentage measurements.

Independent schools are also participating in facilities arm races.

Finally, specific to DC but with national parallels - cost of living has sky rocketed.

All of those drive high tuition as well as other school economic fundamentals.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What has changed in the last 15 years in independent schools mirrors other sectors:

More administrators and more salary devoted to those administrators; HoS and upper admin compensation has generally increased much more than teachers by raw and percentage measurements.

Independent schools are also participating in facilities arm races.

Finally, specific to DC but with national parallels - cost of living has sky rocketed.

All of those drive high tuition as well as other school economic fundamentals.

Interesting. In essence a race to the bottom in terms of “fat” and admin costs.