IB Programs

[Anonymous]

Foreign language was one of the reasons we decided against IB. My DC did two years of Spanish in middle school, and the plan is to do two more years in high school. If he can handle it he’ll sign up for AP Spanish in junior year, if not he’s done. Four years of foreign language is plenty even for the most selective colleges. IB FL is hard, and you have to pick one for the diploma. May be different if you speak at home, otherwise it’s not worth the effort. You’ll be in class with native speakers and have to work that much harder to even be average and the GPA will suffer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know of anyone who thinks IB is half as rigorous as AP. Most people think they are the similar or if anything that IB is more rigorous.

They are similar, IB Math AA HL is comparable to AP calculus BC, but the IB class takes two years, while the AP only one and arguably goes in more depth.

It varies from course to course, but typically AP gets more credit. For the example above at UMD, IB math gets credit for Math 140 (Calculus 1) and Stat 100, while AP Calculus BC gets credit for Math 140 and 141 (Calculus 1 and Calculus 2).

"AP only one and arguably goes in more depth." -- no, it doesn't. AP is breadth, not depth. IB is depth.

I have kids who went through both.

Yes it does, look at the syllabus for both. IB math HL has 55 hours of calculus over two years, AP has 180 hours over one year.

AP Calculus BC specific topics like series and parametric functions are barely touched upon or missing completely. The rest are treated very superficially because there’s no time to go in depth. The remainder of the IB curriculum is statistics and a review of high school math (algebra, geometry and trigonometry).

That’s why AP usually gets credit for the second semester of calculus, but IB almost never does. At least for calculus, IB doesn’t go neither in depth nor in breadth.

Yes, which is why the RMIB students who take IB math HL also take AP BC Calc and MVC, and take the AP Calc and UMD MVC exams in HS.

This supports what the other poster was saying, if you take HL class you also need to take the AP counterpart or at least the AP exam to be competitive. A lot of wasted effort when you could go the AP route directly.

"wasted effort" is a loaded word. It depends on your goals. Lots of very high achieving kids who are STEM majors go the RMIBD route because it's challenging, especially for writing. If your goal is purely to get college credit, then yea, IBD is not worth it. If your goal is to take the most challenging programs, then IBD + AP classes is what you want. There aren't enough IB classes to fill 7 periods, so most kids take AP classes, too.

The very high achieving kids self study and do well on AP exams. If you are not that type of person, then you probably don't want to go the IBD route; just go the AP route.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know of anyone who thinks IB is half as rigorous as AP. Most people think they are the similar or if anything that IB is more rigorous.

They are similar, IB Math AA HL is comparable to AP calculus BC, but the IB class takes two years, while the AP only one and arguably goes in more depth.

It varies from course to course, but typically AP gets more credit. For the example above at UMD, IB math gets credit for Math 140 (Calculus 1) and Stat 100, while AP Calculus BC gets credit for Math 140 and 141 (Calculus 1 and Calculus 2).

"AP only one and arguably goes in more depth." -- no, it doesn't. AP is breadth, not depth. IB is depth.

I have kids who went through both.

Yes it does, look at the syllabus for both. IB math HL has 55 hours of calculus over two years, AP has 180 hours over one year.

AP Calculus BC specific topics like series and parametric functions are barely touched upon or missing completely. The rest are treated very superficially because there’s no time to go in depth. The remainder of the IB curriculum is statistics and a review of high school math (algebra, geometry and trigonometry).

That’s why AP usually gets credit for the second semester of calculus, but IB almost never does. At least for calculus, IB doesn’t go neither in depth nor in breadth.

Yes, which is why the RMIB students who take IB math HL also take AP BC Calc and MVC, and take the AP Calc and UMD MVC exams in HS.

This supports what the other poster was saying, if you take HL class you also need to take the AP counterpart or at least the AP exam to be competitive. A lot of wasted effort when you could go the AP route directly.

"wasted effort" is a loaded word. It depends on your goals. Lots of very high achieving kids who are STEM majors go the RMIBD route because it's challenging, especially for writing. If your goal is purely to get college credit, then yea, IBD is not worth it. If your goal is to take the most challenging programs, then IBD + AP classes is what you want. There aren't enough IB classes to fill 7 periods, so most kids take AP classes, too.

The very high achieving kids self study and do well on AP exams. If you are not that type of person, then you probably don't want to go the IBD route; just go the AP route.

Is it though? There are better options out there than taking AP calculus BC then two years of HL Analysis. Like taking Statistics, sciences, putting more time in extracurriculars, take extra writing if that’s what you’re into, take some interesting classes through dual enrollment that aren’t offered at high school etc.

Theres the risk that a big chunk of high school is duplicate courses, eg 6 semesters of math (four in HLAA, two in BC) and 6 in physics (four in HL and 2 in Physics C), when you could do that in 4 semesters in AP and still have plenty of bandwidth to take up more. Not necessarily for college credit (although why not, I’d take it) but because you want to broaden your knowledge base.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Even MIT doesn't use epsilon-delta in its definition of limit or proof of trig derivatives.

https://youtu.be/kCPVBl953eY?si=Qg67lEG7iQpkd74H
Lec 1-3

Calculus, whether it's IB, AP, or MIT, is a different class from Real Analysis

Respectfully, you’re trying to prove a point without having the slightest clue about Calculus, it’s almost comical.

There’s a way to teach calculus rigorously using theorems, proofs and essentially derive as much as possible from first principles, which requires time and effort. Then there’s the IB way where you just memorize and apply formulas because you’re cramming two semesters of calculus in two months.

For the example from MIT OCW to show the derivative of sin(x), the rigorous treatment is to start with the epsilon delta definition to prove the squeeze theorem. Then you use the squeeze theorem to show that limit of sin(x)/x is 1, which you use to show the derivative of sin(x) is cos(x). They go over that briefly in the prior video, and keep in mind that’s not the totality of the class content, there’s recitation, exercises and homework too.

At the lowly community college where my child took Calculus 1, they go over some form of epsilon delta and proof of sin(x) derivative. Even Khan Academy goes in more depth
https://www.khanacademy.org/math/calculus-1/cs1-derivatives-definition-and-basic-rules/cs1-proof-videos/v/derivative-of-sin-x
https://www.khanacademy.org/math/ap-calculus-ab/ab-limits-new/ab-1-8/v/sinx-over-x-as-x-approaches-0

I bet MIT does it too, they’ll teach the fundamentals and some more. Not in IB though because that would be fetishism. How about the rest, like teaching Calculus without the Fundamental Theorem of Calculus! Got it, that’s fetishism too, we can’t have that. Then you have some complete morons with the nerve to claim that IB goes in depth and does “analytical writing”, while AP is rote memorization and teaching to the test.

In all honesty if a child talented in math is made to take the IB route that’s bad parenting and teaching malpractice.

Tell that to the RMIB kid who started at Princeton as a math major this year. They all take AP Calc B/C in addition to IB Math.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Even MIT doesn't use epsilon-delta in its definition of limit or proof of trig derivatives.

https://youtu.be/kCPVBl953eY?si=Qg67lEG7iQpkd74H
Lec 1-3

Calculus, whether it's IB, AP, or MIT, is a different class from Real Analysis

Respectfully, you’re trying to prove a point without having the slightest clue about Calculus, it’s almost comical.

There’s a way to teach calculus rigorously using theorems, proofs and essentially derive as much as possible from first principles, which requires time and effort. Then there’s the IB way where you just memorize and apply formulas because you’re cramming two semesters of calculus in two months.

For the example from MIT OCW to show the derivative of sin(x), the rigorous treatment is to start with the epsilon delta definition to prove the squeeze theorem. Then you use the squeeze theorem to show that limit of sin(x)/x is 1, which you use to show the derivative of sin(x) is cos(x). They go over that briefly in the prior video, and keep in mind that’s not the totality of the class content, there’s recitation, exercises and homework too.

At the lowly community college where my child took Calculus 1, they go over some form of epsilon delta and proof of sin(x) derivative. Even Khan Academy goes in more depth
https://www.khanacademy.org/math/calculus-1/cs1-derivatives-definition-and-basic-rules/cs1-proof-videos/v/derivative-of-sin-x
https://www.khanacademy.org/math/ap-calculus-ab/ab-limits-new/ab-1-8/v/sinx-over-x-as-x-approaches-0

I bet MIT does it too, they’ll teach the fundamentals and some more. Not in IB though because that would be fetishism. How about the rest, like teaching Calculus without the Fundamental Theorem of Calculus! Got it, that’s fetishism too, we can’t have that. Then you have some complete morons with the nerve to claim that IB goes in depth and does “analytical writing”, while AP is rote memorization and teaching to the test.

In all honesty if a child talented in math is made to take the IB route that’s bad parenting and teaching malpractice.

Tell that to the RMIB kid who started at Princeton as a math major this year. They all take AP Calc B/C in addition to IB Math.

Just to make sure I have the right person, is it the same RMIB kid who got the Nobel Prize for his groundbreaking theory of knowledge essay?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Foreign language was one of the reasons we decided against IB. My DC did two years of Spanish in middle school, and the plan is to do two more years in high school. If he can handle it he’ll sign up for AP Spanish in junior year, if not he’s done. Four years of foreign language is plenty even for the most selective colleges. IB FL is hard, and you have to pick one for the diploma. May be different if you speak at home, otherwise it’s not worth the effort. You’ll be in class with native speakers and have to work that much harder to even be average and the GPA will suffer.

Point taken. MCPS families have different goals for language achievement. It's not all about what the most selective American colleges want for some of us. UK universities mainly admit on exam scores and IBD points totals. GPA doesn't interest them. My kid excels at Mandarin mainly because we're native speakers of Cantonese. We have relatives in England. If he can score high on HL Chinese, along with two sciences, he should be able to crack a top UK university we can readily afford. We'd much rather go that route than sink into student loan debt for a highly selective US private college.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Even MIT doesn't use epsilon-delta in its definition of limit or proof of trig derivatives.

https://youtu.be/kCPVBl953eY?si=Qg67lEG7iQpkd74H
Lec 1-3

Calculus, whether it's IB, AP, or MIT, is a different class from Real Analysis

Respectfully, you’re trying to prove a point without having the slightest clue about Calculus, it’s almost comical.

There’s a way to teach calculus rigorously using theorems, proofs and essentially derive as much as possible from first principles, which requires time and effort. Then there’s the IB way where you just memorize and apply formulas because you’re cramming two semesters of calculus in two months.

For the example from MIT OCW to show the derivative of sin(x), the rigorous treatment is to start with the epsilon delta definition to prove the squeeze theorem. Then you use the squeeze theorem to show that limit of sin(x)/x is 1, which you use to show the derivative of sin(x) is cos(x). They go over that briefly in the prior video, and keep in mind that’s not the totality of the class content, there’s recitation, exercises and homework too.

At the lowly community college where my child took Calculus 1, they go over some form of epsilon delta and proof of sin(x) derivative. Even Khan Academy goes in more depth
https://www.khanacademy.org/math/calculus-1/cs1-derivatives-definition-and-basic-rules/cs1-proof-videos/v/derivative-of-sin-x
https://www.khanacademy.org/math/ap-calculus-ab/ab-limits-new/ab-1-8/v/sinx-over-x-as-x-approaches-0

I bet MIT does it too, they’ll teach the fundamentals and some more. Not in IB though because that would be fetishism. How about the rest, like teaching Calculus without the Fundamental Theorem of Calculus! Got it, that’s fetishism too, we can’t have that. Then you have some complete morons with the nerve to claim that IB goes in depth and does “analytical writing”, while AP is rote memorization and teaching to the test.

In all honesty if a child talented in math is made to take the IB route that’s bad parenting and teaching malpractice.

“Respectfully”, I’ve taught more calculus and real analysis courses than you’ve taken. But I’m sure that you are right, and Leibniz and Newton were morons who didn’t understand calculus, and MIT Calculus I is inferior to the almighty AP Calculus.

I don’t even understand what point you are trying to make, unless it’s that sets, logic, probability, and statistics is somehow wrong to study before calculus, because advanced math students can take more calculus at IB schools before or after HL.

But I guess you know that the pinnacle of advanced high school math is being able to use process of elimination on multiple choice questions and memorize patterned recipes for the AP test?
Seriously, my kid, who hasn’t even taken a calculus class yet, pulled up the AP example exam and scored above the 5 threshold just based on studying Khan Academy Algebra 2 and trigonometry and watching 3Blue1Brown’s Essence of Calculus intuition video series.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are there any AP courses that require a research paper, with elements like cited references and conformance with a specific style guide?

I know we wrote several in my own AP English class eons ago, before it was split into Lang and Lit, but even then it wasn’t a requirement for the AP course—we did it because the school system’s curriculum dictated it. The College Board never saw them.

But even back then, we didn't write research papers in AP history classes, just memorized facts and drilled endlessly on how to tick all the boxes and hit all the keywords in our exam essays. Similarly, the AP history classes my kid took in 9th and 10th didn’t require anything close to what they wrote in IB history for the IA.

So are there any APs that *do* require something like a research paper, something that might prep them for their college coursework? Maybe AP Seminar? (Not sure I have that name right— it’s not offered at my kids’ school.)

There is AP Capstone Diploma that consists of AP Seminar (1st year, where you learn how to research and analyze a topic, and AP Research (2nd year where you write a 4000-5000 word paper). You also need to pass four AP exams to get the Diploma. It seems to emulate the IB diploma framework with AP courses.

It’s not that rare, likely depends on the local schools, about 60k students take Seminar each year, and that’s roughly comparable with AP Computer Science A or the number of students taking the IB Diploma. A large fraction of students don’t seem to follow through, because only 25k students take AP Research, still a significant number.

College credit wise, as an example, MIT gives 9 unrestricted credits to the AP Seminar and AP Research with scores of 5, but no credit to the IB Diploma.

MIT currently gives the same 9 unrestricted credits to any Humanities HL IB course.

On the other hand I’m not really sure what the point of using AP/IB credits at MIT is— I guess it lets you graduate while taking fewer classes but I’m not sure that’s generally a good thing.

With AP credit, a student can take one fewer semester-class each year and still graduate on time. It's an insurance policy for students who can't keep up with the MIT workload.

Most kids aren't going to MIT so not relevant.

You can say that about any other single school. People use MIT as an example and indication of rigor. If MIT gives some credit then it’s probably a good class. One could equally reference Berkeley, Stanford, Yale, or Ohio State for that matter.

If MIT gives some credit to AP Capstone, then that information has more value to me than any marketing blurb from College Board, even if my kid has zero chance of going there. I might even consider advising my student to take that class.

The credit is so tiny. It’s 2 years of HS courses for 0.75 of a semester course worth of elective credit. AP English and Social Studies is far more efficient way to get that credit, as those are 1 year each and it’s for enhancing a course you have take anyway. Better to take AP English + two fun electives like photography than to take honors English + AP Capstone, for MIT credit purposes.


MIT gives free elective credit because they don’t care about those classes and they know that this credit looks good to high schoolers and parents even though they are useful only for… paying tuition but taking up less space by taking fewer classes.

Except Physics C E&M+Mech and Calc BC, MIT doesn’t give any AP credit for escaping credit requirement for any Humanities, Arts, Social Science distribution requirements, or for any major’s requirement.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Foreign language was one of the reasons we decided against IB. My DC did two years of Spanish in middle school, and the plan is to do two more years in high school. If he can handle it he’ll sign up for AP Spanish in junior year, if not he’s done. Four years of foreign language is plenty even for the most selective colleges. IB FL is hard, and you have to pick one for the diploma. May be different if you speak at home, otherwise it’s not worth the effort. You’ll be in class with native speakers and have to work that much harder to even be average and the GPA will suffer.

Agree that if a foreign language is not your kid's thing, then IBD is not a good choice. But for those who (like my kid) enjoy foreign languages, I think it's a great choice. It's nice to have the choice that AP and IB offer at some MCPS HS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know of anyone who thinks IB is half as rigorous as AP. Most people think they are the similar or if anything that IB is more rigorous.

They are similar, IB Math AA HL is comparable to AP calculus BC, but the IB class takes two years, while the AP only one and arguably goes in more depth.

It varies from course to course, but typically AP gets more credit. For the example above at UMD, IB math gets credit for Math 140 (Calculus 1) and Stat 100, while AP Calculus BC gets credit for Math 140 and 141 (Calculus 1 and Calculus 2).

"AP only one and arguably goes in more depth." -- no, it doesn't. AP is breadth, not depth. IB is depth.

I have kids who went through both.

Yes it does, look at the syllabus for both. IB math HL has 55 hours of calculus over two years, AP has 180 hours over one year.

AP Calculus BC specific topics like series and parametric functions are barely touched upon or missing completely. The rest are treated very superficially because there’s no time to go in depth. The remainder of the IB curriculum is statistics and a review of high school math (algebra, geometry and trigonometry).

That’s why AP usually gets credit for the second semester of calculus, but IB almost never does. At least for calculus, IB doesn’t go neither in depth nor in breadth.

Yes, which is why the RMIB students who take IB math HL also take AP BC Calc and MVC, and take the AP Calc and UMD MVC exams in HS.

This supports what the other poster was saying, if you take HL class you also need to take the AP counterpart or at least the AP exam to be competitive. A lot of wasted effort when you could go the AP route directly.

"wasted effort" is a loaded word. It depends on your goals. Lots of very high achieving kids who are STEM majors go the RMIBD route because it's challenging, especially for writing. If your goal is purely to get college credit, then yea, IBD is not worth it. If your goal is to take the most challenging programs, then IBD + AP classes is what you want. There aren't enough IB classes to fill 7 periods, so most kids take AP classes, too.

The very high achieving kids self study and do well on AP exams. If you are not that type of person, then you probably don't want to go the IBD route; just go the AP route.

Is it though? There are better options out there than taking AP calculus BC then two years of HL Analysis. Like taking Statistics, sciences, putting more time in extracurriculars, take extra writing if that’s what you’re into, take some interesting classes through dual enrollment that aren’t offered at high school etc.

Theres the risk that a big chunk of high school is duplicate courses, eg 6 semesters of math (four in HLAA, two in BC) and 6 in physics (four in HL and 2 in Physics C), when you could do that in 4 semesters in AP and still have plenty of bandwidth to take up more. Not necessarily for college credit (although why not, I’d take it) but because you want to broaden your knowledge base.

AP Calc BC is the first year of the IB Math HL track. You only take one year of math after that.

[Anonymous]

I don’t think the foreign language component is that hard. My daughter got. 6/7 on French, and I don’t think her French is great.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Even MIT doesn't use epsilon-delta in its definition of limit or proof of trig derivatives.

https://youtu.be/kCPVBl953eY?si=Qg67lEG7iQpkd74H
Lec 1-3

Calculus, whether it's IB, AP, or MIT, is a different class from Real Analysis

Respectfully, you’re trying to prove a point without having the slightest clue about Calculus, it’s almost comical.

There’s a way to teach calculus rigorously using theorems, proofs and essentially derive as much as possible from first principles, which requires time and effort. Then there’s the IB way where you just memorize and apply formulas because you’re cramming two semesters of calculus in two months.

For the example from MIT OCW to show the derivative of sin(x), the rigorous treatment is to start with the epsilon delta definition to prove the squeeze theorem. Then you use the squeeze theorem to show that limit of sin(x)/x is 1, which you use to show the derivative of sin(x) is cos(x). They go over that briefly in the prior video, and keep in mind that’s not the totality of the class content, there’s recitation, exercises and homework too.

At the lowly community college where my child took Calculus 1, they go over some form of epsilon delta and proof of sin(x) derivative. Even Khan Academy goes in more depth
https://www.khanacademy.org/math/calculus-1/cs1-derivatives-definition-and-basic-rules/cs1-proof-videos/v/derivative-of-sin-x
https://www.khanacademy.org/math/ap-calculus-ab/ab-limits-new/ab-1-8/v/sinx-over-x-as-x-approaches-0

I bet MIT does it too, they’ll teach the fundamentals and some more. Not in IB though because that would be fetishism. How about the rest, like teaching Calculus without the Fundamental Theorem of Calculus! Got it, that’s fetishism too, we can’t have that. Then you have some complete morons with the nerve to claim that IB goes in depth and does “analytical writing”, while AP is rote memorization and teaching to the test.

In all honesty if a child talented in math is made to take the IB route that’s bad parenting and teaching malpractice.

“Respectfully”, I’ve taught more calculus and real analysis courses than you’ve taken. But I’m sure that you are right, and Leibniz and Newton were morons who didn’t understand calculus, and MIT Calculus I is inferior to the almighty AP Calculus.

Exceptionally unlikely.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are there any AP courses that require a research paper, with elements like cited references and conformance with a specific style guide?

I know we wrote several in my own AP English class eons ago, before it was split into Lang and Lit, but even then it wasn’t a requirement for the AP course—we did it because the school system’s curriculum dictated it. The College Board never saw them.

But even back then, we didn't write research papers in AP history classes, just memorized facts and drilled endlessly on how to tick all the boxes and hit all the keywords in our exam essays. Similarly, the AP history classes my kid took in 9th and 10th didn’t require anything close to what they wrote in IB history for the IA.

So are there any APs that *do* require something like a research paper, something that might prep them for their college coursework? Maybe AP Seminar? (Not sure I have that name right— it’s not offered at my kids’ school.)

There is AP Capstone Diploma that consists of AP Seminar (1st year, where you learn how to research and analyze a topic, and AP Research (2nd year where you write a 4000-5000 word paper). You also need to pass four AP exams to get the Diploma. It seems to emulate the IB diploma framework with AP courses.

It’s not that rare, likely depends on the local schools, about 60k students take Seminar each year, and that’s roughly comparable with AP Computer Science A or the number of students taking the IB Diploma. A large fraction of students don’t seem to follow through, because only 25k students take AP Research, still a significant number.

College credit wise, as an example, MIT gives 9 unrestricted credits to the AP Seminar and AP Research with scores of 5, but no credit to the IB Diploma.

MIT currently gives the same 9 unrestricted credits to any Humanities HL IB course.

On the other hand I’m not really sure what the point of using AP/IB credits at MIT is— I guess it lets you graduate while taking fewer classes but I’m not sure that’s generally a good thing.

With AP credit, a student can take one fewer semester-class each year and still graduate on time. It's an insurance policy for students who can't keep up with the MIT workload.

Most kids aren't going to MIT so not relevant.

You can say that about any other single school. People use MIT as an example and indication of rigor. If MIT gives some credit then it’s probably a good class. One could equally reference Berkeley, Stanford, Yale, or Ohio State for that matter.

If MIT gives some credit to AP Capstone, then that information has more value to me than any marketing blurb from College Board, even if my kid has zero chance of going there. I might even consider advising my student to take that class.

The credit is so tiny. It’s 2 years of HS courses for 0.75 of a semester course worth of elective credit. AP English and Social Studies is far more efficient way to get that credit, as those are 1 year each and it’s for enhancing a course you have take anyway. Better to take AP English + two fun electives like photography than to take honors English + AP Capstone, for MIT credit purposes.


MIT gives free elective credit because they don’t care about those classes and they know that this credit looks good to high schoolers and parents even though they are useful only for… paying tuition but taking up less space by taking fewer classes.

Except Physics C E&M+Mech and Calc BC, MIT doesn’t give any AP credit for escaping credit requirement for any Humanities, Arts, Social Science distribution requirements, or for any major’s requirement.

If you’re interested in taking a writing intensive class, you can take AP Capstone and the credit is the cherry on top, provided your college gives it.

Fo MIT AP credit can add up, you can get 24 units from calculus and physics, and up to 48 from unrestricted credit, that’s 72. A full bachelors degree is 180 credits. For some people that matters and if you can do it it can count for a significant portion of your degree. You need about 5 humanities and social sciences to cover those 48 unrestricted credits.

Humanities and social sciences general institute requirement is fulfilled with MIT classes and not AP credit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know of anyone who thinks IB is half as rigorous as AP. Most people think they are the similar or if anything that IB is more rigorous.

They are similar, IB Math AA HL is comparable to AP calculus BC, but the IB class takes two years, while the AP only one and arguably goes in more depth.

It varies from course to course, but typically AP gets more credit. For the example above at UMD, IB math gets credit for Math 140 (Calculus 1) and Stat 100, while AP Calculus BC gets credit for Math 140 and 141 (Calculus 1 and Calculus 2).

"AP only one and arguably goes in more depth." -- no, it doesn't. AP is breadth, not depth. IB is depth.

I have kids who went through both.

Yes it does, look at the syllabus for both. IB math HL has 55 hours of calculus over two years, AP has 180 hours over one year.

AP Calculus BC specific topics like series and parametric functions are barely touched upon or missing completely. The rest are treated very superficially because there’s no time to go in depth. The remainder of the IB curriculum is statistics and a review of high school math (algebra, geometry and trigonometry).

That’s why AP usually gets credit for the second semester of calculus, but IB almost never does. At least for calculus, IB doesn’t go neither in depth nor in breadth.

Yes, which is why the RMIB students who take IB math HL also take AP BC Calc and MVC, and take the AP Calc and UMD MVC exams in HS.

This supports what the other poster was saying, if you take HL class you also need to take the AP counterpart or at least the AP exam to be competitive. A lot of wasted effort when you could go the AP route directly.

"wasted effort" is a loaded word. It depends on your goals. Lots of very high achieving kids who are STEM majors go the RMIBD route because it's challenging, especially for writing. If your goal is purely to get college credit, then yea, IBD is not worth it. If your goal is to take the most challenging programs, then IBD + AP classes is what you want. There aren't enough IB classes to fill 7 periods, so most kids take AP classes, too.

The very high achieving kids self study and do well on AP exams. If you are not that type of person, then you probably don't want to go the IBD route; just go the AP route.

Is it though? There are better options out there than taking AP calculus BC then two years of HL Analysis. Like taking Statistics, sciences, putting more time in extracurriculars, take extra writing if that’s what you’re into, take some interesting classes through dual enrollment that aren’t offered at high school etc.

Theres the risk that a big chunk of high school is duplicate courses, eg 6 semesters of math (four in HLAA, two in BC) and 6 in physics (four in HL and 2 in Physics C), when you could do that in 4 semesters in AP and still have plenty of bandwidth to take up more. Not necessarily for college credit (although why not, I’d take it) but because you want to broaden your knowledge base.

AP Calc BC is the first year of the IB Math HL track. You only take one year of math after that.

Depends on the school, maybe you’re talking specifically about RMIB, that’s not the case in the typical IB program. Even so, doing HL Math after AP Calculus BC is not the best use of time, you’re just reviewing material that’s already mastered.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don’t think the foreign language component is that hard. My daughter got. 6/7 on French, and I don’t think her French is great.

My DD is wrapping up HL French this year, and isn’t finding it difficult, either.

She’s learned enough to be fairly conversational when we were in Montreal this summer, at least. Navigated the city with ease, chatted with servers.

We’ll see how the exams go, but so far she hasn’t found the prep too challenging.