the Atlantic: The Elite College Students Who Can't Read Books

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And yet so many studnets who actually are reading these dense books in high school, and understanding them, and writing papers about them, and translating "Commentarii de Bello Gallico" from Latin into English, are not getting into these colleges because they don't have a 4.6 GPA.

I think college ADs are asleep on the job.

Oh for sure. Many of them are barely out of college themselves and looking for quirky interesting applicants, not necessarily truthful ones.

Or The reality is the kids that are reading 50 books a year are not their best performing alum.

The article is about the school's required great books course. All of their "best performing alum" took it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand this. Aren't admissions more competitive than ever? Aren't these the superhuman students who aced the hardest classes, scored extremely highly on SATs, had very time-consuming ECs....? We are told nobody has a chance at these schools, and yet, those who are actually there, can't read a book? How is this possible.

bc kids lie on the apps.

I mean columbia's app makes you list all the books you've read in the last 2 years...

I love that they still do this! When I applied it also asked what magazines we read. I’m sure they saw my list and were like “this girl has no concept of discernment” and took me on as an intellectual charity case.

I was accepted but didn’t attend until grad school, but as a kid whose mom was always telling me to put books and magazines down and do a chore or go outside, I loved the idea of institutionally-sanctioned reading.

[Anonymous]

I will tell you that War and Peace is extremely interesting. I’ve read it four times.

War and Peace is excellent!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand this. Aren't admissions more competitive than ever? Aren't these the superhuman students who aced the hardest classes, scored extremely highly on SATs, had very time-consuming ECs....? We are told nobody has a chance at these schools, and yet, those who are actually there, can't read a book? How is this possible.

bc kids lie on the apps.

I mean columbia's app makes you list all the books you've read in the last 2 years...

I love that they still do this! When I applied it also asked what magazines we read. I’m sure they saw my list and were like “this girl has no concept of discernment” and took me on as an intellectual charity case.

I was accepted but didn’t attend until grad school, but as a kid whose mom was always telling me to put books and magazines down and do a chore or go outside, I loved the idea of institutionally-sanctioned reading.

You could just make a whole list up, using AI to tailor it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand this. Aren't admissions more competitive than ever? Aren't these the superhuman students who aced the hardest classes, scored extremely highly on SATs, had very time-consuming ECs....? We are told nobody has a chance at these schools, and yet, those who are actually there, can't read a book? How is this possible.

Test prep. Read a short passage find the main idea. Move onto the next skill. Meanwhile, they've never read a whole book about anything. I totally understand why this is happening. Since there's no homework these days, I assign it. My kid is always reading a book for homework, and we're always discussing it.

But that just sounds like a run of the mill 4.0 GPA/grade grabber who we are repeatedly told can't get into, e.g. Columbia.

I mean, my 8th grader is not a big reader and she read a non-fiction psychiatry book over just a few days this summer and we discussed it. Pretty sure she would be capable of discussing Pride and prejudice and Crime and punishment within a couple of weeks. I read these books in HS. They are interesting and not that hard to read.

Those books aren't interesting at all. I mean, Crime & Punishment? Are you now going to tell me War & Peace is interesting too?

Perhaps if we let a kid read a non-fiction psychiatry book instead of Pride and Prejudice or whatever, then things would be better.

But, if you want to read Crime & Punishment, then go for it.

I will tell you that War and Peace is extremely interesting. I’ve read it four times.

An opinion. There is no factual answer when talking about art, literature, film or music.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2024/11/the-elite-college-students-who-cant-read-books/679945/

Students at elite universities such as Columbia are showing up to campus unable to read books. They've only read excerpts their entire school career. Many also struggle to write effectively. In response, many Columbia teachers have to water down the curriculum.

Undiagnosed ADHD?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Some on DCUM argue the kids in the top schools are the best of the best. Others argue they can't read books without getting confused.

Both types are admitted. Its not a meritocratic process, good applicants are admitted to attract desired ones.

[Anonymous]

Blame the proliferation of AP classes. The classes are inevitably structured to teach to the test, meaning zero books. It's a travesty.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
I will tell you that War and Peace is extremely interesting. I’ve read it four times.

War and Peace is excellent!

War, what is it good for?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Maybe kids should have to prove that they have read books for admission. You could take video of yourself reading, no distraction, and then write an easy about the book you’re read, also videoed. This could all be uploaded and AI could analyze the hundreds or thousands of hours of video to ensure the books have been read and understood.

The top kids would have read 100+ great books in high school, maybe even 500 or more. Poets could read poetry. Historians history. English majors English and Spanish majors Spanish. Etc.

Colleges don't want to electronically babysit potential students to make sure they've actually read books. Good grief.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I will tell you that War and Peace is extremely interesting. I’ve read it four times.

War and Peace is excellent!

War, what is it good for?

The original title.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My dcs go to a good public high school in the south. Ds has not had to read a book since middle school. Dd has had one book to read for AP English Lit so far, that's it.

You need to rethink labeling this school “good.”

My kid goes to a suburban public school in California. He has read 5-8 novels a year in English class every year.

I’m in a suburban district in California that’s supposedly good and my middle schooler was assigned two whole books to read in three years of public middle school. And those two books were at an elementary level.

PP here. Sounds like there’s a difference between schools that are “supposedly” good and actually good. Reading is fundamental. If a school doesn’t require students to read novels then I would question its reputation.

Many schools DO require students to read novels throughout the year. Just like in the old days. If your school has discontinued this practice, you may want to push back.

Oh come on. You are coming across as precious and a bit dim now. If a school district is highly rated by all measures used to assess public schools, it is “good.” If that same school district doesn’t make middle school kids read a whole book, it’s “supposedly good.” The fact you can’t seem to understand that the same district can be both goes to your limitations more than anything.

Someone bring over a writing teacher to help this PP…

You obviously didn’t read any full books in middle school and beyond. You should try doing that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And yet so many studnets who actually are reading these dense books in high school, and understanding them, and writing papers about them, and translating "Commentarii de Bello Gallico" from Latin into English, are not getting into these colleges because they don't have a 4.6 GPA.

I think college ADs are asleep on the job.

Oh for sure. Many of them are barely out of college themselves and looking for quirky interesting applicants, not necessarily truthful ones.

Or The reality is the kids that are reading 50 books a year are not their best performing alum.

The article is about the school's required great books course. All of their "best performing alum" took it.

Hello JD Vance.. that’s Categorically untrue. But lying is your way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I wish you guys could see the students in my college classes that I teach. They lack the ability to take notes. They don’t read the textbook. They panic before a test and want a study guide defining exactly what is on the test. They do not want to study any information more than what is on the test. They will ask you questions the morning of the exam. They ask for extra credit. The quality of the student skill set has plummeted in the last 20 years. They are used to fill-in-the-blank guided notes from middle and high school. They are used to re-takes. And, they never see textbooks. It’s easy to ignore the soft copy textbook—why read that? —signed a professor.

These are public school students. None of that describes private school policies at all. My kid’s first study guide came IN college.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand this. Aren't admissions more competitive than ever? Aren't these the superhuman students who aced the hardest classes, scored extremely highly on SATs, had very time-consuming ECs....? We are told nobody has a chance at these schools, and yet, those who are actually there, can't read a book? How is this possible.

bc kids lie on the apps.

I mean columbia's app makes you list all the books you've read in the last 2 years...

I love that they still do this! When I applied it also asked what magazines we read. I’m sure they saw my list and were like “this girl has no concept of discernment” and took me on as an intellectual charity case.

I was accepted but didn’t attend until grad school, but as a kid whose mom was always telling me to put books and magazines down and do a chore or go outside, I loved the idea of institutionally-sanctioned reading.

It’s actually completely stupid.

My chikd was asked to do the same thing and at orientation asked them to name the book they read most recently.

It happened to be Harry Potter. Why? Because their cousin’s Mother had just died. My sister-in-law. So they spent the summer reading Harry Potter to their children.

It was so interesting. When asked what is the book you’re reading this summer they easily answered Harry Potter.. Then they were judged in ways that was insane. And of course, finally they said I don’t always read books for myself. Sometimes I read them for my nieces.

She never mentioned that our aunt had just passed away.