Walls racist incident

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So the thing about white people and racism is that we often say or do things that are not intended to be racist but if a person of color feels uncomfortable or that what we said or did was racist, then intent doesn't matter. It is still racist. It still made the person uncomfortable whether we intended to or not. We should listen, learn and apologize without ifs and buts, justifications or excuses. Just because Cotton-eyed Joe was played at baseball games, that doesn't mean the song isn't offensive to people who know it's origins. So now that we know, we should be thankful to learn that it is offensive and listen to what that student's mother is explaining.

Also, claiming that the song was used for years in baseball doesn't make it okay. Lots of sports team even have names that are offensive. Maybe naming a team the Braves or Indians wasn't intended to be racist but it is offensive which is why the Redskins no longer use that name.

We all agree that this should be a learning opportunity. The point of debate seems to be whether the students are "horrible racists" that deserve significant consequences or bumbling teens who need to apologize, listen, and learn.

Do we, though? Do the posters saying "this is why white people leave DC" want to learn? What about the posters saying that black families that complain of racism should be sued into bankruptcy?

Don't pretend there's common ground where it doesn't exist. "We all hate racism! I just think *complaining* about it is the real problem. What if you make a [white] kid feel badly?"

Way to misrepresent what was said. Those comments are in response to things like the kids getting suspended, being called racist, and presumably having college admissions threatened.

Yeah, that's *exactly* what I said. You think black families should be sued into bankruptcy if they call someone racist. Guess they should know their place, eh? But way to make up something vaguely actionable at the end there that has never been substantiated to try to paper over the thread.

Misrepresenting the thread is saying "we all agree that this should be a learning opportunity," unless the lesson these posters are looking for is for black kids and antiracists to shut up.

I mean yes - if you publicly call someone a racist for *something that was not racist* then you might get sued. But primarily, the legal action would be against the school/DCPS for any discipline based on the false allegation. You seriously expect parents to accept their kids getting disciplined or expelled for false reasons?

There is nothing antiracist about making false or overblown accusations of racism that threaten severe consequences. You cannot solve racism like that.

And now we've circled back to the black kids are lying, the constant loop from "of course racism is bad" to "but fighting it is worse" and finally "racism isn't really happening". Yep, everybody agrees this should be a learning opportunity, PP! Way to read for understanding.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So the thing about white people and racism is that we often say or do things that are not intended to be racist but if a person of color feels uncomfortable or that what we said or did was racist, then intent doesn't matter. It is still racist. It still made the person uncomfortable whether we intended to or not. We should listen, learn and apologize without ifs and buts, justifications or excuses. Just because Cotton-eyed Joe was played at baseball games, that doesn't mean the song isn't offensive to people who know it's origins. So now that we know, we should be thankful to learn that it is offensive and listen to what that student's mother is explaining.

Also, claiming that the song was used for years in baseball doesn't make it okay. Lots of sports team even have names that are offensive. Maybe naming a team the Braves or Indians wasn't intended to be racist but it is offensive which is why the Redskins no longer use that name.

I bolded the part that makes people throw up their hands and move to a "good pyramid."

Intent matters in crime, and should matter in interpersonal relationships as well. We also hold juveniles to a lower standard than adults, because their brains are still developing. They simply can't navigate the racial minefield that is America like an adult. The nation is so diverse, culture moves so fast and the internet creates such an unforgiving environment, that the risk of being pilloried is just too high to engage with people unlike yourself. The only logical thing to do is retreat to the safety of others like yourself.

People can deny that's what is happening, but the segregation in schools isn't an accident. This is exactly the type of thing that gets people to move, even if they tell others, and themselves, other reasons.

Fortuitous timing with this article showing how quickly language can shift from fine to offensive: https://www.campusreform.org/article?id=21614
Hope no one or their kids has social media posts with words like "field" "BIPOC" or "Tribe" in them. Delete them now or deal with the consequences in 2-3 years when it hits the mainstream.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So the thing about white people and racism is that we often say or do things that are not intended to be racist but if a person of color feels uncomfortable or that what we said or did was racist, then intent doesn't matter. It is still racist. It still made the person uncomfortable whether we intended to or not. We should listen, learn and apologize without ifs and buts, justifications or excuses. Just because Cotton-eyed Joe was played at baseball games, that doesn't mean the song isn't offensive to people who know it's origins. So now that we know, we should be thankful to learn that it is offensive and listen to what that student's mother is explaining.

Also, claiming that the song was used for years in baseball doesn't make it okay. Lots of sports team even have names that are offensive. Maybe naming a team the Braves or Indians wasn't intended to be racist but it is offensive which is why the Redskins no longer use that name.

We all agree that this should be a learning opportunity. The point of debate seems to be whether the students are "horrible racists" that deserve significant consequences or bumbling teens who need to apologize, listen, and learn.

Do we, though? Do the posters saying "this is why white people leave DC" want to learn? What about the posters saying that black families that complain of racism should be sued into bankruptcy?

Don't pretend there's common ground where it doesn't exist. "We all hate racism! I just think *complaining* about it is the real problem. What if you make a [white] kid feel badly?"

Way to misrepresent what was said. Those comments are in response to things like the kids getting suspended, being called racist, and presumably having college admissions threatened.

Yeah, that's *exactly* what I said. You think black families should be sued into bankruptcy if they call someone racist. Guess they should know their place, eh? But way to make up something vaguely actionable at the end there that has never been substantiated to try to paper over the thread.

Misrepresenting the thread is saying "we all agree that this should be a learning opportunity," unless the lesson these posters are looking for is for black kids and antiracists to shut up.

I mean yes - if you publicly call someone a racist for *something that was not racist* then you might get sued. But primarily, the legal action would be against the school/DCPS for any discipline based on the false allegation. You seriously expect parents to accept their kids getting disciplined or expelled for false reasons?

There is nothing antiracist about making false or overblown accusations of racism that threaten severe consequences. You cannot solve racism like that.

And now we've circled back to the black kids are lying, the constant loop from "of course racism is bad" to "but fighting it is worse" and finally "racism isn't really happening". Yep, everybody agrees this should be a learning opportunity, PP! Way to read for understanding.

I don’t know if they are intentionally lying, but nobody has provided a shred of evidence that the Tiktok was racist and motivated as a racist attack. And so yes, if you make false accusations of racism you can expect repercussions. Just ask Oberlin.

[Anonymous]

I think terms and phrases like "bro culture" and "white people love to xyz" are racist and offensive. But if I were to say that publicly I'd be completely roasted and told I was "fragile." But on the other hand, if anything is said by a white person, regardless of intent, that's later subjectively viewed by a person of color as racist, then it is. What lesson are we to draw from this? Because one of the lessons could be "to be safe, just don't interact with people of other races," which would be really unfortunate and damaging to our country.

[Anonymous]

My biracial kid is at walls. He is a senior and has had a good experience.
He is on a couple of sports teams but not baseball. In his opinion, some students are more sensitive and more easily offended than others.
He has not experienced or seen any race issues at Walls. Not saying they don’t exist but fortunately his experience at the school has been positive.
He thinks any racial issues at the school are most likely unintentional. He likes the Walls community a lot and appreciates how inclusive it is.
He believes the school should not have suspended the baseball students. He thinks if a parent was offended, then a conversation should have been scheduled to educate the students on the racial connotations of the song. This is obviously just one student’s opinion. Others may disagree.

[Anonymous]

TIL white people actually think they can sue someone for calling them racist. (I'm white, btw.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So the thing about white people and racism is that we often say or do things that are not intended to be racist but if a person of color feels uncomfortable or that what we said or did was racist, then intent doesn't matter. It is still racist. It still made the person uncomfortable whether we intended to or not. We should listen, learn and apologize without ifs and buts, justifications or excuses. Just because Cotton-eyed Joe was played at baseball games, that doesn't mean the song isn't offensive to people who know it's origins. So now that we know, we should be thankful to learn that it is offensive and listen to what that student's mother is explaining.

Also, claiming that the song was used for years in baseball doesn't make it okay. Lots of sports team even have names that are offensive. Maybe naming a team the Braves or Indians wasn't intended to be racist but it is offensive which is why the Redskins no longer use that name.

This isn’t how the world works. If it was, we’d be making our laws and societal rules based on the standards of the most sensitive person. That’s ridiculous and nobody wants it. Intent matters. Objective standards of what the reasonable person considers offensive matter.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So the thing about white people and racism is that we often say or do things that are not intended to be racist but if a person of color feels uncomfortable or that what we said or did was racist, then intent doesn't matter. It is still racist. It still made the person uncomfortable whether we intended to or not. We should listen, learn and apologize without ifs and buts, justifications or excuses. Just because Cotton-eyed Joe was played at baseball games, that doesn't mean the song isn't offensive to people who know it's origins. So now that we know, we should be thankful to learn that it is offensive and listen to what that student's mother is explaining.

Also, claiming that the song was used for years in baseball doesn't make it okay. Lots of sports team even have names that are offensive. Maybe naming a team the Braves or Indians wasn't intended to be racist but it is offensive which is why the Redskins no longer use that name.

I bolded the part that makes people throw up their hands and move to a "good pyramid."

Intent matters in crime, and should matter in interpersonal relationships as well. We also hold juveniles to a lower standard than adults, because their brains are still developing. They simply can't navigate the racial minefield that is America like an adult. The nation is so diverse, culture moves so fast and the internet creates such an unforgiving environment, that the risk of being pilloried is just too high to engage with people unlike yourself. The only logical thing to do is retreat to the safety of others like yourself.

People can deny that's what is happening, but the segregation in schools isn't an accident. This is exactly the type of thing that gets people to move, even if they tell others, and themselves, other reasons.

Fortuitous timing with this article showing how quickly language can shift from fine to offensive: https://www.campusreform.org/article?id=21614
Hope no one or their kids has social media posts with words like "field" "BIPOC" or "Tribe" in them. Delete them now or deal with the consequences in 2-3 years when it hits the mainstream.

To the poster above citing the notorious disinformation site “campus reform”: that is not a legitimate source of information! They do far right, often tacos and sexist, attacks on higher education! Come on now. DCUM is a cesspool but even it has higher standards than campus reform.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So the thing about white people and racism is that we often say or do things that are not intended to be racist but if a person of color feels uncomfortable or that what we said or did was racist, then intent doesn't matter. It is still racist. It still made the person uncomfortable whether we intended to or not. We should listen, learn and apologize without ifs and buts, justifications or excuses. Just because Cotton-eyed Joe was played at baseball games, that doesn't mean the song isn't offensive to people who know it's origins. So now that we know, we should be thankful to learn that it is offensive and listen to what that student's mother is explaining.

Also, claiming that the song was used for years in baseball doesn't make it okay. Lots of sports team even have names that are offensive. Maybe naming a team the Braves or Indians wasn't intended to be racist but it is offensive which is why the Redskins no longer use that name.

I bolded the part that makes people throw up their hands and move to a "good pyramid."

Intent matters in crime, and should matter in interpersonal relationships as well. We also hold juveniles to a lower standard than adults, because their brains are still developing. They simply can't navigate the racial minefield that is America like an adult. The nation is so diverse, culture moves so fast and the internet creates such an unforgiving environment, that the risk of being pilloried is just too high to engage with people unlike yourself. The only logical thing to do is retreat to the safety of others like yourself.

People can deny that's what is happening, but the segregation in schools isn't an accident. This is exactly the type of thing that gets people to move, even if they tell others, and themselves, other reasons.

Fortuitous timing with this article showing how quickly language can shift from fine to offensive: https://www.campusreform.org/article?id=21614
Hope no one or their kids has social media posts with words like "field" "BIPOC" or "Tribe" in them. Delete them now or deal with the consequences in 2-3 years when it hits the mainstream.

To the poster above citing the notorious disinformation site “campus reform”: that is not a legitimate source of information! They do far right, often tacos and sexist, attacks on higher education! Come on now. DCUM is a cesspool but even it has higher standards than campus reform.

* tacos = racist , terrible job autocorrect!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My biracial kid is at walls. He is a senior and has had a good experience.
He is on a couple of sports teams but not baseball. In his opinion, some students are more sensitive and more easily offended than others.
He has not experienced or seen any race issues at Walls. Not saying they don’t exist but fortunately his experience at the school has been positive.
He thinks any racial issues at the school are most likely unintentional. He likes the Walls community a lot and appreciates how inclusive it is.
He believes the school should not have suspended the baseball students. He thinks if a parent was offended, then a conversation should have been scheduled to educate the students on the racial connotations of the song. This is obviously just one student’s opinion. Others may disagree.

I hope you’re teaching your kid that whenever anyone says something is offensive to them, instead of thinking of them as “sensitive”, they should be heard and believed. Also, please teach him that even if an issue is unintentional, that doesn’t make it not racist. I really hope you’re not letting him get away with brushing off the very real experiences and feelings of other Black students on campus.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My biracial kid is at walls. He is a senior and has had a good experience.
He is on a couple of sports teams but not baseball. In his opinion, some students are more sensitive and more easily offended than others.
He has not experienced or seen any race issues at Walls. Not saying they don’t exist but fortunately his experience at the school has been positive.
He thinks any racial issues at the school are most likely unintentional. He likes the Walls community a lot and appreciates how inclusive it is.
He believes the school should not have suspended the baseball students. He thinks if a parent was offended, then a conversation should have been scheduled to educate the students on the racial connotations of the song. This is obviously just one student’s opinion. Others may disagree.

I hope you’re teaching your kid that whenever anyone says something is offensive to them, instead of thinking of them as “sensitive”, they should be heard and believed. Also, please teach him that even if an issue is unintentional, that doesn’t make it not racist. I really hope you’re not letting him get away with brushing off the very real experiences and feelings of other Black students on campus.

And I hope someday you come to understand that carelessly accusing people of racism is not anti-racist, at all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So the thing about white people and racism is that we often say or do things that are not intended to be racist but if a person of color feels uncomfortable or that what we said or did was racist, then intent doesn't matter. It is still racist. It still made the person uncomfortable whether we intended to or not. We should listen, learn and apologize without ifs and buts, justifications or excuses. Just because Cotton-eyed Joe was played at baseball games, that doesn't mean the song isn't offensive to people who know it's origins. So now that we know, we should be thankful to learn that it is offensive and listen to what that student's mother is explaining.

Also, claiming that the song was used for years in baseball doesn't make it okay. Lots of sports team even have names that are offensive. Maybe naming a team the Braves or Indians wasn't intended to be racist but it is offensive which is why the Redskins no longer use that name.

We all agree that this should be a learning opportunity. The point of debate seems to be whether the students are "horrible racists" that deserve significant consequences or bumbling teens who need to apologize, listen, and learn.

Do we, though? Do the posters saying "this is why white people leave DC" want to learn? What about the posters saying that black families that complain of racism should be sued into bankruptcy?

Don't pretend there's common ground where it doesn't exist. "We all hate racism! I just think *complaining* about it is the real problem. What if you make a [white] kid feel badly?"

Way to misrepresent what was said. Those comments are in response to things like the kids getting suspended, being called racist, and presumably having college admissions threatened.

Yeah, that's *exactly* what I said. You think black families should be sued into bankruptcy if they call someone racist. Guess they should know their place, eh? But way to make up something vaguely actionable at the end there that has never been substantiated to try to paper over the thread.

Misrepresenting the thread is saying "we all agree that this should be a learning opportunity," unless the lesson these posters are looking for is for black kids and antiracists to shut up.

I mean yes - if you publicly call someone a racist for *something that was not racist* then you might get sued. But primarily, the legal action would be against the school/DCPS for any discipline based on the false allegation. You seriously expect parents to accept their kids getting disciplined or expelled for false reasons?

There is nothing antiracist about making false or overblown accusations of racism that threaten severe consequences. You cannot solve racism like that.

And now we've circled back to the black kids are lying, the constant loop from "of course racism is bad" to "but fighting it is worse" and finally "racism isn't really happening". Yep, everybody agrees this should be a learning opportunity, PP! Way to read for understanding.

I don’t know if they are intentionally lying, but nobody has provided a shred of evidence that the Tiktok was racist and motivated as a racist attack. And so yes, if you make false accusations of racism you can expect repercussions. Just ask Oberlin.

This is funny as hell. No one is going to give any personal evidence of anything in regard to their kid. FERPA and a zillion other privacy laws prevent any data about kids being exposed. In other words, it's not anyone's business but those involved.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So the thing about white people and racism is that we often say or do things that are not intended to be racist but if a person of color feels uncomfortable or that what we said or did was racist, then intent doesn't matter. It is still racist. It still made the person uncomfortable whether we intended to or not. We should listen, learn and apologize without ifs and buts, justifications or excuses. Just because Cotton-eyed Joe was played at baseball games, that doesn't mean the song isn't offensive to people who know it's origins. So now that we know, we should be thankful to learn that it is offensive and listen to what that student's mother is explaining.

Also, claiming that the song was used for years in baseball doesn't make it okay. Lots of sports team even have names that are offensive. Maybe naming a team the Braves or Indians wasn't intended to be racist but it is offensive which is why the Redskins no longer use that name.

We all agree that this should be a learning opportunity. The point of debate seems to be whether the students are "horrible racists" that deserve significant consequences or bumbling teens who need to apologize, listen, and learn.

Do we, though? Do the posters saying "this is why white people leave DC" want to learn? What about the posters saying that black families that complain of racism should be sued into bankruptcy?

Don't pretend there's common ground where it doesn't exist. "We all hate racism! I just think *complaining* about it is the real problem. What if you make a [white] kid feel badly?"

Way to misrepresent what was said. Those comments are in response to things like the kids getting suspended, being called racist, and presumably having college admissions threatened.

Yeah, that's *exactly* what I said. You think black families should be sued into bankruptcy if they call someone racist. Guess they should know their place, eh? But way to make up something vaguely actionable at the end there that has never been substantiated to try to paper over the thread.

Misrepresenting the thread is saying "we all agree that this should be a learning opportunity," unless the lesson these posters are looking for is for black kids and antiracists to shut up.

I mean yes - if you publicly call someone a racist for *something that was not racist* then you might get sued. But primarily, the legal action would be against the school/DCPS for any discipline based on the false allegation. You seriously expect parents to accept their kids getting disciplined or expelled for false reasons?

There is nothing antiracist about making false or overblown accusations of racism that threaten severe consequences. You cannot solve racism like that.

And now we've circled back to the black kids are lying, the constant loop from "of course racism is bad" to "but fighting it is worse" and finally "racism isn't really happening". Yep, everybody agrees this should be a learning opportunity, PP! Way to read for understanding.

I don’t know if they are intentionally lying, but nobody has provided a shred of evidence that the Tiktok was racist and motivated as a racist attack. And so yes, if you make false accusations of racism you can expect repercussions. Just ask Oberlin.

This is funny as hell. No one is going to give any personal evidence of anything in regard to their kid. FERPA and a zillion other privacy laws prevent any data about kids being exposed. In other words, it's not anyone's business but those involved.

We’re all here posting about it on the internet. So if you truly think it’s nobody’s business you should not be posting anything here at all.

[Anonymous]

This was about Cotton Eye Joe by Rednex? That's crazy, it was a very popular European (Swedish) earworm dance song from the 90's the video for which makes fun of rednecks. Its current popularity is nothing but 90's nostalgia.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This was about Cotton Eye Joe by Rednex? That's crazy, it was a very popular European (Swedish) earworm dance song from the 90's the video for which makes fun of rednecks. Its current popularity is nothing but 90's nostalgia.

Exactly. But folks on here who don’t know anything about the context have already jumped to the conclusion that these kids were evil and racist.
Apparently there can be no other explanation period.
It is disappointing that the school had the knee jerk reaction to suspend the students.