What constitutes a Betrayal in marriage?

[Anonymous]

Obviously, having an affair is considered a betrayal that puts in question the integrity of the guilty party. Most people on DCUM feel that an affair is grounds for divorce with a great settlement in favor of the "betrayed" party.

But what about someone who decides they don't want to have kids after all, five years into the marriage?

When a spouse discovers/reveals that they want fetish sex or group swinger sex and insist on their partner participating?

When a spouse moves far away "temporarily" (under some pretext like helping out/caregiving for a parent or sibling) and ceases to have regular contact with the one who remains in the marital home?

What about someone who decides they no longer want to work in a career that makes a high income, fives years in the marriage?

What about someone who decides they no longer want to work, period, since the betrayed partner makes more than enough to cover their joint expenses?

IMHO, if a spouse does any of these things, that constitutes a betrayal that is on par with a husband who has sex with a woman he meets at a work conference after 4 years in a dead bedroom. There are support groups dedicated to betrayed spouses and counselors who specialize in this area. But they don't seem to include "victim" of these other betrayals.

[Anonymous]

Are you trying to normalize cheating?

[Anonymous]

Marriages are hard because you have two people with their own minds and beliefs and thoughts and opinions and priorities and desires both going through life. Additionally, growth and change are essential aspects of being human - stagnation isn't healthy for anyone.

The goal is to work as a team but sometimes there isn't enough in common to keep the team together or focused on the same goals. I don't think it is betrayal. If you have good communication, it can hurt to find out your partner and you have grown apart or she / he has come to want different things in life. Somethings you can compromise on, but some things you can't or don't want to without it causing too much resentment.

[Anonymous]

Most of those are betrayals, unless the not wanting to work has to do with health issues or childcare.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Are you trying to normalize cheating?

+1000

[Anonymous]

Only cheating is betrayal, others are issues that can be communicated and resolved-may result in separation but still not the way cheating does.

[Anonymous]

Yeah, many things can be betrayals, what of it?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Marriages are hard because you have two people with their own minds and beliefs and thoughts and opinions and priorities and desires both going through life. Additionally, growth and change are essential aspects of being human - stagnation isn't healthy for anyone.

The goal is to work as a team but sometimes there isn't enough in common to keep the team together or focused on the same goals. I don't think it is betrayal. If you have good communication, it can hurt to find out your partner and you have grown apart or she / he has come to want different things in life. Somethings you can compromise on, but some things you can't or don't want to without it causing too much resentment.

+1. It's not a betrayal to decide you don't want kids or need or want to work a different job. It may be a change that leads to divorce, but it's not a betrayal. It's not a betrayal to be a different person at 50 than at 25.

[Anonymous]

You literally them all

[Anonymous]

Listed ^

[Anonymous]

But what about someone who decides they don't want to have kids after all, five years into the marriage?

This happened to my wife's best friend from childhood. She married her college bf at 26. At 31, he said he didn't ever want kids, They did therapy for a year and then ultimately divorced when she was 34.

Guy met a new woman in her mid 20s and had twin daughters with her in two years. Wife's friend had complete meltdown that last a couple years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Obviously, having an affair is considered a betrayal that puts in question the integrity of the guilty party. Most people on DCUM feel that an affair is grounds for divorce with a great settlement in favor of the "betrayed" party.

But what about someone who decides they don't want to have kids after all, five years into the marriage?

When a spouse discovers/reveals that they want fetish sex or group swinger sex and insist on their partner participating?

When a spouse moves far away "temporarily" (under some pretext like helping out/caregiving for a parent or sibling) and ceases to have regular contact with the one who remains in the marital home?

What about someone who decides they no longer want to work in a career that makes a high income, fives years in the marriage?

What about someone who decides they no longer want to work, period, since the betrayed partner makes more than enough to cover their joint expenses?

IMHO, if a spouse does any of these things, that constitutes a betrayal that is on par with a husband who has sex with a woman he meets at a work conference after 4 years in a dead bedroom. There are support groups dedicated to betrayed spouses and counselors who specialize in this area. But they don't seem to include "victim" of these other betrayals.

Unless it's in your prenup, nobody owes you kids. That may be an emotional betrayal if they promised you children and then 180'd, but it's not a contractual obligation the way that fidelity is assumed to be.

Wanting fetish sex, swinging, etc. isn't a betrayal in and of itself. Doing it behind your spouse's back without their consent would be. Kinda hard to "insist" that your partner participate in those things unless you're willing to use force or coercive control, which makes it abuse, not betrayal.

A spouse moving away "temporarily" and then going non-com isn't "betrayal", it's abandonment.

Nobody owes you a high-paying career any more than they owe you children. Unless this is in your prenup, it's not a contractual obligation. "Richer or poorer", right?

None of the examples you cite create a "victim", save maybe the possibility of abuse in the second/sexual scenario. Disappointment isn't victimization. Not living up to your expectations isn't a "betrayal".

There are no specific support groups for these things because they're all covered by general therapy as "reasons I left my marriage". They're legitimately disappointing, frustrating, heartbreaking, even. But they're not "betrayals" the way that infidelity is a betrayal of trust, the physical safety and sanctity of a marital bed, one's vows, etc.

[Anonymous]

Just infidelity constitutes as betrayal as couple others remarked, especially PP who explained it quite well

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

But what about someone who decides they don't want to have kids after all, five years into the marriage?

This happened to my wife's best friend from childhood. She married her college bf at 26. At 31, he said he didn't ever want kids, They did therapy for a year and then ultimately divorced when she was 34.

Guy met a new woman in her mid 20s and had twin daughters with her in two years. Wife's friend had complete meltdown that last a couple years.

Of course she had a meltdown. What a slap in the face!!

He did not want to have kids with her. He may have thought he didn't want kids at all. But he just didn't want to have kids with her. We see this all the time. Men who never want to get married [to you] or have kids [with you].

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Obviously, having an affair is considered a betrayal that puts in question the integrity of the guilty party. Most people on DCUM feel that an affair is grounds for divorce with a great settlement in favor of the "betrayed" party.

But what about someone who decides they don't want to have kids after all, five years into the marriage?

When a spouse discovers/reveals that they want fetish sex or group swinger sex and insist on their partner participating?

When a spouse moves far away "temporarily" (under some pretext like helping out/caregiving for a parent or sibling) and ceases to have regular contact with the one who remains in the marital home?

What about someone who decides they no longer want to work in a career that makes a high income, fives years in the marriage?

What about someone who decides they no longer want to work, period, since the betrayed partner makes more than enough to cover their joint expenses?

IMHO, if a spouse does any of these things, that constitutes a betrayal that is on par with a husband who has sex with a woman he meets at a work conference after 4 years in a dead bedroom. There are support groups dedicated to betrayed spouses and counselors who specialize in this area. But they don't seem to include "victim" of these other betrayals.

Unless it's in your prenup, nobody owes you kids. That may be an emotional betrayal if they promised you children and then 180'd, but it's not a contractual obligation the way that fidelity is assumed to be.

Wanting fetish sex, swinging, etc. isn't a betrayal in and of itself. Doing it behind your spouse's back without their consent would be. Kinda hard to "insist" that your partner participate in those things unless you're willing to use force or coercive control, which makes it abuse, not betrayal.

A spouse moving away "temporarily" and then going non-com isn't "betrayal", it's abandonment.

Nobody owes you a high-paying career any more than they owe you children. Unless this is in your prenup, it's not a contractual obligation. "Richer or poorer", right?

None of the examples you cite create a "victim", save maybe the possibility of abuse in the second/sexual scenario. Disappointment isn't victimization. Not living up to your expectations isn't a "betrayal".

There are no specific support groups for these things because they're all covered by general therapy as "reasons I left my marriage". They're legitimately disappointing, frustrating, heartbreaking, even. But they're not "betrayals" the way that infidelity is a betrayal of trust, the physical safety and sanctity of a marital bed, one's vows, etc.

+1. I agree with the last poster here. OP is just whining. People change.