Blake Lively- Jason Baldoni and NYT - False Light claims

Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I for one appreciate the case updates.


+1, I don't have much to add to these summaries but I appreciate reading them. Thanks for writing them!


Thank you! I've been posting the updates. The "talking to myself" posts are not me but presumably by some Baldoni supporter who wants me to shut up; I'm not mad if folks don't have anything to add ha.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I for one appreciate the case updates.


+1, I don't have much to add to these summaries but I appreciate reading them. Thanks for writing them!


Thank you! I've been posting the updates. The "talking to myself" posts are not me but presumably by some Baldoni supporter who wants me to shut up; I'm not mad if folks don't have anything to add ha.


We know, some people can “listen”to themselves all day. Living proof.
Anonymous
Interestingly, Blake always talks over others as well. Loves the sound of her own voice.
Anonymous
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Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I don't really see how he has been vindicated at all.


Yeah, this is some fantasy world they are living in, I don't know what to tell you.


Us and the everyone besides the two of you (joking, but not by much) Read the comments section on any recent article about Blake, nearly all are Justin supporters. Gen Z, in particular, despises Blake. Not good at all for her figure marketability.


What does this have to do with vindicating him?


Practically no one believes any of her allegations. Outside of the one or two fanatics here.


Call me an optimist, but I still believe that at some point you guys are going to catch up. Not all of you. But some. And other people who aren't involved now will see (I think) her vindication at trial and will grok it as a win for her.

If Gottlieb doesn't feel like they have a good shot of getting through summary judgement and a good shot at trial, this would be a good time to settle. (I've been against settlement until the MTDs, because that complaint was a mess and Lively had nothing to lose at dismissal.) If she doesn't settle, I'd take it as a decent sign they have good evidence and a good shot at trial, and I'd trust Gottlieb a hell of a lot more than Freedman on his representations of that.


Curious why you feel this way? Gottlieb apparently counseled (or failed to counsel against) Blake to bring what was at best a very thin SH case. It was always going to be a thin case (no quid pro quo, very mild ‘hostile environment’ if at all) and apparently didn’t advise her to consider her claims could be discounted by rolling cameras around her, and her own unorthodox text messaging (‘always spicy’). This case has cost her millions and totally destroyed her reputation. Meanwhile Freedman rehabilitated his clients rep in 10 days. I mean, really?? You think Gottlieb is the better lawyer?


Freedman decided to bring the defamation claim, and because of that Sarowitz may be essentially funding all of Lively's attorneys fees for the case, given the treble damages provisions under 47.1. So when you say this has cost her millions, essentially all those costs could move to Baldoni. That's not even considering what she may win at trial, and we now know Baldoni will win basically nothing at trial given his remaining claims are low value (WME K allows no fault divorce; Wayfarer/Lively contract won't yield much $ because the film made millions). Baldoni may work again, if he hasn't burned his bridges with Sarowitz after the expense of this is all over, but what kind of projects/podcast will he be doing, now that he has argued that the CA victims rights bill is unconstitutional and that a bunch of women's rights orgs shouldn't even be heard on the issue, while his only amicus supporter is a person who has also supported, Weinstein, Diddy, and Marilyn Manson? Many normal people outside your bubble find him a hypocrite, and we're not even done yet. I still don't understand your problem with "always spicy" when the tub video at a work lunch was a-okay with you - I think some of this might start to sink in at trial.

So, yes, I'd trust Gottlieb over Freedman every single time.


Responding to myself to add, though I know some people will hate this, maybe the most important thing: Gottlieb has a lot of evidence of a smear campaign that usually you would never have, because they have those texts. I cannot imagine another case where you will start off with this much evidence of a smear campaign -- after Baldoni signed a contract promising not to retaliate -- and that provides a map to get more in discovery. After what happened to Amber Heard, where Depp hired the same PR firm and who I also believe was smeared, how can you have all of that and not sue? If you had power and money and all that evidence, wouldn't you feel like it was your duty to sue, to help other women and to raise people's awareness of the problem because most people had no clue?


Thank you, you've just summed up why I'm pro-Lively in this mess. I think Gottlieb took the case on specifically because the retaliation case is so strong and, with discovery (especially of the Jed Wallace activity), could pull the curtain back on how internet smear campaigns work and how I sidious they are. Gottlieb has previous repped regular people who were subject to these kinds of campaigns -- GA poll workers who became the subject of an online conspiracy theory about voter fraud thanks to Rudy Giuliani, and Comet Ping Pong, the pizza joint in DC that somewhat inexplicably became the subject of a huge online conspiracy about Hillary Clinton and sex trafficking. I think once Gottlieb saw the texts from Abel's phone, and realized that TAG and Jed Wallace were involved, he signed in very willingly for the chance to be able to dig into how this works from the PR side.

And the fact that the smear campaign is tied to SH allegations is a bonus, because of 47.1 and also because this is a rising problem. People accused of harassment or abuse sue for defamation over the allegation, deterring not only their accusers but other victims from coming forward. Being able to help set early precedent in that law, and potentially influence future policy making on this issue, was probably irresistable. I'm Team Gottlieb all the way in that, and while the facts in this case aren't perfect (it probably would be easier if the SH allegations were more egregious, like if Baldoni had hit on Lively or there was assault), they are enough. In some ways, the idea that Baldoni and Wayfarer were willing to try and destroy Lively's rep (the star of their own film!) over the fear that these relatively minor SH allegations would come to light, shows the degree to which online smear campaigns have become normalized. Oh a former employer might say something negative about her experience working for me? No worries, we'll hire Jed Wallace to seed social media with reports that she's a mean girl. Ex is demanding joint custody of kids? Not a problem, we'll hire Jed Wallace to seed stories of the ex being linked to drug use. Ex starts talking about being a survivor of DV publicly in a way that is making people look at your drinking and violent behavior with too much scrutiny? Sue her for defamation and hire TAG and Wallace to fill the internet with rumors about how she's a melodramatic liar with a personality disorder.

Team Gottlieb/Hudson/Lively.

+1

+2 and great comment! (PP from 11:18 and 11:23.)


+3! (pp from page 14 that keeps coming back on occasion)
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
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Anonymous wrote:
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Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I’ve never heard of a judge recusing themselves from a case involving an attorney who clerked for the same Supreme Court justice they have. Seriously, has anyone else ever seen that happen?


I wrote this and am different person than PP who responded to the Baldoni supporter above. You’re so bananas.


So bananas that you can’t stop responding, got it.

I think one of you even said it when the Swift stuff came up, Gottlieb wouldn’t do that, look at his background.

If the judge thinks Gottlieb wouldn’t do that because he is the nice guy he met at a Steven’s clerk picnic, that is a problem.


I think it's fair to also consider there was no proof of that wrongdoing? Even Freedman's affidavit stated he heard it secondhand. That was why he sought records from Venable, but those motions weren't before Liman.

On that note, if Freedman obtains proof that Lively or Gottlieb extorted Swift or encouraged evidence destruction, what would be the remedy he should seek from Liman?


Depending on the severity, dismissal of all or some claims or monetary penalties.

I understand that the evidentiary threshold hasn’t been met. But you know who can also collect evidence? The Judge. He can question the lawyers or parties in a hearing or chambers at any time. The failure to do that most questionable with respect to Van Zan subpoena, imo.


PP. I find that Freedman has a very strange way of bringing up these issues. I'm anti-Freedman/Baldoni but also consider VanZan a sham and fraud on the court. But Freedman never brings things up directly. Lively's lawyers bring a lot of motions, often to the point where they sound whiny, but at least their arguments are clear. Freedman randomly brings up really explosive things (crime fraud, VanZan, extortion of Swift) in reply letters and then they just... sit. I don't know that the judge should sua sponte call for an evidentiary hearing based on those random info drops. Freedman loves to say he still hasn't received the VanZan subpoena. He has every right to see that subpoena. He should request it and then file an MTC if it doesn't receive it. That would make more sense than bringing up crime fraud on a reply to a motion to quash. It's just a very bizarre way of handling what should be an important issue, and I can understand why the judge would have little patience with it, irrespective of how he knows Gottlieb. I guess the thinking is Freedman has some strategy where he's eventually going to bring this up, but VanZan was uncovered a while ago now.


I have noticed this as well and my theory is that Freedman does not actually want to litigate these issues. In some instances I think it's because he knows he'd lose, and in other instances I think it's because he just doesn't want to put the effort into briefing and hearings on an issue.

But he does want the PR benefit of raising them so the JB-hive online will go crazy and get mad. So he brings them up in letters or mentions them in other pleadings without asking for relief just to keep them in the conversation, but he has no real interest in adjudicating them.

The VanZan subpoena is a good example. Let's say he got that subpoena thrown out. Okay. Well guess what, everything disclosed in that subpoena is discoverable in the present action. So... it doesn't matter? You can say it gave Lively an edge in filing her case and that's true, but once she was aware of the text messages, she could have filed. Having the texts in hand made it easier for her to put together a strong complaint on the retaliation stuff and it facilitated the NYT article which was a powerful PR benefit. But she could have sued without it and then asked for discovery and she would have gotten it all. So there's just no there there. The texts exist, they are relevant to the case, and there's no argument that they were fabricated or falsified. If they actually litigated that issue, that would be the end result no matter what Liman decided. Once Lively knew the texts existed (which she found out via Jones well before the subpoena, even if she didn't see the texts directly, Leslie Sloane and thus Lively knew of their existence and roughly what they said), they were going to get them one way or another.

So why litigate all that to get to that conclusion which doesn't really advance Baldoni's case, when he can instead just mention it and poke at it and feed the only PR beast without ever having to actually brief the issue or make full arguments? They get more juice with less squeeze this way.


There is another explanation. The lawyers matter. Lively has great lawyers who own things at this stage of the proceedings. Baldoni does not have serious lawyers. He has showboaters who will do what he wants. His lawyers are subpar for what is going on now.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I’ve never heard of a judge recusing themselves from a case involving an attorney who clerked for the same Supreme Court justice they have. Seriously, has anyone else ever seen that happen?


I wrote this and am different person than PP who responded to the Baldoni supporter above. You’re so bananas.


So bananas that you can’t stop responding, got it.

I think one of you even said it when the Swift stuff came up, Gottlieb wouldn’t do that, look at his background.

If the judge thinks Gottlieb wouldn’t do that because he is the nice guy he met at a Steven’s clerk picnic, that is a problem.


I think it's fair to also consider there was no proof of that wrongdoing? Even Freedman's affidavit stated he heard it secondhand. That was why he sought records from Venable, but those motions weren't before Liman.

On that note, if Freedman obtains proof that Lively or Gottlieb extorted Swift or encouraged evidence destruction, what would be the remedy he should seek from Liman?


Depending on the severity, dismissal of all or some claims or monetary penalties.

I understand that the evidentiary threshold hasn’t been met. But you know who can also collect evidence? The Judge. He can question the lawyers or parties in a hearing or chambers at any time. The failure to do that most questionable with respect to Van Zan subpoena, imo.


PP. I find that Freedman has a very strange way of bringing up these issues. I'm anti-Freedman/Baldoni but also consider VanZan a sham and fraud on the court. But Freedman never brings things up directly. Lively's lawyers bring a lot of motions, often to the point where they sound whiny, but at least their arguments are clear. Freedman randomly brings up really explosive things (crime fraud, VanZan, extortion of Swift) in reply letters and then they just... sit. I don't know that the judge should sua sponte call for an evidentiary hearing based on those random info drops. Freedman loves to say he still hasn't received the VanZan subpoena. He has every right to see that subpoena. He should request it and then file an MTC if it doesn't receive it. That would make more sense than bringing up crime fraud on a reply to a motion to quash. It's just a very bizarre way of handling what should be an important issue, and I can understand why the judge would have little patience with it, irrespective of how he knows Gottlieb. I guess the thinking is Freedman has some strategy where he's eventually going to bring this up, but VanZan was uncovered a while ago now.


I have noticed this as well and my theory is that Freedman does not actually want to litigate these issues. In some instances I think it's because he knows he'd lose, and in other instances I think it's because he just doesn't want to put the effort into briefing and hearings on an issue.

But he does want the PR benefit of raising them so the JB-hive online will go crazy and get mad. So he brings them up in letters or mentions them in other pleadings without asking for relief just to keep them in the conversation, but he has no real interest in adjudicating them.

The VanZan subpoena is a good example. Let's say he got that subpoena thrown out. Okay. Well guess what, everything disclosed in that subpoena is discoverable in the present action. So... it doesn't matter? You can say it gave Lively an edge in filing her case and that's true, but once she was aware of the text messages, she could have filed. Having the texts in hand made it easier for her to put together a strong complaint on the retaliation stuff and it facilitated the NYT article which was a powerful PR benefit. But she could have sued without it and then asked for discovery and she would have gotten it all. So there's just no there there. The texts exist, they are relevant to the case, and there's no argument that they were fabricated or falsified. If they actually litigated that issue, that would be the end result no matter what Liman decided. Once Lively knew the texts existed (which she found out via Jones well before the subpoena, even if she didn't see the texts directly, Leslie Sloane and thus Lively knew of their existence and roughly what they said), they were going to get them one way or another.

So why litigate all that to get to that conclusion which doesn't really advance Baldoni's case, when he can instead just mention it and poke at it and feed the only PR beast without ever having to actually brief the issue or make full arguments? They get more juice with less squeeze this way.


There is another explanation. The lawyers matter. Lively has great lawyers who own things at this stage of the proceedings. Baldoni does not have serious lawyers. He has showboaters who will do what he wants. His lawyers are subpar for what is going on now.

Yeah, DP, and I had a similar reaction here also. I don’t necessarily disagree with what PP is saying above, but all this motions practice briefing and seeing the MTD order point out the deficiencies in the Complaint itself really shows what a terrible legal writer and thinker Freedman is, imo. He can bully people into submission like a pro but his pleadings suck and he isn’t filing things he should be filing (like filing his own MTD, filing a new complaint before the deadline, filing a MTD on the vanzan subpoena or a filing on alleged impropriety re same, etc etc etc). It’s like he doesn’t know what to do in court, only what to say on TMZ (and even there he gets the legal part wrong).

I’m sure the tides may turn again, but right now he is doing awful, having gotten his high value claims kicked, risking treble damages and punitive from his defamation claim, facing down like 5 MTCs and a passel of sanctions motions. He is having a time.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:Interestingly, Blake always talks over others as well. Loves the sound of her own voice.


Exhibit A
https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZP8rdfRso/
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I don't really see how he has been vindicated at all.


Yeah, this is some fantasy world they are living in, I don't know what to tell you.


Us and the everyone besides the two of you (joking, but not by much) Read the comments section on any recent article about Blake, nearly all are Justin supporters. Gen Z, in particular, despises Blake. Not good at all for her figure marketability.


This TikTok guy isn't fooled by Baldoni fwiw: https://www.tiktok.com/@abbysfilmclub/video/7514101149990014238


I appreciate this because he's just going through and reading the judge's opinion and summarizing it in layman's terms. I wish people saying the decision was unfair or that the judge must be corrupt would watch/read analysis like this and really force themselves to give it a fair read. Like they are alleging all these contract torts but they don't even identify the contract OR a single contract provision that was violated, by anyway. Not by Lively, not WM, no one.

But I don't think it's going to do anything. People have bought into this narrative that she's some kind of evil mastermind (Blake Lively! who honestly doesn't seem that smart and who, from what I can tell, at least genuinely *believes* that she was the victim here, regardless of whether legally that's the case) and nothing anyone says will break through. To me that's actually the biggest proof of a smear campaign -- the fact that so many people are willing to ignore the law and logic to believe a story that doesn't pass the sniff test, and that paints Lively in this cartoonishly villainous way.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I for one appreciate the case updates.


+1, I don't have much to add to these summaries but I appreciate reading them. Thanks for writing them!


Thank you! I've been posting the updates. The "talking to myself" posts are not me but presumably by some Baldoni supporter who wants me to shut up; I'm not mad if folks don't have anything to add ha.


PP and haha, that's ridiculous someone is adding those posts. All it did was bump the thread to the top of the Recent Topics list which is why I saw your posts. So, thanks to you too, random Baldoni supporter! You helped me get some good info on what is going on with the case yesterday and today!
Anonymous
Hudson taking a big swing by asking for a protective order for Swift materials to be produced from Lively, I think at least until Freedman produces to them whatever Venable gave them, possibly to see if Seift materials are even still relevant given dismissal? But I could be wrong, haven’t read it all:

https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.nysd.634304/gov.uscourts.nysd.634304.325.0.pdf
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:Hudson taking a big swing by asking for a protective order for Swift materials to be produced from Lively, I think at least until Freedman produces to them whatever Venable gave them, possibly to see if Seift materials are even still relevant given dismissal? But I could be wrong, haven’t read it all:

https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.nysd.634304/gov.uscourts.nysd.634304.325.0.pdf


So this is a Motion seeking permission to be relieved of Lively's duty to produce her communications with Taylor Swift under Wayfarer's doc requests 108 and 109, basically calling Freedman's bluff, for better or for worse, on his statements about what he received from Swift. Hudson says that Wayfarer's claims involving Taylor Swift have been dismissed, and Lively's complaint doesn't mention Taylor Swift at all. Lively's attorneys have attempted to obtain any materials received by Freedman from Swift since late May with basically no response, even though Freedman has a duty to promptly produce to Lively any materials they have received through subpoena via a third party, through mutual agreement, as in most litigation.

So either Freedman received nothing and was just bluffing, or received something while failing to produce it back to Lively despite repeated requests.

Hudson also makes much of the fact that Freedman made several statements to the press that he had obtained "everything he needed" from Swift, which Hudson uses as further ammunition that (1) Freedman was just playing to the press the whole time; and (2) Freedman doesn't require further Swift communications from Lively.

Also interesting that in the email of communications about the Swift materials, the Lively attorney notes that Freedman so far as of Monday, June 9th, had made "only three small productions" and that third party materials were not contained in any of them. This adds further to the idea that Freedman isn't keeping up with his production obligations and that, unless he intends to make a huge production on July 1, he will likely not have substantially produced by then.

I can see one way where Freedman may be trying sort of his best here, in that if Swift provided him with evidence that Gottlieb had tried to extort Swift, he might feel he was not obligated to re-produce that to Gottlieb/Lively. At the same time, though, I don't think he's allowed to sit on that evidence at his leisure, while at the same time asking Lively to produce every communication she has had with Swift about IEWU, which seemingly has no relevance anymore. Maybe Freedman will say such communications are relevant because they can indicate that evidence was destroyed by Lively? But that is not currently an issue in any of the complaints, and if Freedman wants to make it an issue it is his job to file pleadings to make it so.

Here again is Hudson's motion: https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.nysd.634304/gov.uscourts.nysd.634304.325.0.pdf
Here is the declaration re the history of communications: https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.nysd.634304/gov.uscourts.nysd.634304.327.0.pdf
Here is the email showing the parties written communications on the issue: https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.nysd.634304/gov.uscourts.nysd.634304.327.2.pdf
Anonymous
Also, in the "that's got to hurt" category, Kristen Bender at Willkie emailed Freedman et al roughly three hours after Judge Liman's order dismissing all Baldoni's claims was issued, saying hey, you guys haven't bothered to respond to our last communication on this Swift issue for two whole weeks, and you also haven't produced anything relevant, so, essentially, put up or shut up: "We have yet to receive any response to the email below [requesting production of Swift documents/communications received from Venable], which we sent more than two weeks ago. To date you have made three small productions, none of which includes any materials that you received from third parties, including in connection with the decision to withdraw the Venable and Swift subpoenas. We can only conclude that no such materials exist and that the purpose of subpoenaing Venable and Swift was not to procure any relevant discovery but rather to generate a public relations stunt. Either way, given that Mr. Freedman has publicly confirmed that the Wayfarer parties 'dropped the request for the subpoena' because 'they got exactly what they were seeking[,]' we understand that you will withdraw RFPs 108-109 that you served on Ms. Lively and RFPs 106-107 that you served on Mr. Reynolds (to the extent they still are operative considering he is no longer a party—Mr. Reynolds reserves all rights on that regard)." https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.nysd.634304/gov.uscourts.nysd.634304.327.2.pdf
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:Also, in the "that's got to hurt" category, Kristen Bender at Willkie emailed Freedman et al roughly three hours after Judge Liman's order dismissing all Baldoni's claims was issued, saying hey, you guys haven't bothered to respond to our last communication on this Swift issue for two whole weeks, and you also haven't produced anything relevant, so, essentially, put up or shut up: "We have yet to receive any response to the email below [requesting production of Swift documents/communications received from Venable], which we sent more than two weeks ago. To date you have made three small productions, none of which includes any materials that you received from third parties, including in connection with the decision to withdraw the Venable and Swift subpoenas. We can only conclude that no such materials exist and that the purpose of subpoenaing Venable and Swift was not to procure any relevant discovery but rather to generate a public relations stunt. Either way, given that Mr. Freedman has publicly confirmed that the Wayfarer parties 'dropped the request for the subpoena' because 'they got exactly what they were seeking[,]' we understand that you will withdraw RFPs 108-109 that you served on Ms. Lively and RFPs 106-107 that you served on Mr. Reynolds (to the extent they still are operative considering he is no longer a party—Mr. Reynolds reserves all rights on that regard)." https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.nysd.634304/gov.uscourts.nysd.634304.327.2.pdf


I may have left out the best part, which is that on May 22nd, Swift's attorney at Venable emailed the parties saying Venable was dropping their motion to quash and noting specifically that: "No documents are being produced and no deposition is being scheduled."

So Freedman received no documents from Venable! Several gossip magazines had reported that some email existed confirming that Gottlieb had threatened Swift with extortion as a written record of that threat and that Freedman must have received that -- but, no. I guess Freedman could have been told something by the Venable attorney (e.g., that the threats were true, or even that they were false) -- in which case, what if any duty would you have to report that communication in the same way you produce third party documents to other parties?

Even if there is no duty to provide oral communications with third parties to opposing parties, it seems like the value of that communication would be minimal, since you would essentially have no proof of it.

Okay I really am talking to myself now, ha, will give it a rest for a bit.
Anonymous
Dp from above, I said when this happened I thought BF got nothing but the statements in the press that she had nothing to do with it. That would be what I'd expect from a withdrawn subpoena.
Anonymous
So Bryan Freedman lied. Hmmm.
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