Should we take WISC before reapplying for 3rd grade?

[Anonymous]

Is this something people do? Should we schedule a Fall WISC before applying for LLIV services again this fall/winter so that it can be counted as new information?

[Anonymous]

Sorry my title isn't clear - reapplying IN 3rd grade. My child is starting 3rd now not in AAP, we'd like to reapply for 4th grade AAP.

[Anonymous]

You can resubmit a previous WISC if you already have one. The new packet is looked at on its own. No previous submissions are included.

[Anonymous]

I’m confused. Are you both taking it?

[Anonymous]

You don't need "new information" to reapply. Every year, they'll make a completely new packet for your child. There will be new iready scores, new HOPE forms, and new work samples.

Also, what caused your kid to be rejected last year? Was the CogAT low, or did the kid have a lower HOPE score? You can request a free CogAT retest, if the original score wasn't high enough.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You don't need "new information" to reapply. Every year, they'll make a completely new packet for your child. There will be new iready scores, new HOPE forms, and new work samples.

Also, what caused your kid to be rejected last year? Was the CogAT low, or did the kid have a lower HOPE score? You can request a free CogAT retest, if the original score wasn't high enough.

OP here - I believe my child was rejected in the first round because of a low HOPE score (we were new to the school and the HOPE was filled out in October so the teacher barely knew him). His NNAT and COGAT were both above the 132 cut off everyone here talks about, but his iready reading was under 90th percentile. When we appealed, the spring iready was much higher and we submitted new work samples, but he was still rejected. I guess we should have done the WISC, so now we're wondering if we should do it this fall before reapplying.

[Anonymous]

No offense, but this do-whatever-it-takes to bulldoze my kid’s way into AAP is exactly why AAP has become meaningless.
I’m sure your child is bright and will do well academically. They probably don’t need gifted services in ES; very few do. They can self elect into honors in MS and everything will be fine.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No offense, but this do-whatever-it-takes to bulldoze my kid’s way into AAP is exactly why AAP has become meaningless.
I’m sure your child is bright and will do well academically. They probably don’t need gifted services in ES; very few do. They can self elect into honors in MS and everything will be fine.

AAP wasn’t meaningless for my kids. They found deep peer connections and learned exponentially more and at a faster pace than they were learning before.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No offense, but this do-whatever-it-takes to bulldoze my kid’s way into AAP is exactly why AAP has become meaningless.
I’m sure your child is bright and will do well academically. They probably don’t need gifted services in ES; very few do. They can self elect into honors in MS and everything will be fine.

AAP wasn’t meaningless for my kids. They found deep peer connections and learned exponentially more and at a faster pace than they were learning before.

I’m glad your children learned “exponentially more” in elementary school. Presumably that means they went on to be “exponentially” more successful in HS than their pedestrian peers that took regular honors MS school and AP classes in HS?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No offense, but this do-whatever-it-takes to bulldoze my kid’s way into AAP is exactly why AAP has become meaningless.
I’m sure your child is bright and will do well academically. They probably don’t need gifted services in ES; very few do. They can self elect into honors in MS and everything will be fine.

No offense, but you clearly don't know what AAP is. It's NOT a gifted program.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No offense, but this do-whatever-it-takes to bulldoze my kid’s way into AAP is exactly why AAP has become meaningless.
I’m sure your child is bright and will do well academically. They probably don’t need gifted services in ES; very few do. They can self elect into honors in MS and everything will be fine.

AAP wasn’t meaningless for my kids. They found deep peer connections and learned exponentially more and at a faster pace than they were learning before.

I’m glad your children learned “exponentially more” in elementary school. Presumably that means they went on to be “exponentially” more successful in HS than their pedestrian peers that took regular honors MS school and AP classes in HS?

NP. AAP was also valuable for my DC in elementary school. In high school, he was successful in that he made it to high school and had not dropped out due to bullying-the-smart-kid or from years of waiting for academic engagement.

[Anonymous]

I didn’t say it wasn’t valuable for certain reasons. But seems like hyperbole to suggest exponential academic value when we are talking about elementary curriculum. It’s NOT a gifted program anymore. It’s a contrived track inadvertently created by people parent referring, prepping, and paying for outside testing to ensure they get the track. Of course some kids thrive surrounded by generally more motivated kids, but everyone ends up back in the same place with the same academic opportunities by MS and HS. IME, the outcomes aren’t exponentially better for the kids that did some extra social studies in 4th grade.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No offense, but this do-whatever-it-takes to bulldoze my kid’s way into AAP is exactly why AAP has become meaningless.
I’m sure your child is bright and will do well academically. They probably don’t need gifted services in ES; very few do. They can self elect into honors in MS and everything will be fine.

No offense, but you clearly don't know what AAP is. It's NOT a gifted program.

PP - exactly. And because it’s so arbitrary who’s in and out, it doesn’t really make a difference at this point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I didn’t say it wasn’t valuable for certain reasons. But seems like hyperbole to suggest exponential academic value when we are talking about elementary curriculum. It’s NOT a gifted program anymore. It’s a contrived track inadvertently created by people parent referring, prepping, and paying for outside testing to ensure they get the track. Of course some kids thrive surrounded by generally more motivated kids, but everyone ends up back in the same place with the same academic opportunities by MS and HS. IME, the outcomes aren’t exponentially better for the kids that did some extra social studies in 4th grade.

You didn’t say a lot of things. What you did say is that AAP has become meaningless. I suppose worth is individually determined by what one is expecting from the program.

In my response, I said nothing about what AAP means for outcomes in HS, nor did I make disparaging comments about peers who aren’t in AAP — those were your words. I said it wasn’t meaningless for my kids. So sure, I’ll move away from the phrase “exponentially more,” since you’re twisting it into something I never said. Once in AAP my kids were learning more than they (my kids) were learning beforehand and at a faster pace than before. They also were among a cohort with whom they formed deep friendships, which was a welcome change. Frankly, the social benefits and diminished feelings of “otherness” meant the most to me at the elementary ages and have had the biggest impact on their happiness in school and social-emotional well-being. These things matter to many parents and have real impacts on overall academic success.

[Anonymous]

To answer the OP's question... (without debating AAP itself!) Yes, absolutely. It definitely couldn't hurt, especially as it sounds like you are set on getting in. If the scores are lower, you just don't submit them. As another poster said, also retake the COGAT for free, which a lot of kids do. Request from your AART now, so it's on the calendar. It's a new application each year with a new appeal allowed each year, which is not clearly communicated. My daughter's test scores were VERY high, and she only got in for 3rd grade on appeal with work samples, so search for the work sample recs here and spend some real time on those between now and Dec deadline. You can talk to the AART and teacher and have them send home copies of the LIII work, which you can always redo/ add at home with additional time. If nothing else, you'll know what's being collected/ submitted and where your student might have gaps to fill.