Which school best supports children who are advanced academically?

[Anonymous]

[quote=Anonymous]The deafening silence on this topic, on a particularly "loquacious" board, tells the whole story. Special accommodations for truly gifted (> 2 grade levels) is a rare concession at D.C. area private schools. The only options would be insistence on skipping a full grade or two for accommodation or supplementing at home with private tutoring. The latter is what most of my colleagues are doing with kids in private school. Subject acceleration to higher grades in Math, Science or languages is not an option.[/quote]



Why the heck not ? Can someone please explain this to me? We all know that failing to provide a challenging academic environment can be damaging to a child: they become bored and act out out or used to school being "easy" and therefore develop lazy work habits or just loose years . Why wouldn't a school supposedly dedicated to fostrering a love of learning make sure it meets the needs of its gifted students?

[Anonymous]

[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]OP: I have heard from others that we should look at MoCO magnets. Thanks to people who've suggested that. I understand that that is an option. In the meantime, we want to explore which of the schools that I've mentioned may do the best job with advanced children. Please respond only if you've dealt with this issue with one of these schools. They may not come close to the magnets, but on this thread, I want to explore only these four schools. I would like to hear from you if YOUR child is advanced above grade level in one or more subject areas, and attends one of these schools. How engaged is the school with your child's learning needs? It would be helpful to me if you told me how old your child is, what the area(s) of advancement is, how the school is dealing with him or her, and whether it gets better as the child ages. Are you pleased with what your child is getting or do you dream of finding the school that will meet his or her needs better? [/quote]

Sorry, OP, but your tone is really off-putting. You've put so many conditions on who MAY or MAY NOT answer your question that I have no interest in chiming in, even though I do meet the criteria for being "allowed" to comment. Good luck, is all I have to say.[/quote]

I don't have a problem with the post at all. The poster obviously has a child with rare gifts and only people who have related experience in the schools she is interested in can help. I can understand why a parent might turn to this forum for help not wanting to "out herself" as a high maintenance future problem parent during the application process by asking too many pointed questions about how the prospective school would support her gifted child's needs especially of schools that unfortunately face more pressure on the other end of the spectrum: offering remedial help to social admissions who they can't afford financially to lose or offend.

[Anonymous]

[quote=Anonymous]New poster here. Our kid also did math 2 grades up (in a foreign language -- this was one of the immersion programs). There was no separate curriculum for them, instead they went down the hall to a higher grade's class. Starting in fifth grade they needed to walk over to the nearby middle school.

The higher placement for some kids after the "testing" seems to be self-perpetuating. That is, if your kid is in a higher group in the earlier grades, they will do better on the tests next year, and be in the higher group next year.

OP, I'm really glad to help now that I think this is a two-way street. You'll find lots of other very educated parents here, who want to help if they are asked nicely. We have our pride too ;)[/quote]



What do you do if your child is cohorted with a lower level group, not challenged and then, not surprisingly, doesn't test as well because they were never exposed to more challenging math instruction that could have developed their potential ?

[Anonymous]

[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]New poster here. Our kid also did math 2 grades up (in a foreign language -- this was one of the immersion programs). There was no separate curriculum for them, instead they went down the hall to a higher grade's class. Starting in fifth grade they needed to walk over to the nearby middle school.[/quote]
What do you do if your child is cohorted with a lower level group, not challenged and then, not surprisingly, doesn't test as well because they were never exposed to more challenging math instruction that could have developed their potential ?[/quote]
Do people think that just skipping a grade (for all subjects or just some subjects) is a good solution? Are any of your children doing this? How is it working out?

I thought there is a move against grade-skipping because it essentially mixes smart but much younger children into classes with older children. They might not be emotionally ready for that situation, even if they are ready academically. If a 5th grader is sitting in classes with 7th graders, that seems like a situation that might cause some difficulties.

What experience have parents seen with this?

[Anonymous]

A lot of these differences even out when kids get older and learning becomes more abstract. In the younger elementary years some kids will read ahead of others and others will learn quicker in math. But in high school, at least at the privates, the work is challenging all around and there is always room for someone to go into the materials in greater depth within the same curriculum and classes. Kids who do well in math can go ahead to a higher level class. It really, truly isn't an issue. And the kids whose parents identified them as so gifted when they were younger are in the mix as the kids get older. Being able to read at an early age is not nearly as important as having self-discipline once the kids get older.

I get very skeptical of parents who say their children aren't doing well because they are just so gifted that they're bored. Often this becomes an excuse that prevents the parents from investigating other reasons, like undiagnosed ADHD or behavior issues. The truly gifted kids I've seen find ways to enrich themselves -- they love to read and explore and can do so without guidance.

[Anonymous]

I'm the poster with the immersion kid who skipped grades in math. It was only one class, math. And only for one year, then DC went on to a math magnet, solving any latent social problems, not that DC complained of any during that year.

Re the one class, I wouldn't say DC faced any social difficulties while in the class. There were a handful of other kids DC's age in the class, plus sitting in class while the teacher is talking keeps a lid on any teasing. Walking over to class was a bit different and DC once got offered pot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I get very skeptical of parents who say their children aren't doing well because they are just so gifted that they're bored. Often this becomes an excuse that prevents the parents from investigating other reasons, like undiagnosed ADHD or behavior issues. The truly gifted kids I've seen find ways to enrich themselves -- they love to read and explore and can do so without guidance.

I totally agree. Also, I can think of at least one instance where complaining about boredom is a mask for social problems and also part of a strategy to manipulate mom into homeschooling. Bright kids' brains need challenges like their bodies need food. I guess I might modify your statement a bit: bright kids will thrive in magnets but would surely do well in a top private, even if they have to fall back on their own ingenuity a bit.

But get ready to be shouted down, because there are folks who feel strongly otherwise on DCUM.

[Anonymous]

'Why the heck not ? Can someone please explain this to me? We all know that failing to provide a challenging academic environment can be damaging to a child: they become bored and act out out or used to school being "easy" and therefore develop lazy work habits or just loose years . Why wouldn't a school supposedly dedicated to fostrering a love of learning make sure it meets the needs of its gifted students? '

Including spelling?

[Anonymous]

"Walking over to class was a bit different and DC once got offered pot. "

LOL!

[Anonymous]

[quote=Anonymous]

What do you do if your child is cohorted with a lower level group, not challenged and then, not surprisingly, doesn't test as well because they were never exposed to more challenging math instruction that could have developed their potential ?[/quote]

If you think your kid is not being challenged, then you need to talk to the teachers and get him/her moved up. Schools, public and private (we've done both) are notorious for gatekeeping that keeps some qualified kids out. They have limited slots in the advanced class, and they are besieged by parents who want their kids in advanced math. So they take the squeakiest wheels, which means that other qualified kids get left out. We've definitely seen this.

Don't go this route, though, unless you think your kid really needs more challenge. For some parents it's "bragging rights" to have junior in advanced math. Or they think junior won't get into Harvard if he doesn't do advanced math in 2nd grade, which isn't the case. So do a check on yourself and your kid, and make sure that advanced math is really appropriate.

But if it is appropriate for your kid, by all means make a fuss. All the other parents are making a fuss, we've definitely seen this in both public and private. And it's true that being in advanced classes is self-perpetuating, because it's tough for a kid to make the leap from regular math in one year to advanced math the next year.

[Anonymous]

I've been through all this. Two comments:
1. If we're providing environments where kids who are super-smart can actually *flourish*, then creative curricular options like sending down the hall need to be taken seriously. The knee-jerk reaction of many administrators is that they need to manage pushy parents, and this precludes creativity.
2. When serious acceleration is really called for, often teachers of the child will recognize it. That is really the best route. It is a non-starter for parents, without serious documentation of one sort or another, to be the advocates - much better if the school comes to "learn" it themselves. (It was always amusing how teachers told us how they'd discovered how bright our child is -- they were very excited to deliver the news to unsuspecting parents!)

[Anonymous]

I appreciate your thoughtful comments, but I wonder if your point about pushy parents conflicts with the ideal of letting parents decide. In our case, DC scored in the 98th pctile on a national, standardized math test administered by the school, yet the school didn't automatically put DC in advanced math. We asked why, and after about a week if back and forth the school said they "made a mistake."

We put this down, in part, to the existence of a lot of pushy parents whose kids do get into advanced math. Like the mom who told me the teachers say they were "expecting her call" whenever one of her daughters doesn't get into advanced reading or whatever. And guess what, next week the daughter in question appears in advanced reading.

My DC, who was in private, is now in a MoCo math magnet and doing great.

[Anonymous]

8:07 again. I guess the short version of our experience would be, yes, in a better world the teachers would make the decisions to advance kids, but you can't count on that happening for a variety of reasons including pushy parents scoring for their kids the slots that should have gone to other kids. So do an *honest* evaluation of your own kid as well as your own motives, and then decide whether you, too, need to push.

[Anonymous]

[quote=Anonymous] And it's true that being in advanced classes is self-perpetuating, because it's tough for a kid to make the leap from regular math in one year to advanced math the next year.[/quote]

Depends on the school. GDS doesn't differentiate in math until 7th grade but, from then on, there are a series of different ways to accelerate (or decelerate) built into the curriculum (which maxes out two years beyond Calc BC).

We've been very happy with GDS for our kid (whose CTY experiences have made her very grateful she's not in a MoCo magnet). It's just a different model and which you prefer is probably a function of personality (hopefully, your kid's!). One model is to differentiate and push kids to get through the material as fast as they can. Another model is open-ended assignments that offer kids a chance to go deep and to set their own level of challenge. DC hates being pushed or rushed, loves to explore, and sets herself tasks no teacher would dream of assigning to kids her age. But I see other bright kids who just do the needful and coast. Basically, it comes down to whether you kid performs best under external pressure or is self-motivated (and, if the latter, whether you value that trait and the particular directions in which it leads your child). For some very gifted kids, the best approach is to provide a stimulating and worthwhile point of departure and then get out of their way, but be there to help/inspire/keep things on track when they need you.

[Anonymous]

[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]
We've been very happy with GDS for our kid (whose CTY experiences have made her very grateful she's not in a MoCo magnet). [/quote] Could you elaborate about the CTY/magnet connection? Is it that she's met kids from the magnets who are unhappy?