Boundary review can’t come soon enough

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Murch has no more legal right to be in boundary for Deal and Wilson than Shepherd and Bancroft . . .

Are you always this much of a trolling gadfly?

Murch is the closest elementary school to Deal, literally steps away. But sure, let's bring back 1971-era social engineering and make Murch kids go to Stuart Hobson maybe. Or, McFarland?

This doesn’t make sense to me. Janey, Murch and Lafayette are all walking distance to Deal/Wilson. Are you telling me that Oyster Adams feeds to Wilson while Lafayette kids have to go across the park? I really don’t see how this happens.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Murch has no more legal right to be in boundary for Deal and Wilson than Shepherd and Bancroft . . .

Are you always this much of a trolling gadfly?

Murch is the closest elementary school to Deal, literally steps away. But sure, let's bring back 1971-era social engineering and make Murch kids go to Stuart Hobson maybe. Or, McFarland?

This doesn’t make sense to me. Janey, Murch and Lafayette are all walking distance to Deal/Wilson. Are you telling me that Oyster Adams feeds to Wilson while Lafayette kids have to go across the park? I really don’t see how this happens.

You’re racist and it doesn’t matter where your UMC kid goes to school because of data. [sarcasm]

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look Lafayette will be joining Shepherd at Ida Wells. Only moving Shepherd out of Deal is silly because only 40 kids at most go to Deal. 40 kids is nothing. Moving all Ward 4 schools to Wells make perfect sense and will definitely reduce numbers.

A big chunk of Lafayette is in Ward 3.

Again, removing Shepherd doesn’t fix anything. A larger school must go.

Isn't Lafayette Elementary itself in Ward 4?

Yes - it’s on the boundary of ward 4 but more than half of the inbounds population lives in Ward 3

Oh well. Not everyone will be happy. Change is hard but often positive growth comes from it.

[Anonymous]

The data say their kids may not get dragged down, but it doesn’t say the same for their property values ???

[Anonymous]

I have a question about the research that correlates a mother’s education with her child’s educational outcomes. Do the studies account for the fact that these mothers will do everything they can to get their child into the best school possible? I am educated and my children will be as well. I am UMC and bought into a strong upper NW school district when I was pregnant. My sister, also educated, but not UMC financially managed through a school choice city (Seattle) to get both her children well educated.

Yes, we read in the home and talk to our children constantly, etc., but it is in the nature of mothers to work to get their children an education and it is not through assuming that because they are educated so too will be their children by osmosis. Rather, it is through making tangible choices to get that education and such choices include avoiding schools with low proficiency levels.

I have no dog in this fight as my kids will be in high school or college by the next boundary review, but I have always been skeptical of this data as I know a lot would have to happen before I sent my child to a low performing school and I am not unique on this front.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have a question about the research that correlates a mother’s education with her child’s educational outcomes. Do the studies account for the fact that these mothers will do everything they can to get their child into the best school possible? I am educated and my children will be as well. I am UMC and bought into a strong upper NW school district when I was pregnant. My sister, also educated, but not UMC financially managed through a school choice city (Seattle) to get both her children well educated.

Yes, we read in the home and talk to our children constantly, etc., but it is in the nature of mothers to work to get their children an education and it is not through assuming that because they are educated so too will be their children by osmosis. Rather, it is through making tangible choices to get that education and such choices include avoiding schools with low proficiency levels.

I have no dog in this fight as my kids will be in high school or college by the next boundary review, but I have always been skeptical of this data as I know a lot would have to happen before I sent my child to a low performing school and I am not unique on this front.

Not that I'm running any polling or statistical studies, but my life experience says that the presence of a mother AND a father in the home together should correlate positively with the Child's academic achievement.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Murch has no more legal right to be in boundary for Deal and Wilson than Shepherd and Bancroft . . .

Are you always this much of a trolling gadfly?

Murch is the closest elementary school to Deal, literally steps away. But sure, let's bring back 1971-era social engineering and make Murch kids go to Stuart Hobson maybe. Or, McFarland?

This doesn’t make sense to me. Janey, Murch and Lafayette are all walking distance to Deal/Wilson. Are you telling me that Oyster Adams feeds to Wilson while Lafayette kids have to go across the park? I really don’t see how this happens.

Exactly zero kids who actually live near LaFayette actually walk to Deal. Some take the WMATA bus. And most parents drive them. Nice try though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It strikes me that there are many changing dynamics in schools with pressing issues for boundary review across the city. How much longer do we need to wait for the process to start?

Blah blah blah I am bored.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Murch has no more legal right to be in boundary for Deal and Wilson than Shepherd and Bancroft . . .

Are you always this much of a trolling gadfly?

Murch is the closest elementary school to Deal, literally steps away. But sure, let's bring back 1971-era social engineering and make Murch kids go to Stuart Hobson maybe. Or, McFarland?

This doesn’t make sense to me. Janey, Murch and Lafayette are all walking distance to Deal/Wilson. Are you telling me that Oyster Adams feeds to Wilson while Lafayette kids have to go across the park? I really don’t see how this happens.

Agreed. Makes no sense to keep Oyster in deal and Wilson when they should feed to dual language macfalrand.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have a question about the research that correlates a mother’s education with her child’s educational outcomes. Do the studies account for the fact that these mothers will do everything they can to get their child into the best school possible? I am educated and my children will be as well. I am UMC and bought into a strong upper NW school district when I was pregnant. My sister, also educated, but not UMC financially managed through a school choice city (Seattle) to get both her children well educated.

Yes, we read in the home and talk to our children constantly, etc., but it is in the nature of mothers to work to get their children an education and it is not through assuming that because they are educated so too will be their children by osmosis. Rather, it is through making tangible choices to get that education and such choices include avoiding schools with low proficiency levels.

I have no dog in this fight as my kids will be in high school or college by the next boundary review, but I have always been skeptical of this data as I know a lot would have to happen before I sent my child to a low performing school and I am not unique on this front.

Not that I'm running any polling or statistical studies, but my life experience says that the presence of a mother AND a father in the home together should correlate positively with the Child's academic achievement.

Father's educational level is statistically significant, but the coefficients tend to be smaller.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reading this thread just makes me want to move to Arlington.

- IB Lafayette, formerly IB Murch, location chosen solely for access to Wilson

What exactly are you afraid of? Do you honestly think your kid's outcomes will be measurably different if they have to cross to my side of the Park every day for school (which I don't think is likely, but still)?

I mean, if you want to move to VA, go ahead, but I'm just trying to understand what the fear is here.

Have you seen the PARCC scores? I think it’s not unreasonable to assume my kid won’t be at grade level, when his classmates aren’t at grade level. And for me, my kid demonstrating the skills he’s supposed to have (by testing at grade level) equates to a good outcome.

There are data to suggest that kids from affluent backgrounds do well even if they attend schools with large low SES populations. This has been discussed here a number of times here, but apparently the fear of lower SES classmates dragging down your kids still persists.

I don’t really agree with this based on personal experience. I went to an UMC suburban high school and then went to an Ivy for college. I was out of my depth, compared to students who came from prep schools. Schools matter.

DP, but the point is that you probably would have fared the same in college in terms of readiness if you came from a suburban high school with more economic and at-risk diversity. Comparing to kids coming from private is apples to oranges.

+1. I'm the PP that mentioned data. Here's one data point that relates to the black-white achievement gap in 8th grade students:

"White student achievement in schools with the highest Black student density did not differ from White student achievement in schools with the lowest density."

"The Black–White achievement gap was larger in the highest density schools than in the lowest density schools."

So it seems that integrated schools help minority students' performances (although they don't entirely erase the achievement gap), and don't harm white students' performance.

https://nces.ed.gov/nationsreportcard/subject/studies/pdf/school_composition_and_the_bw_achievement_gap_2015.pdf

This is just the crappiest of work.

Did they control for every other factor that might’ve influenced white kids’ performance?
SES? Distance to school? Neighborhood type? Parent job? Parent attitude? Parent wealth? Parent effort? Out of school enrichment?


We really need to start teaching classes in public schools in how to evaluate research papers.

[Anonymous]

The study controls for a number of key factors: SES and school related. Do you have evidence that leads to different conclusions? “You can’t control for everything,” doesn’t advance the discussion very much.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reading this thread just makes me want to move to Arlington.

- IB Lafayette, formerly IB Murch, location chosen solely for access to Wilson

What exactly are you afraid of? Do you honestly think your kid's outcomes will be measurably different if they have to cross to my side of the Park every day for school (which I don't think is likely, but still)?

I mean, if you want to move to VA, go ahead, but I'm just trying to understand what the fear is here.

Have you seen the PARCC scores? I think it’s not unreasonable to assume my kid won’t be at grade level, when his classmates aren’t at grade level. And for me, my kid demonstrating the skills he’s supposed to have (by testing at grade level) equates to a good outcome.

There are data to suggest that kids from affluent backgrounds do well even if they attend schools with large low SES populations. This has been discussed here a number of times here, but apparently the fear of lower SES classmates dragging down your kids still persists.

I don’t really agree with this based on personal experience. I went to an UMC suburban high school and then went to an Ivy for college. I was out of my depth, compared to students who came from prep schools. Schools matter.

DP, but the point is that you probably would have fared the same in college in terms of readiness if you came from a suburban high school with more economic and at-risk diversity. Comparing to kids coming from private is apples to oranges.

+1. I'm the PP that mentioned data. Here's one data point that relates to the black-white achievement gap in 8th grade students:

"White student achievement in schools with the highest Black student density did not differ from White student achievement in schools with the lowest density."

"The Black–White achievement gap was larger in the highest density schools than in the lowest density schools."

So it seems that integrated schools help minority students' performances (although they don't entirely erase the achievement gap), and don't harm white students' performance.

https://nces.ed.gov/nationsreportcard/subject/studies/pdf/school_composition_and_the_bw_achievement_gap_2015.pdf

This is just the crappiest of work.

Did they control for every other factor that might’ve influenced white kids’ performance?
SES? Distance to school? Neighborhood type? Parent job? Parent attitude? Parent wealth? Parent effort? Out of school enrichment?


We really need to start teaching classes in public schools in how to evaluate research papers.

NP. The authors do control for parent education and income. That would be multicollinear with some of the other things you've mentioned. I'm also not aware of a body of work that suggests that distance to school, neighborhood type, or out of school enrichment affects tests scores independently of parent income.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have a question about the research that correlates a mother’s education with her child’s educational outcomes. Do the studies account for the fact that these mothers will do everything they can to get their child into the best school possible? I am educated and my children will be as well. I am UMC and bought into a strong upper NW school district when I was pregnant. My sister, also educated, but not UMC financially managed through a school choice city (Seattle) to get both her children well educated.

Yes, we read in the home and talk to our children constantly, etc., but it is in the nature of mothers to work to get their children an education and it is not through assuming that because they are educated so too will be their children by osmosis. Rather, it is through making tangible choices to get that education and such choices include avoiding schools with low proficiency levels.

I have no dog in this fight as my kids will be in high school or college by the next boundary review, but I have always been skeptical of this data as I know a lot would have to happen before I sent my child to a low performing school and I am not unique on this front.

Yes. I've said this before: People here on DCUM misinterpret the data from these studies. Most families with highly educated mothers aren't putting their children in low performing schools. This wasn't a study of UMC families with highly educated mothers putting their kids into high poverty, low performing DCPS schools.

[Anonymous]

Two things to consider from the study:

"In the highest density [low income black] schools, the reduction in the achievement gap was not statistically significant ( p = .058)."

"In addition, the size of the achievement gaps within each
category of Black student density was smaller when the
analysis accounted for student SES and other student,
teacher, and school characteristics (except in the highest
density category), suggesting that these factors explained a
considerable portion of the observed achievement gap."

...meaning that there's no change in the achievement gap when the school is a high-density african-american, low-income school. Duh. Whereas if the school looks like Washington Latin, everyone wants to get in. Again Duh.