Extended calendar next school year at two schools

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

LOL!

You have no clue! I know exactly how this went down, and there was NOTHING systematic about it.

Take your condescending tone off this thread and stick your head in a journal. You know nothing.

DP. OK. That doesn't mean they won't compare the two schools with it (however unsystematically planned or chosen) with the multiple schools without it. This is a pilot test, no? And MCPS has done pilot tests before.

You don't pilot a project w/o first gathering research from those directly involved. funny how the teachers weren't surveyed

nor were the parents . . .

And were the feeder elementary (Nix is pre-K through 2) and middle schools notified? Did they switch their schedules, too? lol! no!

It's a disaster in the making that won't amount to anything beneficial.

band aid . . .

I don't understand. They are piloting an extended school year at two high-FARMS elementary schools. The comparison will be to regular schedules at comparable high-FARMS elementary schools. The question will presumably be, did the kids at the elementary schools with the extended school year do better the next year than kids at the elementary schools without the extended school year?

So, what kind of research are you talking about? What information would a teacher survey have provided that was relevant to the academic effects of an extended school year for children from low-income families? Why would Cresthaven ES and the middle schools need to be notified?

I mean, it's always good to get buy-in from the staff, for anything an organization does. But other than that, I don't understand why it would invalidate the pilot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

LOL!

You have no clue! I know exactly how this went down, and there was NOTHING systematic about it.

Take your condescending tone off this thread and stick your head in a journal. You know nothing.

DP. OK. That doesn't mean they won't compare the two schools with it (however unsystematically planned or chosen) with the multiple schools without it. This is a pilot test, no? And MCPS has done pilot tests before.

You don't pilot a project w/o first gathering research from those directly involved. funny how the teachers weren't surveyed

nor were the parents . . .

And were the feeder elementary (Nix is pre-K through 2) and middle schools notified? Did they switch their schedules, too? lol! no!

It's a disaster in the making that won't amount to anything beneficial.

band aid . . .

I don't understand. They are piloting an extended school year at two high-FARMS elementary schools. The comparison will be to regular schedules at comparable high-FARMS elementary schools. The question will presumably be, did the kids at the elementary schools with the extended school year do better the next year than kids at the elementary schools without the extended school year?

So, what kind of research are you talking about? What information would a teacher survey have provided that was relevant to the academic effects of an extended school year for children from low-income families? Why would Cresthaven ES and the middle schools need to be notified?

I mean, it's always good to get buy-in from the staff, for anything an organization does. But other than that, I don't understand why it would invalidate the pilot.

The issue is that kids aren't widgets. It really wouldn't be a controlled study because there are too many variables. This year's set of 3rd graders are not the same as last year's set of 3rd graders, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'll believe this when I see it. Don't they need a waiver to go past June 15? I bet Hogan won't let them, because he has a stick up his ass about MCPS and MCEA in particular. He'll make some grandstanding pronouncement about how horrible it is to deny kids summer vacation and that MCPS should try helping kids by having less crappy teachers because the union makes it hard to get rid of them, and this is just another attempt by MCPS to erode his executive order, blah blah blah. Just wait.

No. They can and will get a waiver for ‘innovative’ programs to address academic achievement.

Good. This is how the education system should work. Pilot innovations and see what gets results.

Ha! You must be an administrator. Or you work for MCPS.

Education needs small class sizes, caring, well-educated teachers and parents who respect the value of education.

The rest is BS. We don’t need all the BS initiatives that MCPS continuously rolls out. Kindergarten Head Start? Waste of time and money. Chromebooks in every K class? Also a waste of time and money. Any teacher can tell you how much time and money is wasted on stupid initiatives that get rolled out by admin. With little to no positive results.

Wrong. I'm a parent at a high income elementary school in MCPS. No connection to the education field, but I believe in evidence based decision making. I agree with you that small class sizes and well educated professionals are important. Evidence suggests a longer school year can prevent the 'summer slide,' particularly in low income students and I'm glad MCPS is testing this in a systematic way.

Please don't pull answers from the air, PP. There was nothing systematic in the way this mandate was handled.

again - People living in bubbles shouldn't comment on situations that are unfamiliar to them.

I'm very familiar with randomized controlled trials and other merchanisms to test innovations. MCPS isn't perfect, but their proposal to test a hypothesis in two schools and scale up if successful IS systematic.

LOL!

You have no clue! I know exactly how this went down, and there was NOTHING systematic about it.

Take your condescending tone off this thread and stick your head in a journal. You know nothing.

Are you a 10 year old upset that your school year is going to be longer? Because you write like one.

no

Actually, I'm a high school English teacher with many years under my belt and multiple degrees I've earned over the years. Sadly, you fail to recognize that teachers are indeed the experts with whom to consult regarding any transfomative measures affecting the field of education.

Unfortunately, the ignorant person (I'm sure there's a mirror nearby, PP.) fails to recognize that teachers, who pay taxes, have little say in how schools are run - often overpowered by inexperienced climbers who value licking another's backside over working hard for those who can actually make a difference in a child's life.

But why am I wasting time responding to you? You will never understand, as it's more difficult to change an ignorant adult than it is to enlighten a child.

"10 yo" signing off

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Asking because I don't know: What kind of extra help is offered to these families now? I thought there was already free summer school and meals?

Yes, there is free summer school but that is voluntary. Parents who don't value education won't send their kids to anything voluntary. For all the people out there who flip out when someone says FARMS = Poor Performance, MCPS is saying virtually the same thing when they implement this "Extended Calendar". This is just admitting that these kids don't learn as quickly as other kids at other schools. You will definitely see middle class families leaving. Maybe not the Uber-PC supermoms that will surely post "My child is at that school and I love the idea".

No, what they are "admitting" is that not every child has access to high quality summer programming and therefore kids learn skills over the summer and therefore teachers lose instructional time at the start of the year.

As a middle class parent, I'm not opposed to this at all. If my kids' peers are getting the same type of enrichment over the summer as they are, which is enrichment we can only provide because of our relative wealth, then everyone benefits, including my children not sitting through a month of review at the start of the school year.

What does wealth have to do with enrichment/working at home? MCPS can buy the kids a few workbooks for the summer if money were the issue. I got my kid a $5 set of workbooks online and we do those. Not much cost to that. You can get free stuff online. We don't do camps.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Asking because I don't know: What kind of extra help is offered to these families now? I thought there was already free summer school and meals?

There is also saturday school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'll believe this when I see it. Don't they need a waiver to go past June 15? I bet Hogan won't let them, because he has a stick up his ass about MCPS and MCEA in particular. He'll make some grandstanding pronouncement about how horrible it is to deny kids summer vacation and that MCPS should try helping kids by having less crappy teachers because the union makes it hard to get rid of them, and this is just another attempt by MCPS to erode his executive order, blah blah blah. Just wait.

No. They can and will get a waiver for ‘innovative’ programs to address academic achievement.

Good. This is how the education system should work. Pilot innovations and see what gets results.

Ha! You must be an administrator. Or you work for MCPS.

Education needs small class sizes, caring, well-educated teachers and parents who respect the value of education.

The rest is BS. We don’t need all the BS initiatives that MCPS continuously rolls out. Kindergarten Head Start? Waste of time and money. Chromebooks in every K class? Also a waste of time and money. Any teacher can tell you how much time and money is wasted on stupid initiatives that get rolled out by admin. With little to no positive results.

Wrong. I'm a parent at a high income elementary school in MCPS. No connection to the education field, but I believe in evidence based decision making. I agree with you that small class sizes and well educated professionals are important. Evidence suggests a longer school year can prevent the 'summer slide,' particularly in low income students and I'm glad MCPS is testing this in a systematic way.

Please don't pull answers from the air, PP. There was nothing systematic in the way this mandate was handled.

again - People living in bubbles shouldn't comment on situations that are unfamiliar to them.

I'm very familiar with randomized controlled trials and other merchanisms to test innovations. MCPS isn't perfect, but their proposal to test a hypothesis in two schools and scale up if successful IS systematic.

LOL!

You have no clue! I know exactly how this went down, and there was NOTHING systematic about it.

Take your condescending tone off this thread and stick your head in a journal. You know nothing.

Are you a 10 year old upset that your school year is going to be longer? Because you write like one.

huh?

nanny nanny boo boo to you

wth?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

LOL!

You have no clue! I know exactly how this went down, and there was NOTHING systematic about it.

Take your condescending tone off this thread and stick your head in a journal. You know nothing.

DP. OK. That doesn't mean they won't compare the two schools with it (however unsystematically planned or chosen) with the multiple schools without it. This is a pilot test, no? And MCPS has done pilot tests before.

You don't pilot a project w/o first gathering research from those directly involved. funny how the teachers weren't surveyed

nor were the parents . . .

And were the feeder elementary (Nix is pre-K through 2) and middle schools notified? Did they switch their schedules, too? lol! no!

It's a disaster in the making that won't amount to anything beneficial.

band aid . . .

If the pilot is starting in the fall, they have plenty of time to do a baseline. And I assume they have plenty of administrative data on the student population that will serve to measure outcomes. But I guess actual data won't matter to you, because you've already decided what the outcome will be.

After 20 years of this nonsense and no change, hell yeah, I know what the outcome is.

You'd think they'd do longitudinal studies, eh? funny how that's not the case

know why? bc the supts don't STAY long enough -As each new supt enters the spot, it's away with the old; enter the new!

Just stop, PP. You really have no clue.

We'll all have much more of "a clue" after we see the results of the pilot. Even you!

uh yeah
no

Until they have longitudinal data, these results mean nothing.

Who schooled you posters? The ignorance is amazing!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

The issue is that kids aren't widgets. It really wouldn't be a controlled study because there are too many variables. This year's set of 3rd graders are not the same as last year's set of 3rd graders, etc.

Can you control for all possible variables? No. Can you control for a lot of important variables? Yes. Can a study that is not a randomized controlled trial produce worthwhile results? Yes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

LOL!

You have no clue! I know exactly how this went down, and there was NOTHING systematic about it.

Take your condescending tone off this thread and stick your head in a journal. You know nothing.

DP. OK. That doesn't mean they won't compare the two schools with it (however unsystematically planned or chosen) with the multiple schools without it. This is a pilot test, no? And MCPS has done pilot tests before.

You don't pilot a project w/o first gathering research from those directly involved. funny how the teachers weren't surveyed

nor were the parents . . .

And were the feeder elementary (Nix is pre-K through 2) and middle schools notified? Did they switch their schedules, too? lol! no!

It's a disaster in the making that won't amount to anything beneficial.

band aid . . .

I don't understand. They are piloting an extended school year at two high-FARMS elementary schools. The comparison will be to regular schedules at comparable high-FARMS elementary schools. The question will presumably be, did the kids at the elementary schools with the extended school year do better the next year than kids at the elementary schools without the extended school year?

So, what kind of research are you talking about? What information would a teacher survey have provided that was relevant to the academic effects of an extended school year for children from low-income families? Why would Cresthaven ES and the middle schools need to be notified?

I mean, it's always good to get buy-in from the staff, for anything an organization does. But other than that, I don't understand why it would invalidate the pilot.

The issue is that kids aren't widgets. It really wouldn't be a controlled study because there are too many variables. This year's set of 3rd graders are not the same as last year's set of 3rd graders, etc.

That doesn't make any sense, and that's not how impact evaluation works. People analyzing data can control for identifiable variation (ex: demographics). Do you think scientists are only testing the effectiveness of drugs on people who are identical twins?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Asking because I don't know: What kind of extra help is offered to these families now? I thought there was already free summer school and meals?

Yes, there is free summer school but that is voluntary. Parents who don't value education won't send their kids to anything voluntary. For all the people out there who flip out when someone says FARMS = Poor Performance, MCPS is saying virtually the same thing when they implement this "Extended Calendar". This is just admitting that these kids don't learn as quickly as other kids at other schools. You will definitely see middle class families leaving. Maybe not the Uber-PC supermoms that will surely post "My child is at that school and I love the idea".

No, what they are "admitting" is that not every child has access to high quality summer programming and therefore kids learn skills over the summer and therefore teachers lose instructional time at the start of the year.

As a middle class parent, I'm not opposed to this at all. If my kids' peers are getting the same type of enrichment over the summer as they are, which is enrichment we can only provide because of our relative wealth, then everyone benefits, including my children not sitting through a month of review at the start of the school year.

What does wealth have to do with enrichment/working at home? MCPS can buy the kids a few workbooks for the summer if money were the issue. I got my kid a $5 set of workbooks online and we do those. Not much cost to that. You can get free stuff online. We don't do camps.

I suspect the target audience for this program are folks for whom $5 is a real cost, and who don't have reliable home internet.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'll believe this when I see it. Don't they need a waiver to go past June 15? I bet Hogan won't let them, because he has a stick up his ass about MCPS and MCEA in particular. He'll make some grandstanding pronouncement about how horrible it is to deny kids summer vacation and that MCPS should try helping kids by having less crappy teachers because the union makes it hard to get rid of them, and this is just another attempt by MCPS to erode his executive order, blah blah blah. Just wait.

No. They can and will get a waiver for ‘innovative’ programs to address academic achievement.

Good. This is how the education system should work. Pilot innovations and see what gets results.

Ha! You must be an administrator. Or you work for MCPS.

Education needs small class sizes, caring, well-educated teachers and parents who respect the value of education.

The rest is BS. We don’t need all the BS initiatives that MCPS continuously rolls out. Kindergarten Head Start? Waste of time and money. Chromebooks in every K class? Also a waste of time and money. Any teacher can tell you how much time and money is wasted on stupid initiatives that get rolled out by admin. With little to no positive results.

Wrong. I'm a parent at a high income elementary school in MCPS. No connection to the education field, but I believe in evidence based decision making. I agree with you that small class sizes and well educated professionals are important. Evidence suggests a longer school year can prevent the 'summer slide,' particularly in low income students and I'm glad MCPS is testing this in a systematic way.

Please don't pull answers from the air, PP. There was nothing systematic in the way this mandate was handled.

again - People living in bubbles shouldn't comment on situations that are unfamiliar to them.

I'm very familiar with randomized controlled trials and other merchanisms to test innovations. MCPS isn't perfect, but their proposal to test a hypothesis in two schools and scale up if successful IS systematic.

LOL!

You have no clue! I know exactly how this went down, and there was NOTHING systematic about it.

Take your condescending tone off this thread and stick your head in a journal. You know nothing.

Are you a 10 year old upset that your school year is going to be longer? Because you write like one.

no

Actually, I'm a high school English teacher with many years under my belt and multiple degrees I've earned over the years. Sadly, you fail to recognize that teachers are indeed the experts with whom to consult regarding any transfomative measures affecting the field of education.

Unfortunately, the ignorant person (I'm sure there's a mirror nearby, PP.) fails to recognize that teachers, who pay taxes, have little say in how schools are run - often overpowered by inexperienced climbers who value licking another's backside over working hard for those who can actually make a difference in a child's life.

But why am I wasting time responding to you? You will never understand, as it's more difficult to change an ignorant adult than it is to enlighten a child.

"10 yo" signing off

Teachers control MCPS 100%. They are unionized and their union picks the Board of Education and superintendent.

[Anonymous]

Bumping this thread up...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Plus many teachers take the job because they have kids of their own and they want to be on the same schedule as their kids for child care reasons.

If a teacher’s kid attends a different school, which does not have the extended year, then that obliterates that benefit.

I’m from a family of teachers and have taught almost two decades myself. I don’t know a single teacher who chose the profession for that reason. It’s a perk if you can live in the same district, but there’s no guarantee of that when you factor in a spouse’s commute, housing prices, and who is hiring teachers. College sophomores aren’t thinking about day care when they pick an education major. I’m a career changer and already had one child when I got my certification. Child care wasn’t even in my top five reasons although I had a guaranteed spot in MCPS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'll believe this when I see it. Don't they need a waiver to go past June 15? I bet Hogan won't let them, because he has a stick up his ass about MCPS and MCEA in particular. He'll make some grandstanding pronouncement about how horrible it is to deny kids summer vacation and that MCPS should try helping kids by having less crappy teachers because the union makes it hard to get rid of them, and this is just another attempt by MCPS to erode his executive order, blah blah blah. Just wait.

No. They can and will get a waiver for ‘innovative’ programs to address academic achievement.

Good. This is how the education system should work. Pilot innovations and see what gets results.

Ha! You must be an administrator. Or you work for MCPS.

Education needs small class sizes, caring, well-educated teachers and parents who respect the value of education.

The rest is BS. We don’t need all the BS initiatives that MCPS continuously rolls out. Kindergarten Head Start? Waste of time and money. Chromebooks in every K class? Also a waste of time and money. Any teacher can tell you how much time and money is wasted on stupid initiatives that get rolled out by admin. With little to no positive results.

Wrong. I'm a parent at a high income elementary school in MCPS. No connection to the education field, but I believe in evidence based decision making. I agree with you that small class sizes and well educated professionals are important. Evidence suggests a longer school year can prevent the 'summer slide,' particularly in low income students and I'm glad MCPS is testing this in a systematic way.

Please don't pull answers from the air, PP. There was nothing systematic in the way this mandate was handled.

again - People living in bubbles shouldn't comment on situations that are unfamiliar to them.

I'm very familiar with randomized controlled trials and other merchanisms to test innovations. MCPS isn't perfect, but their proposal to test a hypothesis in two schools and scale up if successful IS systematic.

LOL!

You have no clue! I know exactly how this went down, and there was NOTHING systematic about it.

Take your condescending tone off this thread and stick your head in a journal. You know nothing.

Are you a 10 year old upset that your school year is going to be longer? Because you write like one.

no

Actually, I'm a high school English teacher with many years under my belt and multiple degrees I've earned over the years. Sadly, you fail to recognize that teachers are indeed the experts with whom to consult regarding any transfomative measures affecting the field of education.

Unfortunately, the ignorant person (I'm sure there's a mirror nearby, PP.) fails to recognize that teachers, who pay taxes, have little say in how schools are run - often overpowered by inexperienced climbers who value licking another's backside over working hard for those who can actually make a difference in a child's life.

But why am I wasting time responding to you? You will never understand, as it's more difficult to change an ignorant adult than it is to enlighten a child.

"10 yo" signing off

Teachers control MCPS 100%. They are unionized and their union picks the Board of Education and superintendent.

You don’t have to belong to MCEA to vote for the Board of Ed.

The union is one stakeholder in picking the Superintendent.

[Anonymous]

Jumping over from the VA Schools board. This is probably going to end poorly for the chosen schools. APS did a similar pilot program starting about 20 years ago with one high poverty school. They have never done a longitudinal study AFAIK, but over the time period, test scores have actually declined, and it has made hiring teachers more difficult, and it drove out the middle class families who lived nearby and has failed to recapture the majority of the new MC families despite the neighborhood changing over from lower MC owners and renters to majority UMC owners (older small homes selling above $700,000 and new builds 1.2-1.3 million) from option schools to avoid the one school with a different calendars and very low test scores. APS is considering scrapping the calendar. MoCo would be wise to look at Barcroft before they go full steam ahead.