If not Basis or Latin, where?
![[Post New]](/jforum/templates/default/images/icon_minipost_new.gif){kind=icon}
Anonymous
|
NP here, and I'm just a bit perplexed by some things the Basis Tucson teacher said. I don't think anyone here would disagree with many of those arguments, for example that sole emphasis on APs is a mistake, or that schools like MIT look for extracurriculars and diversity. And, I don't think anyone would disagree that a bonafide perspective from a teacher could provide valuable insights.
But... as some previous posters here have pointed out, Basis does in fact have its students participate in many other types of activities, for example the National Science Bowl. Didn't Basis Tucson make it to be a statewide finalist in the Arizona Science Bowl just a few weeks ago, and wouldn't a Basis Tucson teacher be aware of that ans be proud of it? Why doesn't this Basis Tucson teacher seem to be aware of that, to just slip the mind let alone allow some strong opinion to form that Basis only pursues APs and doesn't have its students pursue competitions and extracurriculars? And it's not just STEM - I believe this week we also learned that a number of Basis students also made it to finalists in the Letters About Literature competition as well. And that's just in the last couple of weeks. Also, from what I hear from DC and other students, it's not just lecture-based seminars, that there are a lot of hands-on activities and fun things in class. I know that Basis DC has a debate team, and that there was recently a field trip to the Newseum. Given the wealth of world-class museums within walking distance of Basis DC it might make sense to have more field trips, I'm sure that's a matter of logistics. |
Anonymous
Hi Basis Teacher here - The one thing that astounds me continually since day 1 is how impressive and cool every kid is at my campus. Many manage to do amazing things both academically and in extracurriculars - science bowl, robotics, music, scholarships, etc. These kids are hats off impressive - polite, quirky, thoughtful, caring, diligent. I should know since I have taught at many other schools! BASIS attracts awesome kids and that alone is its biggest selling point and key to its track record of success. But these kids are awesome when they walk in the door. The key question is whether this great potential is being fostered and maximized by BASIS, or whether they persist despite what BASIS does. I obviously am moving towards the latter conclusion here at my campus. You guys hear the accolades, I hear the students who quit piano lessons etc. to keep up with homework. Now all of this is of course specific to my campus, but I still am troubled by several things that stem from the system imposed from above on all BASIS campuses. First is the loss of some of these good kids because they get defeated. I can see how this might not bother a parent of a kid who is not one of these casualties (or, more troubling but not uncommon - parents who refuse to see that their kid is a casualty), but it deeply saddens me as a teacher. We are an elite / niche school for sure but I think Marines is fine, Navy Seals is too much, if you get what I mean. Second, I do see a notable decline in raw enthusiasm for learning from 5th (where it is just epic) to 11th grade due, I think, not only to hormones but also to cumulative stress and fatigue. I also see that students come to see school mostly as a "learn-stuff-get-tested" process, which is quite passive and definitely not a good foundation for a successful college experience. Again, there are many exceptions, but this is what I perceive to be the case in general terms. The reason I am posting here is because my opinion seems to matter not one bit to the ever-growing BASIS corporation, and this is why I am not happy with the national expansion. Almost every academic and cultural and financial decision now is made by the central office with confidence that "the BASIS system" has a demonstrated track record of success... and I think that is a grave mistake. We look very good on paper but I have serious concerns about what is actually happening, at least at my campus. |
Anonymous
|
I'm catching up on this thread and wanted to thank 15:12 (from 3/26) for posting the mission information for both schools. I had no idea that they were so different.
I hear your concerns, BASIS teacher. I currently teach at a selective private school in the area and have similar concerns about that school. There comes a point when the image appears to be more important than the quality of the education. Clearly, some parents are more concerned with the image, based on a number of the posts here. My school no longer appears to be focused on quality education and meeting the student's needs so much as using the students to make the school look good. I'm not even sure how much longer I want to teach there and my kids will not be attending. Hopefully BASIS DC will avoid some of these pitfalls. We'll be watching it develop with interest, along with the other options, both charter and traditional public. |
Anonymous
| Anyone else find it odd that the person saying they are a BASIS teacher completely glossed over the fact that BASIS offers many diverse extracurriculars and participates in various competitions, not just in STEM but other areas as well, and basically just repeated the same stale assertion that the fraudulent "Ivy Interviewer" made that BASIS only cares about APs? I smell a rat. |
Anonymous
Do you mind sharing where you teach? Thanks |
Anonymous
Could be there IS plenty of "foresight and strategic planning going on downtown" and it's all focused on making DCPS middle school so unappealing for parents (except in ward 3), that parents who are involved in their kids' education will beg for (and get) more charter schools. That is, maybe DCPS is working to support charter schools, not compete with them -- and it's using "engaged parents" to lead the charge -- while the other kids get left behind, as usual. |
Anonymous
| DCPS is focused on meeting the lowest common denominator - which leaves the families pursuing better options in the cold. That's why they go to BASIS and Latin. |
Anonymous
BASIS for MS sounds great. But the HS stories from Arizona (thank you, teacher) don't inspire confidence on the part of this parent of a bright, academically enthusiastic 3rd grader, and 2 younger kids. PPs lash out when an interviewer calls a few BASIS seniors dull. What else would most be after cramming for a dozen AP tests?? Friends at DC privates tell me that their schools expect top students to take "only" 6-8 AP tests, while pursuing all sorts of extra curriculars. I don't want my kids to keep switching schools to find a good public fit (we can't afford privates for 3). Our IB MS school is bad news and we can't be sure that DC1 will get a spot at either Latin OR BASIS for 5th. My eye won't stray far from NOVA and MOCO real estate.... |
Anonymous
I am not so sure about the extent of the cramming for AP exams at BASIS since the curriculum appears to be well thought out. For example, if a student starts in 5th grade, they have classics which encompasses ancient history. For 6th, they have US History. For 7th, world history and for many in 8th AP world history. BASIS tries to lay the foundation and build on it from 5th grade on so that they are truly ready by the time they take the AP exam. Another example, is the sciences at BASIS in which the students have Biology, Chemistry, and Physics every year in some shape or form from 5th to 8th grade which lays the foundation for many AP science courses. Again, English seems to have a purposely thought out curricula to lay the foundation for AP English courses. So as you can see, BASIS has carefully planned for students to be ready for AP exams by coordinating curricula. |
Anonymous
What is so odd to me is that the BASIS Tucson teacher has several times made remarks about how confusing the anonymous posting system is here, and how much better it could be if we all used names, but if there really is a monolithic BASIS corporation out there surely they would terminate this teacher's contract immediately once they identified him/her. Similarly I seriously doubt that the person who posted who teaches at the selective private school in this area will post either their name or the name of their school, just as the BASIS Ivy interviewer will not identify his hallowed institution while alleging that the BASIS Tucson kids he interviewed were "dull as paint", "too busy cramming for AP's," and weak in extra currics etc. I sincerely hope that we have convinced THAT Ivy interviewer to lay off BASIS kids, as he should lay off kids from the private school "cocoon" in NW as he has "basically given up on St. Alban's boys" and the boys at Georgetown prep etc. S/he seems to actually now have stated he will not be interviewing kids from Arizona ever again. Now we just need him to give up altogether given that if he gets the one STA kid who has his heart set on his Ivy his mind is so closed that the kid is doomed - and he admitted this without any apparent moral qualms or embarrassment on DCUM. Imagine the reaction had he been referring to kids of a certain gender/religion/race instead of two private "privileged" boys schools - and effectively all the rest located in NW DC. IMO, the only interviewer/teacher who has posted who has shown some moral courage is the one who said s/he was the person who interviewed the successful Washington Latin applicant at Brown, who said that no one should conclude that this AT ALL indicates that Latin will send many kids to Ivies now or in the future. I agree that their record this year on acceptances and scholarships is impressive. Actually more than impressive. I was quite awed, especially by the scholarships. But most of these schools for a variety of reasons are not where I want my kids to go, even if they got free rides. I know someone who took a merit based free ride to UNC Chapel Hill in my peer group and generation that was based on merit, and more power to them. The fact was obtaining THAT kind of scholarship was a gigantic uptic in anyone's resume. Ok enough on that. We are BASIS parents. We did not want the big public high school experience of MoCo or to put all our eggs in one basket for a 16% acceptance rate at TJ when we have 3 kids. Even though the houses are so so so tempting outside DC, especially right now, especially for me, for reasons that would destroy MY anonymity but are personally significant..... Heck I fell in love 2 years ago with a perfect house that we could afford... and I watched it go for 15k below asking and it was my ultimate fantasy. HOWEVER, while I sympathize with the "it ain't what it used to be" laments of the BASIS Tucson teacher, and the critique of the private school teacher, I feel the same way about the DC private school I went to (it has gotten more money, moved locations, become more a member of the "establishment" it was sort of claiming to undermine when I went there, and now has serious sports teams). I would not send my kids there if I suddenly inherited 10 million dollars. In fact, if I did, (and the lottery would be the only way), I THOUGHT I would give everything up for my children's education and move to Arizona. Seriously if my Fed employed husband got RIF'd, that is what we were thinking we would do. So in that sense the poster from Tucson has given me pause. But not about the school here. We looked it up today. BASIS if a 501c3? corporation, meaning NOT FOR PROFIT. Not that Olga and her husband may not be making out like bandits, but perhaps they deserve to, after what they have accomplished. I kind of think so. The only educators the system tends to reward monetarily are people who could easily vote with their feet or are already wealthy - established authors, incredibly famous liberal arts profs like Cornell West (who I had the luck to study under), and law profs who could just go make partner. Only teachers at the college/GS level. I was with a bunch of people at my 20th reunion last year kvetching about our eating club and there are folks saying the same thing about our church ("it ain't what it used to be"), while both institutions have tried to kick of hefty capital campaigns in the same year recently. While I no ambivalence about my former beloved private school here, and need to find out more about my eating club, who just fired the new "miracle chefs" while changing student involvement in the kitchen and getting rid of the last of the people who were in there when we were, the church is doing right by my kids. And my gut tells me BASIS will as well. Olga and her husband (the original BASIS founders before it became a "corporation") rented an apartment here for this year. They imported 1/3 of the teachers and the head of the school from Arizona (he was a teacher AND had also been a college guidance counselor (yippee!)) AND taught my child in STARS last year before s/he ever showed up in the fall. As far as I know, they have no other schools outside of Arizona yet and are probably all realizing like poor Toto in the Wizard of Oz that they are not in Arizona any more. They are in a city with a majority AA population, brimming with racial tensions, and a large number of inner city poorly educated (not their fault) kids with no home support system who come from terrible neighborhoods enrolled in their school this year. And they chose to start with 7th and 8th graders as well as 5th and 6th, which I think was a mistake since their entire premise is along the lines of 'if we catch them in 5th grade, and they are willing to work and of moderate intelligence, we can get them places no one ever imagined,' 8th grade is another story. And when their first fifth grader showed up this year saying "sorry my mom couldn't come into school today to hear that I need academic/and or psychological help because she got put in jail last night, don't ask who I am staying with, or we got removed by social services or evicted and again sorry" I think maybe it was a hard wake up call. I don't know how many grades they usually open a school with, but as everyone knows, DC is "different." And we have one of the WORST school systems in the country. So odds were many if not most 8th graders were NEVER going to catch up. While the one Latin parent just had the guts to admit that no one should be evaluating the kids on DC CAS scores because they get some new 9th graders every year who are reading at the 5th grade level, and by 10th they are reading at the 8th grade level, but somehow that does not slow MY kid down and is a socially important goal in and of itself (which I totally agree with), BASIS has NEVER held itself out as being the place for those kids. In fact, if I understand their position correctly, they in practice do not admit new kids after 6th grade. So I think including 7th and 8th was a BIG mistake. And as a parent of a younger kid, I would have vastly preferred that the first class be closer in age to MY kid, so that there was no potential to crash and burn with the first two graduating classes on either the DC-CAS or college admissions/scholarships and I would have felt a lot more confident about MY kid being safe. Olga called 8th grade "the year of decision" in Arizona. But I think that presupposed 3 years of figuring out that BASIS is not the right school for you, EVEN if you can squeak by, and no matter how much your PARENTS protest. I am not sure one year will be enough to weed out the potential athletes, rock stars, musical prodigies, future auto mechanics and people who should end up at ITT Tech (NB I am not talking about UDC). There is no University of Arizona here. There is a credit of $10k if you attend a state school ANYWHERE else which is an admission that there is no local acceptable public higher education. There is virtually no acceptable public education for the grades that lead up to college, starting at least with kindergarten I also would not be surprised if among the 8th graders there is at least one girl who in her future could audition for Teen Moms on MTV and at least one boy who will end up incarcerated at least until he is no longer a juvenile. These are the facts of life. I am delighted that BASIS here, delighted that my child is there, and praying that they succeed because for us, having tried Latin, there is no other option. |
Anonymous
|
^^ Phew! That was quite a post! Just a few (final) thoughts from the Tucson teacher...
- I hope you find good place for your kids wherever you end up! - On the anonymous posting thing I just meant we should sign in with "usernames" like bunnymuffin23 so it is easier to follow postings by multiple people, follow the conversation better. You ain't getting my real name, and not just because it could get me fired!!! 
- The corporate / for profit structure of the BASIS system is potentially not relevant to the question of whether BASIS delivers a winning product, and I certainly don't begrudge the Block's reaping financial gains from their creation. However, I do think the facts need to be on the table. All BASIS schools are basically shell entities virtually entirely controlled by the parent for-profit corporation BASIS.ed (http://www.basiseducation.net/schools-we-manage). Not that for-profit status matters for executive compensation of course - the CEO of Goodwill is doing just fine. The big problem with for profit management corporations is the lack of transparency. All money from all campuses flows into BASIS.ed. Teachers and facilities and everything else are leased from the parent to the non-profits. I worry about this assuming BASIS.ed is motivated by profit and/or the desire to expand, then resources for each campus are going to be minimized. In particular I am upset that wages have been essentially frozen for teachers for about 5 years, jeopardizing their ability to retain talent (although to be fair we are a pretty desperate bunch in this economy), but also that class sizes are increasing (growing over the years from about 24 to the standard now of 30 per class). Raising academic standards while increasing class sizes is a very problematic proposition - it greatly increases the odds that kids to fall through the cracks. Could BASIS.ed afford to lower class sizes or give pay raises if it weren't expanding so rapidly? Impossible to tell without financial transparency. But again, this is perhaps a diversion from the central question: What are the pros and cons of "the BASIS model" and how does it stack up to alternatives? As one PP noted, criticizing is all well and good but ultimately parents have to make a decision. |
Anonymous
| I am a BASIS parent and booster. That said as someone stated above, I appreciate the musings of the Arizona teacher. I sometimes worry about BASIS DC being controlled by non-DC folks. Never-the-less I haven't seen anything in DC that compares to BASIS DC and am grateful for the school head and the Blocks for creating the concept and working to bring it here. I worry about too much pressure but my child is thriving for now ( 5th grade) and she is excited about the future. |
Anonymous
|
Wow, 20:23! Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
I'm the private school teacher and I actually think you and I are on the same page. Things change, and that appears to be what happened at BASIS Tucson and at my school. It doesn't mean change is always bad, but I agree that we need to reassess to make sure the situation is still right for our kids. Maybe I blended my "hats" too much and that made my initial post confusing. My intent was to post as a parent who thought I had a long term plan for my kids, and am re-evaluating. I am confused at the apparent tension between BASIS and Latin parents on this forum. The two schools seem very different and it seems like the more DC kids who can have access to high quality education the better. I think BASIS will be an exciting school to watch develop. I'm sorry you had a negative experience at Latin, and am really pleased that you are happy with the education your child is receiving at BASIS. It's certainly a school we will be considering, along with Latin, and any other high performing middle schools, traditional public or charter, when we are at that point. I just wanted to make my postion a little more clear since it appears you feel under attack. A rising tide raises all ships. I just wish there were more than two (which is where this thread started). While I am not comfortable sharing where I teach at this point, (whether that reflects a lack of moral courage or not, I'll leave to others) I hope that sharing what I've seen at my current school will help raise questions for other parents considering where to send their children. |
Anonymous
|
Basis parent here and from watching these threads for a while I think the "Basis vs. Latin" tension is largely artificial, being introduced by people who are intrinsically anti-charter and who are looking to sow doubt. I'm personally thrilled that Latin and Basis both are here as excellent options, and it would be great to see even more charters pursuing similar ideas and providing these types of high-end options.
As for the comparisons and mission statements, they are both of course full of broad and grandiose language, one could probably substitute the Latin and Basis statements on each others' websites and nothing would be fundamentally contradictory or counter to what those two schools are already pursuing and doing in practice. |
Anonymous
| To the private school teacher: can you be a bit more specific about what you've seen at your school that isn't working? Will you consider other private schools for your kids? |