Regional model - which programs in which schools?

[Anonymous]

What the county is losing in this reorg are the critical mass clusters of 99th percentile kids, for lack of a better description, that enable their particular schools to fill classrooms for things like MVC, LA, etc. to prep for the most rigorous undergraduate schools.

Reality check - your 95th percentile kid isn’t losing out much in this reorg. They’ll be fine in the new system.

The kids that are getting screwed are the couple hundred kids each year in the county that can benefit from being around their exceptional academic peers. The only way to do that is to have bussed magnet programs like Blair/Poolesville/etc.

My kid was one of these kids (1600/4.9 WGPA/15 APs/senior magnet award winner) but she’s finished HS. This new reorg will NOT place kids like her in a classroom filled with academic peers. But academics isn’t everything you learn at school, and the impact is only on a couple hundred kids countywide. MCPS doesn’t care if the number of MoCo kids going to Ivy+ drops if median performance of everyone goes up somewhat.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What the county is losing in this reorg are the critical mass clusters of 99th percentile kids, for lack of a better description, that enable their particular schools to fill classrooms for things like MVC, LA, etc. to prep for the most rigorous undergraduate schools.

Reality check - your 95th percentile kid isn’t losing out much in this reorg. They’ll be fine in the new system.

The kids that are getting screwed are the couple hundred kids each year in the county that can benefit from being around their exceptional academic peers. The only way to do that is to have bussed magnet programs like Blair/Poolesville/etc.

My kid was one of these kids (1600/4.9 WGPA/15 APs/senior magnet award winner) but she’s finished HS. This new reorg will NOT place kids like her in a classroom filled with academic peers. But academics isn’t everything you learn at school, and the impact is only on a couple hundred kids countywide. MCPS doesn’t care if the number of MoCo kids going to Ivy+ drops if median performance of everyone goes up somewhat.

I realize we are talking about high school and high school is not a lottery, but as someone with younger kids, I have felt concerned about the way the middle school programs are lottery based. Assuming there will be an update there is well, it seems needed…..

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What the county is losing in this reorg are the critical mass clusters of 99th percentile kids, for lack of a better description, that enable their particular schools to fill classrooms for things like MVC, LA, etc. to prep for the most rigorous undergraduate schools.

Reality check - your 95th percentile kid isn’t losing out much in this reorg. They’ll be fine in the new system.

The kids that are getting screwed are the couple hundred kids each year in the county that can benefit from being around their exceptional academic peers. The only way to do that is to have bussed magnet programs like Blair/Poolesville/etc.

My kid was one of these kids (1600/4.9 WGPA/15 APs/senior magnet award winner) but she’s finished HS. This new reorg will NOT place kids like her in a classroom filled with academic peers. But academics isn’t everything you learn at school, and the impact is only on a couple hundred kids countywide. MCPS doesn’t care if the number of MoCo kids going to Ivy+ drops if median performance of everyone goes up somewhat.

The magnets are staying and will be fine. It’s the kids who don’t get in and don’t get rigor in hs which impacts college acceptances. You are selfish if you don’t get there are many kids who are left behind not in w schools without options.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:The thing I don’t like for region 1 is putting humanities at Whitman. I would really like to see this at Einstein or Northwood, and I don’t care which. My DCC kids could apply to IB at BCC but that’s still the second furthest option. I don’t see why Whitman needs a major draw magnet.

Neither BCC nor Whitman need magnets. They already have all the advanced classwork in their schools that they need. We know this because vanishingly few kids from these schools go to RMIB or Blair SMCS.

Obviously, these schools will attract high-performing kids from Einstein and Northwood (and maybe Blair) who have access to transportation from their parents. It won't go the other way around. BCC students and definitely not Whitman students will definitely NOT be traveling to Einstein, Northwood or Blair. This is how you create inequity. You try to make everything uniform, the same for everyone, but you ignore how these schools, including their course offerings, and the populations they serve are very different, and so trying to give everyone the same thing means giving more opportunities to the wealthiest students.

Yes, exactly.  The program analysis team admitted they did not consider equity in where programs were placed, and it shows. They seemed confused at the idea that anyone would have expected them to.  They really do not understand equity at all, and just use it as a buzzword.

And to the other poster who said "if Whitman doesn't have magnets, no one from out of boundaries will get to go to Whitman"... you can still give Whitman interest-based programs that allow out of boundary kids to go to Whitman if they really want.  The languages magnet seems fine to me-- Whitman offers more languages than other schools, let kids from other schools take advantage of Whitman language classes if they really want them. Their interest-based LASJ program also seems fine to me as an acceptable generic "I want my kid at Whitman, here's a way to do it" option.  

However, criteria-based academic magnets drawing top students are a totally different ballgame.  They increase the number of advanced students and advanced classes at schools, which can be really important and valuable for schools that struggle with that otherwise.  Giving a program like that to Whitman not only gives this benefit to a school that does not at all need it rather than to a school like Northwood that would have gained a lot from it, but actually actively hurt other schools by decreasing the number of advanced students in-bounds who stay. 

(It's also just offensive that Whitman kids will get a leg up in admissions to the humanities program because they will have a local set-aside that gives them a disproportionate share of slots.)

I'm not sure how this would really work for Region 5 - Currently we have Watkins Mill, Gaithersburg HS and Magruder and QO in Region 5. As a QO parent we would rather send our advanced kid to QO and just take AP courses rather than going to Gaithersburg HS which does not have a good rep and because the magnet will most likely be diluted with no strong cohorts for Region 5. I'm sure there will be other parents from QO who think the same.

It sucks because we had access to Poolesville before but now our kid who has no inclination to do anything in the medical field has to go to Gaithersburg or Watkins Mill for the advanced courses they are interested in and we want our kid in a learning environment not in schools with the worst reputations upcounty.

Just stay at QO. My DD is at Blair but if she was a bit younger she would not be attending a magnet. Even Blair won't be Blalr anymore. I predict many of these magnets will fail and at some point we will be back to a few strong ones.

Nothing will change at Blair. It will be fine.

Except 2/3rd of the gifted kids being imported in for the magnet won’t come and the special teachers will have options to go head new programs. The minimal middle class local pop will find it’s self applying to the two better schools it finds it’s self clustered with as it will no longer be the best of the DCC but in the bottom half of its new group. This too will cause a brain drain as motivated kids no longer seek it.

Without the influx Blair’s scores will fall and it will revert to being a high school version of eastern which it natively is.

You don't know much about this area, do you? There are tons of middle class families in the Blair/Northwood/Einstein area (the difference is that there are fewer upper-class families and more poor and working-class families than west of here, not that there's not many middle class families.) We don't need Blair to have a super-advanced program with the top 1% of kids in it to keep liking it-- it's popular largely because it's a good school, not because the SMCS kids are brilliant. And most of us don't want to go to Whitman or BCC, especially Whitman. Yes, Blair SMCS will change from being a super-elite program to "just" a strong program for smart kids, but we have plenty of smart kids in this area and most of us just don't care about it being an elite program as much as the parents from W schools do.

You can easily fill Blair with kids from the region but not all smart kids want to go. $200k is not middle class and some families make way more than that. You clearly don’t know parts of the dcc.

I think of the DCC I think of schools like Eastern which is like 2/3rd FARMS (and half of Blair) and other 1/3 I suspect not many break that 200K very often. Sure there a few neighborhood like Forest Glenn, woodside, Silgo Park Hills, Parts of Takoma where dual professionals are more common but those are small enclaves in a sea of other. You're quick to tout the benefits of these bucolic, well resourced and educated areas and their impact on the local school's culture even when in the minority but yet you dismiss what happens when the entire boundary of a school is comprised of similar if not more affluent and educated families. You can fill any program with any kids but right now most of the magnet kids are imported and you have all of the consortium thinking it is the best choice. That all changes day 1 of the new model and If you don't think local perceptions will change when the brain drain occurs and instead of coming in kids (the good students) start opting out to better schools and merit programs, well i hope you share your Kool-Aid

Why are you like this.

Are you from here? My neighbors and slightly further away neighbors are happy with Blair, Einstein, excited for the new Northwood, like the magnets at Eastern and Takoma Park, thrilled at SCES and Sligo Middle School. I actually know Woodlin people who were relieved not to get recommended for BCC because they prefer Einstein. Who are you and where are you that you have this perspective?

Well if you know a guy I guess all measurables can be thrown out the window then. Bottom line most people in the Blair Zone are there because it is the cheapest inner section of MoCo and they couldn't afford better. Sure there are a few that chose it over more expensive places because they viewed it as a better fit for what ever reason. Schools are the same dynamic. Not many people go to Maryland if accepted into Yale, sure maybe a tiny handful for fit, cost or location but its pointless to discuss the outliers. Truth is there is a choice on which schools people want to go to, at least with the people with options and the overwhelming vast majority vote with their pocket books and go to the better ones. Its a fools errand to entertain the people who know a guy who knows a gal that sour grapes proclaimed at some BBQ that they choose the lesser option because they didn't wan't the better one. Its like listening to the people in nosebleeds about how good their vantage point is and how it's a better community in their row. Yet they almost always move down if given even the slightest chance but then again you know a guy.....

As someone who bought in the Blair zone for over $1M, I’m going to repeat my who are you and where do you even live question.

They want to parented they are better.

if there isn't a difference keep moving east then. Imagine how far your 1mil would have gone in Hyattsville, its just a few streets over from TP to the east. If there is a difference to those couple of blocks east why are you so incredulous that that many view your area similar? There are nice streets in Hyattsville too filled with good people? There are a few high SES families over there too, what the difference? When you figure out the difference that made you stretch for something in Blair's area then realize lots of people kept looking into even nicer areas. If youre happy there.. good, if it is so great you wont mind when Blair becomes a neighborhood school again and they pivot it's class offerings to reflect the majority of students that live around it.

We choose our home due to the beltway and jobs. I’d be fine with Blair and my kid got into the magnet but we had to turn it down due to distance as it conflicted with activities after school. I’d be fine with living in Hyattsville too. Nice is subjective.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What the county is losing in this reorg are the critical mass clusters of 99th percentile kids, for lack of a better description, that enable their particular schools to fill classrooms for things like MVC, LA, etc. to prep for the most rigorous undergraduate schools.

Reality check - your 95th percentile kid isn’t losing out much in this reorg. They’ll be fine in the new system.

The kids that are getting screwed are the couple hundred kids each year in the county that can benefit from being around their exceptional academic peers. The only way to do that is to have bussed magnet programs like Blair/Poolesville/etc.

My kid was one of these kids (1600/4.9 WGPA/15 APs/senior magnet award winner) but she’s finished HS. This new reorg will NOT place kids like her in a classroom filled with academic peers. But academics isn’t everything you learn at school, and the impact is only on a couple hundred kids countywide. MCPS doesn’t care if the number of MoCo kids going to Ivy+ drops if median performance of everyone goes up somewhat.

The magnets are staying and will be fine. It’s the kids who don’t get in and don’t get rigor in hs which impacts college acceptances. You are selfish if you don’t get there are many kids who are left behind not in w schools without options.

Take SMCS @ Blair. Reduction in program size at the school means lack of that critical mass which enables the course variety currently available there but not available at the smaller, current Poolesville program. Not only that, but the now-acknowledged-by-MCPS difficulty in standing up of the other four regional SMCS-type programs expected to be opened (due to their trying to do this on a shoestring, rather than robustly planning it out and ensuring necessary funding) means that there will be many years where the majority of those the expansion seeks to benefit see considerably less than would be expected. Those who would have gone to Blair or Poolesville under the current paradigm but not in their region-to-be stand to lose the most, but even those programs will be knee-capped, likely to fade more as time passes and faculty disperses.

It's detail like this that matters. The rhetoric about making more seats available, technically correct, withers in the light of such failures.

And it's not just SMCS or just the too-small magnet cohorts. The choices for program placement that will see the more rigorous magnets at schools in wealthier areas (already replete with advanced course options), the greater likelihood of magnet-programming access for students from the local school boundary due to the disproportionately large set-asides, the non-magnet local access to other advanced courses made more likely available due to placement of those magnets of the more rigorous variety, the paucity and mundane nature of "advanced courses" envisioned to be ensured as available at each school -- these and more will see a persistence of deep, affluence-associated differences among the sets of academic opportunities made available across MCPS's school communities. Equity with excellence, my foot!

The sad thing is that those at MCPS planning this out have known these issues from early on, if not from the very beginning, yet they appear not to be moved by them in the slightest.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What the county is losing in this reorg are the critical mass clusters of 99th percentile kids, for lack of a better description, that enable their particular schools to fill classrooms for things like MVC, LA, etc. to prep for the most rigorous undergraduate schools.

Reality check - your 95th percentile kid isn’t losing out much in this reorg. They’ll be fine in the new system.

The kids that are getting screwed are the couple hundred kids each year in the county that can benefit from being around their exceptional academic peers. The only way to do that is to have bussed magnet programs like Blair/Poolesville/etc.

My kid was one of these kids (1600/4.9 WGPA/15 APs/senior magnet award winner) but she’s finished HS. This new reorg will NOT place kids like her in a classroom filled with academic peers. But academics isn’t everything you learn at school, and the impact is only on a couple hundred kids countywide. MCPS doesn’t care if the number of MoCo kids going to Ivy+ drops if median performance of everyone goes up somewhat.

The magnets are staying and will be fine. It’s the kids who don’t get in and don’t get rigor in hs which impacts college acceptances. You are selfish if you don’t get there are many kids who are left behind not in w schools without options.

Take SMCS @ Blair. Reduction in program size at the school means lack of that critical mass which enables the course variety currently available there but not available at the smaller, current Poolesville program. Not only that, but the now-acknowledged-by-MCPS difficulty in standing up of the other four regional SMCS-type programs expected to be opened (due to their trying to do this on a shoestring, rather than robustly planning it out and ensuring necessary funding) means that there will be many years where the majority of those the expansion seeks to benefit see considerably less than would be expected. Those who would have gone to Blair or Poolesville under the current paradigm but not in their region-to-be stand to lose the most, but even those programs will be knee-capped, likely to fade more as time passes and faculty disperses.

It's detail like this that matters. The rhetoric about making more seats available, technically correct, withers in the light of such failures.

And it's not just SMCS or just the too-small magnet cohorts. The choices for program placement that will see the more rigorous magnets at schools in wealthier areas (already replete with advanced course options), the greater likelihood of magnet-programming access for students from the local school boundary due to the disproportionately large set-asides, the non-magnet local access to other advanced courses made more likely available due to placement of those magnets of the more rigorous variety, the paucity and mundane nature of "advanced courses" envisioned to be ensured as available at each school -- these and more will see a persistence of deep, affluence-associated differences among the sets of academic opportunities made available across MCPS's school communities. Equity with excellence, my foot!

The sad thing is that those at MCPS planning this out have known these issues from early on, if not from the very beginning, yet they appear not to be moved by them in the slightest.

The magnet will be funded. Blair will not be as impacted as some of the other hs that don’t have advanced classes losing a lot of students. The magnet impacts very few kids and should not be the focus.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What the county is losing in this reorg are the critical mass clusters of 99th percentile kids, for lack of a better description, that enable their particular schools to fill classrooms for things like MVC, LA, etc. to prep for the most rigorous undergraduate schools.

Reality check - your 95th percentile kid isn’t losing out much in this reorg. They’ll be fine in the new system.

The kids that are getting screwed are the couple hundred kids each year in the county that can benefit from being around their exceptional academic peers. The only way to do that is to have bussed magnet programs like Blair/Poolesville/etc.

My kid was one of these kids (1600/4.9 WGPA/15 APs/senior magnet award winner) but she’s finished HS. This new reorg will NOT place kids like her in a classroom filled with academic peers. But academics isn’t everything you learn at school, and the impact is only on a couple hundred kids countywide. MCPS doesn’t care if the number of MoCo kids going to Ivy+ drops if median performance of everyone goes up somewhat.

The magnets are staying and will be fine. It’s the kids who don’t get in and don’t get rigor in hs which impacts college acceptances. You are selfish if you don’t get there are many kids who are left behind not in w schools without options.

Take SMCS @ Blair. Reduction in program size at the school means lack of that critical mass which enables the course variety currently available there but not available at the smaller, current Poolesville program. Not only that, but the now-acknowledged-by-MCPS difficulty in standing up of the other four regional SMCS-type programs expected to be opened (due to their trying to do this on a shoestring, rather than robustly planning it out and ensuring necessary funding) means that there will be many years where the majority of those the expansion seeks to benefit see considerably less than would be expected. Those who would have gone to Blair or Poolesville under the current paradigm but not in their region-to-be stand to lose the most, but even those programs will be knee-capped, likely to fade more as time passes and faculty disperses.

It's detail like this that matters. The rhetoric about making more seats available, technically correct, withers in the light of such failures.

And it's not just SMCS or just the too-small magnet cohorts. The choices for program placement that will see the more rigorous magnets at schools in wealthier areas (already replete with advanced course options), the greater likelihood of magnet-programming access for students from the local school boundary due to the disproportionately large set-asides, the non-magnet local access to other advanced courses made more likely available due to placement of those magnets of the more rigorous variety, the paucity and mundane nature of "advanced courses" envisioned to be ensured as available at each school -- these and more will see a persistence of deep, affluence-associated differences among the sets of academic opportunities made available across MCPS's school communities. Equity with excellence, my foot!

The sad thing is that those at MCPS planning this out have known these issues from early on, if not from the very beginning, yet they appear not to be moved by them in the slightest.

The magnet will be funded. Blair will not be as impacted as some of the other hs that don’t have advanced classes losing a lot of students. The magnet impacts very few kids and should not be the focus.

This presents non sequitur and platitude.

"The magnet will be funded" ≠ "each magnet will be funded well enough to ensure depth and breath both similar to (or better than) the current offering and, for same-subject magnets across regions, similar to each other."

Saying Blair will not be as impacted presents neither excellence nor equity. Blair was only an example, above, if a convenient one for illustration -- the post was not a cry to support that school/program more than any other.

Noting that a school (e.g., Einstein) currently with a lower portfolio of advanced class offerings and losing students with the boundary shift fares particularly poorly with the regions proposal lends no support, either to the proposal as a whole or to the note about Blair.

The needs of all kids should be well in focus. All kids, not only a majority or larger groups, and certainly not only a majority or pluralities within each school. The current proposal fails in this regard and perpetuates the current divide among MCPS high school catchments.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What the county is losing in this reorg are the critical mass clusters of 99th percentile kids, for lack of a better description, that enable their particular schools to fill classrooms for things like MVC, LA, etc. to prep for the most rigorous undergraduate schools.

Reality check - your 95th percentile kid isn’t losing out much in this reorg. They’ll be fine in the new system.

The kids that are getting screwed are the couple hundred kids each year in the county that can benefit from being around their exceptional academic peers. The only way to do that is to have bussed magnet programs like Blair/Poolesville/etc.

My kid was one of these kids (1600/4.9 WGPA/15 APs/senior magnet award winner) but she’s finished HS. This new reorg will NOT place kids like her in a classroom filled with academic peers. But academics isn’t everything you learn at school, and the impact is only on a couple hundred kids countywide. MCPS doesn’t care if the number of MoCo kids going to Ivy+ drops if median performance of everyone goes up somewhat.

The magnets are staying and will be fine. It’s the kids who don’t get in and don’t get rigor in hs which impacts college acceptances. You are selfish if you don’t get there are many kids who are left behind not in w schools without options.

Take SMCS @ Blair. Reduction in program size at the school means lack of that critical mass which enables the course variety currently available there but not available at the smaller, current Poolesville program. Not only that, but the now-acknowledged-by-MCPS difficulty in standing up of the other four regional SMCS-type programs expected to be opened (due to their trying to do this on a shoestring, rather than robustly planning it out and ensuring necessary funding) means that there will be many years where the majority of those the expansion seeks to benefit see considerably less than would be expected. Those who would have gone to Blair or Poolesville under the current paradigm but not in their region-to-be stand to lose the most, but even those programs will be knee-capped, likely to fade more as time passes and faculty disperses.

It's detail like this that matters. The rhetoric about making more seats available, technically correct, withers in the light of such failures.

And it's not just SMCS or just the too-small magnet cohorts. The choices for program placement that will see the more rigorous magnets at schools in wealthier areas (already replete with advanced course options), the greater likelihood of magnet-programming access for students from the local school boundary due to the disproportionately large set-asides, the non-magnet local access to other advanced courses made more likely available due to placement of those magnets of the more rigorous variety, the paucity and mundane nature of "advanced courses" envisioned to be ensured as available at each school -- these and more will see a persistence of deep, affluence-associated differences among the sets of academic opportunities made available across MCPS's school communities. Equity with excellence, my foot!

The sad thing is that those at MCPS planning this out have known these issues from early on, if not from the very beginning, yet they appear not to be moved by them in the slightest.

The magnet will be funded. Blair will not be as impacted as some of the other hs that don’t have advanced classes losing a lot of students. The magnet impacts very few kids and should not be the focus.

This presents non sequitur and platitude.

"The magnet will be funded" ≠ "each magnet will be funded well enough to ensure depth and breath both similar to (or better than) the current offering and, for same-subject magnets across regions, similar to each other."

Saying Blair will not be as impacted presents neither excellence nor equity. Blair was only an example, above, if a convenient one for illustration -- the post was not a cry to support that school/program more than any other.

Noting that a school (e.g., Einstein) currently with a lower portfolio of advanced class offerings and losing students with the boundary shift fares particularly poorly with the regions proposal lends no support, either to the proposal as a whole or to the note about Blair.

The needs of all kids should be well in focus. All kids, not only a majority or larger groups, and certainly not only a majority or pluralities within each school. The current proposal fails in this regard and perpetuates the current divide among MCPS high school catchments.

Schools have not the space or the resources to offer all classes at all schools. When is it the parents responsibility to provide for their kids? With those limitations it is equally misguided to expect schools like Einstein not to cater to its general population which isn’t clamoring for advanced math classes. Obviously so and going forward if you have a kid who needs that get it else where or find a place that offers it. You prioritizing a certain type of home over that and hoping the school fills in the gap is a deflection of responsibility. There are cheap apts in every cluster and if some parents aren’t willing to sacrifice for their kids then maybe the schools shouldn’t either.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What the county is losing in this reorg are the critical mass clusters of 99th percentile kids, for lack of a better description, that enable their particular schools to fill classrooms for things like MVC, LA, etc. to prep for the most rigorous undergraduate schools.

Reality check - your 95th percentile kid isn’t losing out much in this reorg. They’ll be fine in the new system.

The kids that are getting screwed are the couple hundred kids each year in the county that can benefit from being around their exceptional academic peers. The only way to do that is to have bussed magnet programs like Blair/Poolesville/etc.

My kid was one of these kids (1600/4.9 WGPA/15 APs/senior magnet award winner) but she’s finished HS. This new reorg will NOT place kids like her in a classroom filled with academic peers. But academics isn’t everything you learn at school, and the impact is only on a couple hundred kids countywide. MCPS doesn’t care if the number of MoCo kids going to Ivy+ drops if median performance of everyone goes up somewhat.

The magnets are staying and will be fine. It’s the kids who don’t get in and don’t get rigor in hs which impacts college acceptances. You are selfish if you don’t get there are many kids who are left behind not in w schools without options.

Take SMCS @ Blair. Reduction in program size at the school means lack of that critical mass which enables the course variety currently available there but not available at the smaller, current Poolesville program. Not only that, but the now-acknowledged-by-MCPS difficulty in standing up of the other four regional SMCS-type programs expected to be opened (due to their trying to do this on a shoestring, rather than robustly planning it out and ensuring necessary funding) means that there will be many years where the majority of those the expansion seeks to benefit see considerably less than would be expected. Those who would have gone to Blair or Poolesville under the current paradigm but not in their region-to-be stand to lose the most, but even those programs will be knee-capped, likely to fade more as time passes and faculty disperses.

It's detail like this that matters. The rhetoric about making more seats available, technically correct, withers in the light of such failures.

And it's not just SMCS or just the too-small magnet cohorts. The choices for program placement that will see the more rigorous magnets at schools in wealthier areas (already replete with advanced course options), the greater likelihood of magnet-programming access for students from the local school boundary due to the disproportionately large set-asides, the non-magnet local access to other advanced courses made more likely available due to placement of those magnets of the more rigorous variety, the paucity and mundane nature of "advanced courses" envisioned to be ensured as available at each school -- these and more will see a persistence of deep, affluence-associated differences among the sets of academic opportunities made available across MCPS's school communities. Equity with excellence, my foot!

The sad thing is that those at MCPS planning this out have known these issues from early on, if not from the very beginning, yet they appear not to be moved by them in the slightest.

The magnet will be funded. Blair will not be as impacted as some of the other hs that don’t have advanced classes losing a lot of students. The magnet impacts very few kids and should not be the focus.

This presents non sequitur and platitude.

"The magnet will be funded" ≠ "each magnet will be funded well enough to ensure depth and breath both similar to (or better than) the current offering and, for same-subject magnets across regions, similar to each other."

Saying Blair will not be as impacted presents neither excellence nor equity. Blair was only an example, above, if a convenient one for illustration -- the post was not a cry to support that school/program more than any other.

Noting that a school (e.g., Einstein) currently with a lower portfolio of advanced class offerings and losing students with the boundary shift fares particularly poorly with the regions proposal lends no support, either to the proposal as a whole or to the note about Blair.

The needs of all kids should be well in focus. All kids, not only a majority or larger groups, and certainly not only a majority or pluralities within each school. The current proposal fails in this regard and perpetuates the current divide among MCPS high school catchments.

Schools have not the space or the resources to offer all classes at all schools. When is it the parents responsibility to provide for their kids? With those limitations it is equally misguided to expect schools like Einstein not to cater to its general population which isn’t clamoring for advanced math classes. Obviously so and going forward if you have a kid who needs that get it else where or find a place that offers it. You prioritizing a certain type of home over that and hoping the school fills in the gap is a deflection of responsibility. There are cheap apts in every cluster and if some parents aren’t willing to sacrifice for their kids then maybe the schools shouldn’t either.

DP
There are plenty of smart kids interested in STEM zoned for Einstein. The problem is many of them choose Wheaton in the DCC process.

The DCC is being dismantled, Einstein's boundaries are changing and the regional program model will be put into place. We don't know what this means for Einstein's course offerings.

But there is no information or standardized process for determining how many students in a school's "general population" (whatever tf that means) are "clamoring for advanced math classes". We do know that Wheaton HS currently offers a lot of advanced math classes.

[Anonymous]

Plenty of artistic kids that are also strong math students. I don’t understand why we can’t offer high level math classes at every HA when we offer compacted math at every ES

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What the county is losing in this reorg are the critical mass clusters of 99th percentile kids, for lack of a better description, that enable their particular schools to fill classrooms for things like MVC, LA, etc. to prep for the most rigorous undergraduate schools.

Reality check - your 95th percentile kid isn’t losing out much in this reorg. They’ll be fine in the new system.

The kids that are getting screwed are the couple hundred kids each year in the county that can benefit from being around their exceptional academic peers. The only way to do that is to have bussed magnet programs like Blair/Poolesville/etc.

My kid was one of these kids (1600/4.9 WGPA/15 APs/senior magnet award winner) but she’s finished HS. This new reorg will NOT place kids like her in a classroom filled with academic peers. But academics isn’t everything you learn at school, and the impact is only on a couple hundred kids countywide. MCPS doesn’t care if the number of MoCo kids going to Ivy+ drops if median performance of everyone goes up somewhat.

The magnets are staying and will be fine. It’s the kids who don’t get in and don’t get rigor in hs which impacts college acceptances. You are selfish if you don’t get there are many kids who are left behind not in w schools without options.

Take SMCS @ Blair. Reduction in program size at the school means lack of that critical mass which enables the course variety currently available there but not available at the smaller, current Poolesville program. Not only that, but the now-acknowledged-by-MCPS difficulty in standing up of the other four regional SMCS-type programs expected to be opened (due to their trying to do this on a shoestring, rather than robustly planning it out and ensuring necessary funding) means that there will be many years where the majority of those the expansion seeks to benefit see considerably less than would be expected. Those who would have gone to Blair or Poolesville under the current paradigm but not in their region-to-be stand to lose the most, but even those programs will be knee-capped, likely to fade more as time passes and faculty disperses.

It's detail like this that matters. The rhetoric about making more seats available, technically correct, withers in the light of such failures.

And it's not just SMCS or just the too-small magnet cohorts. The choices for program placement that will see the more rigorous magnets at schools in wealthier areas (already replete with advanced course options), the greater likelihood of magnet-programming access for students from the local school boundary due to the disproportionately large set-asides, the non-magnet local access to other advanced courses made more likely available due to placement of those magnets of the more rigorous variety, the paucity and mundane nature of "advanced courses" envisioned to be ensured as available at each school -- these and more will see a persistence of deep, affluence-associated differences among the sets of academic opportunities made available across MCPS's school communities. Equity with excellence, my foot!

The sad thing is that those at MCPS planning this out have known these issues from early on, if not from the very beginning, yet they appear not to be moved by them in the slightest.

The magnet will be funded. Blair will not be as impacted as some of the other hs that don’t have advanced classes losing a lot of students. The magnet impacts very few kids and should not be the focus.

This presents non sequitur and platitude.

"The magnet will be funded" ≠ "each magnet will be funded well enough to ensure depth and breath both similar to (or better than) the current offering and, for same-subject magnets across regions, similar to each other."

Saying Blair will not be as impacted presents neither excellence nor equity. Blair was only an example, above, if a convenient one for illustration -- the post was not a cry to support that school/program more than any other.

Noting that a school (e.g., Einstein) currently with a lower portfolio of advanced class offerings and losing students with the boundary shift fares particularly poorly with the regions proposal lends no support, either to the proposal as a whole or to the note about Blair.

The needs of all kids should be well in focus. All kids, not only a majority or larger groups, and certainly not only a majority or pluralities within each school. The current proposal fails in this regard and perpetuates the current divide among MCPS high school catchments.

Schools have not the space or the resources to offer all classes at all schools. When is it the parents responsibility to provide for their kids? With those limitations it is equally misguided to expect schools like Einstein not to cater to its general population which isn’t clamoring for advanced math classes. Obviously so and going forward if you have a kid who needs that get it else where or find a place that offers it. You prioritizing a certain type of home over that and hoping the school fills in the gap is a deflection of responsibility. There are cheap apts in every cluster and if some parents aren’t willing to sacrifice for their kids then maybe the schools shouldn’t either.

The local governmental authority charged with providing education is MCPS, not the Magruder cluster or the Wootton cluster. Not even the putative Region 1 or Region 6.

MCPS has an equivalent responsibility to the needs of each and every student. That is regardless of race and gender, of course, but of other things, as well. One of those is location within the system. That made available in one locale must be made available to all on a reasonably equivalent basis.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Plenty of artistic kids that are also strong math students. I don’t understand why we can’t offer high level math classes at every HA when we offer compacted math at every ES

Exactly. Some of the middle schools start algebra in 6th so kids are out of options mid high school. They can offer it virtually.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What the county is losing in this reorg are the critical mass clusters of 99th percentile kids, for lack of a better description, that enable their particular schools to fill classrooms for things like MVC, LA, etc. to prep for the most rigorous undergraduate schools.

Reality check - your 95th percentile kid isn’t losing out much in this reorg. They’ll be fine in the new system.

The kids that are getting screwed are the couple hundred kids each year in the county that can benefit from being around their exceptional academic peers. The only way to do that is to have bussed magnet programs like Blair/Poolesville/etc.

My kid was one of these kids (1600/4.9 WGPA/15 APs/senior magnet award winner) but she’s finished HS. This new reorg will NOT place kids like her in a classroom filled with academic peers. But academics isn’t everything you learn at school, and the impact is only on a couple hundred kids countywide. MCPS doesn’t care if the number of MoCo kids going to Ivy+ drops if median performance of everyone goes up somewhat.

The magnets are staying and will be fine. It’s the kids who don’t get in and don’t get rigor in hs which impacts college acceptances. You are selfish if you don’t get there are many kids who are left behind not in w schools without options.

Take SMCS @ Blair. Reduction in program size at the school means lack of that critical mass which enables the course variety currently available there but not available at the smaller, current Poolesville program. Not only that, but the now-acknowledged-by-MCPS difficulty in standing up of the other four regional SMCS-type programs expected to be opened (due to their trying to do this on a shoestring, rather than robustly planning it out and ensuring necessary funding) means that there will be many years where the majority of those the expansion seeks to benefit see considerably less than would be expected. Those who would have gone to Blair or Poolesville under the current paradigm but not in their region-to-be stand to lose the most, but even those programs will be knee-capped, likely to fade more as time passes and faculty disperses.

It's detail like this that matters. The rhetoric about making more seats available, technically correct, withers in the light of such failures.

And it's not just SMCS or just the too-small magnet cohorts. The choices for program placement that will see the more rigorous magnets at schools in wealthier areas (already replete with advanced course options), the greater likelihood of magnet-programming access for students from the local school boundary due to the disproportionately large set-asides, the non-magnet local access to other advanced courses made more likely available due to placement of those magnets of the more rigorous variety, the paucity and mundane nature of "advanced courses" envisioned to be ensured as available at each school -- these and more will see a persistence of deep, affluence-associated differences among the sets of academic opportunities made available across MCPS's school communities. Equity with excellence, my foot!

The sad thing is that those at MCPS planning this out have known these issues from early on, if not from the very beginning, yet they appear not to be moved by them in the slightest.

The magnet will be funded. Blair will not be as impacted as some of the other hs that don’t have advanced classes losing a lot of students. The magnet impacts very few kids and should not be the focus.

This presents non sequitur and platitude.

"The magnet will be funded" ≠ "each magnet will be funded well enough to ensure depth and breath both similar to (or better than) the current offering and, for same-subject magnets across regions, similar to each other."

Saying Blair will not be as impacted presents neither excellence nor equity. Blair was only an example, above, if a convenient one for illustration -- the post was not a cry to support that school/program more than any other.

Noting that a school (e.g., Einstein) currently with a lower portfolio of advanced class offerings and losing students with the boundary shift fares particularly poorly with the regions proposal lends no support, either to the proposal as a whole or to the note about Blair.

The needs of all kids should be well in focus. All kids, not only a majority or larger groups, and certainly not only a majority or pluralities within each school. The current proposal fails in this regard and perpetuates the current divide among MCPS high school catchments.

Schools have not the space or the resources to offer all classes at all schools. When is it the parents responsibility to provide for their kids? With those limitations it is equally misguided to expect schools like Einstein not to cater to its general population which isn’t clamoring for advanced math classes. Obviously so and going forward if you have a kid who needs that get it else where or find a place that offers it. You prioritizing a certain type of home over that and hoping the school fills in the gap is a deflection of responsibility. There are cheap apts in every cluster and if some parents aren’t willing to sacrifice for their kids then maybe the schools shouldn’t either.

DP
There are plenty of smart kids interested in STEM zoned for Einstein. The problem is many of them choose Wheaton in the DCC process.

The DCC is being dismantled, Einstein's boundaries are changing and the regional program model will be put into place. We don't know what this means for Einstein's course offerings.

But there is no information or standardized process for determining how many students in a school's "general population" (whatever tf that means) are "clamoring for advanced math classes". We do know that Wheaton HS currently offers a lot of advanced math classes.

All kids deserve to be taught at the level they are capable of. Wheaton only goes to MVC. Wheaton has a lot of other stem. We are considering moving or private, private may be cheaper, for our younger child as Einstein isn’t worth it for smarter kids. What will happen is families will be forced to move or go private or the kids go without, which happens now. The principal and one ap do not believe in ap and higher level classes nor stem so they don’t make it a priority. They also don’t fully support the arts. Einstein will fail without strong classes as the pockets of smarter, more comfortable families will leave. At Einstein, they force the kids to slow down and take ap ab and rarely allow students to go to bc. They have enough smart kids to run more bc and an mvc class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Plenty of artistic kids that are also strong math students. I don’t understand why we can’t offer high level math classes at every HA when we offer compacted math at every ES

They offer compacted math virtually, so they could offer bc, mvc, and linear algebra virtually too. Just align the school schedules.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Plenty of artistic kids that are also strong math students. I don’t understand why we can’t offer high level math classes at every HA when we offer compacted math at every ES

They offer compacted math virtually, so they could offer bc, mvc, and linear algebra virtually too. Just align the school schedules.

Hey, as long as they go this route at all schools or robustly mitigate the differences between in-person and virtual, no problem.