When is the standardized craze gonna hit the LACs?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think test required is easier for most kids. So many kids making themselves crazy over a 1480. It’s fine, really!

Test required hasn't reduced scores; it's just kept the same bar where top SAT scores are expected.

[Anonymous]

Test required def reduced 25%

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Use of standardized tests is not a "craze". Most LACs were test required pre-covid.

Now that tests are shorter, digital and more easily accessible, I think the ones that were test required before covid will go back to that.

As others have noted, CMC already announced it will go back to test required next year. And even though they are currently TO, they do require test results from all admitted students so they can take note of what it was, even if it was not part of the admission decision this year.

I expect Pomona, Swarthmore, Wellesley and Williams to go back to test required in the coming years, like they were before.

I do expect Bowdoin, Wesleyan and Carleton will stay test optional for the long-term.

To what benefit? These schools are receiving more fellowship winners and grad school acceptances than ever. What’s the point of changing demographics cause Harvard needs to?

??? Most of the most well-regarded LACs (Williams, Amherst, Swat, Pomona, Wellesley, Carleton, Claremont, etc.) mandated tests back pre-covid only 5 years ago. Why would they not go back given it helped them choose great classes before? Only Wesleyan and Bowdoin (I believe) were test optional then. Standardized tests are a simple and low-effort way schools can put a check on grade inflation that's more objective than GPA. And don't suggest AP scores, those are only relevant for schools that offer APs. Many public and private schools don't teach AP curriculum so it's only a useful gauge if all schools offered the same amount of subjects with the same curriculum in the same way.

Seems like the wisest thing for schools to begin demanding. For decades, students at privates have taken AP tests without taking AP courses- it isn’t needed. If you actually want to see how a student performs long term in a core curriculum, this makes much more sense than the SAT.

Anyway, these schools have little reason to go back to TO. Their apps are up, their yields are improving, and their students are doing fine. I don’t know why people are so obsessed with test scores.

Just wait until they announce it one by one in the next two years. These are private colleges, they can set whatever admission policies they want. Mark this page and be back in two years to see how wrong you were.

I wholeheartedly agree that they’re allowed to set whatever test optional policy they want. Glad we could agree.

I actually do agree. Before the Affirmative Action case, I said so. I still say so after the Affirmative Action case. If they receive federal funding the policy has to be constitutional. They may keep legacy, athletes, and donor preference until one day SCOTUS rules it unconstitutional. SLAC can even get rid of the very small amount of federal funding they received or cut any other ties with the fed, and set any admission policy they want, including race-based preference.

But they are going back to test required.

Can you stop rambling? Colleges can and will stay test optional if they wish. Bowdoin has since the 60s. There is nothing unconstitutional about being neutral about the utility of a private company's exam.

Your reading comprehension is really poor, did I say test optional unconstitutional?

Colleges can stay test optional if they wish. But they are reinstating test required one by one. Wait a year or two. Come back to this thread.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Use of standardized tests is not a "craze". Most LACs were test required pre-covid.

Now that tests are shorter, digital and more easily accessible, I think the ones that were test required before covid will go back to that.

As others have noted, CMC already announced it will go back to test required next year. And even though they are currently TO, they do require test results from all admitted students so they can take note of what it was, even if it was not part of the admission decision this year.

I expect Pomona, Swarthmore, Wellesley and Williams to go back to test required in the coming years, like they were before.

I do expect Bowdoin, Wesleyan and Carleton will stay test optional for the long-term.

To what benefit? These schools are receiving more fellowship winners and grad school acceptances than ever. What’s the point of changing demographics cause Harvard needs to?

??? Most of the most well-regarded LACs (Williams, Amherst, Swat, Pomona, Wellesley, Carleton, Claremont, etc.) mandated tests back pre-covid only 5 years ago. Why would they not go back given it helped them choose great classes before? Only Wesleyan and Bowdoin (I believe) were test optional then. Standardized tests are a simple and low-effort way schools can put a check on grade inflation that's more objective than GPA. And don't suggest AP scores, those are only relevant for schools that offer APs. Many public and private schools don't teach AP curriculum so it's only a useful gauge if all schools offered the same amount of subjects with the same curriculum in the same way.

Seems like the wisest thing for schools to begin demanding. For decades, students at privates have taken AP tests without taking AP courses- it isn’t needed. If you actually want to see how a student performs long term in a core curriculum, this makes much more sense than the SAT.

Anyway, these schools have little reason to go back to TO. Their apps are up, their yields are improving, and their students are doing fine. I don’t know why people are so obsessed with test scores.

Just wait until they announce it one by one in the next two years. These are private colleges, they can set whatever admission policies they want. Mark this page and be back in two years to see how wrong you were.

I wholeheartedly agree that they’re allowed to set whatever test optional policy they want. Glad we could agree.

I actually do agree. Before the Affirmative Action case, I said so. I still say so after the Affirmative Action case. If they receive federal funding the policy has to be constitutional. They may keep legacy, athletes, and donor preference until one day SCOTUS rules it unconstitutional. SLAC can even get rid of the very small amount of federal funding they received or cut any other ties with the fed, and set any admission policy they want, including race-based preference.

But they are going back to test required.

Can you stop rambling? Colleges can and will stay test optional if they wish. Bowdoin has since the 60s. There is nothing unconstitutional about being neutral about the utility of a private company's exam.

Your reading comprehension is really poor, did I say test optional unconstitutional?

Colleges can stay test optional if they wish. But they are reinstating test required one by one. Wait a year or two. Come back to this thread.

Then why bring up constitutionality?

But they are reinstating test required one by one. Wait a year or two. Come back to this thread.

Just cause you repeat something, doesn't actually make it a valid or educated point. It's clear you are here to waste my time. Come back to this thread in a year or two.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Test required def reduced 25%

Show it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think test required is easier for most kids. So many kids making themselves crazy over a 1480. It’s fine, really!

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think test required is easier for most kids. So many kids making themselves crazy over a 1480. It’s fine, really!

+1

“[There was] a kind of signal or message that if you don’t get a 1500 on the SAT, you will be declined by most of the universities,” she said. “It is quite hard to gain the courage to not give your score when all of the people around you are giving their scores, which are unimaginably high.”

Domestically, that sentiment appears to be true as well. Noah Herrera ’29, an admitted student from Lubbock, Texas, said he was “a little scared” when he heard that Dartmouth reinstated the requirement because of how his score compared to those of previously admitted students.

“I’ll be honest, my SAT score wasn’t in [Dartmouth’s] 50th percentile,” Herrera said. “I think I was barely at the 25th percentile.”

Seems the anxiety is about the same.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Use of standardized tests is not a "craze". Most LACs were test required pre-covid.

Now that tests are shorter, digital and more easily accessible, I think the ones that were test required before covid will go back to that.

As others have noted, CMC already announced it will go back to test required next year. And even though they are currently TO, they do require test results from all admitted students so they can take note of what it was, even if it was not part of the admission decision this year.

I expect Pomona, Swarthmore, Wellesley and Williams to go back to test required in the coming years, like they were before.

I do expect Bowdoin, Wesleyan and Carleton will stay test optional for the long-term.

To what benefit? These schools are receiving more fellowship winners and grad school acceptances than ever. What’s the point of changing demographics cause Harvard needs to?

??? Most of the most well-regarded LACs (Williams, Amherst, Swat, Pomona, Wellesley, Carleton, Claremont, etc.) mandated tests back pre-covid only 5 years ago. Why would they not go back given it helped them choose great classes before? Only Wesleyan and Bowdoin (I believe) were test optional then. Standardized tests are a simple and low-effort way schools can put a check on grade inflation that's more objective than GPA. And don't suggest AP scores, those are only relevant for schools that offer APs. Many public and private schools don't teach AP curriculum so it's only a useful gauge if all schools offered the same amount of subjects with the same curriculum in the same way.

Seems like the wisest thing for schools to begin demanding. For decades, students at privates have taken AP tests without taking AP courses- it isn’t needed. If you actually want to see how a student performs long term in a core curriculum, this makes much more sense than the SAT.

Anyway, these schools have little reason to go back to TO. Their apps are up, their yields are improving, and their students are doing fine. I don’t know why people are so obsessed with test scores.

Just wait until they announce it one by one in the next two years. These are private colleges, they can set whatever admission policies they want. Mark this page and be back in two years to see how wrong you were.

I wholeheartedly agree that they’re allowed to set whatever test optional policy they want. Glad we could agree.

I actually do agree. Before the Affirmative Action case, I said so. I still say so after the Affirmative Action case. If they receive federal funding the policy has to be constitutional. They may keep legacy, athletes, and donor preference until one day SCOTUS rules it unconstitutional. SLAC can even get rid of the very small amount of federal funding they received or cut any other ties with the fed, and set any admission policy they want, including race-based preference.

But they are going back to test required.

Can you stop rambling? Colleges can and will stay test optional if they wish. Bowdoin has since the 60s. There is nothing unconstitutional about being neutral about the utility of a private company's exam.

Your reading comprehension is really poor, did I say test optional unconstitutional?

Colleges can stay test optional if they wish. But they are reinstating test required one by one. Wait a year or two. Come back to this thread.

Then why bring up constitutionality?

But they are reinstating test required one by one. Wait a year or two. Come back to this thread.

Just cause you repeat something, doesn't actually make it a valid or educated point. It's clear you are here to waste my time. Come back to this thread in a year or two.

That's what I said at the very beginning.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Use of standardized tests is not a "craze". Most LACs were test required pre-covid.

Now that tests are shorter, digital and more easily accessible, I think the ones that were test required before covid will go back to that.

As others have noted, CMC already announced it will go back to test required next year. And even though they are currently TO, they do require test results from all admitted students so they can take note of what it was, even if it was not part of the admission decision this year.

I expect Pomona, Swarthmore, Wellesley and Williams to go back to test required in the coming years, like they were before.

I do expect Bowdoin, Wesleyan and Carleton will stay test optional for the long-term.

To what benefit? These schools are receiving more fellowship winners and grad school acceptances than ever. What’s the point of changing demographics cause Harvard needs to?

??? Most of the most well-regarded LACs (Williams, Amherst, Swat, Pomona, Wellesley, Carleton, Claremont, etc.) mandated tests back pre-covid only 5 years ago. Why would they not go back given it helped them choose great classes before? Only Wesleyan and Bowdoin (I believe) were test optional then. Standardized tests are a simple and low-effort way schools can put a check on grade inflation that's more objective than GPA. And don't suggest AP scores, those are only relevant for schools that offer APs. Many public and private schools don't teach AP curriculum so it's only a useful gauge if all schools offered the same amount of subjects with the same curriculum in the same way.

Seems like the wisest thing for schools to begin demanding. For decades, students at privates have taken AP tests without taking AP courses- it isn’t needed. If you actually want to see how a student performs long term in a core curriculum, this makes much more sense than the SAT.

Anyway, these schools have little reason to go back to TO. Their apps are up, their yields are improving, and their students are doing fine. I don’t know why people are so obsessed with test scores.

Just wait until they announce it one by one in the next two years. These are private colleges, they can set whatever admission policies they want. Mark this page and be back in two years to see how wrong you were.

I wholeheartedly agree that they’re allowed to set whatever test optional policy they want. Glad we could agree.

I actually do agree. Before the Affirmative Action case, I said so. I still say so after the Affirmative Action case. If they receive federal funding the policy has to be constitutional. They may keep legacy, athletes, and donor preference until one day SCOTUS rules it unconstitutional. SLAC can even get rid of the very small amount of federal funding they received or cut any other ties with the fed, and set any admission policy they want, including race-based preference.

But they are going back to test required.

Can you stop rambling? Colleges can and will stay test optional if they wish. Bowdoin has since the 60s. There is nothing unconstitutional about being neutral about the utility of a private company's exam.

Your reading comprehension is really poor, did I say test optional unconstitutional?

Colleges can stay test optional if they wish. But they are reinstating test required one by one. Wait a year or two. Come back to this thread.

Then why bring up constitutionality?

But they are reinstating test required one by one. Wait a year or two. Come back to this thread.

Just cause you repeat something, doesn't actually make it a valid or educated point. It's clear you are here to waste my time. Come back to this thread in a year or two.

Relevant in that SLACs could adopt racial preference admission if they give up fed funding (small amount, easily given up). But they chose not to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Use of standardized tests is not a "craze". Most LACs were test required pre-covid.

Now that tests are shorter, digital and more easily accessible, I think the ones that were test required before covid will go back to that.

As others have noted, CMC already announced it will go back to test required next year. And even though they are currently TO, they do require test results from all admitted students so they can take note of what it was, even if it was not part of the admission decision this year.

I expect Pomona, Swarthmore, Wellesley and Williams to go back to test required in the coming years, like they were before.

I do expect Bowdoin, Wesleyan and Carleton will stay test optional for the long-term.

To what benefit? These schools are receiving more fellowship winners and grad school acceptances than ever. What’s the point of changing demographics cause Harvard needs to?

??? Most of the most well-regarded LACs (Williams, Amherst, Swat, Pomona, Wellesley, Carleton, Claremont, etc.) mandated tests back pre-covid only 5 years ago. Why would they not go back given it helped them choose great classes before? Only Wesleyan and Bowdoin (I believe) were test optional then. Standardized tests are a simple and low-effort way schools can put a check on grade inflation that's more objective than GPA. And don't suggest AP scores, those are only relevant for schools that offer APs. Many public and private schools don't teach AP curriculum so it's only a useful gauge if all schools offered the same amount of subjects with the same curriculum in the same way.

Seems like the wisest thing for schools to begin demanding. For decades, students at privates have taken AP tests without taking AP courses- it isn’t needed. If you actually want to see how a student performs long term in a core curriculum, this makes much more sense than the SAT.

Anyway, these schools have little reason to go back to TO. Their apps are up, their yields are improving, and their students are doing fine. I don’t know why people are so obsessed with test scores.

Just wait until they announce it one by one in the next two years. These are private colleges, they can set whatever admission policies they want. Mark this page and be back in two years to see how wrong you were.

I wholeheartedly agree that they’re allowed to set whatever test optional policy they want. Glad we could agree.

I actually do agree. Before the Affirmative Action case, I said so. I still say so after the Affirmative Action case. If they receive federal funding the policy has to be constitutional. They may keep legacy, athletes, and donor preference until one day SCOTUS rules it unconstitutional. SLAC can even get rid of the very small amount of federal funding they received or cut any other ties with the fed, and set any admission policy they want, including race-based preference.

But they are going back to test required.

Can you stop rambling? Colleges can and will stay test optional if they wish. Bowdoin has since the 60s. There is nothing unconstitutional about being neutral about the utility of a private company's exam.

Your reading comprehension is really poor, did I say test optional unconstitutional?

Colleges can stay test optional if they wish. But they are reinstating test required one by one. Wait a year or two. Come back to this thread.

Then why bring up constitutionality?

But they are reinstating test required one by one. Wait a year or two. Come back to this thread.

Just cause you repeat something, doesn't actually make it a valid or educated point. It's clear you are here to waste my time. Come back to this thread in a year or two.

Relevant in that SLACs could adopt racial preference admission if they give up fed funding (small amount, easily given up). But they chose not to.

So straight up not the conversation and just blabbering to blabber. Stfu.

[Anonymous]

The lac model works pretty well for a wide range of academic talents. Look at what reed starts with academically and you wouldn’t expect it being a major feeder for graduate programs but it is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think test required is easier for most kids. So many kids making themselves crazy over a 1480. It’s fine, really!

Test required hasn't reduced scores; it's just kept the same bar where top SAT scores are expected.

Dartmouth class of 2029 sat range is 1440-1560. Before, applying with anything other than a 1500+ was insane.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think test required is easier for most kids. So many kids making themselves crazy over a 1480. It’s fine, really!

Test required hasn't reduced scores; it's just kept the same bar where top SAT scores are expected.

Dartmouth class of 2029 sat range is 1440-1560. Before, applying with anything other than a 1500+ was insane.

Are you relying on historic data or did they release 2029 data? I was not aware it’s been released and have been trying to find it. I have a senior debating whether to do the supplementals and apply.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think test required is easier for most kids. So many kids making themselves crazy over a 1480. It’s fine, really!

+1

“[There was] a kind of signal or message that if you don’t get a 1500 on the SAT, you will be declined by most of the universities,” she said. “It is quite hard to gain the courage to not give your score when all of the people around you are giving their scores, which are unimaginably high.”

Domestically, that sentiment appears to be true as well. Noah Herrera ’29, an admitted student from Lubbock, Texas, said he was “a little scared” when he heard that Dartmouth reinstated the requirement because of how his score compared to those of previously admitted students.

“I’ll be honest, my SAT score wasn’t in [Dartmouth’s] 50th percentile,” Herrera said. “I think I was barely at the 25th percentile.”

Seems the anxiety is about the same.

I'm not sure I understand your comment. I read the full article this quote comes from here: https://www.thedartmouth.com/article/2025/02/yee-from-cicero-to-the-sat-a-history-of-standardized-testing-at-dartmouth. It seems like one admitted student Herrera says he got barely in the 25th percentile and was surprised he got in, but my point was that in 2024/25 when he applied the 25%ile number for Dartmouth was inflated too high and beyond being reasonable. After a few years of test required, the average and median SAT numbers will come down a bit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think test required is easier for most kids. So many kids making themselves crazy over a 1480. It’s fine, really!

+1

“[There was] a kind of signal or message that if you don’t get a 1500 on the SAT, you will be declined by most of the universities,” she said. “It is quite hard to gain the courage to not give your score when all of the people around you are giving their scores, which are unimaginably high.”

Domestically, that sentiment appears to be true as well. Noah Herrera ’29, an admitted student from Lubbock, Texas, said he was “a little scared” when he heard that Dartmouth reinstated the requirement because of how his score compared to those of previously admitted students.

“I’ll be honest, my SAT score wasn’t in [Dartmouth’s] 50th percentile,” Herrera said. “I think I was barely at the 25th percentile.”

Seems the anxiety is about the same.

I'm not sure I understand your comment. I read the full article this quote comes from here: https://www.thedartmouth.com/article/2025/02/yee-from-cicero-to-the-sat-a-history-of-standardized-testing-at-dartmouth. It seems like one admitted student Herrera says he got barely in the 25th percentile and was surprised he got in, but my point was that in 2024/25 when he applied the 25%ile number for Dartmouth was inflated too high and beyond being reasonable. After a few years of test required, the average and median SAT numbers will come down a bit.

Which hasn't been shown! So you're just speaking nonsense. Great.