Why is Friendship Heights so empty and lame?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A bookstore, a movie theater, a cafe. Missing all of these things and used to have these things.

Exactly. Let's hope for businesses and services that meet the needs of the local area. These will be sustainable longterm, rather than twisting ourselves into pretzel knots on how to make or keep FH as a "regional destination" in competition with other such destinations like the Wharf or downtown Bethesda, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:And when these luxury stores were in friendship heights they were robbed as well.

Criminals know that depending on which side of Western Avenue they prey on victims and commit their crimes, the police and criminal justice response can be very different.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Friendship Heights will end up looking like downtown Bethesda - lots of nice apartment buildings, parking garages, and ground floor retail. DC and MD could easily add a few thousand units of housing within a 5 minute walk to the FH Metro station.

Wouldn't that mean necessarily bulldozing some SFH streets in Chevy Chase (MD), Chevy Chase (DC), and American University Park?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Friendship Heights will end up looking like downtown Bethesda - lots of nice apartment buildings, parking garages, and ground floor retail. DC and MD could easily add a few thousand units of housing within a 5 minute walk to the FH Metro station.

Wouldn't that mean necessarily bulldozing some SFH streets in Chevy Chase (MD), Chevy Chase (DC), and American University Park?

No.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:The stores in friendship heights moved to Bethesda (Williams Sonoma, Anthro, Pottery Barn) or City Center (all the luxury brands). It’s always been an awkward site because the developments were unconnected and it’s relatively unattractive. But when Mazza was in its heyday it was a nice place and a destination. That’s probably 15-20 years ago at this point.

Aesthetics matter. Especially now when online shopping is so easy. You have to make a place attractive to visit and linger. Expanses of concrete, ugly glass and steel buildings, and a major commuter route running right down the middle of it all is going to make this a heavy lift.

Hopefully the development realizes just how bad the situation is rather than just thinking a minor facelift will fix everything. They need to ask, "where will people want to linger?" and not lie to themselves and investors about that.

I wouldn't call tearing down an entire shopping mall -- with plans for similarly drastic changes on the other side of the street -- "a minor facelift".

Yeah, tearing down old ugly buildings and putting up new ugly (and bigger!) buildings on the same commuter road is really just a facelift. What is the draw? Why would someone from outside the neighborhood travel to Friendship Heights? Why would they linger there? Its not on the water, near anything "cool", historic, or in anyway a destination. Friendship Heights being a destination is a historical anomaly, which likely can't continue between online shopping and other parts of the city/region getting their acts together.

If the developers don't have a plan for making Friendship Heights top-notch then they should just plan FH to be smaller and more locally oriented.

People don't need to travel there, because the Maryland portion of FH is the densest CDP in the nation (denser than Manhattan). And the DC portion is going to see a huge uptick in density with the new developments, both in FH and nearby. There's also a little thing called the Metro, which is directly below.

We get it, you don't like the neighborhood based on what it was. Cool. Edgy, even. But maybe you could also wait and see how it turns out instead of suggesting it should just be left for dead.

Are you arguing that the local area alone can sustain destination retail? If so, why is it in a downward spiral now? Even the mid-market stuff.

What is going to get someone to metro (or drive) to Friendship Heights? What is the draw? Are they going to reboot luxury retail or try something else?

Can you even pull off a downtown Bethesda, when downtown Bethesda is just one stop away? Why would you come here if you are coming from the north and passing the real deal?

They really should be looking at Tenleytown and Van Ness as realistic models. Developers won't though, because that would mean a more downscale FH and people can't accept that yet.

DP. PP isn't talking about "destination retail". PP is talking about Friendship Heights being a place where people live and do the kinds of things people do in places where they live. They wouldn't have to take Metro or drive to Friendship Heights. They would already be there, living there.

Pls do not model anything after Tenleytown.

Friendship Heights is fundamentally the same thing as Tenleytown so the outcomes are likely going to be the same. You've got the same big ugly road running right down the middle of the district, a metro-station and a ton of over-leveraged transients. That's not a recipe for a world-class destination.

Who said anything about "world-class destination"?

[Anonymous]

It is expensive real estate that is attractive to funds and institutional owners that rarely have any vision and just do whatever a consultant type advises them based on copying another project somewhere else. The projects that succeed to draw in people have a creative side to them or mimic something that had a creative side where it was originally put and fits the area where it is copied.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It is expensive real estate that is attractive to funds and institutional owners that rarely have any vision and just do whatever a consultant type advises them based on copying another project somewhere else. The projects that succeed to draw in people have a creative side to them or mimic something that had a creative side where it was originally put and fits the area where it is copied.

This. The area has more money than vision.

That's why it will ultimately remain lame.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A bookstore, a movie theater, a cafe. Missing all of these things and used to have these things.

Exactly. Let's hope for businesses and services that meet the needs of the local area. These will be sustainable longterm, rather than twisting ourselves into pretzel knots on how to make or keep FH as a "regional destination" in competition with other such destinations like the Wharf or downtown Bethesda, etc.

It is a "regional destination" by virtue of the metro and bus depots. The coming retail,etc will probably be a regular mix of neighborhood and regional serving.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Possibly crazy, but FH seems like it has areas where a Costco or other popular big box could move in. Seems like the old Lord & Taylor site when you include all the parking (both gargage and uncovered) is a large enough location.

A Costco could really be an anchor to turbocharge the area.

Doesn't this belong to WMATA now? Future bus barn?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's all under construction. They were phasing out the businesses for years so they could redo it all. When it's done, it will be like old times.

Here is the general plan: https://dc.urbanturf.com/articles/blog/the_1500_units_in_the_friendship_heights_pipeline/21020

Here are the plans for the stretch above old TJ Maxx: https://www.popville.com/2023/06/tishman-speyer-dc-friendship-heights-shopping-mall-mixed-use-mazza-gallerie/

And here is what is in store for across the street where Maggiano's is: https://www.axios.com/local/washington-dc/2022/12/02/friendship-heights-apartments-affordable-housing

It looks like the current set of plans will add 1300+ units housing a very close walk to the FH metro. I bet there's even more in the pipeline if the buildings fill quickly. Geico corporate site has a TON of empty, valuable land. Jenifer Street NW has some terrible old and smaller Class C office buildings that can easily come down.

This is going to end up like downtown Bethesda within 5 years. The demand for housing is still there. Plus both sides of the border feed to good schools.

[Anonymous]

I think a movie theater like ipic would do well. There’s really no movie theater in that area

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's all under construction. They were phasing out the businesses for years so they could redo it all. When it's done, it will be like old times.

Here is the general plan: https://dc.urbanturf.com/articles/blog/the_1500_units_in_the_friendship_heights_pipeline/21020

Here are the plans for the stretch above old TJ Maxx: https://www.popville.com/2023/06/tishman-speyer-dc-friendship-heights-shopping-mall-mixed-use-mazza-gallerie/

And here is what is in store for across the street where Maggiano's is: https://www.axios.com/local/washington-dc/2022/12/02/friendship-heights-apartments-affordable-housing

Anyone hear anything recently about a Trader Joe's or other grocer going into the former H&M? That would be a nice little catalyst.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's all under construction. They were phasing out the businesses for years so they could redo it all. When it's done, it will be like old times.

Here is the general plan: https://dc.urbanturf.com/articles/blog/the_1500_units_in_the_friendship_heights_pipeline/21020

Here are the plans for the stretch above old TJ Maxx: https://www.popville.com/2023/06/tishman-speyer-dc-friendship-heights-shopping-mall-mixed-use-mazza-gallerie/

And here is what is in store for across the street where Maggiano's is: https://www.axios.com/local/washington-dc/2022/12/02/friendship-heights-apartments-affordable-housing

It looks like the current set of plans will add 1300+ units housing a very close walk to the FH metro. I bet there's even more in the pipeline if the buildings fill quickly. Geico corporate site has a TON of empty, valuable land. Jenifer Street NW has some terrible old and smaller Class C office buildings that can easily come down.

This is going to end up like downtown Bethesda within 5 years. The demand for housing is still there. Plus both sides of the border feed to good schools.

I thought Geico sold their HQ building and land and will move to Rockville or somewhere like that? Is that true, or just an urban myth?

That is a massive area for development.

[Anonymous]

Anyone know if the bus depot is indeed replacing the Lord and Taylor? I know it was in discussion. Still holding out hope that it could be something better...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's all under construction. They were phasing out the businesses for years so they could redo it all. When it's done, it will be like old times.

Here is the general plan: https://dc.urbanturf.com/articles/blog/the_1500_units_in_the_friendship_heights_pipeline/21020

Here are the plans for the stretch above old TJ Maxx: https://www.popville.com/2023/06/tishman-speyer-dc-friendship-heights-shopping-mall-mixed-use-mazza-gallerie/

And here is what is in store for across the street where Maggiano's is: https://www.axios.com/local/washington-dc/2022/12/02/friendship-heights-apartments-affordable-housing

It looks like the current set of plans will add 1300+ units housing a very close walk to the FH metro. I bet there's even more in the pipeline if the buildings fill quickly. Geico corporate site has a TON of empty, valuable land. Jenifer Street NW has some terrible old and smaller Class C office buildings that can easily come down.

This is going to end up like downtown Bethesda within 5 years. The demand for housing is still there. Plus both sides of the border feed to good schools.

The Geico site is not available for dense development. Geico agreed to preserve the original buildings and the lawns as part of an expansion plan some time ago. It's actually nice having the openness in the midst of tall FH on the Maryland side.