How important are college costs to you, even if you can afford any college?

[Anonymous]

[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]
You're assuming that UVA, which has one of the wealthiest student bodies in the country, is full of kids who can't afford to go elsewhere? Ok . . . [/quote]

Wealthy for a state school. Full of middle class or upper middle class parents who are economically-savvy, perhaps. But there are a number of private colleges where family wealth is much greater - if you don't even notice the difference in cost, you pay for what your child prefers, right?

I don't have a dog in this UVA/Notre Dame fight and I have no personal preference, but I just want to point this out.[/quote]

Yes, Notre Dame has a higher percentage of 1 percenters than UVA, but both schools have among the top 100 wealthiest student bodies -- out of 3000+ colleges -- in the country. UVA also has one-third of its students paying out of state tuition, which at $52k a year is the second highest public school tuition (after Michigan). Are you seriously going to argue that UVA isn't a rich kid school?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:What are "CTCL" schools?

An NYT education reporter coined the term, then wrote a book (maybe more) about them. They're mainly liberal arts colleges outside the Northeast. There are some posters on here who seem to live to hate them and accuse anyone who even mentions one of them of having veal for children. Yes, they may not be as prestigious as some of the NESCACs, but some crank out grads in certain fields who go on to top grad schools, etc. For example, Wooster is known for its physics program. They are a good alternative for students who can only afford in-state, but may better thrive in a LAC. There are some who offer generous merit packages to make that possible.

What this poster really means is that they're a good alternative for kids who don't have to smarts to get into top ranked private colleges but have parents with money who think their kids are too special for state schools.

What the PP is unwilling to recognize is that not all top-ranked private colleges provide merit aid. I know a kid in at Amherst, Harvard, and Stanford, but headed to a CTCL as the parents cannot afford four years of full-pay private tuition when there are two more right behind this kid. The parents make enough to not qualify for aid, but not enough to bank roll even one kid for those four years.

Part of what this thread reveals is the parochial nature of some parents, ones who can't contemplate a world other than their own.

I don't believe for one second that a kid got into Harvard, Stanford and Amherst but chose a CTCL school because of finances. There are plenty of schools that are MUCH better than CTCL schools that offer merit aid. Sorry, but I call BS.

DP. I can't speak to the anecdote above, but my friend has asserted multiple times that she refuses to pay an arm and a leg for her children's college. I asked her what she'd do if her kids get accepted to Harvard, and she said without significant aid, nope. And now her oldest is a junior, she's looking at European universities, so I guess she's serious...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If a kid has to pay $80K at HYPSM, $50K at T20 (part merit) and $0 at state flagship (full ride). I think, I'll let him pick T20 if he wants to.

My son qualified for the full ride Bannaker Key scholarship at College Park and chose Notre Dame. It was a no brainer for us. ND was his dream school. To be cheap and make him attend UMD would be close to child abuse considering our 529 had over $300K in it.

I'd have trouble sending a kid to Maryland over ND also, especially with that much money in a 529. UVA is a different call, however. It's far more prestigious than Maryland.

[Anonymous]

[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]
You're assuming that UVA, which has one of the wealthiest student bodies in the country, is full of kids who can't afford to go elsewhere? Ok . . . [/quote]

Wealthy for a state school. Full of middle class or upper middle class parents who are economically-savvy, perhaps. But there are a number of private colleges where family wealth is much greater - if you don't even notice the difference in cost, you pay for what your child prefers, right?

I don't have a dog in this UVA/Notre Dame fight and I have no personal preference, but I just want to point this out.[/quote]

Yes, Notre Dame has a higher percentage of 1 percenters than UVA, but both schools have among the top 100 wealthiest student bodies -- out of 3000+ colleges -- in the country. UVA also has one-third of its students paying out of state tuition, which at $52k a year is the second highest public school tuition (after Michigan). Are you seriously going to argue that UVA isn't a rich kid school?[/quote]

PP you replied to. Not at all, I agree they both skew wealthy. One more than the other, but let's not nitpick.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If a kid has to pay $80K at HYPSM, $50K at T20 (part merit) and $0 at state flagship (full ride). I think, I'll let him pick T20 if he wants to.

Mine was offered/negotiated $47k for top LAC, $40k for T10 and Ivy, 32k for other Ivy, 30k for other top LAC, 10k for state flagship. Chose 32k Ivy. We had 40k/yr budgeted, so all good. We have hhi under 150k

So all FA? Or a mix of FA and merit?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If a kid has to pay $80K at HYPSM, $50K at T20 (part merit) and $0 at state flagship (full ride). I think, I'll let him pick T20 if he wants to.

My son qualified for the full ride Bannaker Key scholarship at College Park and chose Notre Dame. It was a no brainer for us. ND was his dream school. To be cheap and make him attend UMD would be close to child abuse considering our 529 had over $300K in it.

I'd have trouble sending a kid to Maryland over ND also, especially with that much money in a 529. UVA is a different call, however. It's far more prestigious than Maryland.

PP you replied to. I can't say how my son would have decided in that situation, but if he chose ND over free ride at UVA, I would pay for it. It's what he had been striving for through HS. Never even considered or applied to HYPSM.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I won’t pay a lot for clothes or cars or alcohol or beauty treatments or jewelry or fine dining any of that stuff but yeah, I will pay tuition at whatever college my kid wants to go to. My kid goes to an $80k school, my pants are from Old Navy. Makes me happy. YMMV.

+1000

DOn't understand the "I'll pay for an ivy or Stanford/MIT but after that, I'm not paying $80K". If you can afford to pay, why would you not want your kid to attend the best college of THEIR choice?

And if you would need to take loans for the IVY/S/M I don't call that affording it. I'd ask, why would you take $40-50K/year just for that. Ivies are great school, but really not that much better (or even better at all) than many of the other T50 schools. For me it's more about major and fit. But I wouldn't go into debt for any school if I had other choices I could afford (but it's a mute point as I have saved and can/am sending my kids to full pay expensive schools)

Because paying 80k "after that" is just plain stupid, that's why, and most 18 year olds aren't sophisticated enough financially to realize that. So you have to step in. Why is it that folks don't think twice about denying a kid anything but a college education on the ground that the thing they want just isn't worth the money.

We had one kid get into UVA and Notre Dame. Yes, we could have afforded Notre Dame, but we can afford lots of things that we don't buy. Are we really just expected to pay double for Notre Dame just because our kid wants us to? Sorry, no.

We value education. So yes, I'd happily pay if that's where my kid wants to attend. You obviously are not required to do that. But I'd rather spend on a college education than a fancy car or vacation

Ridiculous. UVA in state is less than half of ND and the educations are very comparable. Next?

Not ridiculous at all, just in your opinion. I suspect you don't have $320K saved so ND just isn't affordable for your family so you are just stating they are "comparable".

If one is a better fit for your kid and their major and you can afford to pay, why wouldn't you?
ND vs UVA stats
10K vs 17K undergrads alone is a huge difference for many kids.
8.3:1 vs 14:1 student:faculty ratio
2.3% vs 6.5% of classes with 100+ students
7.9% vs 14.5% of classes with 50+ students

In less than 5 mins I found these key data points demonstrating key differences and ones that I'd argue make ND "a better school" More access to faculty, smaller class sizes makes for a better educational experience IMO.

So while both are great schools, ND definately has an edge.

I'm a Notre Dame grad. I know more about the school than you do. I was making nearly 7 figures a year when my kid was accepted to ND. I easily could have afforded it. None of the metrics that you have just listed necessarily make it a better school than UVA. Otherwise a school like, say, Hampshire College would be better than both ND and UVA by definition. Your presumption that the smaller, the better just doesn't hold true.

I'm fond of ND, but it's not worth nearly triple of UVA in state.

I actually despise ND because of their athletic policies over the years and the misogyny demonstrated over the years (I'm old enough to remember when the guys got their laundry sent out for free and the girls had to use the machines themselves--until the laundry facility burned to the ground). However, if comparing two similar schools (hint: ND vs Hampshire or UVA vs Hampshire is not 2 similar schools), IMO the advantages of smaller classes, much lower faculty to student ratio all tip the scale for me---18K students vs 10K students is a huge difference in student life.

Hope your kids get into UVA, since you don't seem willing to fund more expensive schools despite easily being able to. I cannot imagine making over $1M/year and telling my kids "sorry not paying more than $50k/year for college, even if you really want to attend one and it's the best fit school for you".

[Anonymous]

I don’t have a strong opinion on the schools but the Notredame parents and UVA parents seem extremely annoying judging from this thread

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What are "CTCL" schools?

An NYT education reporter coined the term, then wrote a book (maybe more) about them. They're mainly liberal arts colleges outside the Northeast. There are some posters on here who seem to live to hate them and accuse anyone who even mentions one of them of having veal for children. Yes, they may not be as prestigious as some of the NESCACs, but some crank out grads in certain fields who go on to top grad schools, etc. For example, Wooster is known for its physics program. They are a good alternative for students who can only afford in-state, but may better thrive in a LAC. There are some who offer generous merit packages to make that possible.

What this poster really means is that they're a good alternative for kids who don't have to smarts to get into top ranked private colleges but have parents with money who think their kids are too special for state schools.

What the PP is unwilling to recognize is that not all top-ranked private colleges provide merit aid. I know a kid in at Amherst, Harvard, and Stanford, but headed to a CTCL as the parents cannot afford four years of full-pay private tuition when there are two more right behind this kid. The parents make enough to not qualify for aid, but not enough to bank roll even one kid for those four years.

Part of what this thread reveals is the parochial nature of some parents, ones who can't contemplate a world other than their own.

I don't believe for one second that a kid got into Harvard, Stanford and Amherst but chose a CTCL school because of finances. There are plenty of schools that are MUCH better than CTCL schools that offer merit aid. Sorry, but I call BS.

Right, you are ominiscient. The parents cannot afford $80k/four years with two more kids in the pipeline. They had hoped there may be some merit but there wasn't. A couple local scholarships, but they are one time and peanuts compared to the overall costs.

Maybe there are plenty of other schools that are MUCH better, but doesn't sound like kid applied with that in mind. Kid going to parents' alma mater where they got a robust merit package. Parents are successful professionals, just not in high enough paying jobs when they will have 3 kids in school at same time for at least two years. FWIW, parents wish it were different, but retirement in another 15-20 years so they think this is the most prudent choice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What are "CTCL" schools?

An NYT education reporter coined the term, then wrote a book (maybe more) about them. They're mainly liberal arts colleges outside the Northeast. There are some posters on here who seem to live to hate them and accuse anyone who even mentions one of them of having veal for children. Yes, they may not be as prestigious as some of the NESCACs, but some crank out grads in certain fields who go on to top grad schools, etc. For example, Wooster is known for its physics program. They are a good alternative for students who can only afford in-state, but may better thrive in a LAC. There are some who offer generous merit packages to make that possible.

What this poster really means is that they're a good alternative for kids who don't have to smarts to get into top ranked private colleges but have parents with money who think their kids are too special for state schools.

What the PP is unwilling to recognize is that not all top-ranked private colleges provide merit aid. I know a kid in at Amherst, Harvard, and Stanford, but headed to a CTCL as the parents cannot afford four years of full-pay private tuition when there are two more right behind this kid. The parents make enough to not qualify for aid, but not enough to bank roll even one kid for those four years.

Part of what this thread reveals is the parochial nature of some parents, ones who can't contemplate a world other than their own.

IMO that's a smart kid! They will go far in life, and definately make it much easier by not being burdened with huge college debt. CTCL are hidden gems---perhaps not "highly ranked" by USNWR because they are smaller/less well known. However, once you get your first job it doesn't really matter where you attended college. What matters is what you do at the job, and for that what matters is what you actually learned in college. I attended 2 elite schools (uG and Grad), and have never needed to use the alumni networks for employment.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don’t have a strong opinion on the schools but the Notredame parents and UVA parents seem extremely annoying judging from this thread

Amen

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If a kid has to pay $80K at HYPSM, $50K at T20 (part merit) and $0 at state flagship (full ride). I think, I'll let him pick T20 if he wants to.

My son qualified for the full ride Bannaker Key scholarship at College Park and chose Notre Dame. It was a no brainer for us. ND was his dream school. To be cheap and make him attend UMD would be close to child abuse considering our 529 had over $300K in it.

I'd have trouble sending a kid to Maryland over ND also, especially with that much money in a 529. UVA is a different call, however. It's far more prestigious than Maryland.

Prestige isn't really the point. If ND is the kid's "dream school", kid gets in , and the parents have prioritized education and actually saved and can afford it, why not send your kid to their dream school? THat's the entire point of saving for college---to have enough saved so your kid can attend whatever school is the "best for them"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If my kids get into an IVY then I'm all for paying for that, but nothing much else other than say MIT or similar. We are looking to Canada and the UK (where we're from) as having excellent colleges at reasonable prices.

In the US college costs have just become another component of capitalism.

We're looking abroad too! You get more value for money in Europe, even as an overseas student!! The tuition increases over the past 20 years and the state university emphasis on sports instead of education has really eroded the return on investment here in the US.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If a kid has to pay $80K at HYPSM, $50K at T20 (part merit) and $0 at state flagship (full ride). I think, I'll let him pick T20 if he wants to.

My son qualified for the full ride Bannaker Key scholarship at College Park and chose Notre Dame. It was a no brainer for us. ND was his dream school. To be cheap and make him attend UMD would be close to child abuse considering our 529 had over $300K in it.

I'd have trouble sending a kid to Maryland over ND also, especially with that much money in a 529. UVA is a different call, however. It's far more prestigious than Maryland.

Prestige isn't really the point. If ND is the kid's "dream school", kid gets in , and the parents have prioritized education and actually saved and can afford it, why not send your kid to their dream school? THat's the entire point of saving for college---to have enough saved so your kid can attend whatever school is the "best for them"

Plus 100. The point of saving in a 529 is to have the luxury of choices for many.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If my kids get into an IVY then I'm all for paying for that, but nothing much else other than say MIT or similar. We are looking to Canada and the UK (where we're from) as having excellent colleges at reasonable prices.

In the US college costs have just become another component of capitalism.

We're looking abroad too! You get more value for money in Europe, even as an overseas student!! The tuition increases over the past 20 years and the state university emphasis on sports instead of education has really eroded the return on investment here in the US.

Which UK colleges are you looking at, precisely? St Andrews? Others? We're looking at McGill in Canada, but I've been hesitant to search across the pond...