Explain to me the American mindset around work, entitlement, and earning

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As someone who wanted to SAH and arranged my life in such a way to do that, I definitely don’t want to pay higher taxes to pay for other women to have free childcare and year long paid maternity leaves! Yes SAH is my choice, but why does my family have to pay another family’s daycare and long maternity leave?

I would argue it's the same consideration as public schools - plenty of people pay property taxes that go towards paying for the schooling of other people's children. We decided that an educated population is a public good.

Education is primarily funded at the local level giving citizens the ability to choose form a variety of taxing schemes and funding mechanisms. That you can move to Texas or Wyoming where tax policy is more aligned with your personal views is an important societal outlet. That’s not what people are pushing here.

Where and how childcare is funded is a tangential discussion. All states have compulsory schooling requirements paid by taxes. I am sure something similar in terms of fundingcan be put in place for childcare. I agree that it should be implemented at the local level rather than federal.

Its not tangential if 90% of it is being funded by the federal government. Whereas with schools, the local tax base determines both the cost and quality of the schools.

Again, the discussion is whether we as a society should provide certain social benefits, not how.

The how predicates the answer. No I do not want to fund extraneous social benefits that raise my federal taxes and provide no further benefits to myself or my family - just takes money for our pocket.

Police, fire, roads, health insurance, military are a common good. Susan sitting at home making formula at 3PM is not.

Be careful. Extreme inequality causes crime and eventually violent revolutionary tactics.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why is it that so many Americans, especially on the right wing but also center and center-left, are so viscerally against the idea of someone receiving something basic that they didn't "earn"? Of all the terrible things in society, why is this the thing that generates so much outrage?

When it's about any left wing or moderately left policy - student loan debt forgiveness or free college, a public health system, a nationally higher minimum wage, family leave and childcare, public housing, the increased unemployment payouts over the pandemic, people like to mock these ideas and call them "free stuff" and "entitlements" for people who haven't earned them, as if that's some horrible thing.

I am not even arguing that I am in favor of every single one of these left ideas. There are valid criticisms of whether these things can be implemented soundly and whether we can configure a tax structure, without loopholes, that would pay for them, and whether as the assumed "world police" we can afford to reduce our military budget enough to have the social programs of the levels of other countries. There are obviously logistical criticism of any large scale government program in such a huge country being implemeneted from scratch.

But rhetorically, Americans seem so viscerally offended by the idea of someone receiving something they didn't work for... and this is almost always about low income people receiving something, and not about corporations that lie, cheat, and steal every day (or at the very least deceive, manipulate, and rig the system every day). Why is it so offensive that somebody receives a home if you don't think their low income job means they didn't work hard enough for it? Furthermore, there is an attitude that glorified suffering, like "I had to work 80 hour weeks and suffer to get into the middle class, so you should too." Is it that crazy to want things to get better and easier for future generations? Is it offensive to your great uncle who died of polio that the polio vaccine was created and people don't have it anymore? Wasn't the innovative vision of the future supposed to be a world where automation and technology makes things easier, so less labor is needed to provide for the world, and people could have more leisure time? Instead, work productivity has doubled, more or less, and work weeks and work days have gotten longer.

I'll also say that I'm not a Communist. I don't agree with state control or everything and government-appointed roles for people. I am American by marriage, not by birth, and still, some ideas are foreign to me. Why is leisure time and vacations looked down upon? even if it's just spending time with your family, caring for children or the elderly? Why is this devalued in favor of work?

Wouldn't it be better for everyone, for the environment especially, and for health, if we all just worked LESS, and produced less, consumed less? I think so many of the problems and needs that are especially prevalent in America are connected with overworking. So maybe it's not the end of the world if people receive food, healthcare, and shelter without having to "earn" it?

Maybe because most Americans understand human nature, and that to just give people things in the end creates a desire for more and more and it never ends. I think most Americans agree with the old saying "Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish, and you feed him for a lifetime."

Probably the majority Americans are in favor of many if not most of these, but it is how to go about accomplishing these that becomes the issue.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Those of you "happy to pay more taxes" should donate to charity. The rest of us are not "happy" to. We are stlll paying for aftercare, our own student loans, and saving for our own kids to go to college. Its not my responsibility to do that for other people too. But you are free to donate your money if you like!

You’re an idiot. You do realize that you wouldn’t have had to do any of this if there were higher taxes, correct?

Wrong. At our income we don’t qualify for $hit. So my taxes will go up but I will get no additional benefit. Hard pass.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Those of you "happy to pay more taxes" should donate to charity. The rest of us are not "happy" to. We are stlll paying for aftercare, our own student loans, and saving for our own kids to go to college. Its not my responsibility to do that for other people too. But you are free to donate your money if you like!

You’re an idiot. You do realize that you wouldn’t have had to do any of this if there were higher taxes, correct?

Wrong. At our income we [b]don’t[b]qualify for $hit. So my taxes will go up but I will get no additional benefit. Hard pass.

Currently, that is. You don’t seem to understand the term “universal” in “universal healthcare.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Those of you "happy to pay more taxes" should donate to charity. The rest of us are not "happy" to. We are stlll paying for aftercare, our own student loans, and saving for our own kids to go to college. Its not my responsibility to do that for other people too. But you are free to donate your money if you like!

You’re an idiot. You do realize that you wouldn’t have had to do any of this if there were higher taxes, correct?

Wrong. At our income we [b]don’t[b]qualify for $hit. So my taxes will go up but I will get no additional benefit. Hard pass.

Currently, that is. You don’t seem to understand the term “universal” in “universal healthcare.”

And who is going to pay for this universal healthcare..... There is a solution already get a job and you have healthcare next

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Those of you "happy to pay more taxes" should donate to charity. The rest of us are not "happy" to. We are stlll paying for aftercare, our own student loans, and saving for our own kids to go to college. Its not my responsibility to do that for other people too. But you are free to donate your money if you like!

You’re an idiot. You do realize that you wouldn’t have had to do any of this if there were higher taxes, correct?

Wrong. At our income we [b]don’t[b]qualify for $hit. So my taxes will go up but I will get no additional benefit. Hard pass.

Currently, that is. You don’t seem to understand the term “universal” in “universal healthcare.”

And who is going to pay for this universal healthcare..... There is a solution already get a job and you have healthcare next

Oh boy, you are incredibly sheltered and naive.

[Anonymous]

Not a fan of universal health care or socialized medicine.

My Obamacare runs $900 per month with a $6000 deductible.
I get no subsidy as I earn over $46,000 per year in my state.

I preferred what I had before Obamacare. My blue cross was $250 per month with a $1500 deductible. My blue cross that I had before Obamacare covered a lot more.

[Anonymous]

This is the American mindset regarding “work, entitlement and earning”:

“If you work, you should be entitled to keep as much as you earn as is possible”


That’s it. Very simple and easy to grasp.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Not a fan of universal health care or socialized medicine.

My Obamacare runs $900 per month with a $6000 deductible.
I get no subsidy as I earn over $46,000 per year in my state.

I preferred what I had before Obamacare. My blue cross was $250 per month with a $1500 deductible. My blue cross that I had before Obamacare covered a lot more.

Insurance costs have gone up anyway. Newsflash, goods and services are more expensive in 2022 than in 2012. Crazy, right?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Those of you "happy to pay more taxes" should donate to charity. The rest of us are not "happy" to. We are stlll paying for aftercare, our own student loans, and saving for our own kids to go to college. Its not my responsibility to do that for other people too. But you are free to donate your money if you like!

You’re an idiot. You do realize that you wouldn’t have had to do any of this if there were higher taxes, correct?

Wrong. At our income we [b]don’t[b]qualify for $hit. So my taxes will go up but I will get no additional benefit. Hard pass.

Currently, that is. You don’t seem to understand the term “universal” in “universal healthcare.”

And who is going to pay for this universal healthcare..... There is a solution already get a job and you have healthcare next

We spend more on healthcare than almost any other developed country. Your insurance costs are not only going toward you. Do you know how insurance risk pools work?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Not a fan of universal health care or socialized medicine.

My Obamacare runs $900 per month with a $6000 deductible.
I get no subsidy as I earn over $46,000 per year in my state.

I preferred what I had before Obamacare. My blue cross was $250 per month with a $1500 deductible. My blue cross that I had before Obamacare covered a lot more.

Yes, but the dozens of willfully unemployed losers living in their parents’ basements applaud your subsidizing all their healthcare with your $11,000 in annual premiums.

Ok, ok…. they don’t really applaud you… To them you’re just another rich a-hole not paying her “fair share”.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not a fan of universal health care or socialized medicine.

My Obamacare runs $900 per month with a $6000 deductible.
I get no subsidy as I earn over $46,000 per year in my state.

I preferred what I had before Obamacare. My blue cross was $250 per month with a $1500 deductible. My blue cross that I had before Obamacare covered a lot more.

Yes, but the dozens of willfully unemployed losers living in their parents’ basements applaud your subsidizing all their healthcare with your $11,000 in annual premiums.

Ok, ok…. they don’t really applaud you… To them you’re just another rich a-hole not paying her “fair share”.

If you’re on Marketplace healthcare you’re probably not too successful anyway.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Those of you "happy to pay more taxes" should donate to charity. The rest of us are not "happy" to. We are stlll paying for aftercare, our own student loans, and saving for our own kids to go to college. Its not my responsibility to do that for other people too. But you are free to donate your money if you like!

You’re an idiot. You do realize that you wouldn’t have had to do any of this if there were higher taxes, correct?

Wrong. At our income we [b]don’t[b]qualify for $hit. So my taxes will go up but I will get no additional benefit. Hard pass.

Currently, that is. You don’t seem to understand the term “universal” in “universal healthcare.”

And who is going to pay for this universal healthcare..... There is a solution already get a job and you have healthcare next

We spend more on healthcare than almost any other developed country. Your insurance costs are not only going toward you. Do you know how insurance risk pools work?

DP

Yes, I do. And lawyers and liability insurance is why healthcare costs more here than any place on the planet.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Those of you "happy to pay more taxes" should donate to charity. The rest of us are not "happy" to. We are stlll paying for aftercare, our own student loans, and saving for our own kids to go to college. Its not my responsibility to do that for other people too. But you are free to donate your money if you like!

You’re an idiot. You do realize that you wouldn’t have had to do any of this if there were higher taxes, correct?

Wrong. At our income we [b]don’t[b]qualify for $hit. So my taxes will go up but I will get no additional benefit. Hard pass.

Currently, that is. You don’t seem to understand the term “universal” in “universal healthcare.”

And who is going to pay for this universal healthcare..... There is a solution already get a job and you have healthcare next

We spend more on healthcare than almost any other developed country. Your insurance costs are not only going toward you. Do you know how insurance risk pools work?

DP

Yes, I do. And lawyers and liability insurance is why healthcare costs more here than any place on the planet.

Well, I am not a fan of medical malpractice insurance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Not a fan of universal health care or socialized medicine.

My Obamacare runs $900 per month with a $6000 deductible.
I get no subsidy as I earn over $46,000 per year in my state.

I preferred what I had before Obamacare. My blue cross was $250 per month with a $1500 deductible. My blue cross that I had before Obamacare covered a lot more.

People earning up to $51,520 were eligible for premium subsidies for 2021. Also, ARPA ramps that even higher for 2022, providing premium subsidies for singles earning up to $76,560, and broadly caps one's premiums at 8.5% of their annual income.

It seems like you're either missing out on some assistance you're eligible for, or you're not telling us the whole story. Can you please elaborate?