College Football--Big Ten Expansion

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The ACC offer to Stanford & Cal will be in the range of $24 million to $28 million. At $30 million, Stanford is a bargain for the Big Ten Conference. Cal less so, but would be a very interesting addition.

So, Big Ten, if Cal & Stanford would say yes at $28 million each for the remainder of the broadcast contract--6 to 7 years--what would your response be ?

Please consider the list at post 18:50 today August 8, 2023.

CORRECTION: Today is August 9, 2023. Post at 18:50 August 9, 2023.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:the Big ten's weakness is that it owes loyalty to the 4 Pac-12 teams joining the conference next year. UCLA & USC especially deserve a say in further West Coast expansion in their recruiting territory. Stanford is more palatable because Stanford has a national recruiting base versus Cal's western focus.

Like how USC didn’t want Oregon?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:the Big ten's weakness is that it owes loyalty to the 4 Pac-12 teams joining the conference next year. UCLA & USC especially deserve a say in further West Coast expansion in their recruiting territory. Stanford is more palatable because Stanford has a national recruiting base versus Cal's western focus.

Like how USC didn’t want Oregon?

Do you know that for a fact ?

No major player in college football wants recruiting competition from another major player in the same region--like Texas A&M didn't want Texas in the SEC. South Carolina/Clemson; Florida/FSU; etc.

In the ACC it doesn't matter as much; ACC is basketball country except for Clemson.

[Anonymous]

Just checked. One website is trying to attract subscribers within the last 24 hours with the clickbait type headline: "Stanford and Notre Dame To Join Big Ten".

I did not subscribe.

[Anonymous]

https://deadspin.com/stanford-college-athletics-conferences-pac-12-big-10-1850722565

Stanford has no home.

[Anonymous]

Reports are that Cal & Stanford are not getting a warm reception from ACC schools. No vote taken tonight. Requires 12 of 15 yes votes to get an offer to join the ACC according to one source.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The real question is:

Big Ten Conference, what is the vision for the future of your conference ?

If that vision includes a 24 team nationwide mega-conference, then Stanford & Cal could be valuable additions in the future.

I do not think that the ACC has a vision that included adding just two West Coast schools. Makes no sense unless 6 schools are added to create a West Coast Division.

The West Coast time zone remains a major concern as it is difficult to attract a national audience so late in the day--especially after a long day of college football viewing has already occurred. The 3 hour time zone difference is an issue that should be able to be worked out--especially if Cal & Stanford join at partial shares--which is a certainty for both the Big Ten Conference and for the ACC.

Interesting post.

I agree that the vision thing is a key here. I do believe that the SEC and the Big10 have a vision of a 24 or more team conference. That may not be the 2023 or 2024 dream but I think it is at least the 2030 vision. The ACC now I think has the same vision --- if they pull this off. So I agree that the will be adding schools Westish like SMU. Maybe ND. Maybe a couple more west coast. BYU?

From what I have read -- the late games are not a detraction. The ACC feels ESPN will have to open up the checkbook for a live west coast game like Stanford vs NC or Cal vs Clemson. There would be an extra ACC game every Saturday (and maybe Thursday) that the west coast would watch.

The thing is, most people don't care about SMU or BYU football. Sure, the small alumni base in Dallas cares about SMU and mormons may care about BYU, but in terms of garnering millions of eyeballs, a wake forest-SMU game is just not going to do it.

[Anonymous]

Stanford has the money to make an offer that the major conferences shouldn't be able to refuse. My suggestion remains: Stanford pick up the phone & make your best offer to the Big Ten as the ACC seems reluctant to offer even a 60% share. If you need advice, call SMU.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So what do I think is happening today ?

I think that Notre Dame understands the current and future landscape of big-time college football well. ND understands that the Big Ten Conference has taken several shrewd steps that will affect Notre Dame football.

To remain as an independent in college football, Notre Dame needs a CFP that gives ND a strong chance at making the 12 team playoff. Things are going to change in 2026 regarding the CFP and, as matters stand now, the Big Ten Conference and the SEC will control those changes to CFP eligibility. Notre Dame may want a strong ally in the ACC to counter the influence of the Big ten Conference and of the SEC. Notre Dame--even though independent--has a spot on the CFP committee.

This could be. ND could be saying we agree not to join anyone and stay ind. with our deal with you and play Cal and Stanford every year. One on our NBC revenue and one on your ESPN revenue. ND already agreed to play a number of ACC schools. Long history with BC, GTech, Miami. And for ND they would love to play Cal and Stanford in non-revenue sports. They have to travel regardless.

But they may also just join the ACC if all of this can be pulled off. Either now (less likley) or a couple of years from now.

Agree except with your final two sentences.

From Notre Dame's perspective, this is all about the CFP and controlling the changes to the CFP in 2025 & 2026. Notre Dame has a seat at the table as an independent, so why surrender that when you can make an ally ?

Okay, so how does ND screw the Big Ten Conference and help the ACC financially if Notre Dame does NOT become a full football member of the ACC ? Easy. ND schedules few to no regular season games against Big Ten opponents and schedules more games against the patsies of the ACC.

Notre Dame draws viewers nationwide & puts fans in stadium seats. This results in more money from broadcast partners.

So Notre Dame goes 11-0 against a bunch of second tier schools...that doesn't get them into the playoffs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The real question is:

Big Ten Conference, what is the vision for the future of your conference ?

If that vision includes a 24 team nationwide mega-conference, then Stanford & Cal could be valuable additions in the future.

I do not think that the ACC has a vision that included adding just two West Coast schools. Makes no sense unless 6 schools are added to create a West Coast Division.

The West Coast time zone remains a major concern as it is difficult to attract a national audience so late in the day--especially after a long day of college football viewing has already occurred. The 3 hour time zone difference is an issue that should be able to be worked out--especially if Cal & Stanford join at partial shares--which is a certainty for both the Big Ten Conference and for the ACC.

Interesting post.

I agree that the vision thing is a key here. I do believe that the SEC and the Big10 have a vision of a 24 or more team conference. That may not be the 2023 or 2024 dream but I think it is at least the 2030 vision. The ACC now I think has the same vision --- if they pull this off. So I agree that the will be adding schools Westish like SMU. Maybe ND. Maybe a couple more west coast. BYU?

From what I have read -- the late games are not a detraction. The ACC feels ESPN will have to open up the checkbook for a live west coast game like Stanford vs NC or Cal vs Clemson. There would be an extra ACC game every Saturday (and maybe Thursday) that the west coast would watch.

The thing is, most people don't care about SMU or BYU football. Sure, the small alumni base in Dallas cares about SMU and mormons may care about BYU, but in terms of garnering millions of eyeballs, a wake forest-SMU game is just not going to do it.

You could have started your post with: "Truth be told:"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So what do I think is happening today ?

I think that Notre Dame understands the current and future landscape of big-time college football well. ND understands that the Big Ten Conference has taken several shrewd steps that will affect Notre Dame football.

To remain as an independent in college football, Notre Dame needs a CFP that gives ND a strong chance at making the 12 team playoff. Things are going to change in 2026 regarding the CFP and, as matters stand now, the Big Ten Conference and the SEC will control those changes to CFP eligibility. Notre Dame may want a strong ally in the ACC to counter the influence of the Big ten Conference and of the SEC. Notre Dame--even though independent--has a spot on the CFP committee.

This could be. ND could be saying we agree not to join anyone and stay ind. with our deal with you and play Cal and Stanford every year. One on our NBC revenue and one on your ESPN revenue. ND already agreed to play a number of ACC schools. Long history with BC, GTech, Miami. And for ND they would love to play Cal and Stanford in non-revenue sports. They have to travel regardless.

But they may also just join the ACC if all of this can be pulled off. Either now (less likley) or a couple of years from now.

Agree except with your final two sentences.

From Notre Dame's perspective, this is all about the CFP and controlling the changes to the CFP in 2025 & 2026. Notre Dame has a seat at the table as an independent, so why surrender that when you can make an ally ?

Okay, so how does ND screw the Big Ten Conference and help the ACC financially if Notre Dame does NOT become a full football member of the ACC ? Easy. ND schedules few to no regular season games against Big Ten opponents and schedules more games against the patsies of the ACC.

Notre Dame draws viewers nationwide & puts fans in stadium seats. This results in more money from broadcast partners.

So Notre Dame goes 11-0 against a bunch of second tier schools...that doesn't get them into the playoffs.

The ACC has Clemson, FSU, and a few other respectable football programs.

Whether or not Notre Dame gets a berth in the 12 team CFP depends upon CFP rules. Currently, the rules are favorable to Notre Dame, but that may change for 2026.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The real question is:

Big Ten Conference, what is the vision for the future of your conference ?

If that vision includes a 24 team nationwide mega-conference, then Stanford & Cal could be valuable additions in the future.

I do not think that the ACC has a vision that included adding just two West Coast schools. Makes no sense unless 6 schools are added to create a West Coast Division.

The West Coast time zone remains a major concern as it is difficult to attract a national audience so late in the day--especially after a long day of college football viewing has already occurred. The 3 hour time zone difference is an issue that should be able to be worked out--especially if Cal & Stanford join at partial shares--which is a certainty for both the Big Ten Conference and for the ACC.

Interesting post.

I agree that the vision thing is a key here. I do believe that the SEC and the Big10 have a vision of a 24 or more team conference. That may not be the 2023 or 2024 dream but I think it is at least the 2030 vision. The ACC now I think has the same vision --- if they pull this off. So I agree that the will be adding schools Westish like SMU. Maybe ND. Maybe a couple more west coast. BYU?

From what I have read -- the late games are not a detraction. The ACC feels ESPN will have to open up the checkbook for a live west coast game like Stanford vs NC or Cal vs Clemson. There would be an extra ACC game every Saturday (and maybe Thursday) that the west coast would watch.

The thing is, most people don't care about SMU or BYU football. Sure, the small alumni base in Dallas cares about SMU and mormons may care about BYU, but in terms of garnering millions of eyeballs, a wake forest-SMU game is just not going to do it.

It does not have to. Not at 10:30 pm. That's the point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Cal & Stanford are desperate. If the ACC offers at a less than full share, both will accept, but it won't last beyond the first contractual obligation.

The Big Ten Conference has a moral responsibility to Stanford & Cal and has a lot to gain long term.

If Cal and Stanford join the ACC they are required to adopt the GOR. Meaning they would be tied up in the ACC for a number of years and would not be able to move.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Stanford has the money to make an offer that the major conferences shouldn't be able to refuse. My suggestion remains: Stanford pick up the phone & make your best offer to the Big Ten as the ACC seems reluctant to offer even a 60% share. If you need advice, call SMU.

What do you mean Stanford has the money? What would they do? Offer it to the Big10?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The real question is:

Big Ten Conference, what is the vision for the future of your conference ?

If that vision includes a 24 team nationwide mega-conference, then Stanford & Cal could be valuable additions in the future.

I do not think that the ACC has a vision that included adding just two West Coast schools. Makes no sense unless 6 schools are added to create a West Coast Division.

The West Coast time zone remains a major concern as it is difficult to attract a national audience so late in the day--especially after a long day of college football viewing has already occurred. The 3 hour time zone difference is an issue that should be able to be worked out--especially if Cal & Stanford join at partial shares--which is a certainty for both the Big Ten Conference and for the ACC.

Interesting post.

I agree that the vision thing is a key here. I do believe that the SEC and the Big10 have a vision of a 24 or more team conference. That may not be the 2023 or 2024 dream but I think it is at least the 2030 vision. The ACC now I think has the same vision --- if they pull this off. So I agree that the will be adding schools Westish like SMU. Maybe ND. Maybe a couple more west coast. BYU?

From what I have read -- the late games are not a detraction. The ACC feels ESPN will have to open up the checkbook for a live west coast game like Stanford vs NC or Cal vs Clemson. There would be an extra ACC game every Saturday (and maybe Thursday) that the west coast would watch.

The thing is, most people don't care about SMU or BYU football. Sure, the small alumni base in Dallas cares about SMU and mormons may care about BYU, but in terms of garnering millions of eyeballs, a wake forest-SMU game is just not going to do it.

Eyeballs don’t really matter. Revenue is based on the number of cable subscribers in the market, and the price goes up if the market is “in state” for a conference team. The Bay Area and DFW are huge markets. From a cable revenue standpoint, it’s not that relevant how many people actually watch.