how to most kindly fire nanny (aside from severance)

[Anonymous]

Severance aside (which we will do) - what's the best way to fire a nanny when it's not one major mistake but a hundred little ways its not working out? From a logistical side, she's late at least once a week, has taken 8 sick days in 5 months (none covid related) and seems overwhelmed by the reasonable workload (kids laundry left washed but in unfolded piles every week etc). I thought about discussing all these issues with her, but realized that even if she could fix these her instincts on how to handle a situation are almost always wrong or at least not what I would do and most importantly she brings no happiness / fun / silliness to her management of the kids and her relationship with them is just so blah.

She's nice and tries hard - it's just not going to work. I do think this will be a big surprise to her as I haven't directly addressed the logistical issues because i've been debating whether I'd keep her if she fixed them, or if it was unfair to basically put her on notice when it just wasn't going to work.

How would you phrase the need for a change? In our contract I (dumbly) agreed to 8 weeks notice if there's no cause, but given the tardiness and absenteeism there is cause so I'm planning to do 4 weeks severance. So I'll need to point to those issues, but should I keep it to those issues or a more broad story about our needs changing or us not clicking? Should I make the day I let her know the last day or does that feel cruelly sudden and should give her like 2 more weeks coming + the 4 weeks severance? Or does having to come after being tired feel cruel and it should just be an instant goodbye?

I've gently inquired if there's anything going on in case there is some underlying major stressor in her life that would cause these issues and I could support her better. she's said no and shares nothing. Not that it's my business what it is, but if there was some big thing going on in her personal life I'd have tried to support her, but at least as far as I know there isn't anything temporary that would cause all these issues.

[Anonymous]

How long has she been with you?

[Anonymous]

Just give her the 8 weeks. And offer a reference letter. Hope that she finds something sooner than 8 weeks. Do you even have new childcare lined up yet?

You don't like her and it's not going to work out, so just let her go to another family that may be a better fit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Just give her the 8 weeks. And offer a reference letter. Hope that she finds something sooner than 8 weeks. Do you even have new childcare lined up yet?

You don't like her and it's not going to work out, so just let her go to another family that may be a better fit.

Paying 2 nannies for 8 weeks (and giving 2 months severance for a mediocre job / regularly lateness etc) isn't reasonable. I've talked to several nanny staffing agencies to gut check this and they've all said that paying a month severance in this situation is more than generous. Just because I can afford a nanny doesn't mean I can afford 2.

[Anonymous]

Give her the 8 weeks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Just give her the 8 weeks. And offer a reference letter. Hope that she finds something sooner than 8 weeks. Do you even have new childcare lined up yet?

You don't like her and it's not going to work out, so just let her go to another family that may be a better fit.

Sorry - by give her 8 weeks, I meant let her stay working for 8 weeks. She will probably try to get a new job much sooner. And then you may not have to do severance. 2 weeks on the job and 4 weeks severance is weird and cheap IMO. Why short her two weeks. Be supportive, give her 8 weeks notice and move on. You can get through 8 more weeks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How long has she been with you?

Since november. she's our 3rd nanny - the first was when we lived in another city and the second had her own baby after 2.5 years with us. just providing context that in general our nanny relationships go well with both parties happy and only ending due to life changes

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just give her the 8 weeks. And offer a reference letter. Hope that she finds something sooner than 8 weeks. Do you even have new childcare lined up yet?

You don't like her and it's not going to work out, so just let her go to another family that may be a better fit.

Paying 2 nannies for 8 weeks (and giving 2 months severance for a mediocre job / regularly lateness etc) isn't reasonable. I've talked to several nanny staffing agencies to gut check this and they've all said that paying a month severance in this situation is more than generous. Just because I can afford a nanny doesn't mean I can afford 2.

Yes, but you don't need two nannies. You sound like an inconsiderate jerk. Have them overlap for two weeks at most. I bet you won't like the new nanny either.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just give her the 8 weeks. And offer a reference letter. Hope that she finds something sooner than 8 weeks. Do you even have new childcare lined up yet?

You don't like her and it's not going to work out, so just let her go to another family that may be a better fit.

Sorry - by give her 8 weeks, I meant let her stay working for 8 weeks. She will probably try to get a new job much sooner. And then you may not have to do severance. 2 weeks on the job and 4 weeks severance is weird and cheap IMO. Why short her two weeks. Be supportive, give her 8 weeks notice and move on. You can get through 8 more weeks.

i've heard in general horror stories about trying to keep things going well with a nanny once they've been fired. i can't imagine she'd want to continue with us for 2months after being fired and that any motivation to try to show up on time / be fun for the kids etc is gone. what i was envisioning is lining up the new person first and then letting her go based on that timing. i didn't know if a nanny would prefer just fully being done that very day if they've been fired or would prefer a week or two to transition so it didn't feel so cold and sudden.

[Anonymous]

I don’t know but FYI it’s poor management to not bring up issues as they come along. You should have been gently addressing these issues along the way in a polite but straight forward manner. (“We’d appreciate it if you would fold and put away the laundry in addition to washing it! Thanks!” “It’s important to be at work on time so that we are t late for work. If you could leave your home a little earlier to account for any mishaps we appreciate it.”

Eight sick days in five months is nothing out of hand.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just give her the 8 weeks. And offer a reference letter. Hope that she finds something sooner than 8 weeks. Do you even have new childcare lined up yet?

You don't like her and it's not going to work out, so just let her go to another family that may be a better fit.

Sorry - by give her 8 weeks, I meant let her stay working for 8 weeks. She will probably try to get a new job much sooner. And then you may not have to do severance. 2 weeks on the job and 4 weeks severance is weird and cheap IMO. Why short her two weeks. Be supportive, give her 8 weeks notice and move on. You can get through 8 more weeks.

i've heard in general horror stories about trying to keep things going well with a nanny once they've been fired. i can't imagine she'd want to continue with us for 2months after being fired and that any motivation to try to show up on time / be fun for the kids etc is gone. what i was envisioning is lining up the new person first and then letting her go based on that timing. i didn't know if a nanny would prefer just fully being done that very day if they've been fired or would prefer a week or two to transition so it didn't feel so cold and sudden.

Then do what you want. Why did you even ask? Not many people are going to say that shorting your nanny out of the contract (that you agreed to) is fair. Late once a week and not doing laundry aren't egregious - annoying for sure, but not egregious. She'll likely want to stay working when looking for a new job as she will have to explain why she was let go by you -- instead of working while searching for a new one. If I was interviewing her, I would wonder why the employer couldn't keep them on for a little longer until she found new employment. If she was working and searching and the employer knew, then I would think it just wasn't a great fit.

You can hem and haw all you want, but ultimately going against the contract you agreed to makes you a jerk. There is a power imbalance in your relationship and you are exploiting it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just give her the 8 weeks. And offer a reference letter. Hope that she finds something sooner than 8 weeks. Do you even have new childcare lined up yet?

You don't like her and it's not going to work out, so just let her go to another family that may be a better fit.

Sorry - by give her 8 weeks, I meant let her stay working for 8 weeks. She will probably try to get a new job much sooner. And then you may not have to do severance. 2 weeks on the job and 4 weeks severance is weird and cheap IMO. Why short her two weeks. Be supportive, give her 8 weeks notice and move on. You can get through 8 more weeks.

i've heard in general horror stories about trying to keep things going well with a nanny once they've been fired. i can't imagine she'd want to continue with us for 2months after being fired and that any motivation to try to show up on time / be fun for the kids etc is gone. what i was envisioning is lining up the new person first and then letting her go based on that timing. i didn't know if a nanny would prefer just fully being done that very day if they've been fired or would prefer a week or two to transition so it didn't feel so cold and sudden.

Then do what you want. Why did you even ask? Not many people are going to say that shorting your nanny out of the contract (that you agreed to) is fair. Late once a week and not doing laundry aren't egregious - annoying for sure, but not egregious. She'll likely want to stay working when looking for a new job as she will have to explain why she was let go by you -- instead of working while searching for a new one. If I was interviewing her, I would wonder why the employer couldn't keep them on for a little longer until she found new employment. If she was working and searching and the employer knew, then I would think it just wasn't a great fit.

You can hem and haw all you want, but ultimately going against the contract you agreed to makes you a jerk. There is a power imbalance in your relationship and you are exploiting it.

I asked because I wanted opinions like yours. From the nanny staffing agencies, they've said her logistical issues (degree of absenteeism and lateness) are very much under the "cause" aspects of our contract and very outside the range of normal or acceptable even in the current nanny market. they've all advised even given 2 weeks severance is more than fair. I'd assumed that once I fire someone, the last thing they'd want to do is have to keep coming back and caring for my kids for weeks on end...so I was thinking the day I gave notice would likely be what she wanted to be their last day. Your opinion is helpful that you think they'd rather keep coming to have a good story for their next employer, to get 8 paid weeks to transition (while continuing to work....versus 4 weeks fully paid not working). So thank you for responding with your perspective

[Anonymous]

You asked how to do this in the most kind way (from your post title). Kindest way is to give her 8 weeks notice as per your agreement. And offer a reference letter that will help her get a new job.

[Anonymous]

Did she take sick days that you, as the employer, provided to her as part of her contract? If so, it's not absenteeism at all. And you may be dinging her illegally.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You asked how to do this in the most kind way (from your post title). Kindest way is to give her 8 weeks notice as per your agreement. And offer a reference letter that will help her get a new job.

Ok - got it. I'd (i guess wrongly) assumed that once someone is fired, they'd never want to spend another 40 days coming in and having to care for my kids every day. I'd thought they'd rather basically be done and have a paid month with no work responsibilities to go find the next thing and never have to make small talk with me or wipe my kids tears or butts again.