Questions for HYPSM alumni

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yes, my undergrad and grad credentials continue to impress people. I’m more than 20 years out and (other) people bring it up in a professional context. I never bring it up. I actually find it somewhat annoying since at 20 years out my accomplishments should stand for themselves, but big names continue to have some sort of impact (I’ve gotten negative comments, too).

I was a first generation student at HYP but I married someone who is a longtime family legacy - like his family have been going to the same HYP school since the 1800s. So we come at our view of sending our kids from different angles, but we both really hope our kids are able to be admitted and attend HYP. But if they don’t, that’s fine, I guess they can attend Stanford or MIT.

All of the FGLI students I met at my Ivy turned a little nuts after college and want to cut off the hand that fed them. I would never say that out loud but it’s totally obvious.

[Anonymous]

NP
I’m not sure what you mean. Care to elaborate?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do many colleges have societies for the pedigreed kids or is it an ivy league phenonem?

That’s a complicated question. How do you define “many”? It tends to be an Ivy (and Little Three) thing. Here’s the deal: When most colleges close a frat that’s the end of the frat at that college. Elite frats at the Ivies are immortal. If the college closes it, it remains as an elite social club. When Harvard closed Alpha Delta Phi, it remained as two social clubs, Fly and A.D. When Williams closed its frats, St. A’s remained under the radar. At most colleges, a frat is a frat is a frat. Different at the Ivies. For example, at Yale, Alpha Delta Phi has traditionally been a feeder for Skull & Bones.

lol. The now-shuttered AD and Fly has NOTHING to do with the frats.

Are you the same poster who keeps claiming that Columbia is one of the “4 horsemen?”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do many colleges have societies for the pedigreed kids or is it an ivy league phenonem?

That’s a complicated question. How do you define “many”? It tends to be an Ivy (and Little Three) thing. Here’s the deal: When most colleges close a frat that’s the end of the frat at that college. Elite frats at the Ivies are immortal. If the college closes it, it remains as an elite social club. When Harvard closed Alpha Delta Phi, it remained as two social clubs, Fly and A.D. When Williams closed its frats, St. A’s remained under the radar. At most colleges, a frat is a frat is a frat. Different at the Ivies. For example, at Yale, Alpha Delta Phi has traditionally been a feeder for Skull & Bones.

lol. The now-shuttered AD and Fly has NOTHING to do with the frats.

Are you the same poster who keeps claiming that Columbia is one of the “4 horsemen?”

I have never heard of the four horsemen, but but Fly and A.D. were founded by members of Harvard’s chapter of Alpha Delta Phi after Harvard closed its frats. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fly_Club

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do many colleges have societies for the pedigreed kids or is it an ivy league phenonem?

That’s a complicated question. How do you define “many”? It tends to be an Ivy (and Little Three) thing. Here’s the deal: When most colleges close a frat that’s the end of the frat at that college. Elite frats at the Ivies are immortal. If the college closes it, it remains as an elite social club. When Harvard closed Alpha Delta Phi, it remained as two social clubs, Fly and A.D. When Williams closed its frats, St. A’s remained under the radar. At most colleges, a frat is a frat is a frat. Different at the Ivies. For example, at Yale, Alpha Delta Phi has traditionally been a feeder for Skull & Bones.

lol. The now-shuttered AD and Fly has NOTHING to do with the frats.

Are you the same poster who keeps claiming that Columbia is one of the “4 horsemen?”

Harvard closed its frats after the Civil War. A.D. and Fly were founded by members of the Harvard chapter of Alpha Delta Phi. The only four horsemen I know of are in Revelations.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A.D._Club

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fly_Club

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Seriously, HYPSM is a term that is only used in these Internet forums and has no bearing in the real world. Your kid would receive the same level of education at any of the T20 or so schools, or perhaps an even better one if it's a top LAC. There is no tangible advantage for employment to attend these schools either, and some LACs even place better for professional and PhD programs. With the exception of maybe Harvard, attending a HYPSM school won't give you a leg up over other elite schools.

You’re conflating the quality of education with the value of the degree. No “LAC” will give you a degree as valuable as a BA from Stanford.

And even you admit that a Harvard College BA opens doors that other schools can’t, even if you can’t quite get yourself to apply the arguments to Yale, Stanford, etc.

So, what are the opportunities that will present itself to a Princeton grad that a Wharton grad would never be able to gain access to? Assuming that HYPSM offers a special distinction in the real world is inaccurate and pathetic.

Oh, man. Are you the parent insecure about Wharton?

No, I’m not associated with any of these schools. But I just want to know what specific perks HYPSM grads get that other elite school grads are prohibited from accessing.

Bush Jr went to an ivy through a side door. He was allowed to start a war in Afghanistan. Ashram Ghani, the former prez of Afghanistan and an Ivy grad, was allowed a back door out of Afghanistan.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have an MD/PhD from a too med school (think Johns Hopkins/Harvard/UCSF) and I think, as a woman, it has hurt me professionally.

It made it easier to get a good residency, but since then I have worked with men from predominantly mid-tier and foreign medical schools in an academic/research setting. I’m in a more technical speciality and most of my colleagues are men. My “fancy” med school appears to trigger their insecurities.

Occasionally when I say something incorrect or just not that smart, my med school pedigree is whipped out and people make snarky comments about what “quality graduates” my med school produces. A few times they have “joked” that I was an affirmative action admit. (I am old - there were affirmative action admissions for women in the MD/PhD program back then). They love to ask me to translate Latin terms, and when I say they can’t, they act “surprised”. And it’s not like I even talk about my pedigree, and I would certainly never hang my diploma in my office.

Honestly, I think that my career may have gone smoother if I had gone to a mid tier med school. As a woman, it’s like my fancy degree is a target on my back and the guys need to prove that they are better than a graduate from my school. I wonder if it is this way for other women?

URMs are often unprepared.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have an MD/PhD from a too med school (think Johns Hopkins/Harvard/UCSF) and I think, as a woman, it has hurt me professionally.

It made it easier to get a good residency, but since then I have worked with men from predominantly mid-tier and foreign medical schools in an academic/research setting. I’m in a more technical speciality and most of my colleagues are men. My “fancy” med school appears to trigger their insecurities.

Occasionally when I say something incorrect or just not that smart, my med school pedigree is whipped out and people make snarky comments about what “quality graduates” my med school produces. A few times they have “joked” that I was an affirmative action admit. (I am old - there were affirmative action admissions for women in the MD/PhD program back then). They love to ask me to translate Latin terms, and when I say they can’t, they act “surprised”. And it’s not like I even talk about my pedigree, and I would certainly never hang my diploma in my office.

Honestly, I think that my career may have gone smoother if I had gone to a mid tier med school. As a woman, it’s like my fancy degree is a target on my back and the guys need to prove that they are better than a graduate from my school. I wonder if it is this way for other women?

URMs are often unprepared.

Only according to your perception. Not if you look at the data.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have an MD/PhD from a too med school (think Johns Hopkins/Harvard/UCSF) and I think, as a woman, it has hurt me professionally.

It made it easier to get a good residency, but since then I have worked with men from predominantly mid-tier and foreign medical schools in an academic/research setting. I’m in a more technical speciality and most of my colleagues are men. My “fancy” med school appears to trigger their insecurities.

Occasionally when I say something incorrect or just not that smart, my med school pedigree is whipped out and people make snarky comments about what “quality graduates” my med school produces. A few times they have “joked” that I was an affirmative action admit. (I am old - there were affirmative action admissions for women in the MD/PhD program back then). They love to ask me to translate Latin terms, and when I say they can’t, they act “surprised”. And it’s not like I even talk about my pedigree, and I would certainly never hang my diploma in my office.

Honestly, I think that my career may have gone smoother if I had gone to a mid tier med school. As a woman, it’s like my fancy degree is a target on my back and the guys need to prove that they are better than a graduate from my school. I wonder if it is this way for other women?

URMs are often unprepared.

Only according to your perception. Not if you look at the data.

Read PP’s description of how his or her colleagues are judging her character irrespective of her degree.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I kind of feel like it should be HSYPM now, not HYPSM.

I think it should be just HSM. HSM shows up in the top 5 of most global rankings and contribute the most to academia in the US (+ Berkeley). Y and P are closer to Columbia and Caltech, the next rung of schools, more so than they are to HSM.

That's about right based on my experience living overseas. P and Y are well-respected in the US but less well known abroad and their grad programs are less endowed than HSM, hence their international rankings dip. QS had Yale at #14, below Penn, and Princeton below Columbia at #20 this year. Just go abroad and ask how many people have heard of H/S vs Y/P and you'll get a good idea.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have an MD/PhD from a too med school (think Johns Hopkins/Harvard/UCSF) and I think, as a woman, it has hurt me professionally.

It made it easier to get a good residency, but since then I have worked with men from predominantly mid-tier and foreign medical schools in an academic/research setting. I’m in a more technical speciality and most of my colleagues are men. My “fancy” med school appears to trigger their insecurities.

Occasionally when I say something incorrect or just not that smart, my med school pedigree is whipped out and people make snarky comments about what “quality graduates” my med school produces. A few times they have “joked” that I was an affirmative action admit. (I am old - there were affirmative action admissions for women in the MD/PhD program back then). They love to ask me to translate Latin terms, and when I say they can’t, they act “surprised”. And it’s not like I even talk about my pedigree, and I would certainly never hang my diploma in my office.

Honestly, I think that my career may have gone smoother if I had gone to a mid tier med school. As a woman, it’s like my fancy degree is a target on my back and the guys need to prove that they are better than a graduate from my school. I wonder if it is this way for other women?

URMs are often unprepared.

Only according to your perception. Not if you look at the data.

Read PP’s description of how his or her colleagues are judging her character irrespective of her degree.

PP here. I guess I wasn’t clear. I am easily as good as if not better than my male colleagues, and have the CV to match. Don’t worry, women doctors aren’t dumber than the guys! And nowadays there are actually more women than men in most med schools.

My point was that coming from a top med school seems to have put a target on my back. There are a lot of insecure people out there, and shooting down a fancy-school grad is apparently more fun and satisfying than shooting down someone who went to a med school like UTSW, Vandy, CWRU, or Tulane, although we are all of the same intellectual caliber. Men who trained at foreign med schools seem particularly triggered by the “name brand” nature of my degree.

Just a dissenting opinion that, as a woman, a fancy degree does not buy an easy road to success and may in fact engender envy more so than opportunities if you don’t work with or for very secure people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Do you feel that going there affected your life in ways that wouldn't have happened if you had attended a less selective school?

If your kid wanted to go there, would you recommend it?

Yes, absolutely.

Yes, absolutely.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Do you feel that going there affected your life in ways that wouldn't have happened if you had attended a less selective school?

If your kid wanted to go there, would you recommend it?

Yes, I met some great people there, who are lifelong friends, and for that reason alone, it was worth it.

And no, I don't recommend that my kid go there. The education I received wasn't the very best. It was good, but not great.

I wish I'd gone to a smaller, less selective college where I stood out.

The fact that I was just average in college did a number on my self esteem. I was a star in high school, and my star disappeared in college.

I want my kids to feel appreciated, and I did not feel appreciated in college. I felt like I was a number, and so, so lucky to be there. People to this day are impressed that I went there. But I didn't like it. I worked so hard to get there, and was disappointed by the education I received. I think I would have gotten a far better education and had a lot more fun at smaller, less-selective school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yes. I was admitted to a top-5 doctoral program based largely on my prestigious UG degree, I believe. I had a related degree but had done little to no work in the field to which I applied. I sincerely doubt I would have been admitted, much less fully funded, otherwise.

Depends on the kid. My more brilliant child would more likely thrive at a smaller LAC. If he really wanted to attend HYPSM, I'd support it but I doubt he will. Too soon to tell for sure with my younger child, but I suspect he will not be interested in the grind necessary to be competitive for admission.

For the right kid, I do think it is a fabulous experience and very worthwhile academically and professionally. Is it necessary to become highly successful? No. Anyone who truly excels at a T-50 school has a good shot at top grad school programs.

Hate to burst your bubble, but my kid from a teensy no-name college got accepted to a top-5 doctoral program, fully funded, with no experience in the field.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This kid is a serious science geek and not like that. Hope they will be happy.

A super-nice kid from one of my kid's classes went to Harvard. She does not seem changed in any negative way by the experience. She's still nice and not at all arrogant. And she seems to appreciate her education. Another super-nice kid (now 30) of a close friend went to Harvard, and that kid is an intense nerd who loved it there, but is not in any way pretentious or even self-impressed. He met his wife there, and he's so grateful for that. I've never heard him say "When I was at Harvard..." His mom, who went to a no-name state school, drops the H word as often as she can, though.