It's (finally) time for reparations. It's time for the US to pay its debt.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My white G+Grandfather died freeing the slaves fighting for the North.

My debt has been paid.

My family is on one of the state monuments at Gettysburg. Me too.

Did you read it? No one is asking you to pay.

-multiple ancestors who fought for the Union

Sure someone is. Where do you think "Congress" is going to get that money?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My white G+Grandfather died freeing the slaves fighting for the North.

My debt has been paid.

My family is on one of the state monuments at Gettysburg. Me too.

Did you read it? No one is asking you to pay.

-multiple ancestors who fought for the Union

Sure someone is. Where do you think "Congress" is going to get that money?

Print more like they've been doing for everything else lately

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My white G+Grandfather died freeing the slaves fighting for the North.

My debt has been paid.

My family is on one of the state monuments at Gettysburg. Me too.

Did you read it? No one is asking you to pay.

-multiple ancestors who fought for the Union

Sure someone is. Where do you think "Congress" is going to get that money?

Print more like they've been doing for everything else lately

Or stop giving tax cuts to billionaires and close all of the loopholes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My white G+Grandfather died freeing the slaves fighting for the North.

My debt has been paid.

My family is on one of the state monuments at Gettysburg. Me too.

Did you read it? No one is asking you to pay.

-multiple ancestors who fought for the Union

Sure someone is. Where do you think "Congress" is going to get that money?

Print more like they've been doing for everything else lately

Or stop giving tax cuts to billionaires and close all of the loopholes.

It's still partly my money and the money of the poster I quoted whose family was also on the right side of history.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm all for paying higher taxes to provide healthcare for all, better schools, and free college for lower-income kids.

I worked in development for 10 years and huge cash transfers aren't the way to go. Teach a man to fish and all that.

How about other forms of reparations?

Do you support the principle but not just handing out cash?

NP here. The principle is abhorrent. My parents and grandparents recieved Holocaust reparations from the German government. That was for their suffering. I would not accept reparations for me. I did not suffer anything close to what they went through.

On the other hand, I do believe society has an obligation to assist people who are poor today. Present conditions that keep them in poverty should be fixed. They are entitled to a decent life and opportunities. Cash is okay, but jobs at living wages is better.

Otherwise, we will be saying Oprah deserves "reparations," but a poor white who grew up in poverty deserves nothing.

What if your parents had never been paid? What if Israel wasn't formed? What if extensive systemic antisemitism was still happening today?

Did you know that the US government still pays (this year $5 million) to support Holocaust survivors living in America? And $3.8B in military aid to Israel in 2019.

Even, some slave owners were compensated:
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/16/opinion/when-slaveowners-got-reparations.html


How much has the US ever paid to survivors of slavery and other forms of black oppression?

My mother's family was compensated. Due to the vagaries of history, my father's family was not. That's how it goes. I would not accept money for him.

Military aid to Israel is not reparations. It's a military alliance. Formation of Israel was perhaps reparations, but that benefited actual refugees, and unfortunately created other refugees who are still suffering.

What about Indians? We took 100 per cent of their land. Do we give it back?

What about Chinese railroad builders? They weren't paid very well and faced years of discrimination. Do they get back compensation for what they should have been paid?

What about women for the last 5,000 years? So many were slaves to their husbands. Do today's men owe women payment for our grandfathers beating our grandmothers?


The point is, history is history. The winners and the losers all end up dead. Their joys and sufferings are over. We can't fix what happened to the dead, not even in theory.

We can however make the world better for those who suffer today. That's what we should be talking about.

Thoughts on how to bridge the wealth gap without reparations?

Focus on systemic racism issues that exist today. It's really that simple. It's disgusting to demand anything called "reparations" for something that happened 400 years ago.

400 years ago? The Civil Rights Act was only passed 56 years ago. At that point, discrimination became illegal, but nothing was done to correct existing injustices and black people still do face discrimination today. Brown v. Board of Education was decided 66 years ago, but our schools remain segregated today. All moving us in the right direction, but the harm of 400 years of slavery and oppression was never corrected and nothing lost was restored.

I agree we should work on systemic racism, but without also addressing the wealth gap we are limited in our ability to transform our country. We can't achieve racial equality until we achieve economic equality.

The harm of 400 years of slavery CANNOT be corrected. That's the point.

I didn't say anything about the wealth gap and I won't until you understand that your small bank account is a CURRENT problem, not an historical one. YOU did not lose anything. Your ancestors did. Nothing can be "restored," to dead people.

We can't resolve current problems by appealing to past injustices.

Did you even read the essay? Past and current injustices have current day manifestations.

Small bank accounts are a current problem caused by current and historical issues. The wealth gap today shows exactly what was "lost".

No it doesn't.

Black people lost a lot of wealth in DC after the riots. That is because of property value changes, not slavery. You're mixing up a lot of historical issues while ignoring recent history.

When have black people and white people had economic equality? Why are there "black neighborhoods"?

And, as discussed in the essay, the economic impacts were caused by US policies way beyond slavery. Slavery was the start, not the end. Let me know after you actually read it...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My white G+Grandfather died freeing the slaves fighting for the North.

My debt has been paid.

My family is on one of the state monuments at Gettysburg. Me too.

Did you read it? No one is asking you to pay.

-multiple ancestors who fought for the Union

Sure someone is. Where do you think "Congress" is going to get that money?

Print more like they've been doing for everything else lately

Or stop giving tax cuts to billionaires and close all of the loopholes.

It's still partly my money and the money of the poster I quoted whose family was also on the right side of history.

The US has committed great atrocities. It's (finally) time to make amends.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm all for paying higher taxes to provide healthcare for all, better schools, and free college for lower-income kids.

I worked in development for 10 years and huge cash transfers aren't the way to go. Teach a man to fish and all that.

How about other forms of reparations?

Do you support the principle but not just handing out cash?

NP here. The principle is abhorrent. My parents and grandparents recieved Holocaust reparations from the German government. That was for their suffering. I would not accept reparations for me. I did not suffer anything close to what they went through.

On the other hand, I do believe society has an obligation to assist people who are poor today. Present conditions that keep them in poverty should be fixed. They are entitled to a decent life and opportunities. Cash is okay, but jobs at living wages is better.

Otherwise, we will be saying Oprah deserves "reparations," but a poor white who grew up in poverty deserves nothing.

What if your parents had never been paid? What if Israel wasn't formed? What if extensive systemic antisemitism was still happening today?

Did you know that the US government still pays (this year $5 million) to support Holocaust survivors living in America? And $3.8B in military aid to Israel in 2019.

Even, some slave owners were compensated:
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/16/opinion/when-slaveowners-got-reparations.html


How much has the US ever paid to survivors of slavery and other forms of black oppression?

My mother's family was compensated. Due to the vagaries of history, my father's family was not. That's how it goes. I would not accept money for him.

Military aid to Israel is not reparations. It's a military alliance. Formation of Israel was perhaps reparations, but that benefited actual refugees, and unfortunately created other refugees who are still suffering.

What about Indians? We took 100 per cent of their land. Do we give it back?

What about Chinese railroad builders? They weren't paid very well and faced years of discrimination. Do they get back compensation for what they should have been paid?

What about women for the last 5,000 years? So many were slaves to their husbands. Do today's men owe women payment for our grandfathers beating our grandmothers?


The point is, history is history. The winners and the losers all end up dead. Their joys and sufferings are over. We can't fix what happened to the dead, not even in theory.

We can however make the world better for those who suffer today. That's what we should be talking about.

Thoughts on how to bridge the wealth gap without reparations?

Focus on systemic racism issues that exist today. It's really that simple. It's disgusting to demand anything called "reparations" for something that happened 400 years ago.

400 years ago? The Civil Rights Act was only passed 56 years ago. At that point, discrimination became illegal, but nothing was done to correct existing injustices and black people still do face discrimination today. Brown v. Board of Education was decided 66 years ago, but our schools remain segregated today. All moving us in the right direction, but the harm of 400 years of slavery and oppression was never corrected and nothing lost was restored.

I agree we should work on systemic racism, but without also addressing the wealth gap we are limited in our ability to transform our country. We can't achieve racial equality until we achieve economic equality.

The harm of 400 years of slavery CANNOT be corrected. That's the point.

I didn't say anything about the wealth gap and I won't until you understand that your small bank account is a CURRENT problem, not an historical one. YOU did not lose anything. Your ancestors did. Nothing can be "restored," to dead people.

We can't resolve current problems by appealing to past injustices.

Did you even read the essay? Past and current injustices have current day manifestations.

Small bank accounts are a current problem caused by current and historical issues. The wealth gap today shows exactly what was "lost".

No it doesn't.

Black people lost a lot of wealth in DC after the riots. That is because of property value changes, not slavery. You're mixing up a lot of historical issues while ignoring recent history.

When have black people and white people had economic equality? Why are there "black neighborhoods"?

And, as discussed in the essay, the economic impacts were caused by US policies way beyond slavery. Slavery was the start, not the end. Let me know after you actually read it...

Chicago got rid of redlining in the 80s. Do you think we should go back to that?

Greatschools is resegregating schools and neighborhoods. That's a real issue that you should focus on, if you want to effect change. Not reparations.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My white G+Grandfather died freeing the slaves fighting for the North.

My debt has been paid.

My family is on one of the state monuments at Gettysburg. Me too.

Did you read it? No one is asking you to pay.

-multiple ancestors who fought for the Union

Sure someone is. Where do you think "Congress" is going to get that money?

Print more like they've been doing for everything else lately

Or stop giving tax cuts to billionaires and close all of the loopholes.

It's still partly my money and the money of the poster I quoted whose family was also on the right side of history.

The US has committed great atrocities. It's (finally) time to make amends.

Let's start with your wallet.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm all for paying higher taxes to provide healthcare for all, better schools, and free college for lower-income kids.

I worked in development for 10 years and huge cash transfers aren't the way to go. Teach a man to fish and all that.

How about other forms of reparations?

Do you support the principle but not just handing out cash?

NP here. The principle is abhorrent. My parents and grandparents recieved Holocaust reparations from the German government. That was for their suffering. I would not accept reparations for me. I did not suffer anything close to what they went through.

On the other hand, I do believe society has an obligation to assist people who are poor today. Present conditions that keep them in poverty should be fixed. They are entitled to a decent life and opportunities. Cash is okay, but jobs at living wages is better.

Otherwise, we will be saying Oprah deserves "reparations," but a poor white who grew up in poverty deserves nothing.

What if your parents had never been paid? What if Israel wasn't formed? What if extensive systemic antisemitism was still happening today?

Did you know that the US government still pays (this year $5 million) to support Holocaust survivors living in America? And $3.8B in military aid to Israel in 2019.

Even, some slave owners were compensated:
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/16/opinion/when-slaveowners-got-reparations.html


How much has the US ever paid to survivors of slavery and other forms of black oppression?

My mother's family was compensated. Due to the vagaries of history, my father's family was not. That's how it goes. I would not accept money for him.

Military aid to Israel is not reparations. It's a military alliance. Formation of Israel was perhaps reparations, but that benefited actual refugees, and unfortunately created other refugees who are still suffering.

What about Indians? We took 100 per cent of their land. Do we give it back?

What about Chinese railroad builders? They weren't paid very well and faced years of discrimination. Do they get back compensation for what they should have been paid?

What about women for the last 5,000 years? So many were slaves to their husbands. Do today's men owe women payment for our grandfathers beating our grandmothers?


The point is, history is history. The winners and the losers all end up dead. Their joys and sufferings are over. We can't fix what happened to the dead, not even in theory.

We can however make the world better for those who suffer today. That's what we should be talking about.

Thoughts on how to bridge the wealth gap without reparations?

Focus on systemic racism issues that exist today. It's really that simple. It's disgusting to demand anything called "reparations" for something that happened 400 years ago.

400 years ago? The Civil Rights Act was only passed 56 years ago. At that point, discrimination became illegal, but nothing was done to correct existing injustices and black people still do face discrimination today. Brown v. Board of Education was decided 66 years ago, but our schools remain segregated today. All moving us in the right direction, but the harm of 400 years of slavery and oppression was never corrected and nothing lost was restored.

I agree we should work on systemic racism, but without also addressing the wealth gap we are limited in our ability to transform our country. We can't achieve racial equality until we achieve economic equality.

The harm of 400 years of slavery CANNOT be corrected. That's the point.

I didn't say anything about the wealth gap and I won't until you understand that your small bank account is a CURRENT problem, not an historical one. YOU did not lose anything. Your ancestors did. Nothing can be "restored," to dead people.

We can't resolve current problems by appealing to past injustices.

Did you even read the essay? Past and current injustices have current day manifestations.

Small bank accounts are a current problem caused by current and historical issues. The wealth gap today shows exactly what was "lost".

I don't need to read the essay, I've read a lot about this. I am conceptually opposed to the idea of "reparations," in any form. "Current manifestations" are the only thing needing correcting. Past injustices are past. Which is why Oprah is a billionaire and her great grandmother was a slave. What reparations does she actually deserve? On the other hand, if you are poor today for ANY reason, you deserve help. Is that so hard to understand?

[Anonymous]

I support pouring a lot of money into high quality early childhood education in poor neighborhoods. Additional staff in low income schools. Different criteria for performance of both students and staff.
Also I support financing parent education, run by someone who looks like them, speaks like them, and can gain their trust.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My white G+Grandfather died freeing the slaves fighting for the North.

My debt has been paid.

My family is on one of the state monuments at Gettysburg. Me too.

Did you read it? No one is asking you to pay.

-multiple ancestors who fought for the Union

Sure someone is. Where do you think "Congress" is going to get that money?

Print more like they've been doing for everything else lately

Or stop giving tax cuts to billionaires and close all of the loopholes.

It's still partly my money and the money of the poster I quoted whose family was also on the right side of history.

The US has committed great atrocities. It's (finally) time to make amends.

Let's start with your wallet.

Yes. I do already pay a fair share in taxes. Happy to pay more as a citizen of this country as should all other 1%ers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm all for paying higher taxes to provide healthcare for all, better schools, and free college for lower-income kids.

I worked in development for 10 years and huge cash transfers aren't the way to go. Teach a man to fish and all that.

How about other forms of reparations?

Do you support the principle but not just handing out cash?

NP here. The principle is abhorrent. My parents and grandparents recieved Holocaust reparations from the German government. That was for their suffering. I would not accept reparations for me. I did not suffer anything close to what they went through.

On the other hand, I do believe society has an obligation to assist people who are poor today. Present conditions that keep them in poverty should be fixed. They are entitled to a decent life and opportunities. Cash is okay, but jobs at living wages is better.

Otherwise, we will be saying Oprah deserves "reparations," but a poor white who grew up in poverty deserves nothing.

What if your parents had never been paid? What if Israel wasn't formed? What if extensive systemic antisemitism was still happening today?

Did you know that the US government still pays (this year $5 million) to support Holocaust survivors living in America? And $3.8B in military aid to Israel in 2019.

Even, some slave owners were compensated:
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/16/opinion/when-slaveowners-got-reparations.html


How much has the US ever paid to survivors of slavery and other forms of black oppression?

My mother's family was compensated. Due to the vagaries of history, my father's family was not. That's how it goes. I would not accept money for him.

Military aid to Israel is not reparations. It's a military alliance. Formation of Israel was perhaps reparations, but that benefited actual refugees, and unfortunately created other refugees who are still suffering.

What about Indians? We took 100 per cent of their land. Do we give it back?

What about Chinese railroad builders? They weren't paid very well and faced years of discrimination. Do they get back compensation for what they should have been paid?

What about women for the last 5,000 years? So many were slaves to their husbands. Do today's men owe women payment for our grandfathers beating our grandmothers?


The point is, history is history. The winners and the losers all end up dead. Their joys and sufferings are over. We can't fix what happened to the dead, not even in theory.

We can however make the world better for those who suffer today. That's what we should be talking about.

Thoughts on how to bridge the wealth gap without reparations?

Focus on systemic racism issues that exist today. It's really that simple. It's disgusting to demand anything called "reparations" for something that happened 400 years ago.

400 years ago? The Civil Rights Act was only passed 56 years ago. At that point, discrimination became illegal, but nothing was done to correct existing injustices and black people still do face discrimination today. Brown v. Board of Education was decided 66 years ago, but our schools remain segregated today. All moving us in the right direction, but the harm of 400 years of slavery and oppression was never corrected and nothing lost was restored.

I agree we should work on systemic racism, but without also addressing the wealth gap we are limited in our ability to transform our country. We can't achieve racial equality until we achieve economic equality.

The harm of 400 years of slavery CANNOT be corrected. That's the point.

I didn't say anything about the wealth gap and I won't until you understand that your small bank account is a CURRENT problem, not an historical one. YOU did not lose anything. Your ancestors did. Nothing can be "restored," to dead people.

We can't resolve current problems by appealing to past injustices.

Did you even read the essay? Past and current injustices have current day manifestations.

Small bank accounts are a current problem caused by current and historical issues. The wealth gap today shows exactly what was "lost".

No it doesn't.

Black people lost a lot of wealth in DC after the riots. That is because of property value changes, not slavery. You're mixing up a lot of historical issues while ignoring recent history.

When have black people and white people had economic equality? Why are there "black neighborhoods"?

And, as discussed in the essay, the economic impacts were caused by US policies way beyond slavery. Slavery was the start, not the end. Let me know after you actually read it...

Chicago got rid of redlining in the 80s. Do you think we should go back to that?

Greatschools is resegregating schools and neighborhoods. That's a real issue that you should focus on, if you want to effect change. Not reparations.

So your solutions to the wealth gap are...reinstating redlining and eliminating Great Schools?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm all for paying higher taxes to provide healthcare for all, better schools, and free college for lower-income kids.

I worked in development for 10 years and huge cash transfers aren't the way to go. Teach a man to fish and all that.

How about other forms of reparations?

Do you support the principle but not just handing out cash?

NP here. The principle is abhorrent. My parents and grandparents recieved Holocaust reparations from the German government. That was for their suffering. I would not accept reparations for me. I did not suffer anything close to what they went through.

On the other hand, I do believe society has an obligation to assist people who are poor today. Present conditions that keep them in poverty should be fixed. They are entitled to a decent life and opportunities. Cash is okay, but jobs at living wages is better.

Otherwise, we will be saying Oprah deserves "reparations," but a poor white who grew up in poverty deserves nothing.

What if your parents had never been paid? What if Israel wasn't formed? What if extensive systemic antisemitism was still happening today?

Did you know that the US government still pays (this year $5 million) to support Holocaust survivors living in America? And $3.8B in military aid to Israel in 2019.

Even, some slave owners were compensated:
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/16/opinion/when-slaveowners-got-reparations.html


How much has the US ever paid to survivors of slavery and other forms of black oppression?

My mother's family was compensated. Due to the vagaries of history, my father's family was not. That's how it goes. I would not accept money for him.

Military aid to Israel is not reparations. It's a military alliance. Formation of Israel was perhaps reparations, but that benefited actual refugees, and unfortunately created other refugees who are still suffering.

What about Indians? We took 100 per cent of their land. Do we give it back?

What about Chinese railroad builders? They weren't paid very well and faced years of discrimination. Do they get back compensation for what they should have been paid?

What about women for the last 5,000 years? So many were slaves to their husbands. Do today's men owe women payment for our grandfathers beating our grandmothers?


The point is, history is history. The winners and the losers all end up dead. Their joys and sufferings are over. We can't fix what happened to the dead, not even in theory.

We can however make the world better for those who suffer today. That's what we should be talking about.

Thoughts on how to bridge the wealth gap without reparations?

Focus on systemic racism issues that exist today. It's really that simple. It's disgusting to demand anything called "reparations" for something that happened 400 years ago.

400 years ago? The Civil Rights Act was only passed 56 years ago. At that point, discrimination became illegal, but nothing was done to correct existing injustices and black people still do face discrimination today. Brown v. Board of Education was decided 66 years ago, but our schools remain segregated today. All moving us in the right direction, but the harm of 400 years of slavery and oppression was never corrected and nothing lost was restored.

I agree we should work on systemic racism, but without also addressing the wealth gap we are limited in our ability to transform our country. We can't achieve racial equality until we achieve economic equality.

The harm of 400 years of slavery CANNOT be corrected. That's the point.

I didn't say anything about the wealth gap and I won't until you understand that your small bank account is a CURRENT problem, not an historical one. YOU did not lose anything. Your ancestors did. Nothing can be "restored," to dead people.

We can't resolve current problems by appealing to past injustices.

Did you even read the essay? Past and current injustices have current day manifestations.

Small bank accounts are a current problem caused by current and historical issues. The wealth gap today shows exactly what was "lost".

No it doesn't.

Black people lost a lot of wealth in DC after the riots. That is because of property value changes, not slavery. You're mixing up a lot of historical issues while ignoring recent history.

When have black people and white people had economic equality? Why are there "black neighborhoods"?

And, as discussed in the essay, the economic impacts were caused by US policies way beyond slavery. Slavery was the start, not the end. Let me know after you actually read it...

Chicago got rid of redlining in the 80s. Do you think we should go back to that?

Greatschools is resegregating schools and neighborhoods. That's a real issue that you should focus on, if you want to effect change. Not reparations.

So your solutions to the wealth gap are...reinstating redlining and eliminating Great Schools?

No, I mentioned redlining because you referenced it.

However, we now have legal de facto resegregation occurring. I don't know how to address this. Maybe you have some ideas.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm all for paying higher taxes to provide healthcare for all, better schools, and free college for lower-income kids.

I worked in development for 10 years and huge cash transfers aren't the way to go. Teach a man to fish and all that.

How about other forms of reparations?

Do you support the principle but not just handing out cash?

NP here. The principle is abhorrent. My parents and grandparents recieved Holocaust reparations from the German government. That was for their suffering. I would not accept reparations for me. I did not suffer anything close to what they went through.

On the other hand, I do believe society has an obligation to assist people who are poor today. Present conditions that keep them in poverty should be fixed. They are entitled to a decent life and opportunities. Cash is okay, but jobs at living wages is better.

Otherwise, we will be saying Oprah deserves "reparations," but a poor white who grew up in poverty deserves nothing.

What if your parents had never been paid? What if Israel wasn't formed? What if extensive systemic antisemitism was still happening today?

Did you know that the US government still pays (this year $5 million) to support Holocaust survivors living in America? And $3.8B in military aid to Israel in 2019.

Even, some slave owners were compensated:
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/16/opinion/when-slaveowners-got-reparations.html


How much has the US ever paid to survivors of slavery and other forms of black oppression?

My mother's family was compensated. Due to the vagaries of history, my father's family was not. That's how it goes. I would not accept money for him.

Military aid to Israel is not reparations. It's a military alliance. Formation of Israel was perhaps reparations, but that benefited actual refugees, and unfortunately created other refugees who are still suffering.

What about Indians? We took 100 per cent of their land. Do we give it back?

What about Chinese railroad builders? They weren't paid very well and faced years of discrimination. Do they get back compensation for what they should have been paid?

What about women for the last 5,000 years? So many were slaves to their husbands. Do today's men owe women payment for our grandfathers beating our grandmothers?


The point is, history is history. The winners and the losers all end up dead. Their joys and sufferings are over. We can't fix what happened to the dead, not even in theory.

We can however make the world better for those who suffer today. That's what we should be talking about.

Thoughts on how to bridge the wealth gap without reparations?

Focus on systemic racism issues that exist today. It's really that simple. It's disgusting to demand anything called "reparations" for something that happened 400 years ago.

400 years ago? The Civil Rights Act was only passed 56 years ago. At that point, discrimination became illegal, but nothing was done to correct existing injustices and black people still do face discrimination today. Brown v. Board of Education was decided 66 years ago, but our schools remain segregated today. All moving us in the right direction, but the harm of 400 years of slavery and oppression was never corrected and nothing lost was restored.

I agree we should work on systemic racism, but without also addressing the wealth gap we are limited in our ability to transform our country. We can't achieve racial equality until we achieve economic equality.

The harm of 400 years of slavery CANNOT be corrected. That's the point.

I didn't say anything about the wealth gap and I won't until you understand that your small bank account is a CURRENT problem, not an historical one. YOU did not lose anything. Your ancestors did. Nothing can be "restored," to dead people.

We can't resolve current problems by appealing to past injustices.

Did you even read the essay? Past and current injustices have current day manifestations.

Small bank accounts are a current problem caused by current and historical issues. The wealth gap today shows exactly what was "lost".

I don't need to read the essay, I've read a lot about this. I am conceptually opposed to the idea of "reparations," in any form. "Current manifestations" are the only thing needing correcting. Past injustices are past. Which is why Oprah is a billionaire and her great grandmother was a slave. What reparations does she actually deserve? On the other hand, if you are poor today for ANY reason, you deserve help. Is that so hard to understand?

Like I said in my OP, this essay really changed my mind. It’s a shame you’re unwilling to take the time to read it so we can discuss.

Past injustices absolutely have current day manifestations. How equal are schools? Property values in black v. white neighborhoods? Why do we have such a huge wealth gap?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I'm all for paying higher taxes to provide healthcare for all, better schools, and free college for lower-income kids.

I worked in development for 10 years and huge cash transfers aren't the way to go. Teach a man to fish and all that.

How about other forms of reparations?

Do you support the principle but not just handing out cash?

NP here. The principle is abhorrent. My parents and grandparents recieved Holocaust reparations from the German government. That was for their suffering. I would not accept reparations for me. I did not suffer anything close to what they went through.

On the other hand, I do believe society has an obligation to assist people who are poor today. Present conditions that keep them in poverty should be fixed. They are entitled to a decent life and opportunities. Cash is okay, but jobs at living wages is better.

Otherwise, we will be saying Oprah deserves "reparations," but a poor white who grew up in poverty deserves nothing.

What if your parents had never been paid? What if Israel wasn't formed? What if extensive systemic antisemitism was still happening today?

Did you know that the US government still pays (this year $5 million) to support Holocaust survivors living in America? And $3.8B in military aid to Israel in 2019.

Even, some slave owners were compensated:
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/16/opinion/when-slaveowners-got-reparations.html


How much has the US ever paid to survivors of slavery and other forms of black oppression?

My mother's family was compensated. Due to the vagaries of history, my father's family was not. That's how it goes. I would not accept money for him.

Military aid to Israel is not reparations. It's a military alliance. Formation of Israel was perhaps reparations, but that benefited actual refugees, and unfortunately created other refugees who are still suffering.

What about Indians? We took 100 per cent of their land. Do we give it back?

What about Chinese railroad builders? They weren't paid very well and faced years of discrimination. Do they get back compensation for what they should have been paid?

What about women for the last 5,000 years? So many were slaves to their husbands. Do today's men owe women payment for our grandfathers beating our grandmothers?


The point is, history is history. The winners and the losers all end up dead. Their joys and sufferings are over. We can't fix what happened to the dead, not even in theory.

We can however make the world better for those who suffer today. That's what we should be talking about.

Thoughts on how to bridge the wealth gap without reparations?

Focus on systemic racism issues that exist today. It's really that simple. It's disgusting to demand anything called "reparations" for something that happened 400 years ago.

400 years ago? The Civil Rights Act was only passed 56 years ago. At that point, discrimination became illegal, but nothing was done to correct existing injustices and black people still do face discrimination today. Brown v. Board of Education was decided 66 years ago, but our schools remain segregated today. All moving us in the right direction, but the harm of 400 years of slavery and oppression was never corrected and nothing lost was restored.

I agree we should work on systemic racism, but without also addressing the wealth gap we are limited in our ability to transform our country. We can't achieve racial equality until we achieve economic equality.

The harm of 400 years of slavery CANNOT be corrected. That's the point.

I didn't say anything about the wealth gap and I won't until you understand that your small bank account is a CURRENT problem, not an historical one. YOU did not lose anything. Your ancestors did. Nothing can be "restored," to dead people.

We can't resolve current problems by appealing to past injustices.

Did you even read the essay? Past and current injustices have current day manifestations.

Small bank accounts are a current problem caused by current and historical issues. The wealth gap today shows exactly what was "lost".

I don't need to read the essay, I've read a lot about this. I am conceptually opposed to the idea of "reparations," in any form. "Current manifestations" are the only thing needing correcting. Past injustices are past. Which is why Oprah is a billionaire and her great grandmother was a slave. What reparations does she actually deserve? On the other hand, if you are poor today for ANY reason, you deserve help. Is that so hard to understand?

Like I said in my OP, this essay really changed my mind. It’s a shame you’re unwilling to take the time to read it so we can discuss.

Past injustices absolutely have current day manifestations. How equal are schools? Property values in black v. white neighborhoods? Why do we have such a huge wealth gap?

Because of the past 20-30 years. That's all, not longer.