Guiliani, Trump, and Ukraine

[Anonymous]

This is a good summary and mind-bogging. Complete abuse of power by the president to try to lay the groundwork to get his crony pardoned, and to help is own campaign.

https://www.nybooks.com/daily/2019/09/25/trump-giuliani-and-manafort-the-ukraine-scheme/

The effort by President Trump to pressure the government of Ukraine to investigate former Vice President Joe Biden and his son had its origins in an earlier endeavor to obtain information that might provide a pretext and political cover for the president to pardon his former campaign chairman, Paul Manafort, according to previously undisclosed records.

These records indicate that attorneys representing Trump and Manafort respectively had at least nine conversations relating to this effort, beginning in the early days of the Trump administration, and lasting until as recently as May of this year. Through these deliberations carried on by his attorneys, Manafort exhorted the White House to press Ukrainian officials to investigate and discredit individuals, both in the US and in Ukraine, who he believed had published damning information about his political consulting work in the Ukraine. A person who participated in the joint defense agreement between President Trump and others under investigation by Special Counsel Robert Mueller, including Manafort, allowed me to review extensive handwritten notes that memorialized conversations relating to Manafort and Ukraine between Manafort’s and Trump’s legal teams, including Trump’s personal attorney, Rudy Giuliani.

The records I have reviewed also indicate that on at least three occasions, Rudy Giuliani was in communication with Manafort’s legal team to discuss how the White House was pushing a narrative that the Democratic National Committee, Democratic donors, and Ukrainian government officials had “colluded” to defeat Donald Trump’s 2016 presidential bid. (This story has since been debunked as baseless, though that has not prevented Trump, Giuliani, and other surrogates in conservative media from repeatedly pushing the story.)

In particular, the records show that Manafort’s camp provided Giuliani with information designed to smear two people: one was a Ukrainian journalist and political activist named Serhiy Leshchenko, whom Manafort believed, correctly, of helping to uncover Manafort’s secret payments from Yanukovych; another was Alexandra Chalupa, a Ukrainian-American political consultant and US citizen, whom Manafort suspected, mistakenly in this case, was also behind the exposé. The records also show that Giuliani and attorneys for Manafort exchanged information about the then US ambassador to the Ukraine, Marie Yovanovitch, who Giuliani believed had attempted to undercut his covert Ukrainian diplomacy and fact-finding;

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is a good summary and mind-bogging. Complete abuse of power by the president to try to lay the groundwork to get his crony pardoned, and to help is own campaign.

https://www.nybooks.com/daily/2019/09/25/trump-giuliani-and-manafort-the-ukraine-scheme/

The effort by President Trump to pressure the government of Ukraine to investigate former Vice President Joe Biden and his son had its origins in an earlier endeavor to obtain information that might provide a pretext and political cover for the president to pardon his former campaign chairman, Paul Manafort, according to previously undisclosed records.

These records indicate that attorneys representing Trump and Manafort respectively had at least nine conversations relating to this effort, beginning in the early days of the Trump administration, and lasting until as recently as May of this year. Through these deliberations carried on by his attorneys, Manafort exhorted the White House to press Ukrainian officials to investigate and discredit individuals, both in the US and in Ukraine, who he believed had published damning information about his political consulting work in the Ukraine. A person who participated in the joint defense agreement between President Trump and others under investigation by Special Counsel Robert Mueller, including Manafort, allowed me to review extensive handwritten notes that memorialized conversations relating to Manafort and Ukraine between Manafort’s and Trump’s legal teams, including Trump’s personal attorney, Rudy Giuliani.

The records I have reviewed also indicate that on at least three occasions, Rudy Giuliani was in communication with Manafort’s legal team to discuss how the White House was pushing a narrative that the Democratic National Committee, Democratic donors, and Ukrainian government officials had “colluded” to defeat Donald Trump’s 2016 presidential bid. (This story has since been debunked as baseless, though that has not prevented Trump, Giuliani, and other surrogates in conservative media from repeatedly pushing the story.)

In particular, the records show that Manafort’s camp provided Giuliani with information designed to smear two people: one was a Ukrainian journalist and political activist named Serhiy Leshchenko, whom Manafort believed, correctly, of helping to uncover Manafort’s secret payments from Yanukovych; another was Alexandra Chalupa, a Ukrainian-American political consultant and US citizen, whom Manafort suspected, mistakenly in this case, was also behind the exposé. The records also show that Giuliani and attorneys for Manafort exchanged information about the then US ambassador to the Ukraine, Marie Yovanovitch, who Giuliani believed had attempted to undercut his covert Ukrainian diplomacy and fact-finding;

Read the entire piece, but note especially the bolded above. Bat-sh!t crazy.

[Anonymous]

Ex-Ukraine prosecutor general: "Hunter Biden cannot be responsible for violations of the management of Burisma that took place two years before his arrival."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Ex-Ukraine prosecutor general: "Hunter Biden cannot be responsible for violations of the management of Burisma that took place two years before his arrival."

What about the other violations?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ex-Ukraine prosecutor general: "Hunter Biden cannot be responsible for violations of the management of Burisma that took place two years before his arrival."

What about the other violations?

More relevantly, can Donald J. Trump be responsible for violations that the president undertakes while he is the president?

[Anonymous]

oh boy rudy sounds like he is going to take everyone down with him

https://twitter.com/TheViewFromLL2/status/1177252712360108033



from this story:

https://www.cnn.com/2019/09/26/politics/giuliani-denies-charges-whistleblower-complaint-ukraine/index.html

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:oh boy rudy sounds like he is going to take everyone down with him

https://twitter.com/TheViewFromLL2/status/1177252712360108033



from this story:

https://www.cnn.com/2019/09/26/politics/giuliani-denies-charges-whistleblower-complaint-ukraine/index.html

Like all criminal attorneys, Rudy knows what prison is like. No way is he going to let himself be the fall guy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:oh boy rudy sounds like he is going to take everyone down with him

https://twitter.com/TheViewFromLL2/status/1177252712360108033



from this story:

https://www.cnn.com/2019/09/26/politics/giuliani-denies-charges-whistleblower-complaint-ukraine/index.html

Like all criminal attorneys, Rudy knows what prison is like. No way is he going to let himself be the fall guy.

For once, I could support a "broken-windows" prosecutor who would insist on prosecuting every possible crime committed by these guys.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:oh boy rudy sounds like he is going to take everyone down with him

https://twitter.com/TheViewFromLL2/status/1177252712360108033



from this story:

https://www.cnn.com/2019/09/26/politics/giuliani-denies-charges-whistleblower-complaint-ukraine/index.html

Like all criminal attorneys, Rudy knows what prison is like. No way is he going to let himself be the fall guy.

“When I reached him by phone this morning, following House Intelligence Committee Chairman Adam Schiff’s release of the full whistle-blower complaint at the center of the Ukraine scandal, he was, put simply, very angry.

“It is impossible that the whistle-blower is a hero and I’m not. And I will be the hero! These morons—when this is over, I will be the hero,” Giuliani told me.”
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2019/09/giuliani-ukraine-trump-biden/598879/

[Anonymous]

Ukrainian President says that Trump told him we'll help them get Crimea back.

https://www.unian.info/politics/10698891-zelensky-says-trump-vows-to-help-return-annexed-crimea.html

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky has said U.S. President Donald Trump during the meeting promised to help him to return Russian-annexed Crimea. "A very interesting story about Crimea. You know there were statements that if people there speak Russian, it is no longer Ukraine... I explained to him that this is our land; we have no issues about communication or language – we have a state language, and it's Ukrainian," he told journalists following a meeting with Trump in New York, according to an UNIAN correspondent.

According to Zelensky, he told Trump that "Crimea is a beautiful place" and "it is a large beautiful part of our country." "It seems to me, and I heard that he agrees that this is our native land and we will get it back, and he says: 'Yes, you need to work, and we will help you'," he said.

[Anonymous]

Former Ukraine prosecutor says Hunter Biden ‘did not violate anything’

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/former-ukraine-prosecutor-says-hunter-biden-did-not-violate-anything/2019/09/26/48801f66-e068-11e9-be7f-4cc85017c36f_story.html?outputType=amp&__twitter_impression=true

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Ukrainian President says that Trump told him we'll help them get Crimea back.

https://www.unian.info/politics/10698891-zelensky-says-trump-vows-to-help-return-annexed-crimea.html

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky has said U.S. President Donald Trump during the meeting promised to help him to return Russian-annexed Crimea. "A very interesting story about Crimea. You know there were statements that if people there speak Russian, it is no longer Ukraine... I explained to him that this is our land; we have no issues about communication or language – we have a state language, and it's Ukrainian," he told journalists following a meeting with Trump in New York, according to an UNIAN correspondent.

According to Zelensky, he told Trump that "Crimea is a beautiful place" and "it is a large beautiful part of our country." "It seems to me, and I heard that he agrees that this is our native land and we will get it back, and he says: 'Yes, you need to work, and we will help you'," he said.

What Trump didn't tell him was that he supports the one-state solution for Crimea, with the state being Russia. So ya, when he says "we will get it back" the 'we" is Russia/Putin.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:oh boy rudy sounds like he is going to take everyone down with him

https://twitter.com/TheViewFromLL2/status/1177252712360108033



from this story:

https://www.cnn.com/2019/09/26/politics/giuliani-denies-charges-whistleblower-complaint-ukraine/index.html

Like all criminal attorneys, Rudy knows what prison is like. No way is he going to let himself be the fall guy.

“When I reached him by phone this morning, following House Intelligence Committee Chairman Adam Schiff’s release of the full whistle-blower complaint at the center of the Ukraine scandal, he was, put simply, very angry.

“It is impossible that the whistle-blower is a hero and I’m not. And I will be the hero! These morons—when this is over, I will be the hero,” Giuliani told me.”
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2019/09/giuliani-ukraine-trump-biden/598879/

So if Rudy wasn’t acting as a lawyer none of this is privileged.

[Anonymous]

All anyone needs to know in two related quotes:

"I want to know who's the person who gave the whistle-blower the information because that's close to a spy.”

"You know what we used to do in the old days when we were smart with spies and treason, right? We used to handle it a little differently than we do now."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:oh boy rudy sounds like he is going to take everyone down with him

https://twitter.com/TheViewFromLL2/status/1177252712360108033



from this story:

https://www.cnn.com/2019/09/26/politics/giuliani-denies-charges-whistleblower-complaint-ukraine/index.html

Like all criminal attorneys, Rudy knows what prison is like. No way is he going to let himself be the fall guy.

“When I reached him by phone this morning, following House Intelligence Committee Chairman Adam Schiff’s release of the full whistle-blower complaint at the center of the Ukraine scandal, he was, put simply, very angry.

“It is impossible that the whistle-blower is a hero and I’m not. And I will be the hero! These morons—when this is over, I will be the hero,” Giuliani told me.”
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2019/09/giuliani-ukraine-trump-biden/598879/

I wish I'd saved the comment because it's lost. A poster on Reddit Politics a few weeks ago under a "where's Rudy" topic said he was a waiter in NYC and Rudy orders and consumes an entire fifth of a very expensive bourbon with dinner regularly. This is just rumor but maybe he's an end stage alcoholic. I certainly think he was drunk on Cuomo the other night. He spits and sputters when he's angry.

Rudy should be subpoenaed while his anger is fresh and his judgement is poor. Too bad Congress is starting a two week break on Friday. IMO it should be cancelled if national security is truly on the line.