I just scooped the DCPCSB - 2018 tiers

[Anonymous]

Good grief. the PMF and the tiering are only marginally helpful to anyone if you really want to know what is going on at a school. It is not apples to apples and it is really unfortunate that the stupid DCPCSB likes to pretend that it is. It is also unfortunate that stupid DC is wedded to the PARCC even though almost the entire rest of the country has kicked that crappy assessment tot he curb. Anyway, the same thing is true that has been true since the beginning of time: if you are a white high SES kid, you will always be fine. This is why the parents at CMI do not care about their tiering - that white, fake progressive crowd knows their kids will be fine regardless of the tier of their school on the stupid PMF.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Good grief. the PMF and the tiering are only marginally helpful to anyone if you really want to know what is going on at a school. It is not apples to apples and it is really unfortunate that the stupid DCPCSB likes to pretend that it is. It is also unfortunate that stupid DC is wedded to the PARCC even though almost the entire rest of the country has kicked that crappy assessment tot he curb. Anyway, the same thing is true that has been true since the beginning of time: if you are a white high SES kid, you will always be fine. This is why the parents at CMI do not care about their tiering - that white, fake progressive crowd knows their kids will be fine regardless of the tier of their school on the stupid PMF.

No one (except some anonymous DCUM poster who have to try and 'rank' people by the scores) claims that the PMF is apples to apples, including and especially the PCSB.

If you don't think they are useful, ignore them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Good grief. the PMF and the tiering are only marginally helpful to anyone if you really want to know what is going on at a school. It is not apples to apples and it is really unfortunate that the stupid DCPCSB likes to pretend that it is. It is also unfortunate that stupid DC is wedded to the PARCC even though almost the entire rest of the country has kicked that crappy assessment tot he curb. Anyway, the same thing is true that has been true since the beginning of time: if you are a white high SES kid, you will always be fine. This is why the parents at CMI do not care about their tiering - that white, fake progressive crowd knows their kids will be fine regardless of the tier of their school on the stupid PMF.

I argue the best things to read when assessing schools are the QSRs

[Anonymous]

To 22:12 - if the DCPCSB does not believe their tiering is apples to apples then why are they tiering? Th y very much promote their tiering and make sweeping statements about it. Where are you getting your information that says something different?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:To 22:12 - if the DCPCSB does not believe their tiering is apples to apples then why are they tiering? Th y very much promote their tiering and make sweeping statements about it. Where are you getting your information that says something different?

The tiers are really wide bands. My point is that 'ranking' within the #1s and #2s is rather silly. Depending on the school's state of development and grades different measures are used; e.g. a newer high school with no graduates yet isn't be measured on graduation and/or college acceptance. So comparing them to the high schools that have graduates is of limited utility, but each measure within the ranking is still useful / interesting and worth watching for year over year trends.


Also if you dislike the tiers, you are gonna HATE the new star ratings that are coming out for ALL DC schools from OSSE soon.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Good grief. the PMF and the tiering are only marginally helpful to anyone if you really want to know what is going on at a school. It is not apples to apples and it is really unfortunate that the stupid DCPCSB likes to pretend that it is. It is also unfortunate that stupid DC is wedded to the PARCC even though almost the entire rest of the country has kicked that crappy assessment tot he curb. Anyway, the same thing is true that has been true since the beginning of time: if you are a white high SES kid, you will always be fine. This is why the parents at CMI do not care about their tiering - that white, fake progressive crowd knows their kids will be fine regardless of the tier of their school on the stupid PMF.

- signed CMI parent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

As discussed above, students have a growth percentile calculated against similarly scoring students, not all kids in their age group. So there is no inherent advantage in having any specific group at the school in terms of the growth score. There is, of course, for overall testing levels, which is 35% of the PMF.

Of course there is an inherent advantage. Read the Equity Report. White students in the district have an average growth score of 65. Black students have average growth of 46. This disparity in growth remains true even in "high performing" schools.

The listing in the equity reports compares average growth for white students to all students in DC. Same for the listing for black students, Hispanic, etc. Each group is being compared to the entire city.

The listing for each school in the PMF is calculated by doing a "Student Growth Percentile" for each individual student. The system matches that student with a cohort of students who scored similarly on the test last year. That student's growth is then compared to the average growth of that cohort, NOT the average growth across the entire city. The individual Student Growth Percentiles are then averaged out to produce the entire school's Median Growth Percentile.

Therefore, the calculation is a true test of a school's ability to help a student grow, because it is comparing that student to similarly scoring cohort. Now, you can get into all sorts of discussions about what tests are testing, the appropriateness of the tests, cultural bias, etc. But the way they are measuring a school's Median Growth Percentile is internally consistent.

And again, this is separate from the score for testing achievement, which is 35% of a school's overall score. That is, no doubt, tied almost directly to the overall socioeconomic makeup of the student body.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Good grief. the PMF and the tiering are only marginally helpful to anyone if you really want to know what is going on at a school.

I think it is more than marginally helpful, but by no means the only way to assess what is going on at a school. As someone above said, the QSR's are a great resource as well

It is not apples to apples and it is really unfortunate that the stupid DCPCSB likes to pretend that it is.

It is not a perfect system but I think probably as close as you can get to "apples to apples" as can reasonably be achieved for something as difficult to assess and compare as schools made up of hundreds of kids and staff. I went to a college where 90% of the people I knew loved it. But it was not great for those 10%, and it didn't matter if you told them 90% of the people were happy.

It is also unfortunate that stupid DC is wedded to the PARCC even though almost the entire rest of the country has kicked that crappy assessment tot he curb.

High stakes testing and PARCC are good because they force school and political leaders to face up to the challenges of the achievement gap- it makes it more obvious. But the idea of sitting kids down every year for 6 years in a row for this test seems like overkill

Anyway, the same thing is true that has been true since the beginning of time: if you are a white high SES kid, you will always be fine.

Statistically true. America is pretty much set up that way, let's be honest.

This is why the parents at CMI do not care about their tiering - that white, fake progressive crowd knows their kids will be fine regardless of the tier of their school on the stupid PMF.

Don't really know any parents at CMI, but I have been surprised by the number of people in this general crowd who ARE super worried about their kids, despite the statistical truth above

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Good grief. the PMF and the tiering are only marginally helpful to anyone if you really want to know what is going on at a school.

I think it is more than marginally helpful, but by no means the only way to assess what is going on at a school. As someone above said, the QSR's are a great resource as well

It is not apples to apples and it is really unfortunate that the stupid DCPCSB likes to pretend that it is.

It is not a perfect system but I think probably as close as you can get to "apples to apples" as can reasonably be achieved for something as difficult to assess and compare as schools made up of hundreds of kids and staff. I went to a college where 90% of the people I knew loved it. But it was not great for those 10%, and it didn't matter if you told them 90% of the people were happy.

It is also unfortunate that stupid DC is wedded to the PARCC even though almost the entire rest of the country has kicked that crappy assessment tot he curb.

High stakes testing and PARCC are good because they force school and political leaders to face up to the challenges of the achievement gap- it makes it more obvious. But the idea of sitting kids down every year for 6 years in a row for this test seems like overkill

Anyway, the same thing is true that has been true since the beginning of time: if you are a white high SES kid, you will always be fine.

Statistically true. America is pretty much set up that way, let's be honest.

This is why the parents at CMI do not care about their tiering - that white, fake progressive crowd knows their kids will be fine regardless of the tier of their school on the stupid PMF.

Don't really know any parents at CMI, but I have been surprised by the number of people in this general crowd who ARE super worried about their kids, despite the statistical truth above

Actually I think this is a total myth that your kid will be just fine anywhere. It's not true. They will learn more in some settings than others, period. Because some things will be taught better in some settings, say, ones where a teacher is better skilled or classrooms are better managed. Education is certainly cultural transmission, and maybe we should be less opaque about that part of it and just spell that out (not just saying oh you're racist, but admit it's valid that it be cultural transmission, that's actually a neutral statement, it's what you wish to be transmitting that can vary).

But from a purely academic standpoint, there is a kid who's challenged and engaged and there's a kid who isn't. This measurement is supposed to take that into account as best it can.

[Anonymous]

So according to the other thread, the math is wrong on the SSMA tiering and they should actually be Tier Two? Now I need to go check the math on all the schools!

[Anonymous]

How embarrassing for the DCPCSB!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Good grief. the PMF and the tiering are only marginally helpful to anyone if you really want to know what is going on at a school.

I think it is more than marginally helpful, but by no means the only way to assess what is going on at a school. As someone above said, the QSR's are a great resource as well

It is not apples to apples and it is really unfortunate that the stupid DCPCSB likes to pretend that it is.

It is not a perfect system but I think probably as close as you can get to "apples to apples" as can reasonably be achieved for something as difficult to assess and compare as schools made up of hundreds of kids and staff. I went to a college where 90% of the people I knew loved it. But it was not great for those 10%, and it didn't matter if you told them 90% of the people were happy.

It is also unfortunate that stupid DC is wedded to the PARCC even though almost the entire rest of the country has kicked that crappy assessment tot he curb.

High stakes testing and PARCC are good because they force school and political leaders to face up to the challenges of the achievement gap- it makes it more obvious. But the idea of sitting kids down every year for 6 years in a row for this test seems like overkill

Anyway, the same thing is true that has been true since the beginning of time: if you are a white high SES kid, you will always be fine.

Statistically true. America is pretty much set up that way, let's be honest.

This is why the parents at CMI do not care about their tiering - that white, fake progressive crowd knows their kids will be fine regardless of the tier of their school on the stupid PMF.

Don't really know any parents at CMI, but I have been surprised by the number of people in this general crowd who ARE super worried about their kids, despite the statistical truth above

Actually I think this is a total myth that your kid will be just fine anywhere. It's not true. They will learn more in some settings than others, period. Because some things will be taught better in some settings, say, ones where a teacher is better skilled or classrooms are better managed. Education is certainly cultural transmission, and maybe we should be less opaque about that part of it and just spell that out (not just saying oh you're racist, but admit it's valid that it be cultural transmission, that's actually a neutral statement, it's what you wish to be transmitting that can vary).

But from a purely academic standpoint, there is a kid who's challenged and engaged and there's a kid who isn't. This measurement is supposed to take that into account as best it can.

My white, upper SES did not do well at CMI. What does that say about us? Child is “thriving” (isn’t that the CMI word) at another school. It wasn’t our money or whiteness.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How embarrassing for the DCPCSB!

Between the accidental early release and this, I really feel for whomever there is going to get the heat for these mistakes.

[Anonymous]

I mean, an agency assessing match progress cannot add...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I mean, an agency assessing match progress cannot add...

Put down the tumbler and try again.