DD wants top SLACs But Doesn't Have Grades

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Aren't you supposed to ED reaches? Other kid has top grades on a demanding schedule is thinking of EDing Yale or Dartmouth. I am telling him Dartmouth because a little easier.

You should do ED if your stats are a match or above for a first choice school that is highly selective enough that it is a reach even for those who are above stats. It's often considered a waste of ED if you fall below any 50% metric in a school where you have no hook and the overall acceptance rate is below 25-30% unless it truly is your top school. If you're just trying to get into a top SLAC and doesn't matter which one among a few, should choose the one where you are most likely (e.g. have a hook they value, stats that are nearer the 75%ile). ED really only gets you a very slight advantage if you're already a match. They are happy to have ED candidates to defer/reject since ED is coming under scrutiny.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Aren't you supposed to ED reaches? Other kid has top grades on a demanding schedule is thinking of EDing Yale or Dartmouth. I am telling him Dartmouth because a little easier.

You should do ED if your stats are a match or above for a first choice school that is highly selective enough that it is a reach even for those who are above stats. It's often considered a waste of ED if you fall below any 50% metric in a school where you have no hook and the overall acceptance rate is below 25-30% unless it truly is your top school. If you're just trying to get into a top SLAC and doesn't matter which one among a few, should choose the one where you are most likely (e.g. have a hook they value, stats that are nearer the 75%ile). ED really only gets you a very slight advantage if you're already a match. They are happy to have ED candidates to defer/reject since ED is coming under scrutiny.

Agreed. Our kids (and a number of our friends’ kids) burned the ED by thinking it was a ticket to apply well above their qualifications. It wasn’t realistic and we’d do it differently. ED once normalized for more competitive pool and athletes (the unavailability of data relating to the latter making said normalization impossible) isn’t the advantage advertised. My advice would be to treat it as a minor bump to an application. These schools can find their 25th percentile applicants with their eyes closed, so don’t expect them to get too excited. Use it for a reach, absolutely, but a modest one.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:0 chance at Amherst, Williams, Swarthmore, Bowdoin, Pomona, and Claremont McKenna. Not even worth bothering applying to these. All are in the selectivity ballpark of the Ivies and equivalent. They do not admit B students unless it's a highly grade deflated school they're familiar with.

Middlebury, Carleton, Davidson, Wellesley, Washington and Lee, Vassar, Haverford, Wesleyan would be reaches. If D really likes one or multiple, strongly encourage ED1 or ED2.

Other SLACs in the top 50 (Grinnell, Bates, Colgate, Scripps, Kenyon, etc) are matches.

Let go of the Amherst obsession and be realistic. Many of the attainable reaches are just as good as Amherst, and many have a similar culture.

That is not a positive

[Anonymous]

To console your daughter...has she visited Amherst?

We did not like it. While the town look charming/fun, the campus is not really separate (my DD preferred Mount Holyoke, in that you could have quiet and peace to study OR take the shuttle 20 minutes to the fun/college town of Amherst). We found our tour guide (okay, that is one person but...) to be snobby/arrogant. For example, she said her favorite event on campus is when they have skits that MAKE FUN of the essays of kids who did not get in. I kid you not, that is what she said was her favorite "tradition" on campus. That was all we needed to hear....

[Anonymous]

This is still going on?

She doesn't have the grades, then she doesn't get to go.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:0 chance at Amherst, Williams, Swarthmore, Bowdoin, Pomona, and Claremont McKenna. Not even worth bothering applying to these. All are in the selectivity ballpark of the Ivies and equivalent. They do not admit B students unless it's a highly grade deflated school they're familiar with.

Middlebury, Carleton, Davidson, Wellesley, Washington and Lee, Vassar, Haverford, Wesleyan would be reaches. If D really likes one or multiple, strongly encourage ED1 or ED2.

Other SLACs in the top 50 (Grinnell, Bates, Colgate, Scripps, Kenyon, etc) are matches.

Let go of the Amherst obsession and be realistic. Many of the attainable reaches are just as good as Amherst, and many have a similar culture.

Thank you. OP here. She is thinking ED (ED1) to Middlebury. Just got Naviance and looks like her school has admitted kids there. We have visited. Also, Colby sent her something in the mail. Do you think ED2 if she doesn't get it? I know they say ED has a lot of legacies and recruited athletes but Middlebury takes 2/3rds of its class ED, so I gotta think it helps.

There was a kid that got into Amherst from her school who did ED and we think he had similar grades. He was URM but not really because the family was wealthy.

Honestly, it is a wasted ED with her stats.

He’s URM if they can count him in their number of URMs. It doesn’t matter what his SES is. So he would get in with lower stats. Maybe unfair. But it is reality.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:0 chance at Amherst, Williams, Swarthmore, Bowdoin, Pomona, and Claremont McKenna. Not even worth bothering applying to these. All are in the selectivity ballpark of the Ivies and equivalent. They do not admit B students unless it's a highly grade deflated school they're familiar with.

Middlebury, Carleton, Davidson, Wellesley, Washington and Lee, Vassar, Haverford, Wesleyan would be reaches. If D really likes one or multiple, strongly encourage ED1 or ED2.

Other SLACs in the top 50 (Grinnell, Bates, Colgate, Scripps, Kenyon, etc) are matches.

Let go of the Amherst obsession and be realistic. Many of the attainable reaches are just as good as Amherst, and many have a similar culture.

Thank you. OP here. She is thinking ED (ED1) to Middlebury. Just got Naviance and looks like her school has admitted kids there. We have visited. Also, Colby sent her something in the mail. Do you think ED2 if she doesn't get it? I know they say ED has a lot of legacies and recruited athletes but Middlebury takes 2/3rds of its class ED, so I gotta think it helps.

There was a kid that got into Amherst from her school who did ED and we think he had similar grades. He was URM but not really because the family was wealthy.

Honestly, it is a wasted ED with her stats.

He’s URM if they can count him in their number of URMs. It doesn’t matter what his SES is. So he would get in with lower stats. Maybe unfair. But it is reality.

Mein Fuhrer Trump will be ending this nonsense soon #MAGA

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Don't think she has the grades. Junior. She thinks SLACs are easier with 40 Plus ED rate. She has mostly Bs and some As (three B's to every two As). Courses are somewhat rigorous but not as much as it could be. Top local private. Excellent EC. ACT not taken but getting 31-32 on practices. Foreign background that would be considered Asian but not traditional Asian countries you would think of i.e. not Chinese or Korean.

Visited Middlebury but thought it to be isolated. Likes Amherst because less isolated. External adviser said aiming high. Wants to visit Haverford. Thoughts on other schools that might be similar to these. She wants to be a SLACer.

You don’t know unless you apply. Just have a range too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:To console your daughter...has she visited Amherst?

We did not like it. While the town look charming/fun, the campus is not really separate (my DD preferred Mount Holyoke, in that you could have quiet and peace to study OR take the shuttle 20 minutes to the fun/college town of Amherst). We found our tour guide (okay, that is one person but...) to be snobby/arrogant. For example, she said her favorite event on campus is when they have skits that MAKE FUN of the essays of kids who did not get in. I kid you not, that is what she said was her favorite "tradition" on campus. That was all we needed to hear....

Sorry you had a poor tour guide. She also explained that event incorrectly - of course they don't make fun of essays of kids who didn't get admitted. The skits are based on the essays of the admitted students and done for the incoming freshman as a bonding experience. They don't identify whose essay it's based on.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To console your daughter...has she visited Amherst?

We did not like it. While the town look charming/fun, the campus is not really separate (my DD preferred Mount Holyoke, in that you could have quiet and peace to study OR take the shuttle 20 minutes to the fun/college town of Amherst). We found our tour guide (okay, that is one person but...) to be snobby/arrogant. For example, she said her favorite event on campus is when they have skits that MAKE FUN of the essays of kids who did not get in. I kid you not, that is what she said was her favorite "tradition" on campus. That was all we needed to hear....

Sorry you had a poor tour guide. She also explained that event incorrectly - of course they don't make fun of essays of kids who didn't get admitted. The skits are based on the essays of the admitted students and done for the incoming freshman as a bonding experience. They don't identify whose essay it's based on.

Sounds potentially hilarious to me, provided they don’t pick the 50% of essays where the kid lost his grandmother or she overcame some obstacle and then founded the future doctors club at her HS.

[Anonymous]

Just the fact that they make fun of the essays tells me they know that kids at this level are gaming the system with hyperbole and consultants.
For kids who wrote SINCERE sentiments, I don't actually think this would be entertaining (or appropriate).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Check out Macalester--great school, urban-ish, strong international bent, she sounds like a likely admit.

If you visit Macalester, you should also visit Gustavus Adolphus and Carelton and St. Olaf's while you are in Minnesota

Junior DS and I are doing St. Olaf’s and Macalaster and then renting a car and driving to Grinnell this spring. It’s about 4-5 hours. But worth the drive because Grinnell could be a great fit. I don’t want to have to fly into Minneapolis one weekend and Iowa the next.

Op— ED Oberlin and Kenyon. Look at Denison. I was super impressed by Wooster when we visited for my STEM kid. Skidmore. Layfayette. Dickinson. Macalaster. St. Olaf’s, Union, Hamilton. Washington and Lee and U Richmond if she likes the southern, conservative feel. All probably doable. Carleton, Grinnell and Davidson will be reaches. Amherst, Williams, Swat, Haverford, Pomona are not going to happen. They are as hard to get into— or harder— than Ivys. She’s going to have a hard time— or find it impossible— to get into the top 10-15 SLACs. You aren’t doing her any favors by letting her focus on schools she can’t get into.

Pull the common data set for these colleges. If she is an unhooked, Asian female who isn’t first gen, her ACT needs to line up with the 75%. Women have a harder time getting into SLACs than men. What you are doing is like taking a kid with you kids SATs and focusing on just Harvard, Yale and Stanford, then asking if you should look and Columbia or Brown next. When you should aim for Emory, Vandy, Wake Forest, etc. as reach schools, and also have matches.

BTW— small undergrad school, beautiful campus, LAC vibe, test optional, great for kids who are pre-professional— look at Wake. I attended back and the day and it had the same feel as the SLAC colleges DS is looking at. He will be applying, although he is concerned about the frat scene/ conservative bent.

There are great schools out there that do what she wants. Help her focus on Davidson, Grinnell, Carleton, etc as reaches and find some good Macalaster, etc matches.

+1. Incredibly helpful post. Agree with pps that a few reaches aren’t bad, just in case. Good luck!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Just the fact that they make fun of the essays tells me they know that kids at this level are gaming the system with hyperbole and consultants.
For kids who wrote SINCERE sentiments, I don't actually think this would be entertaining (or appropriate).

Wha? You don’t think essays can be funny, embarrassing or entertaining? Jeez, so cynical.

[Anonymous]

I think you are the cynical one. Some kids worked on their essays for weeks, really trying to capture who they are and where they are headed. Not fodder for jokes, in my book. But obviously we see things differently. I am so glad that my daughter left this type of superior snark back at her MoCo high school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think you are the cynical one. Some kids worked on their essays for weeks, really trying to capture who they are and where they are headed. Not fodder for jokes, in my book. But obviously we see things differently. I am so glad that my daughter left this type of superior snark back at her MoCo high school.

You seem fun. Does your face hurt from all the seriousness?