i know it is a favorite, but anyone else underwhelmed by Mundo Verde open house?

[Anonymous]

Actually YY parents care very much about the aftercare costs, and are working toward that goal. Can't speak for Mundo Verde.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yu Ying & Mundo verde posters who qualified for reduced rate that are not FARMS: what do you have to make to qualify?

YY reduced rate family: for a family of 4, the cutoff is $59k/year (for a family of 5, it's 69k; for a family of 3 it's $48k, going up & down @ basically $10k per person added/subtracted from each family).

Thanks for posting this.

So a family of four, two kids, both parents work full time, with a HHI of $70K/year is expected to pay over $400/mo per kid for aftercare.
Clearly this shuts out many families from schools like YY and MV.

I think both schools offer a small sibling discount, but yes. The cost of raising children in DC is part of why we only had one child.

I guess it seems reasonable to me that parents making above (or just below) DC's median household income of $64 k don't get a discount.

I'll also add that because Fridays are half days, you can save $130/month if you're able to pick your kid up at 1 pm on those days. (I know it's not an option for everyone, but it has worked for our family.)

And yes, there's a sibling discount--the 2nd/3rd/etc child is only $340.

THat's good that it makes sense to you and works for you. There are a LOT of families where it is still unrealistically high, and there are families that were passionate about Mandarin (talking about YY only obviously) and beat the odds to get admitted, only to have to turn it down because of the aftercare costs were too much. The YY school community just needs to figure out if that's acceptable, if there's anything that can be done about it, and what that might be. But obviously that is an internal YY issue and no parent trying to figure out schools for next year can count on anything being different until it's offiically going to be different.

A LOT of families turn down YY every year because of aftercare prices? Correct me if I'm wrong, but only about 10 or so families turned YY down. I find it hard to believe that all of them were both PASSIONATE about mandarin AND unable to come up with the extra $180 or so per month to afford the aftercare. Don't get me wrong, I'd like very much to see aftercare costs be reduced for middle-income families, but you are completely exaggerating.

Charter schools need to balance the needs of all different kinds of families on a much smaller budget than DCPS. Perhaps pursuing equal funding as mentioned up thread is one way to help cover costs.

Read it again.... There are a LOT of families who can't afford it... and "there are families that were passionate about Mandarin that had to turn YY down". Nowhere does it say "A LOT of families turn it down". Some of you guys really get kicks overreacting to things that no one said, don't you!

So is it acceptable for one or two families every year to turn down YY or MV because they find the costs of aftercare too high? Hard to say, but I think it's fair to say that there are many, many more families who willingly embrace the extra cost for the high quality programming, even those of us for whom it is a stretch.

You know what, you get to value what you value, I get to value what I value. I think that given how few new slots open up at YY every year, I think that it's doable and important for the school to figure out coverage for aftercare so that if a family qualifies for FARMS, there is a way to cover their fees appropriately. If you are a YY parent, you get to disagree with that. But to answer your question, no, I don't think it's acceptable for a couple of parents a year who really wanted the school to have to turn it down because of cost.

And your point about there being many other families willing to embrace the extra cost, well yeah, thank you Captain Obvious. People were sleeping out for the waitlist, so OBVIOUSLY there is a great demand. That is not the point. The point is whether, after going through all that and beating the odds to be offered a spot, the question is how YY as a school and a school community feels about being a public school that 1, 2, 4 families every year may have to turn down because of the cost of aftercare. No one is suggesting that quality aftercare isn't a bonus and worthwhile. The question is, does that prevent a few kids each year from being able to take a lucky spot. Me, I want to be part of a school community that does whatever it can to make sure that doesn't happen. If you are a YY parent, you are free not to care or to work against that goal.

I am not a YY parent but am confused--YY does have reduced rates for FARMs families and even some of those who are above FARM rate. I agree that some people are stretched thin beyond that, but I don't think your bolded statement above is fair to YY.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yu Ying & Mundo verde posters who qualified for reduced rate that are not FARMS: what do you have to make to qualify?

YY reduced rate family: for a family of 4, the cutoff is $59k/year (for a family of 5, it's 69k; for a family of 3 it's $48k, going up & down @ basically $10k per person added/subtracted from each family).

Thanks for posting this.

So a family of four, two kids, both parents work full time, with a HHI of $70K/year is expected to pay over $400/mo per kid for aftercare.
Clearly this shuts out many families from schools like YY and MV.

I think both schools offer a small sibling discount, but yes. The cost of raising children in DC is part of why we only had one child.

I guess it seems reasonable to me that parents making above (or just below) DC's median household income of $64 k don't get a discount.

I'll also add that because Fridays are half days, you can save $130/month if you're able to pick your kid up at 1 pm on those days. (I know it's not an option for everyone, but it has worked for our family.)

And yes, there's a sibling discount--the 2nd/3rd/etc child is only $340.

THat's good that it makes sense to you and works for you. There are a LOT of families where it is still unrealistically high, and there are families that were passionate about Mandarin (talking about YY only obviously) and beat the odds to get admitted, only to have to turn it down because of the aftercare costs were too much. The YY school community just needs to figure out if that's acceptable, if there's anything that can be done about it, and what that might be. But obviously that is an internal YY issue and no parent trying to figure out schools for next year can count on anything being different until it's offiically going to be different.

A LOT of families turn down YY every year because of aftercare prices? Correct me if I'm wrong, but only about 10 or so families turned YY down. I find it hard to believe that all of them were both PASSIONATE about mandarin AND unable to come up with the extra $180 or so per month to afford the aftercare. Don't get me wrong, I'd like very much to see aftercare costs be reduced for middle-income families, but you are completely exaggerating.

Charter schools need to balance the needs of all different kinds of families on a much smaller budget than DCPS. Perhaps pursuing equal funding as mentioned up thread is one way to help cover costs.

Read it again.... There are a LOT of families who can't afford it... and "there are families that were passionate about Mandarin that had to turn YY down". Nowhere does it say "A LOT of families turn it down". Some of you guys really get kicks overreacting to things that no one said, don't you!

So is it acceptable for one or two families every year to turn down YY or MV because they find the costs of aftercare too high? Hard to say, but I think it's fair to say that there are many, many more families who willingly embrace the extra cost for the high quality programming, even those of us for whom it is a stretch.

You know what, you get to value what you value, I get to value what I value. I think that given how few new slots open up at YY every year, I think that it's doable and important for the school to figure out coverage for aftercare so that if a family qualifies for FARMS, there is a way to cover their fees appropriately. If you are a YY parent, you get to disagree with that. But to answer your question, no, I don't think it's acceptable for a couple of parents a year who really wanted the school to have to turn it down because of cost.

And your point about there being many other families willing to embrace the extra cost, well yeah, thank you Captain Obvious. People were sleeping out for the waitlist, so OBVIOUSLY there is a great demand. That is not the point. The point is whether, after going through all that and beating the odds to be offered a spot, the question is how YY as a school and a school community feels about being a public school that 1, 2, 4 families every year may have to turn down because of the cost of aftercare. No one is suggesting that quality aftercare isn't a bonus and worthwhile. The question is, does that prevent a few kids each year from being able to take a lucky spot. Me, I want to be part of a school community that does whatever it can to make sure that doesn't happen. If you are a YY parent, you are free not to care or to work against that goal.

FARMS families get reduced aftercare costs at all schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:no...it is certainly not shutting you out from the educational program. you can choose to find more affordable aftercare somewhere else. many of us do. if you break the aftercare cost down (remember, fridays are early closing), it's really only about 8$ per hour (with a discount for sibs). where are you going to find quality (no tv, structured classes, grouped by age, stimulating content) aftercare programming for less?
are you sure you're not acting as though the world owes you something because you decided to have children???

NP here. We have aftercare of quality, no tv, structured, extras, grouped by age and stimulating content (and a few more things) at our charter for less than $300/month. YY and MV's costs are outrageous, anyone that defends that statement, likens it to daycare, shows the $8/hour average or any of the other strategies is just luny. Just admit it is a major downside of the school and move on. It's not a reflection on you as an individual because you attend the school. Heck it's not even a major reflection on the school, it's just a flaw that can and should be fixed. Stop being so defensive already.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
You know what, you get to value what you value, I get to value what I value. I think that given how few new slots open up at YY every year, I think that it's doable and important for the school to figure out coverage for aftercare so that if a family qualifies for FARMS, there is a way to cover their fees appropriately. If you are a YY parent, you get to disagree with that. But to answer your question, no, I don't think it's acceptable for a couple of parents a year who really wanted the school to have to turn it down because of cost.

And your point about there being many other families willing to embrace the extra cost, well yeah, thank you Captain Obvious. People were sleeping out for the waitlist, so OBVIOUSLY there is a great demand. That is not the point. The point is whether, after going through all that and beating the odds to be offered a spot, the question is how YY as a school and a school community feels about being a public school that 1, 2, 4 families every year may have to turn down because of the cost of aftercare. No one is suggesting that quality aftercare isn't a bonus and worthwhile. The question is, does that prevent a few kids each year from being able to take a lucky spot. Me, I want to be part of a school community that does whatever it can to make sure that doesn't happen. If you are a YY parent, you are free not to care or to work against that goal.

I am totally with you, especially on the point about valuing different things. Some people may decide that aftercare is too expensive (whether subsidized or not), and figure out a way to have a grandparent or older sibling pick up their child and take him/her home. Others may do some sort of sharing with neighbors who pick up a few kids. I definitely see grandparents picking up kids at my kids' charter.

But again, I think you need to come back to the real question- who should pay for the aftercare subsidy? Taxpayers, richer families, donors? Seriously, that's a real question. Because if you look at any of these school's finances they don't have a ton of money just sitting around. Now, if you suggest that the District significantly raise the per-pupil payment for things like this, that would probably work. But are you willing to pay more taxes for that?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I know students at several DCPS aftercare programs who report watching TV almost every afternoon in school. That would be cheaper. Should we do this? No.

No one here has questioned the value of good aftercare. What is your point? Just because no one wants their kid watching t.v. in aftercare, that means there's no worthwhile discussion to have about making it affordable for more families?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
You know what, you get to value what you value, I get to value what I value. I think that given how few new slots open up at YY every year, I think that it's doable and important for the school to figure out coverage for aftercare so that if a family qualifies for FARMS, there is a way to cover their fees appropriately. If you are a YY parent, you get to disagree with that. But to answer your question, no, I don't think it's acceptable for a couple of parents a year who really wanted the school to have to turn it down because of cost.

And your point about there being many other families willing to embrace the extra cost, well yeah, thank you Captain Obvious. People were sleeping out for the waitlist, so OBVIOUSLY there is a great demand. That is not the point. The point is whether, after going through all that and beating the odds to be offered a spot, the question is how YY as a school and a school community feels about being a public school that 1, 2, 4 families every year may have to turn down because of the cost of aftercare. No one is suggesting that quality aftercare isn't a bonus and worthwhile. The question is, does that prevent a few kids each year from being able to take a lucky spot. Me, I want to be part of a school community that does whatever it can to make sure that doesn't happen. If you are a YY parent, you are free not to care or to work against that goal.

I am totally with you, especially on the point about valuing different things. Some people may decide that aftercare is too expensive (whether subsidized or not), and figure out a way to have a grandparent or older sibling pick up their child and take him/her home. Others may do some sort of sharing with neighbors who pick up a few kids. I definitely see grandparents picking up kids at my kids' charter.


But again, I think you need to come back to the real question- who should pay for the aftercare subsidy? Taxpayers, richer families, donors? Seriously, that's a real question. Because if you look at any of these school's finances they don't have a ton of money just sitting around. Now, if you suggest that the District significantly raise the per-pupil payment for things like this, that would probably work. But are you willing to pay more taxes for that?

I don't think one person has mentioned that it should be the gov't's/richer famiies responsibility to pay for aftercare. I think you are making a stretch. Almost every other charter makes it happen, they can find a suitable aftarecare program for the $250-$300 range that will meet the needs of more families. Why can't or wont' YY and MV? Don't give crap about enrichment and language, again, it happens elsewhere. There has to be a middle that can be found.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know students at several DCPS aftercare programs who report watching TV almost every afternoon in school. That would be cheaper. Should we do this? No.

No one here has questioned the value of good aftercare. What is your point? Just because no one wants their kid watching t.v. in aftercare, that means there's no worthwhile discussion to have about making it affordable for more families?

So, how do you propose paying for it? Remember, schools are juggling ALL of your priorities: qualified, experienced teachers, challenging and appropriate curriculum, small classroom sizes, pullout groups, timely communications, adequate support staff, robust specials, attractive and functional facilities, a secure building, healthful and affordable meals, outdoor space and physical education, special ed accommodations, and quality before and aftercare.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know students at several DCPS aftercare programs who report watching TV almost every afternoon in school. That would be cheaper. Should we do this? No.

No one here has questioned the value of good aftercare. What is your point? Just because no one wants their kid watching t.v. in aftercare, that means there's no worthwhile discussion to have about making it affordable for more families?

So, how do you propose paying for it? Remember, schools are juggling ALL of your priorities: qualified, experienced teachers, challenging and appropriate curriculum, small classroom sizes, pullout groups, timely communications, adequate support staff, robust specials, attractive and functional facilities, a secure building, healthful and affordable meals, outdoor space and physical education, special ed accommodations, and quality before and aftercare.

They should pay for it the same way every other school does. If the school can't pay for it directly, they can hire a vendor. CM, LAMB, Bridges, IT, Haynes, Stokes, Cap City all have aftercare for the target price. How come YY and MV can't do the same?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know students at several DCPS aftercare programs who report watching TV almost every afternoon in school. That would be cheaper. Should we do this? No.

No one here has questioned the value of good aftercare. What is your point? Just because no one wants their kid watching t.v. in aftercare, that means there's no worthwhile discussion to have about making it affordable for more families?

So, how do you propose paying for it? Remember, schools are juggling ALL of your priorities: qualified, experienced teachers, challenging and appropriate curriculum, small classroom sizes, pullout groups, timely communications, adequate support staff, robust specials, attractive and functional facilities, a secure building, healthful and affordable meals, outdoor space and physical education, special ed accommodations, and quality before and aftercare.

They should pay for it the same way every other school does. If the school can't pay for it directly, they can hire a vendor. CM, LAMB, Bridges, IT, Haynes, Stokes, Cap City all have aftercare for the target price. How come YY and MV can't do the same?

There is an extremely high value in continuing the same type of educational philosophy in the aftercare program as the students have during the day. I think it is one of the absolute best things about MV, and I love the fact that they do not waste 3 hours of each of our children's day.

[Anonymous]

Do you think kids that skip the high value after care at MV or YY miss out on a lot?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know students at several DCPS aftercare programs who report watching TV almost every afternoon in school. That would be cheaper. Should we do this? No.

No one here has questioned the value of good aftercare. What is your point? Just because no one wants their kid watching t.v. in aftercare, that means there's no worthwhile discussion to have about making it affordable for more families?

So, how do you propose paying for it? Remember, schools are juggling ALL of your priorities: qualified, experienced teachers, challenging and appropriate curriculum, small classroom sizes, pullout groups, timely communications, adequate support staff, robust specials, attractive and functional facilities, a secure building, healthful and affordable meals, outdoor space and physical education, special ed accommodations, and quality before and aftercare.

They should pay for it the same way every other school does. If the school can't pay for it directly, they can hire a vendor. CM, LAMB, Bridges, IT, Haynes, Stokes, Cap City all have aftercare for the target price. How come YY and MV can't do the same?

There is an extremely high value in continuing the same type of educational philosophy in the aftercare program as the students have during the day. I think it is one of the absolute best things about MV, and I love the fact that they do not waste 3 hours of each of our children's day.

Do you attend another charter for you to be able to compare the values? Again, are you saying the high-value of MV outweighs the need for middle income families? Can't there be a middle ground? Fwiw, our charter aftercare is extremely high value with many extras and great curriculum for under $300 (prof days, early release, spring/winter break included).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know students at several DCPS aftercare programs who report watching TV almost every afternoon in school. That would be cheaper. Should we do this? No.

No one here has questioned the value of good aftercare. What is your point? Just because no one wants their kid watching t.v. in aftercare, that means there's no worthwhile discussion to have about making it affordable for more families?

So, how do you propose paying for it? Remember, schools are juggling ALL of your priorities: qualified, experienced teachers, challenging and appropriate curriculum, small classroom sizes, pullout groups, timely communications, adequate support staff, robust specials, attractive and functional facilities, a secure building, healthful and affordable meals, outdoor space and physical education, special ed accommodations, and quality before and aftercare.

They should pay for it the same way every other school does. If the school can't pay for it directly, they can hire a vendor. CM, LAMB, Bridges, IT, Haynes, Stokes, Cap City all have aftercare for the target price. How come YY and MV can't do the same?

There is an extremely high value in continuing the same type of educational philosophy in the aftercare program as the students have during the day. I think it is one of the absolute best things about MV, and I love the fact that they do not waste 3 hours of each of our children's day.

Do you attend another charter for you to be able to compare the values? Again, are you saying the high-value of MV outweighs the need for middle income families? Can't there be a middle ground? Fwiw, our charter aftercare is extremely high value with many extras and great curriculum for under $300 (prof days, early release, spring/winter break included).

What charter do you attend?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
FARMS families get reduced aftercare costs at all schools.

Yes, they do. The question is, once the reduction is in place, is the family still paying essentially the same amount as other schools charge non-FARMS families for aftercare? And if that remaining amount is equivalent to full fee aftercare elsewhere, is the school in a position to/interested in/trying to do something so that that, alone, is not the factor that forces an otherwise committed family to decline a spot?

It may be that there are very very few families who have been in this position of having to deny a slot at a highly sought-after charter just because of aftercare costs. But I know 2 such families at my school and I've only been there for a year (they are families I met at open houses). So it is happening, and it's heartbreaking to me frankly, given that charters started in DC as a way to provide quality education to students who were totally being failed by DCPS. Both MV and YY offer really unusual and exciting educational options (both green, both bilingal, MV with the added sustainability focus throughout the curricula and expeditionary learning, YY with IB). It's exciting that so many people want to benefit from those offerings. To me, as a member of the parent community of one of those schools, it is absolutely worth it to try to make sure that the higher aftercare costs don't prohibit an otherwise excited, committed family from attending the school.

Maybe others are talking about other aspects of this conversation, but I'm simply saying it's worth exploring and I hope to assist my school in exploring it. As do other parents I've spoken to at my school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
FARMS families get reduced aftercare costs at all schools.

Yes, they do. The question is, once the reduction is in place, is the family still paying essentially the same amount as other schools charge non-FARMS families for aftercare? And if that remaining amount is equivalent to full fee aftercare elsewhere, is the school in a position to/interested in/trying to do something so that that, alone, is not the factor that forces an otherwise committed family to decline a spot?

It may be that there are very very few families who have been in this position of having to deny a slot at a highly sought-after charter just because of aftercare costs. But I know 2 such families at my school and I've only been there for a year (they are families I met at open houses). So it is happening, and it's heartbreaking to me frankly, given that charters started in DC as a way to provide quality education to students who were totally being failed by DCPS. Both MV and YY offer really unusual and exciting educational options (both green, both bilingal, MV with the added sustainability focus throughout the curricula and expeditionary learning, YY with IB). It's exciting that so many people want to benefit from those offerings. To me, as a member of the parent community of one of those schools, it is absolutely worth it to try to make sure that the higher aftercare costs don't prohibit an otherwise excited, committed family from attending the school.

Maybe others are talking about other aspects of this conversation, but I'm simply saying it's worth exploring and I hope to assist my school in exploring it. As do other parents I've spoken to at my school.

Bravo!!!