Are students unhappy at CMU?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DD suffered through 4 years. She did not enjoy college and was happy to graduate. With that said, she got a job and is excelling. Most of her friends felt similarly. It’s just a really hard school and the location isn’t great. She will not make the same mistake for grad school.

Why do you say that about the location? My kid is considering Pitt, which is right next to CMU, and the location seems good to us - near several colleges, seems pretty vibrant. Thanks!

Most people agree, the location is great. It's probably 2nd behind Boston for the best college city in the US.

No it's not! I was there in the 90s for grad school. I agree it's improved, but they literally had nowhere to go but up (I was there when you would end up carjacked at 11am if you didn't lock your car door and/or had your windows rolled down so they could open the door). The campus is dreary, the buildings are not exciting and most of the students just never seem happy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I graduated from CMU with a degree in Computer Engineering in 2010 with so many regrets. I literally spent at least 75 hours a week on classes and assignments. I didn't have time to develop my social skills (e.g. EQ) and hobbies during my time there. There were many hobbies that I wanted to do in those four years, but I never had the time due to academic commitments. You could say that I can follow up on those hobbies after graduation, but they were never the same after that. IMHO, I could get the same job with the same pay had I gone to UVA, Virginia Tech, or GMU as I would at CMU, and had much more time to pursue my hobbies. Time is something that I will never get back at CMU. CMU is a great school for people who have passions for academics and very much nothing else, and it was definitely not for me. YMMV.

The average CS graduate from CMU makes much more than the average UVA, VT, or GMU CS graduate.

DP. I wrote about the 2010 CMU grad. Yes, I make 350K while my older brother who attended UVA makes 300K, but his life outside work is so much better and more interesting than mine. He had time at UVA to pursue many of his hobbies and improve his social skills while I did not. I would love to trade that 350K for the life that he has.

And for $50K difference, take out $15K in taxes. So you make $30-35K more but had no college life and still haven't developed one.

Alex: I'll take happy for $500

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DD suffered through 4 years. She did not enjoy college and was happy to graduate. With that said, she got a job and is excelling. Most of her friends felt similarly. It’s just a really hard school and the location isn’t great. She will not make the same mistake for grad school.

Why do you say that about the location? My kid is considering Pitt, which is right next to CMU, and the location seems good to us - near several colleges, seems pretty vibrant. Thanks!

Agree!
The Shadyside neighborhood near Pitt & CMU is a fun area.

Shadyside is almsot a mile from CMU

[Anonymous]

I’ve heard people laugh about how you can tell the difference between a CMU student vs. a Pitt student. A smile!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I graduated from CMU with a degree in Computer Engineering in 2010 with so many regrets. I literally spent at least 75 hours a week on classes and assignments. I didn't have time to develop my social skills (e.g. EQ) and hobbies during my time there. There were many hobbies that I wanted to do in those four years, but I never had the time due to academic commitments. You could say that I can follow up on those hobbies after graduation, but they were never the same after that. IMHO, I could get the same job with the same pay had I gone to UVA, Virginia Tech, or GMU as I would at CMU, and had much more time to pursue my hobbies. Time is something that I will never get back at CMU. CMU is a great school for people who have passions for academics and very much nothing else, and it was definitely not for me. YMMV.

The average CS graduate from CMU makes much more than the average UVA, VT, or GMU CS graduate.

DP. I wrote about the 2010 CMU grad. Yes, I make 350K while my older brother who attended UVA makes 300K, but his life outside work is so much better and more interesting than mine. He had time at UVA to pursue many of his hobbies and improve his social skills while I did not. I would love to trade that 350K for the life that he has.

Maybe it's just you, not CMU.

DP: No, it's a large majority of CMU CS/Engineering majors. I attended Grad school there (company required it and was the largest sponsor of the program at that time)

I have know 5 CS/Eng students at CMU in the last 4 years. 1 left after freshman year. The other 4 were not that happy and just stayed to get the degree and get the hell out of there. Most are not genuinely happy. There is not much to do, it's a grinder school

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I graduated from CMU with a degree in Computer Engineering in 2010 with so many regrets. I literally spent at least 75 hours a week on classes and assignments. I didn't have time to develop my social skills (e.g. EQ) and hobbies during my time there. There were many hobbies that I wanted to do in those four years, but I never had the time due to academic commitments. You could say that I can follow up on those hobbies after graduation, but they were never the same after that. IMHO, I could get the same job with the same pay had I gone to UVA, Virginia Tech, or GMU as I would at CMU, and had much more time to pursue my hobbies. Time is something that I will never get back at CMU. CMU is a great school for people who have passions for academics and very much nothing else, and it was definitely not for me. YMMV.

The average CS graduate from CMU makes much more than the average UVA, VT, or GMU CS graduate.

DP. I wrote about the 2010 CMU grad. Yes, I make 350K while my older brother who attended UVA makes 300K, but his life outside work is so much better and more interesting than mine. He had time at UVA to pursue many of his hobbies and improve his social skills while I did not. I would love to trade that 350K for the life that he has.

I try to never analyze off of a single data point as you did. (You can draw a line in any direction through a single point.) The College Scorecard shows CS graduates from Carnegie Mellon make 56% more than UVA CS graduates, which is substantial. WSJ data shows a significant gap as well. So there may be a significant career upside for Carnegie Mellon.

However, that said, only you can evaluate the tradeoffs you made.

A CMU and UVA grad working same company and same job make the same. However, CMU grads likely have quant and other company/job opportunities not generally available to a UVA grad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We're a family of Hopkins alums and it has changed quite a bit over the past 25 years as they've expanded wholistic admissions, DEI initiatives, etc. It is not the slog it once once.

It's fascinating because as college admissions have become more difficult, schools like Northwestern, Duke, Cornell have become more of a grind (full of geeks), others like Chicago and JHU have become less so. Now they're all very similar---they've met in the middle if you will.

I don't know much about CMU or where it currently stands on the grind scale.

So,your tacit assumption is that "less of a slog" correlates to dei and holistic admissions, and, yet, you can't even spell! Maybe any changes to lower stress levels are a result of mental health initiatives, and holistic admissions just brings a broader learning experience to the campus.

It always cracks me up that a certain set of people on this board want to dictate admissions priorities, and, when they don't match up, claim "gaming" or "less qualified," or whatever. So many kids "merit" admission to these schools. You all can't prescribe the terms.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm curious about this also. Why would CMU be more of a pressure cooker than any other selective college. Aren't all of the top schools hard, particularly for STEM majors?

its worse.

My kid (an athlete) is a senior at a different school in the same conference as CMU. This conference includes- NYU, Emory, Wash U, U Chicago, Case, Rochester- I have heard that CMU case work is more than these other schools. I always heard that UChicago was were fun goes to die, but maybe it is really CMU.

Chicago's slogan was always tongue-in-cheek to an extent. It's certainly no Florida State, but I get the sense things have improved.

CMU has just gotten worse and worse over the last few decades. Rochester is pretty abysmal too from what I hear.

Rochester is not abysmal. Sure it's not a city most kids plan to stay in after college (unless you work for the university), but it's a good city with lots to do. Campus is amazing and the school is great. More importantly, it's not a grind school. yes the kids are smart and work hard, but most have fun as well. Also, it filled with kids who pursue other interests than just their major. They pursue multiple passions and the school encourages it. But it's definately not a Grind like CMU (attended CMU for grad school and have a kid at UR now in engineering).
Yes, if Rochester were to be in Chicago or say Boston, they would be a reach school (with sub 20% acceptance rates) just like CWRU would be as well

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DD suffered through 4 years. She did not enjoy college and was happy to graduate. With that said, she got a job and is excelling. Most of her friends felt similarly. It’s just a really hard school and the location isn’t great. She will not make the same mistake for grad school.

Why do you say that about the location? My kid is considering Pitt, which is right next to CMU, and the location seems good to us - near several colleges, seems pretty vibrant. Thanks!

Agree!
The Shadyside neighborhood near Pitt & CMU is a fun area.

Shadyside is almsot a mile from CMU

CMU students do live there and take the city bus to campus.

[Anonymous]

Carnegie Mellon and Rochester are both pretty grim. Not places I’d send my kid. Kinda like Hopkins. Great schools with depressed/stressed out undergrads. Chicago is different. Tough love but getting more cuddly, plus they’re in a world class city and not…
Pittsburgh, Baltimore or Rochester!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm curious about this also. Why would CMU be more of a pressure cooker than any other selective college. Aren't all of the top schools hard, particularly for STEM majors?

its worse.

My kid (an athlete) is a senior at a different school in the same conference as CMU. This conference includes- NYU, Emory, Wash U, U Chicago, Case, Rochester- I have heard that CMU case work is more than these other schools. I always heard that UChicago was were fun goes to die, but maybe it is really CMU.

Chicago's slogan was always tongue-in-cheek to an extent. It's certainly no Florida State, but I get the sense things have improved.

CMU has just gotten worse and worse over the last few decades. Rochester is pretty abysmal too from what I hear.

Rochester is not abysmal. Sure it's not a city most kids plan to stay in after college (unless you work for the university), but it's a good city with lots to do. Campus is amazing and the school is great. More importantly, it's not a grind school. yes the kids are smart and work hard, but most have fun as well. Also, it filled with kids who pursue other interests than just their major. They pursue multiple passions and the school encourages it. But it's definately not a Grind like CMU (attended CMU for grad school and have a kid at UR now in engineering).
Yes, if Rochester were to be in Chicago or say Boston, they would be a reach school (with sub 20% acceptance rates) just like CWRU would be as well

To me, it seems as if Rochester and Case Western are weirdly undervalued these days. Great schools in great locations.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I graduated from CMU with a degree in Computer Engineering in 2010 with so many regrets. I literally spent at least 75 hours a week on classes and assignments. I didn't have time to develop my social skills (e.g. EQ) and hobbies during my time there. There were many hobbies that I wanted to do in those four years, but I never had the time due to academic commitments. You could say that I can follow up on those hobbies after graduation, but they were never the same after that. IMHO, I could get the same job with the same pay had I gone to UVA, Virginia Tech, or GMU as I would at CMU, and had much more time to pursue my hobbies. Time is something that I will never get back at CMU. CMU is a great school for people who have passions for academics and very much nothing else, and it was definitely not for me. YMMV.

The average CS graduate from CMU makes much more than the average UVA, VT, or GMU CS graduate.

The PP is literally telling you that wasn't the case for them. It might be for some, but in reality, it's not about where you go as much as the degree itself and a decent GPA. Fact is you don't get paid that much more (if any ) from a top school. It might be slightly easier to land a job with FAANG, but if you do, you will be working with kids from other less "hard core Schools" and making the same thing

The PP wouldn't know. They didn't attend both and have the option to compare.

The actual data shows you do get paid more from top schools. CS graduates from CMU make 56% more than UVA CS grads according to U.S. College Scorecard data.

[Anonymous]

It’s funny that the only acceptable answer to the question that parents here have about where my kid should go to make (literally 1/3) more money than their colleagues in the same field is: well, obviously they have to go to HYP. Actually no. But people don’t want to believe that HYP no longer reliably delivers on the income front. (Unless you’re already rich and join your father’s company.).
I have really good friends who are HYP grads. Some aren’t doing so well, income -wise these days. The pedigree doesn’t have the power it used to have. They will tell you that in confidence.
I’m just saying that parents really need to get over their obsession with the Ivy League. It’s lovely that your kids got in. Yay you. You earned it (unless you bought your way in). Your kids will never say “meh” when you ask them “how is Harvard?” If they did, you would think they are ungrateful or bonkers. (But my Harvard grad nephew said exactly that to me.)
No kid is ever going to tell you that they were miserable at Harvard or Yale or Princeton! There are free ski trips! Lobster dinners in gorgeous venues! It’s seductive. But, it’s a fact that their CS CMU colleagues make 1/3 more money after graduation. There are other places where grads do really well too.
PS. I taught at Harvard, have a grad certificate from Princeton. Two family members who are Harvard Law grads (one first in his class). An uncle who graduated from Penn. Lots of Ivy exposure. It’s fine for those who lust after it. And it’s not everything.
The CMU faculty actually love their students and love teaching. Yes it’s hard work. Some kids actually thrive on that. And don’t tell me that Pittsburgh sucks. They’ve never been to Primanti’s? They’ve never been to a performance of CMU’s theater dept? Leslie Odom Jr. (Hamilton original cast member) performed there! (His Xmas album - gorgeous!). Well, that’s on them if they’re missing out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Carnegie Mellon and Rochester are both pretty grim. Not places I’d send my kid. Kinda like Hopkins. Great schools with depressed/stressed out undergrads. Chicago is different. Tough love but getting more cuddly, plus they’re in a world class city and not…
Pittsburgh, Baltimore or Rochester!

Kids at Hopkins are just as happy as those as Chicago, I don’t know why you keep repeatedly claiming otherwise.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It’s funny that the only acceptable answer to the question that parents here have about where my kid should go to make (literally 1/3) more money than their colleagues in the same field is: well, obviously they have to go to HYP. Actually no. But people don’t want to believe that HYP no longer reliably delivers on the income front. (Unless you’re already rich and join your father’s company.).
I have really good friends who are HYP grads. Some aren’t doing so well, income -wise these days. The pedigree doesn’t have the power it used to have. They will tell you that in confidence.
I’m just saying that parents really need to get over their obsession with the Ivy League. It’s lovely that your kids got in. Yay you. You earned it (unless you bought your way in). Your kids will never say “meh” when you ask them “how is Harvard?” If they did, you would think they are ungrateful or bonkers. (But my Harvard grad nephew said exactly that to me.)
No kid is ever going to tell you that they were miserable at Harvard or Yale or Princeton! There are free ski trips! Lobster dinners in gorgeous venues! It’s seductive. But, it’s a fact that their CS CMU colleagues make 1/3 more money after graduation. There are other places where grads do really well too.
PS. I taught at Harvard, have a grad certificate from Princeton. Two family members who are Harvard Law grads (one first in his class). An uncle who graduated from Penn. Lots of Ivy exposure. It’s fine for those who lust after it. And it’s not everything.
The CMU faculty actually love their students and love teaching. Yes it’s hard work. Some kids actually thrive on that. And don’t tell me that Pittsburgh sucks. They’ve never been to Primanti’s? They’ve never been to a performance of CMU’s theater dept? Leslie Odom Jr. (Hamilton original cast member) performed there! (His Xmas album - gorgeous!). Well, that’s on them if they’re missing out.

A friend of mine hated Harvard, said they were miserable there, but this was 30 years ago. They were from a MC family in CA. Could've been in part due to the depressing weather, but I know some of it was due to the students there.